Anderson | 2013/14 Performances (on loan at Fiorentina)

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Rossa said:
Under 8% is considered having too little fat. I recall reading that Stallone had as low as a 3% body fat percentage when filming Rocky III (I believe) where he fainted repeatedly as a result. If Ronaldo has a 5% body fat percentage, he would probably struggle with the same and he would look far more ripped than he already does. I talked to someone who did fitness and he said he had a 7% body fat percentage at his best and blood veins on his stomach were clearly visible at that time. about 15% is quite normal for men, 5-10% is normal for male athletes - if Anderson has a 9,6% he is still within the normal. Thus for him to shred 4-5 pounds sounds reasonable, but would in no way make him go from overweight to normal - it would make him go from a normal athlete to a slightly above average for an athlete. Body fat is probably just about half the story anyhow.
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So you're saying it's normal for athletes to be between 5-10%, but at the same time you say Ronaldo would struggle if he was 5%?
Based on the general consensus of 5-10% for athletes, 5% is the target, 10% is at the fat end for normal athletes.

Rossa said:
If you talk to cross country skiers and runners, most of them argue that footballers aren't much athletes at all anyhow.
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When one watches Anderson play football at one of the biggest clubs in the world, I can see how they can come to that conclusion.

I'm not knocking the guy, he seems a great character to have in the dressing room, but he has been promising to lose the weight for years. He just doesn't have the will power to fulfill his potential.
 
I doubt any caftard ever meant to suggest that Ando was fat compared to an average human being, but only that he was fat compared to an average prem footballer. Whether "fat" is the right word or not is debatable what is not debatable is that Ando lacked the fitness level required of an average prem footballer.

The more serious issue is his performances. I'd still be very happy with 30 minutes of outstanding football, but he just doesn't deliver the quality of performances you'd expect from a United man. I believe quality football is still in Ando's bones somewhere, but he's got to deal with fitness first and then deal with overhit passes and the mindless running straight at his teammates to whom he has passed the ball. We're not asking for him to become the next sensation, but when he comes on he needs to be more useful. A help, not a hindrance. Every club has a place for players like Ando on their bench and if he can pull himself together he'd be a very nice weapon to bring on the pitch for those cold nights against Stoke.
 
Fergie's gum said:
I'm not a dietician or PT but let's assume he is 72kg, and he should be 70kg to have a body fat percentage of 7% (generous due to body type). 7% is 4.9kg of fat. 6.9kg(4.9+2) of fat is 9.6% body fat. That's almost double the optimum (Ronaldo would probably be 5%).
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You're right, your not a dietician or PT. I don't want to come across as uneccessarily harsh but there's strong fail in this post. I suspect you are talking about things you don't quite understand. Firstly, 5% body fat is not the 'optimum' level for an elite athlete. As someone who has been in and around bodybuilding for the last 10 years, let me tell you how ridiculously hard it is to maintain a bf that low and still hold muscle mass. You can't do it for long, and you feel like shit when you do. Just completely weak and lethargic. Hardly optimal for an elite athlete. Ronaldo is probably the most cut footballer I can think of, but he just doesn't have the vascularity or separation one would get at 5%. He's in the 8-9% range IMO, at a push 7%. Anderson probably 12-13%. I look more cut and have more mass than he does and I'm currently 12%. If we get him under 10% he'll look pretty damn cut.
 
I think we make too big a deal about weight and body size. Players like Rooney, Lampard and Tevez have all been considered fat for a footballer, yet all of them can complete 90 minutes and play on a regular basis. Of course it would help Anderson if he were to lose a few pounds, but I think if he were ever able to play regularly without getting injured, the way the three I mentioned do, his extra weight wouldn't be such an issue. The best way to get into footballing shape is by actually playing regularly and that's something Anderson hasn't managed to do.
 
Only just read those quotes, he seems to have developed a maturity now. It seems like he's been here for a lifetime now and we've still not seen his consistency which is frustrating. I'm glad to hear him say how frustrated he is as well and to hear that he wants to stay and play 90 minutes is a lot better than hearing that he wanted to leave before.
 
manutddjw said:
I think we make too big a deal about weight and body size. Players like Rooney, Lampard and Tevez have all been considered fat for a footballer, yet all of them can complete 90 minutes and play on a regular basis. Of course it would help Anderson if he were to lose a few pounds, but I think if he were ever able to play regularly without getting injured, the way the three I mentioned do, his extra weight wouldn't be such an issue. The best way to get into footballing shape is by actually playing regularly and that's something Anderson hasn't managed to do.
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I agree with parts of this. Rooney has never really looked in the shape of an elite athlete but he has a terrific engine. However I think the best way to get in footballing shape is on the training pitch. That's where the hard hours are put in. Matches provided sharpness and experience, but proper fitness takes time and dedication behind the scenes. If he was eating right and consistently putting in the work, weight wouldn't be an issue at all. Injuries are another question. Seems like he has at least embraced the importance of nutrition and recovery, finally.

Rooney is a perfect example of this. Plays a ton of games but can so often look unfit mid season. I attribute this to poor off the field discipline. I.e. poor nutritional habits, drinking, smoking and less than optimal recovery. That's all that separates him from a top star like Ronaldo IMO. He'd be in the same bracket if he had the same discipline. Too late now probably.
 
I do this to my parents every year. He's lying, I can tell from experience.
 
You just cannot hate this guy. Everyear I hope it's the one he breaks through. Just one season without injuries could help wonders.
 
Fergie's gum said:
So you're saying it's normal for athletes to be between 5-10%, but at the same time you say Ronaldo would struggle if he was 5%?
Based on the general consensus of 5-10% for athletes, 5% is the target, 10% is at the fat end for normal athletes.
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I'm saying I seriously doubt that Ronaldo has a 5% body fat percentage because, as a poster below said, that is very hard to maintain. Many athletes vary quite a bit in terms of fitness and weight because they have shorter seasons, whereas a footballer needs to stay fit for 10 months - you can't stay at a 5% for that duration. 5% isn't the target, it is one end of the "scale" for athletes and 10% is the other. There would be a a lot of people in between that. If Ando is about 10 or slightly below then he is within normal.

Fergie's gum said:
When one watches Anderson play football at one of the biggest clubs in the world, I can see how they can come to that conclusion.

I'm not knocking the guy, he seems a great character to have in the dressing room, but he has been promising to lose the weight for years. He just doesn't have the will power to fulfill his potential.
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You are knocking the guy. The same applies to the likes of Gerrard, Rooney etc who can regularly consume alcohol whilst competing at "the highest level." Most athletes do not consume alcohol whilst competing and some have sworn it off completely.
 
I've been a doubter.

But surely a World Cup year in his home country will get him extra motivated this year. It's going to be tough for him to get in the squad, but if he performs for us then he's got a very good shout. I mean wasn't Big Phil saying he's going to be one of the best, when Anderson came on the scene.
 
Bojan11 said:
I've been a doubter.

But surely a World Cup year in his home country will get him extra motivated this year. It's going to be tough for him to get in the squad, but if he performs for us then he's got a very good shout. I mean wasn't Big Phil saying he's going to be one of the best, when Anderson came on the scene.
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He has not been in the squad for 4 years and there are about a dozen players who are ahead of him. He has no chance in getting in that squad.
 
psychdelicblues said:
He has not been in the squad for 4 years and there are about a dozen players who are ahead of him. He He has no chance in getting in that squad.
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Have to agree really. Hopefully he has the intentions of going out to prove people wrong.

I think their are a couple of players who will benefit from a new start and I think Anderson is one of those. He's had a tough couple of years with injuries etc.., and he has a chance now under Moyes to put all that behind him and start a fresh.
 
ghaliboy said:
There are some rich feckers in this thread from hearing that one :lol:.

But I hope he does well every year. He's very likable and not a squad twat whos moaning for play time. I'm not going to turn around and tell everyone to feck off if he goes RvP and bangs in 30/30 for the season but I'd love to see him have a big impact and would certainly take pleasure in some people realizing that he has improved as a player.
Cina said:
You realize that your reasons for keeping him was that he's likable and doesn't complain, neither of which have anything to do with him as a footballer. If anything, you're the one making him look pointless.
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Revan said:
These are totally rubbish reasons for keeping him. Just cause he's likable doesn't mean that we should keep him. A player that gets millions of pounds every year should contribute more than being likable. And about not moaning? How can he moan that he at times is rubbish, while most of the times he's injured. I like him and when he is on form is a very good player but that happens about 5 times a year. The only reason we should keep him is because we are short in that department but if we can sign someone he should be sold regardless that he looks a funny guy.
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If you'll allow me to elaborate, considering it was an off topic side point in a thread unrelated to Anderson.

The best British manager saw it fit to give Anderson and Cleverley a solid go at the start of these last two seasons past and made them both an integral part of the first team in doing so. It's rather unfortunate that Anderson was injured last year and has had some subsequent injury problems since.

You don't get to start for United being some two-bit clogger who's stealing a living at this level. Part of the fans hope that he has a good season comes from knowing there is a decent footballer there somewhere. Behind whatever is in the way there is someone the fans want to get behind and want to hope can be an integral part of our season or a catalyst for praise during tough times on the pitch. Having seen the worth of other players who enjoy their time at the club that boast good records and probably 'deserve' playing time there are three in our squad that get honorable mentions for both reasons. Chicharito being one that could walk into most sides on the planet right now but is happy with his current role at United. The other being Welbeck an academy and local product who despite having some problems last year still managed to get plenty of game time and development time. It's these types of personalities in a squad that you need for balance. Danny probably got more time than he deserved.. Chicha probably didn't. Yet neither are really complaining either way.

The same goes for Anderson. The lad clearly has an ability that is worth pursuing or he would have been sold quick fecking smart. I'm not like in my original post saying he's going to turn into a world class planet smashing world beater but as long as his role in the squad is to strive to better himself and one day can achieve that then he poses no threat to the balance of the squad. Which is pretty helpful when trying to keep a harmonious squad in todays age of overpaid and over quoted moany footballers.
 
I just don't think he has the intelligence and calmness needed for a centre midfielder.

I want him to stay, but only because we have so little options in midfield.
 
Cina said:
he was barely given any chances last year though. Carrick, Giggs and Cleverley were all preferred to him, Jones and Rooney were used in midfield instead of him. I think SAF finally lost patience with him last season, and now he's being linked to Wigan. I'd say the only reason he hasn't been sold is because we're short of options right now.
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From what i remember of watching him last season although he didn't get a good run of games when he played he played pretty well. I find myself thinking of Fergie's cow analogy....I honestly believe if Anderson played for another club people om here would be wanting to sign him.

I just hope he can finally shake off his injury problems because if he can then i think we will have a very good central midfielder who has the potential (if he dedicates himself to improving) to become top class.
 
Cina said:
he was barely given any chances last year though. Carrick, Giggs and Cleverley were all preferred to him, Jones and Rooney were used in midfield instead of him. I think SAF finally lost patience with him last season, and now he's being linked to Wigan. I'd say the only reason he hasn't been sold is because we're short of options right now.
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Exactly. He can be good twice or five times in a season but that isn't enough. It is very strange when I see people saying that if he can improve his fitness and won't get injured he'll become a great player. These are two things he couldn't do in 6 years, I don't get how he's going to improve his fitness and not get injured now. It's blind faith.
 
Cina said:
I highly doubt that.

if he played for another club we'd be doing what the Arse and Pool fans do and laugh about his fitness issues and failures as a footballer.
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I think most people would argue that he had great potential and that he could be a great signing if this and that. His failures as a footballer is something I think only you would argue - how could you possibly be a failure as a footballer when you get games for United? You must be Pele or something.

He has everything our midfield needs, and what most people with sense still argue is that IF (the big if) he can stay injury free, he can be a very important player for us. When some posters argue that he is slow and can't pass and can't do this or that it just makes me cringe. He has all the attributes needed, but he lacks a good spell of being injury free. What point is there in selling him if we can't get much from a sale anyhow?
 
Rossa said:
I think most people would argue that he had great potential and that he could be a great signing if this and that. His failures as a footballer is something I think only you would argue - how could you possibly be a failure as a footballer when you get games for United? You must be Pele or something.

He has everything our midfield needs, and what most people with sense still argue is that IF (the big if) he can stay injury free, he can be a very important player for us. When some posters argue that he is slow and can't pass and can't do this or that it just makes me cringe. He has all the attributes needed, but he lacks a good spell of being injury free. What point is there in selling him if we can't get much from a sale anyhow?
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Duh. Problem is "this and that" happened, therefore he clearly would not be a great signing for a club like Man Utd.
 
Cina said:
Duh. Problem is "this and that" happened, therefore he clearly would not be a great signing for a club like Man Utd.
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Duh. But people on here still argue that he has no pace, slow as feck I think I read somewhere, can't pass the ball and basically has no skills - obviously even you, who hate Ando (I preferred that tag-line to your golden shower one), can see that he has some very welcoming attributes and has shown that he CAN play well (if this and that).
 
The local kebab houses must be bricking it about the prospect of losing both Anderson and Rooney from the city.
 
Rossa said:
Duh. But people on here still argue that he has no pace, slow as feck I think I read somewhere, can't pass the ball and basically has no skills - obviously even you, who hate Ando (I preferred that tag-line to your golden shower one), can see that he has some very welcoming attributes and has shown that he CAN play well (if this and that).
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I don't hate him, don't believe everything you see in a tagline, Christ.

I like Anderson, he seems like a good guy and all that, and I rated him very high when he was younger, probably higher than Nani actually, but still, he's not nearly justified any of his potential here and I think most of it is down to him and his own fitness issues, that's why I'm so critical of him as a player.
 
Cina said:
I don't hate him, don't believe everything you see in a tagline, Christ.

I like Anderson, he seems like a good guy and all that, and I rated him very high when he was younger, probably higher than Nani actually, but still, he's not nearly justified any of his potential here and I think most of it is down to him and his own fitness issues, that's why I'm so critical of him as a player.
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Cina is spot on. Ando is a nice guy but he doesn't done enough as a footballer over the last six seasons to warrant high praise as a footballer. Still, he's a decent squad player but when he his contract winds down to its end, we should just let him go.
 
Cina said:
I don't hate him, don't believe everything you see in a tagline, Christ.

I like Anderson, he seems like a good guy and all that, and I rated him very high when he was younger, probably higher than Nani actually, but still, he's not nearly justified any of his potential here and I think most of it is down to him and his own fitness issues, that's why I'm so critical of him as a player.
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I don't - I see now that I should have used a smiley ;)

That other paragraph - fair enough and a good point. He's played well tonight though, hasn't he? Seems like there's some urgency in his play. Id do think he burns too much energy on some more or less pointless runs at times though - they must drain energy like a mother******
 
Have again completed 90 minutes and didn't looked fecked at the end of the match :eek:
 
Thought he did very well. Always said that for me, a fit Anderson has to start ahead of Cleverley anyday of the week.
 
Perhaps Moyes forcing him to play every minute of every possible United match might make him somewhat fit.

Interesting to see where he finds himself in the pecking order come start of the season.
 
Yeah, looked good to me too, one of our best players today, and didn't look tired at the end.
 
Anderson looked more energetic in the last 10 mins than he ever is

A fit Anderson - and he's not quite there yet - will be a real asset

Moyes has put a padlock on his fridge
 
Come on guys. Don't do this to yourselves. You know he's a couple of Happy Meals and a hammy from not playing till christmas.
 
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