Jesus. I rest my case.
Erik ten Hag - Manchester United manager
- Thread starter sewey89
- Start date
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik @Rood and Imran @Annihilate Now! start with the good news by celebrating Manchester United Women's emphatic FA Cup win over Spurs at Wembley and the future of manager Marc Skinner.
Then it's the bad news and the ever worsening form of our Men with losses to Arsenal and Palace.
Finally the main debate - ETH Out now or keep him until the end of the season - if not longer. Are you Team Nik or Team Imran?
I literally started with 'I'm not saying it's likely'. We all start on zero points next season. I just don't see the point in limiting your ambition before a ball is even kicked.
Next season in particular is going to be very unusual with World Cup. There could be some very odd results and injuries caused by that interruption.
Good episode I found floating about on Twitter.
Summary
Summary
- Go Ahead Eagles:
- Suriname is a former dutch colony, GAE had a lot of Surinamese players and ETH connected well with all different ethnicities. Sometimes pats, sometimes approached hard, no one was mad for not being played etc.
- Tells the truth in a way that doesn't piss people off.
- If he has something to say, has images, videos etc.
- Players saw football in a different way.
- Player asked ETH for training off (not super important session player thought - training session after match). ETH didn't agree. ETH is not about training to train - there's always a goal behind each session.
- Won playoffs with GAE - brought them back for the first time in 17 years.
- Bayern
- Tobias Schweinsteiger: Older brother of Bastian - in the last two years of his football. First coach where he felt every training session, every warmup / ronda made sense. Side, player improved a lot. First time he believed players could be improved.
- He improved positioning game, pressing game. Understood why he needed to be in a certain space. The game was in a certain situation and he knew by being in a certain position he'd create another scenario.
- Detail on passing drills: Playing from A->B->C. Coached every detail, every pass, every bounce, every touch. Wasn't used to that. He wanted players to be perfect in the passing drill.
- No bouncing balls! If the ball bounced, it was a bad pass. Good pass => better chance to score.
- Won the regional championship with U23s
- Dynamic with Guardiola
- ETH liked the style Cruyff played. Good connection with Pep and talked to him a bit. Took some drills from Pep's training and implemented it in the U-23 side.
- First team trained at an extremely high level pass -> first touch -> pass -> first touch extremely quickly. Ten Hag was impressed so he pushed the U23s towards that as well.
- Sometimes it's good for a coach to see as well: you might think your team's performance in a drill is good but one of the best teams in the world running the drill at a much higher level sets the benchmark.
- FC Utrecht
- Explained players who are not in starting XI why their role is important in a certain game and kept them ready all the time.
- Gets to know people and communicates well, keeps people on their tip toes and makes sure they're ready.
- Normally starters get a lot more attention than the subs. He made sure guys that are not starting, when you get in, this is what's expected from you.
- Invested the same amount of time he put in to the starters as the non starters.
- Starters vs Non Starters, took some non starters put them in the starters team etc.
- Boymans: Handled every player well. Ten Hag knew Boymans was smoking cigarettes and knew how to approach the player etc. Every player had their own approach.
- Ajax
- Not a lot on this.
After Rangnick disaster appointment as manager and U-turn as consultant appointment by Murtough, there are lots of doubts to the so called new football structure. It's like nothing has changed since Woodward time. We all would like to pretend that this time will be different. And we have been saying that for 10 years.
The reports indicating that ETH now has control over player recruitment. This can only be good news taking away the responsibility from Murtough. Based on Ajax recruitment during ETH time he has done an excellent job. I rather trust him than our so called new football structure. After all, it's the same people that failed badly for the last 10 years are still running the club.
The reports indicating that ETH now has control over player recruitment. This can only be good news taking away the responsibility from Murtough. Based on Ajax recruitment during ETH time he has done an excellent job. I rather trust him than our so called new football structure. After all, it's the same people that failed badly for the last 10 years are still running the club.
Giving managers so much power over transfers is the reason we’ve been so shite in the market. And no, ETH wasn’t in charge of recruitment at Ajax.
Wasn't Overmars the mastermind behind Ajax's recruitment?
Lets back into top 4 first and concentrate on playing proper football. We need to walk before we can run.
Our managers keep concentrating on short term success instead of building a proper platform that will naturally flow trophies.
Obviously anything is possible, but we should not be hoping or expecting for anything more than a decent cup run + top 4 again IMO. Really depends on the level of investment too.
I understand but I rather trust him than our "football structure". Anyway, it's been reported that he has control over player recruitment.
As for Ajax, he worked very closely with Overmars to sign the players suitable for his system.
Hope this will be also implemented in Man Utd to make us successful again.
With inputs from ETH to suit his style of play. Both of them work very well together.
Ajax signed players with very different characteristics, it's actually one of the appeals of someone like ETH. Overmars didn't sign players that suited a particular style of play and ETH wasn't bothered by it.
This is still a ridiculously negative view point. We’ve just come off our worst ever season and finished 6th while the teams above and around us are bang average outside of City and Liverpool. Basically you are saying you expect Ten Hag to have zero impact when that’s his only job. This is the same sort of moving the goalposts many of us have had to put up with with Ragnick. The squad is nowhere near as bad as made out, a decent manager which a summer window behind him, pisses top four.
That's weird. I could've sworn I wrote my post in clear English.
I get your point about negativity because people are being ridiculous but I also believe that we need to be realistic, 6th is currently our level, that's where a decent coach can take this imbalanced squad. Now I believe that ETH is more than decent and that eventually he will find a way to elevate numerous players performances, so I expect us to compete for top 4 but I wouldn't say that we will do it easily, at least not if ETH is just decent.
We’ve signed world class players. Just had massively under par managers and coaches. Pogba, Bruno, De Gea, Varane, Di Maria, Sancho, Ronaldo, have all shown world class levels and under the right coach’s can be miles better than the season just gone.
Hmm... ETH wasn't bothered and has no inputs on players recruitment to suit his style of play at Ajax?
Anyway, luckily he has demanded control over player recruitment in Man Utd. This can only be good thing for us.
Yohan Kebab?
I disagree we finished 6th while being in complete free fall. A decent coach would have us competing for top 4 easily (as Conte showed at Spurs with a weaker squad). An elite coach (which I hope ETH is) should be looking at Chelsea in third and thinking they are a really average and beatable marker. City and Liverpool are still too far off but there’s no reason for our expectations to be that low.
No. Ajax didn't sign players based on playing style in fact while Ajax under ETH kept a certain identity, the type of players, the roles given to players and overall style changed based on the players at his disposal.
You're right. His English isn't good for a Dutchman. He's been taking English lessons before he got the job, so nothing to worry about.
To me they are not world class except Ronaldo first stint with us.
Many people here wanted DDG to be replaced and Bruno to improve his passing.
Varane and Sancho are both average so far. Di Maria? Really?
World class player can perform up to a very high standard even with a shit manager.
This is a given for a top class manager to make best use of whatever resources are available. Surely a manager has certain inputs? And he has been known to be working very closely with Overmars. ETH is also known to be very detailed and like to control many things leaving little to chances. Hence, he has also demanded for control over player recruitment before signing for Man Utd.
We weren't in free fall, United has been very stable this season. From October to the end of the season United has been between the 4th and 8th position every weeks, 10 times 6th, 7 times 7th, 6 times 4th, 4 times 5th and 2 times 8th.
We haven't had any free fall and there is nothing suggesting that we didn't end at the position we deserved.
No it's not. The Ten Hag signings at Ajax were rather horrible. Overmars just had to give him some to keep him happy, but most signings are more Ajax signings than Ten Hag signings.
I understand your post perfectly. And I find it strange to say least. But it's not the only of that type here unfortunately.
This really worries me. We have promised ETH to give him control over player recruitment before he signed for us. Praying hard now.
BTW, how to differentiate which is ETH or Overmars signing?
Having some inputs and having control are two different things. Also the point I made was that Ajax didn't sign players to suit a play style unlike what you suggested since he routinely had completely different players replacing departures. Ajax and ETH changed things based on the players at their disposal.
Jose fans probably.
And do you understand the difference between a question and a statement?
I don't care if you want to rip into pessimists - just make sure you tag the right posters.
How do you guys know which player is ETH signing and which player is Overmars/club signing?
Usually there will always be an argument around this, club signing vs manager signing.
So what's the question. Is it likely he'll get sacked sooner rather than later?
I think people assume that the signing of his former players were based on his own demands.
Ajax and ETH changed things based on the players at their disposal but still within ETH's style of play that he was able to coach and the evidence was they won numerous titles together. Otherwise the players would be redundant. I certainly thinks that the manager surely has more influence one way or another. That's why ETH and Overmars worked very well together.
Pep and Klopp are also having strong influence on player recruitment in their respective club.
Yeah true, I think those transfers are easy to guess. My question was about players like Tadic and other players who never worked with ETH before, how do people know.
The only fans that will be a problem are the ones who are still in love with previous managers. Well, one in particular
No. As much as you want to insist what actually happened more often than not is that ETH would change the way players play including changing their positions while also adapting tactics to the players at his disposal. You seem to think that ETH is dogmatic when he isn't.
Jose, Ole, or Ralf? take your pickThe only fans that will be a problem are the ones who are still in love with previous managers. Well, one in particular
Oh, you think it's likely that he'll never be sacked? Wow. I guess I am a pessimist compared to you.
So, yes, I think he will get sacked one day. Hopefully not in the next five years. The article I referred to said he will most likely be sacked within a year. I wanted to hear what people thought about it.
So, the question, "will he be sacked within a year?" does not mean I think he will be.
I don't think anyone as suggested that they know for each and every players. And I don't think anyone should.
I never said that. Really dont know how did you come to that conclusion.
Stop going around the bush, tell us how do you really feel.The only fans that will be a problem are the ones who are still in love with previous managers. Well, one in particular