White people are not subject to the institutional and systemic racism in our law protecting organisations, in our work places and in our society. White people do not face that every day, several times a day, all throughout their lives. White people simply do not face these injustices and you cannot say that poverty stricken white people face them either in the same manner or to the same degree. All Lives Matter and one day we'll hopefully be able to say that but not until Black Lives Matter too and in every respect as every other Life matters. The job to be done is to ensure that Black Lives Matter, not White Lives. To attempt to promote White Lives Matter is to attempt to deny the conscious and unconscious Racism that Black people face and endure today, now. White people do not face and endure that and do not deserve a platform in these debates and protests.
Protests following the killing of George Floyd
- Thread starter Abizzz
- Start date
I know that i am arguing in good faith. I know that i am totally against any kind of racism, for me a human is just a human. No matter the color, no matter the race or religion.
But i think if it's okay to send the message that black lifes matter, it should also be okay to send the message that white lifes matter (if in good faith, obviously). Both is okay for me, as long as it is about equality and not about superiority. It's not okay for me, if only one thing is allowed though without getting branded as a racist. And i will keep saying that, even if you guys think i am stupid or even, which would make me laugh, a racist because of that.
But sometimes i have the feeling that some people just recognize racism against a certain kind of people. But there can be racism against any kind of people (i personally even experienced racism against me personally in this very forum, quite a few times, when i was new), and i don't think that racism against black people for instance is worse than racism against muslims, jews, asians and yes, even white people. That's why i have trouble if someone gets instantly (without proof) branded as a racist if he says that white lifes matter, in a time where many people say that black lifes matter.
Like it or not, that is just my honest opinion. Sorry for my bad english though.
Let us say I am a climate change activist, my symbol being the polar bear, and I proclaim that ‘polar bears matter’. If you come back with ’all mammals matter’, you’re subverting and mocking my message. You’re technically right as all mammals do matter, but it’s clear there was not an attempt at honest discourse.
There's not that many good apples it seems
Good apples won't stand idle seeing all them bad apples
Good apples won't stand idle seeing all them bad apples
A viral video shows a woman holding a Confederate flag at a Black Lives Matter protest in Missouri and telling demonstrators, “I will teach my grandkids to hate you all.” She then turned around, stuck up her fist and said, “KKK belief.”
https://thehill.com/blogs/blog-brie...woman-holding-confederate-flag-at-blm-protest
https://thehill.com/blogs/blog-brie...woman-holding-confederate-flag-at-blm-protest
She probably considers herself a God fearing Christian. Square that circle.
Mouse lives matter
I would recommend spending sometime reading about the history of black people here https://www.history.com/topics/black-history maybe it will help you understand why the movement means so much.
Except that flying a banner in the sky when the stadium is currently promoting BLM is clearly not in good faith now is it?
If it wasn’t for this BLM movement, would they have flown that flag? Of course not!
It is quite clearly and obviously is an attempt to undermine it.
No one is saying only black lives matter, the movement is about the equality you claim you want. If you want equality then you should be delighted by this movement, as we clearly do not have that equality as things stand.
I'm so glad people like yourself can explain this in terms for people to understand. I struggle like hell to not condescend and instead end up ignoring it which solves nothing. So thank you.
I never said, that i don't like the BLM movement. Where is this coming from? I was just contesting that the 'white life matter' flag was instantly branded as racist.
Why do you think the flag is branded as racist?
Why should it become clearer in this picture? Because they are white?Here's the guy who organised it..
Is the intention starting to become clearer?
(I don't know any of those two guys as i am not from England, so maybe i miss some context here)
Put simply a bunch of Racists are attempting to divert attention from a thoroughly deserving and desperate cause (BLM) on to one which does not matter (White Lives Matter) and is not urgent nor the people suffering from.
Try and understand that on its simplest level in its purest form, that it is a Racist device at a time when no one had any reason to insist that it mattered.
That is your takeaway from those posts? You've been provided a decent explanation of the subject at hand, and yet you're focusing on the same bit that all other classic racists seem to be focused on.
I think this medium is a difficult one to use if you are trying to understand any sort of intent or device especially when the writer's first language is not English and simply try to answer their points. Besides there are far better speakers on here than me. We just have to speak up when we are present and see the need.
It's Tommy Robinson, who is famous for being a racist feck-wit
But you know that, I just wanted to see what you came up with
Because they are white?
Give him a break he genuinely might not have known this.It's Tommy Robinson, who is famous for being a racist feck-wit
But you know that, I just wanted to see what you came up with
Because they are white?
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(not parody, she's maga)
Nah, it's all horse-shit. Given the previous posts it's clearly the actions of someone arguing in bad-faith
To be fair he's now had numerous explanations from people with varying and similar points, I think to be able to judge him we need to be able to see a pattern of deliberate mis-understanding.
Yep your last post on the matter was perfect, very simple to understand, hopefully he understands now.
Maybe I'm too cynical but the first post on the matter was more than enough for me
It's impossible that this was a sincere 'white lives matter' protest or for anyone to legitimately be ignorant enough to believe that
I can understand that, but I think being that his first language isn't English he's not done enough yet to damn himself however for the mods to kick a racist from here they'd want him to hang himself.
This isn't the first time he's made these sorts of comments, so there's already a pattern. I think you're right that we have to try to give people the benefit of the doubt when we can, but that has limits for me.
Don't you hate it when actions have consequences?
This really is one of the key actions in any improvement. It’s actually commendable that people are taking family & friends to task for their views - people are going to have far less safe havens going forward.
Well that's good then, they really can't seem to help themselves, it's like a prime directive or something to out themselves.
Give him a pass on this one. I've seen the name Tommy Robinson mentioned in various threads here over the years and I'm well aware that he's a massive racist, but I still didn't know what he looked like.It's Tommy Robinson, who is famous for being a racist feck-wit
But you know that, I just wanted to see what you came up with
Because they are white?
I can honestly say I have no idea who Tommy Robinson is.
What's with the OutlawGER mocking about not knowing that dude, first time I hear about this Tommy Robinson also, not everyone knows everyone.It's Tommy Robinson, who is famous for being a racist feck-wit
But you know that, I just wanted to see what you came up with
Because they are white?
He's a small, and not entirely insignificant pipsqueak who doesn't deserve the credit of someone being told they should look him up but he does play a role in all of this and the sooner that people see that he's only deserving of ridicule, the idiot whose real name is Stephen Yaxley Lennon and thought that Tommy Robinson would be some sort of improvement, the sooner he'll disappear under the stone he crawled out from under.
We already know that white lives matter. This isn't in question. Black lives on the other hand....
Even if he didn't know him (which is of course possible), the "because they are white?" line is such an obvious attempt at playing dumb. Do people not see that?
And that's before you look at all the pathetic posts attempting to down-play racism. I did a cursory search and found one claiming George Floyd's death wasn't connected to racism, and another saying white players are more intelligent.
I'm tired of giving these trolls the benefit of the doubt...
No, it was no take-away or anything like that. Please put things into context. The person before basically accused me of "not liking the BLM-movement, even though i am supposed to be pro-equality". My answer just suggested that i never said that i am against BLM, because i think its a good thing, i was just (from my starting point) questioning why 'white life matters' is instantly branded as racist. (this is not a new question or a takeaway, its just where i was coming from. I never critisized the BLM movement itself).
How am i supposed to know? You can read in my name, my location and from my "sorry for my bad english", that i am not from England. So what am i supposed to think if you just send me a picture of a bunch of white people smiling into a camera without any further context and a comment like yours? Am i supposed to think they are racists because of their looks?It's Tommy Robinson, who is famous for being a racist feck-wit
But you know that, I just wanted to see what you came up with
Because they are white?
Your first sentence in this post would have been good enough to answer my starting question "why is 'white life matters' instantly branded as racist?". If i would have known that it was coming from an well known racist, then my question would have been answered far enough to my understanding and this case would have been solved far earlier.
I get what you mean and where you are coming from with your point, but i think there actually also are some white people in the US which are suffering from racism and stereotypes.
But i understand what you are trying to say. But i have the (sometimes bad) habit to think too deep into a very complex topic.
It depends on the context. Wasn't it the case in the US that since the George Floyd incident many (mostly innocent) white people, many cops too, had to suffer from revenge attacks for example? I don't want to go too far into the topic now because it seems proven as a racist act (the white flag thing), so this discussion doesn't make any sense any more i guess.
I guess you are referring to my comments in the 'blackface' thread a few weeks ago. Yes, i was not educated on that topic and i was wondering why Griezmann was critized so hard, because it didn't seem that he had any bad intentions with his costume, and the intention behind peoples actions are what matter the most to me personally. So it's okay for me to tell the person (in this case Griezmann) that this was not cool, but completely cancel/judge him and his reputation goes waaaaay too far for me.
The whole topic is complex but this is a very simple abstract. I don't think I am trying to say anything, it is you who appears to be trying just a little to understand. Try to understand that any stereotype attached to some white people in America is not something that they are suffering from, not in the context that Black Peoples have suffered torture, kidnap, forced labour, murder and all manner of injustice from centuries ago to the present day.
On balance which People do you feel need the most urgent and deserving of attention and remedy?
To those giving the benefit of doubt to @OutlawGER
It’s all nonsense. His posts are cnuty posts. He knows what he’s doing and his motive is clear.
His Mo is to come into threads like these and basically question how something can be seen as racist, usually when the discussion is on black people. He deliberately tries to undermine it by playing devils advocate. When questioned he then resorts to playing dumb and playing the “my English isn’t good card”... this is quickly followed up by the “I believe everyone is equal” card which people with underlying, covert racism use to pretend that they aren’t racist. But the saying goes ‘fool me once but you can’t then fool me five more times’.
Anyway here are a selection of what I would class as “questionable posts”.
But I’m sure it’s just one big misunderstanding. No matter how many times people explain it to him.
People with opinions lives matter!
It’s all nonsense. His posts are cnuty posts. He knows what he’s doing and his motive is clear.
His Mo is to come into threads like these and basically question how something can be seen as racist, usually when the discussion is on black people. He deliberately tries to undermine it by playing devils advocate. When questioned he then resorts to playing dumb and playing the “my English isn’t good card”... this is quickly followed up by the “I believe everyone is equal” card which people with underlying, covert racism use to pretend that they aren’t racist. But the saying goes ‘fool me once but you can’t then fool me five more times’.
Anyway here are a selection of what I would class as “questionable posts”.
But I’m sure it’s just one big misunderstanding. No matter how many times people explain it to him.
During the London terrorist incident, where he had magically decided the suspects were foreign born before confirmed. Let’s nuke the parasites
incredibly he’s done this twice in this thread.
In the “black players are lazy stereotype”.
Indeed, attacking people for having shite opinions is now worse than homophobia and racism.
People with opinions lives matter!
Well as i said, for me every human is just the same: A human, no matter the color, no matter the race or religion. Everyone who suffers from racism needs help to get rid of it as far as possible. But just like rapists, murderers, pedophiles, etc. it will always be out there, because there will always be a certain amount of bad people in this world, unfortunately. And there is not much we can do against it.
But if i have to make a decision in case of remedy, it would certainly be the gypsies. A minority which suffers from racism and stigmatism and it seems to this day that no one cares.
No disagreement there and it seems like playing dumb is his game plan with all of this, which is why I said give him a pass on 'this one'. Everyone who hasn't been living under a rock will know that flying that banner over the arena was done with racist intentions, and if he has a history of posts like you claim then it becomes even more clear what he's doing.