I had a conversation with a City fan the other day. He was proud to point out that Ten Hag had as many points as Rangnick at the same point of the season. He ommited the fact we've won a (mickey mouse) cup, are in a final and had a decent run in the Europa League with a shite squad. Give Ten Hag time to get the players he needs with the right mindset and see what happens. We can't keep flipping from manager to manager and adding to this Frankenstein's monster of a squad. Honestly, has Arteta had a better season than us if we get top 4? I remember when people (including myself) thought he'd be gone before Ole.
Erik ten Hag - Manchester United manager
- Thread starter sewey89
- Start date
Real pleasure to read this. It's been torture hearing people aren't happy with EtH's decisions when he's having to make them with both arms and a leg tied behind his back.
And who was responsible for putting us in a strong position 3 months ago?
Also, not sure what you mean by a squad like ours should be competing for a title. Our only CF who can stay fit wouldn't start for most other PL clubs and our GK is statistically the worst in the league for claiming crosses and is terrible with the ball at his feet, thus preventing us from effectively playing out from the back, which is a key component for any title challenging team in 2023.
Agree. The “highest” standard is not static but a continuously evolving one. It’s actually more about we haven’t evolved ours to match or exceed the highest. We are now trying to catch up with them but at least most of us have realized it and wanted a change. It needs our belief and support, and also a change of owners.
people who think we should be in a title challenge with the squad we have may be borderline deluded.
With 7 of the 11 starting XI the same players from last year(s), 3 of the new 4 starters are new to the league/country, with Eriksen the 4th starter.
Martial didn't even play the full season at United last year and wasn't a starter!
The core squad is the same from last year's truly horrible season.
I don't really come to this thread often lately but if there is someone who is complaining about what ten Hag has done this season, I'm shocked. If your complain is the playing style then I hope you are the same person who thinks new keeper to replace DDG is priority because we ain't playing good football if our keeper can't retain possession and just hoof the ball. I thought ten Hag decision tactically has been good or understandable given the squad's limitation he has, only time I remember that I questioned his decision was when he chose to play McTominay and Weghorst up front together against Newcastle United.
The only qualm I have with him is that he's not gotten as much out of the squad as he's gotten out of the first 11. And yes I understand there's a limitation of quality, but not to the degree that we've seen - where a few B team players being added basically drops the team's quality off a cliff. His overusing of the first XI, a problem he had even when he was at Ajax, is a big reason behind why the squad is this gassed at the end of the season and fairly prone to niggles and injuries. (Scheduling of course is still the primary problem)
Other than that I have no complaints. Man got a team with basically no finishers, so while our chance creation has increased, our goal scoring is garbage and mostly Rashford, who scores a small percentage of the big chances he gets, making it difficult to trust him as a goalscorer even though he has the most in the team. Defensively we've been head and shoulders above last season, Varane and Martinez have basically nursed a dodgy De Gea to a golden glove, AWB has shown unlikely improvement and Shaw had one of his best seasons as a defender (including a relieving stint at CB). And he's handled a lot of drama thrown his way exceptionally well, considering he sacrificed a few gameweeks of football to the Ronaldo circus.
Next season's going to be a nightmare though, I don't think we'll plug enough of the holes in the squad in the summer because of dodgy ownership transitions, and may find ourselves in a similar position in the second half of the season, and I don't think even the positive voices are going to be as patient should that happen.
Other than that I have no complaints. Man got a team with basically no finishers, so while our chance creation has increased, our goal scoring is garbage and mostly Rashford, who scores a small percentage of the big chances he gets, making it difficult to trust him as a goalscorer even though he has the most in the team. Defensively we've been head and shoulders above last season, Varane and Martinez have basically nursed a dodgy De Gea to a golden glove, AWB has shown unlikely improvement and Shaw had one of his best seasons as a defender (including a relieving stint at CB). And he's handled a lot of drama thrown his way exceptionally well, considering he sacrificed a few gameweeks of football to the Ronaldo circus.
Next season's going to be a nightmare though, I don't think we'll plug enough of the holes in the squad in the summer because of dodgy ownership transitions, and may find ourselves in a similar position in the second half of the season, and I don't think even the positive voices are going to be as patient should that happen.
I’m convinced some of you are Liverpool fans in disguise in some psyops shite.
I’d call you spoilt but from what success?
The only other reasonable explanation is that you’re literal children with no discernible reasoning skills.
I’d call you spoilt but from what success?
The only other reasonable explanation is that you’re literal children with no discernible reasoning skills.
Thinking our current squad, this early on under Ten Hag should be competing for the title and being legitimately angry that we weren't 
that's mental.
that's mental.I mean, we don't have a striker and there are other areas of clear weakness
how are we gonna battle it out with City in this state? They pretty much have two great options for every position, not to mention a 40-goal striker. 12 months ago we were a banter club
Surely this deserves a permanent ban.
when the thread skips forward a few pages there's always this brief glimmer of hope that something happened
but nah, someones had a meltdown again
but nah, someones had a meltdown again
Chill out. It’s been dealt with. All calm in this thread. I imagine you’re the classic card waving person trying to get others in trouble.
But out of that six months we have no competitive matches for 2,5 months. So it’d be 3,5 months then?
Ole thread vibes coming out of this one lately
Just sort the away form for next season and we will be flying. This man clearly knows what he’s doing.
A squad like ours? A gk with poppadoms for wrists and who shits himself at the thought of physical contact, a backup cb with the vision and football brain of Maradona (after he died) a winger who is so fecking meek he should be offered out by cats protection for re-homing, out of 4 forwards 1 is a sick criminal who can't play, 1 is made of plywood and afraid of running, 1 decided he would rather play in one of the shittest leagues in the world so he can pretend he is still good, and because of this we signed a lamppost on loan. Yeah that a title challenging squad if I ever saw one!
Nearly everyone has been poor for multiple reasons. One being a world cup in the middle of a season and a massively congested fixture list which has made the whole thing a massive slog. Only City who have two world class players in almost every position have managed to get through without faltering.
This argument is so boring and done to death. City only won the league because the other 19 teams were poor? We only won the treble because the league, FA cup teams and CL teams were poor?
It's just so abstract you can use it however you'd like. Not taking into account the ridiculous amount of games we've had, all condensed together, the key injuries, having no striker all season etc.. is silly.
True. But if we get new owners can you see him lasting if we were bad until October?
Personally I love Hag. I think he will turn it around and even win the FA Cup. A few good signings and I think we will be contenders next season.
There's absolutely nothing to "turn around". Nobody even expected us to be in 4th this season, never mind winning a trophy. Without a proper striker for most of the season too, injuries to key players and the squad being severely stretched given the schedule. He's done a fantastic job this season.
Depends. If the owners are smart and think long-term, he could.
Anyway we’ve not even finished this season so I don’t really see the point in discussing what happens if we start the next one badly.
We haven’t controlled games at home the way we’ve done for our last 4 games for a decade. The fact we’re missing chances is clouding what have been some very impressive performances. Brighton away first half was also the best I’ve seen a side play against Brighton (Everton debacle aside) for some time. A top striker and we’d have scored a few goals in that half. I don’t really get how people can’t see that we’ve made progress or how he wants to play. The building blocks are there.
So, this squad of ours supposedly should compete for a title but at the same time play horrible and go through a second horror season in a row. What is it now? Are they good enough to fight for a title or do you see this squad for what it really is? Because most people see this squad lacks serious quality and therefore it IS a solid season to build upon.
Looking very likely for Top 4, a trophy won, with a chance for another is a horror season might be the stupidest take I’ve seen on here recently.
Mate, I don't know what happend but you are coming across a little hot headed. I am totally on your side, that some of the praise is a bit shallow but going full force into the opposite direction isn't helping as well. Take one thing as constructive criticism: Don't expect the people in here to have the same understanding of certain words like you have. When you go literal, it all falls apart.
Good post. I agree. The bolded part is worrying for me too... Especially seeing that some developments are taking place that also happend before the rift in the fan base during Oles time as a manager. For the record, as long as I think the club is moving in the right direction, I probably would be fine with losing out on European football. Given the right circumstances even next year. Turning us into a modern club on the right track isn't an easy track. There was always to be pain involved. I am confident in the manager those days. Now it is on the recruiting team.
Yeah polarization is already happening. And I think, it has more to do with the enthusiastic'ness of some of his fans than with the actual events on the pitch.
Maybe you have a little too many people on your ignore-list by now but that surely isn't true. If you didn't expect it, thats obviously fine, but generalization doesn't work. And by the way, most if not all people were worried for 4th because of battling with City, Liverpool and Chelsea and having Arsenal and Spurs in the mix. Liverpool, Chelsea and Spurs took themselves out of the equasion yet Newcastle sits currently in front of us. Again - if that doesn't change your stance, thats perfectly fine but I think, it is reasonable to at least discuss it.
Out of interest (and to be able to put your choice of words in perspective): How would you describe the job that Howe and De Zerbi did this season?
You say our squad was good enough to challenge for the title without Varane, Martinez and a striker
Pile oooooon!
The stats show that our performance drops off significantly when we don‘t play our preferred eleven, you are wrong on that point.
There are no easy games in the PL where you can put in some young players and get a result.
Basically, with the success we have had in all cups we screwed ourselves because we don‘t have a bench good enough to compete in all of them.
If we don‘t plug holes in summer, we are indeed in trouble. It has nothing to do with 10 Hag though.
In what way has it been dealt with? All you've done is double down on what you originally said.
Your posts have come across as unhinged
I’ve received points by a moderator. Done. Move on.
While I largely agree with what you've said here, it does rely on Ten Hag actually wanting to oust De Gea. I can accept Ten Hag being pragmatic in his first season but his comments in recent weeks are concerning - if he doesn't make a clean break from him De Gea this summer, that puts an automatic question mark over his judgement.
It's fine being pragmatic in the early phases but there has to come a time where he fully commits to implementing his playstyle, if he's ever going to do it. De Gea is such a huge obstacle in us achieving that, and he's one of our highest earners. If he makes the wrong decision on that I would probably feel a bit disillusioned before the summer window has even begun.
Last season our point tally was 58 and this season we already have 66. How can anyone say it's not an improvement on last season ?
As a few people have pointed out, we have one of the worst xG gaps in the league. We should have scored c. 10 more goals than we have, which makes perfect sense because we don't have a damn striker, and haven't for the whole season. If that deficit was even halved we'd easily been done with top 4 and this discussion would be very different.
None of that is ETH's fault. Weghorst was worth a try given the extraordinarily limited options available. We have no youth strikers worth a punt. Martial can't play more than about 200 minutes a season, and has lost a lot of what he used to have. And that's it.
Take most of the top 10's backup centre forward, stick em into our first XI and we'd have significantly more points. And no, ETH couldn't sort that in the summer because the ego hadn't worked out what to do yet.
None of that is ETH's fault. Weghorst was worth a try given the extraordinarily limited options available. We have no youth strikers worth a punt. Martial can't play more than about 200 minutes a season, and has lost a lot of what he used to have. And that's it.
Take most of the top 10's backup centre forward, stick em into our first XI and we'd have significantly more points. And no, ETH couldn't sort that in the summer because the ego hadn't worked out what to do yet.
I agree with what you're saying and I don't believe DDG will be the #1 next season. But from what I've read about ten Hag over the years, his tactics/strategy can only be implemented if he has the right culture in the dressing room. And our dressing room culture has deteriorated over the years from what has been reported, hence ten Hag also wanted to keep Matic around for another season due to his professionalism, leadership and influence on the players. DDG is also said to be the same in that regard and having been the #1 for over a decade, he has influence and gravitas to help with maintaining dressing room standards.
All the players that have been brought to the club on a permanent deal under ten Hag, have been players who fit the positional play requirements. And he wanted FdJ aswell, which is a move that didn't materialise. But I have no doubt the players that will be targeted under him will be players who will help aid the development of the play style in question. But I think it's important to create a team that's technically excellent on the ball but also has the physical and athletic capabilities to help add variety to the way we play in the EPL.
So along with a well rounded keeper, it's also important to sign a striker who I believe should be able to help us win those second balls both aerially and on the ground when playing out from the back becomes problematic or predictable. There was a statistic I came across earlier this season about Man City playing the most backwards passes, and it made sense, because Ederson passing it long to break the man to man press with the likes of Haaland either running in behind or battling to win the second ball from the long passes from the back, adds variety to the way City play and hence makes them even more dangerous.
I believe ETH is a very intelligent football manager who knows the deficiencies he has in this squad inside and out, and also what it will take to remedy that. He is a manager worth investing in and worth giving 2-3 seasons to show that continuous improvement.
There are times when I've been really disappointed with us this season, being knocked out by Sevilla and that god-awful performance against Newcastle away really irked me more than the drubbing at Liverpool.
We are limping towards the end of the season, but there are factors for that beyond Ten Hags control
I really wish we'd have targeted a striker over a winger in the Summer though - but the situation with Ronaldo was proper causing us problems in the recruitment department in that area of the pitch. I don't blame him for not getting the right players in but Martial was never going to cut it as a main striker for us.
It would be unforgivable if we don't buy a proper No.9 before the start of next season, I don't see how ETH can succeed here if we keep ignoring the obvious.
There are times when I've been really disappointed with us this season, being knocked out by Sevilla and that god-awful performance against Newcastle away really irked me more than the drubbing at Liverpool.
We are limping towards the end of the season, but there are factors for that beyond Ten Hags control
I really wish we'd have targeted a striker over a winger in the Summer though - but the situation with Ronaldo was proper causing us problems in the recruitment department in that area of the pitch. I don't blame him for not getting the right players in but Martial was never going to cut it as a main striker for us.
It would be unforgivable if we don't buy a proper No.9 before the start of next season, I don't see how ETH can succeed here if we keep ignoring the obvious.
This is the biggest issue of our season and mainly the fault of the Glazers. And that's even before we let Ronaldo go and another piece of sht forward was arrested on rape and battery.
Wasn't it similar at Ajax? I.e, a strong first 11 but a big drop-off in quality when it comes to the rest of the squad. Of course, Ajax is known for its academy and their fans tend to wildly overestimate the quality of the people coming through (hey, sounds a lot like United fans actually!), which added significantly to this conversation about his lack of rotation.
Maybe I'm exonerating Ten Hag too much here, but I'd be curious to see what happens when he has a more balanced squad (in terms of quality), cause you do see a lot more line-up variation in positions where he does have better competition. (Like at RB, and he has gone through numerous permutiations in the forward line as well, even when there weren't injuries.)
I'm quite curious about that one. I think the latest is that De Gea would get a new contract with reduced wages and pay-per-game? That doesn't sound like he's seen as a starter. Either way, it would be risky to let De Gea go without any idea about his replacements, while there are so many First XI gaps to fall and only so much money to spend. You could say a new GK is a priority though, but so are a striker and midfielder.
Decisions, decisions! But in any case, anything that's said in the press about transfers seems pretty unreliable, so I think I'd wait with conclusions until the end of the transfer window.
Always great to read your posts Adnan. You probably mentioned it elsewhere, but what level of priority do you think midfield recruitment has for Ten Hag? His starting three seem to be Casemiro-Eriksen-Bruno, but Eriksen probably isn't fully at the right level, and the back-up isn't good enough; I would assume all of McTominay, Fred, and Van de Beek to disappear fairly soon - and possibly Sabitzer, although I could see him staying as cheap and versatile back-up for various positions. (And then I suppose there are some youngsters around; Mainoo?). That means that there really isn't any quality depth in yet another key area onn the pitch (but aren't they all).
Writing this makes me realize how poor squad management has been at United. With Sancho and Martial underperforming, there are also only three quality strikers (Rashford, Antony, Garnacho), Maguire is still dead weight in CB (in a Ten Hag team), and both RBs are middling quality (again, in a Ten Hag team). Given in practice no club (outside City) replaces half a squad in a single season, it will take a couple of windows for Ten Hag to have a proper squad in his image. It will be interesting to see how he continues to work around that.