Where did you read he wanted out? He’s never ever stated anything like that, it’s usually people making crap up and posting it as some kind of truth. He’s negotiating a contract with United, that’s all anyone has heard thus far.Anything new on Gomes. Last I read was he wanted out. Don't know if it's true as haven't heard anymore on this.
https://bleacherreport.com/articles...chester-united-after-rejecting-contract-offerWhere did you read he wanted out? He’s never ever stated anything like that, it’s usually people making crap up and posting it as some kind of truth. He’s negotiating a contract with United, that’s all anyone has heard thus far.
I read it in early November mate, That's why I asked the Question, if it is true.Where did you read he wanted out? He’s never ever stated anything like that, it’s usually people making crap up and posting it as some kind of truth. He’s negotiating a contract with United, that’s all anyone has heard thus far.
Where did you read he wanted out? He’s never ever stated anything like that, it’s usually people making crap up and posting it as some kind of truth. He’s negotiating a contract with United, that’s all anyone has heard thus far.
Actually you could see his quality for the first team too, unlike Chong. No idea why you lump Gomes and Chong together. Gomes' problem hasn't been him making awful decisions, and looking technically inept. His performances have merely been quiet. And I think this was exacerbated by him being played on the left wing in 2 starts. There is more of an onus to dribble past players and causing havoc by running at defenses when on the wings. So failing to do that can make you look like you've done nothing. Just think of Greenwood's time on the wings. It's not like he's been terrorizing defenses from the wing. He's just succeeding at translating his finishing onto the first team when given an opportunity. A lot of his performances have been reliant on his goal scoring, so that him being more passive (not forcing the issue) is much more tolerable on the wings.Because that worked out so well for Garner and Chong. Some of you are starting to sound like the Ravel crowd, who to this day still thinks he 'has a shot' at the highest level.
I agree. I think he does need to get better with his movement off the ball. However, it's hard to learn that when not playing for the first team. He gets more time and space for the youth teams.A lot of supporters evaluate Gomes based on what he do when he is on the ball. The problem is when he is off it if you compare him to Lingard, Pereira and even Mata. And remember; a player spend 90 % of the game off the ball, maybe even more if you are an attacker.
Gomes has disappointed me a bit. I would expect a young player to come in with enthusiasm and drive. Instead he acts like a veteran past his peak who lost his mobility and expect everyone to adjust. Even Zlatan gave us a lot more movement (especially in the build up).
To be fair to Lingard, he was decent and I don't think any other 10 in our team would have done better. He was a key player in several of our counter-attacks, which Michael Cox at The Athletic pointed out brilliantly. Lingard has not been great this season or last, but against City and Spurs he definitely did his job.Lingard didn't really play well vs Spurs and City. He was his usual average self, our team winning those games with him starting doesn't mean he played well
To some degree, I agree. But I worry because it looks a bit attitude related. I might be wrong. But his style is so arrogant. Chong is not as talented, and his movement is not good, but at least he moves alot!Actually you could see his quality for the first team too, unlike Chong. No idea why you lump Gomes and Chong together. Gomes' problem hasn't been him making awful decisions, and looking technically inept. His performances have merely been quiet. And I think this was exacerbated by him being played on the left wing in 2 starts. There is more of an onus to dribble past players and causing havoc by running at defenses when on the wings. So failing to do that can make you look like you've done nothing. Just think of Greenwood's time on the wings. It's not like he's been terrorizing defenses from the wing. He's just succeeding at translating his finishing onto the first team when given an opportunity. A lot of his performances have been reliant on his goal scoring, so that him being more passive (not forcing the issue) is much more tolerable on the wings.
This is a better critique of Gomes
I agree. I think he does need to get better with his movement off the ball. However, it's hard to learn that when not playing for the first team. He gets more time and space for the youth teams.
Honestly I don't need Cox to tell me about what I saw with my own eyes. The bar is set so so low with him that something truly average seems extraordinaryTo be fair to Lingard, he was decent and I don't think any other 10 in our team would have done better. He was a key player in several of our counter-attacks, which Michael Cox at The Athletic pointed out brilliantly. Lingard has not been great this season or last, but against City and Spurs he definitely did his job.
Moving a lot without any real purpose is useless.To some degree, I agree. But I worry because it looks a bit attitude related. I might be wrong. But his style is so arrogant. Chong is not as talented, and his movement is not good, but at least he moves alot!
I'm just pointing out that he deserves some credit for those games. Obviously, he has been below par otherwise.Honestly I don't need Cox to tell me about what I saw with my own eyes. The bar is set so so low with him that something truly average seems extraordinary
Anyone said otherwise?Moving a lot without any real purpose is useless.
So he deserves credit for not being shit in those games? Is this the standard we hold a Man United player earning £100k a week to now? “Just don’t be shit” Because he was nothing special in those games and he’s being praised by his fans on here because we won and I honestly don’t think you’d be saying he deserves any praise had we lost those games.I'm just pointing out that he deserves some credit for those games. Obviously, he has been below par otherwise.
That's the unfortunate truth.Gomes abilities are not suited to the way we play. Simple as that. Same as any other technical but not physical player would be next to worthless in a team preferring to play low block and possessionless counter-attacking football.
We didn't lose and he played well. Just stop being negative when there's no reason. He played well in those games. His general play is another matter though and he is rightly criticized for that.So he deserves credit for not being shit in those games? Is this the standard we hold a Man United player earning £100k a week to now? “Just don’t be shit” Because he was nothing special in those games and he’s being praised by his fans on here because we won and I honestly don’t think you’d be saying he deserves any praise had we lost those games.
Negative in what way? Did he score ? Did he directly assist a goal as the number 10? Played well in what way? Pressing? Running around? Enlighten me please because I know what I saw in those games and he was average.We didn't lose and he played well. Just stop being negative when there's no reason. He played well in those games. His general play is another matter though and he is rightly criticized for that.
This. Anytime he manages not to be a liability in a game, he’s praised to the heavens.Honestly I don't need Cox to tell me about what I saw with my own eyes. The bar is set so so low with him that something truly average seems extraordinary
He was playing out wide against a static, dug in defence. For most part of the first half and part of the second, Luke Shaw wasn't able or didn't care to bring Gomes into the game by making runs which would have enabled Gomes to pick him out and make some interchanging play. It got better in the second half when Shaw decided to venture forward a bit more. The chance that Chong missed, a horrible miss for that matter was down to Gomes. Astana picked up the ball and attacked from our right back position instantly, and scored. Gomes wasn't playing as a number 10 or defensive midfielder, the attack that led to the goal didn't come down his lane. The miss by Chong and subsequent attack by Astana - from which they equalised - was the main reason we lost. If Chong had scored, we would be 2:0 up and that would be game over for Astana.Of course he would.
Workrate and the ability to press is key for the number 10 position in United's system. It is not suited to Gomes at all.
In that system, the number 10 has more defensive responsibility than the wide players, which is why Ole plays hard working players like Pereira and Lingard there and Gomes wide more often.
Even from there, his lack of workrate cost the team the winner away to Astana.
For a starter Ole has given Chong better playing time than Gomes, even after he played very badly in earlier appearances. And comparing his situation to that of Ravel is head scratching, in my opinion. We also had a Paul Pogba crowd, why don't you use it as a reference? There is no way to know what Gomes can offer is he is not given the chance and many rightly believe Ole hasn't done so. There could be other reasons but ability is not one of them.Because that worked out so well for Garner and Chong. Some of you are starting to sound like the Ravel crowd, who to this day still thinks he 'has a shot' at the highest level.
I understand the bolded a bit but maybe we should cast our mind back to the pre-season when for some inexplicable reason Ole decided to shut him out after playing a good game against Leeds as a midfielder, prefering to give him a token 10 mins or so from the wing against against AC Milan and Spurs. He was lively against those two teams and that is easily understandable. First the entire team was playing, with full backs getting forward as normal. Secondly the opponents were also playing, not with a static defence. Thirdly other team mates were willing to make exchanges with him. I think one of the duties of a manager is to know when and how best to use a player, especially an upcoming one.A lot of supporters evaluate Gomes based on what he do when he is on the ball. The problem is when he is off it if you compare him to Lingard, Pereira and even Mata. And remember; a player spend 90 % of the game off the ball, maybe even more if you are an attacker.
Gomes has disappointed me a bit. I would expect a young player to come in with enthusiasm and drive. Instead he acts like a veteran past his peak who lost his mobility and expect everyone to adjust. Even Zlatan gave us a lot more movement (especially in the build up).
My problem with those who have dismissed Gomes in preference to Lingard is that they can't point to anything Lingard brings to the team apart from his pressing and runnng, and occasional hiding. Yes the hiding accusation is true. I thought it was being overblown until I decided to pay good attention to him versus Everton. At a point it appeared he was determined to counteract his team mates, especially Martial. In that match against city we had Martial racing into space and all Lingard needed to do was make what should be an easy over the top pass. Something even the tiring Matic can pull off. But Lingard failed woefully and the chance to set Martial up was lost. It wasn't even a case of getting the ball over the top but having it out of the best attacking spot. He failed to see the leg or body of a city player right in front of him. What manner of attacking midfield player?Negative in what way? Did he score ? Did he directly assist a goal as the number 10? Played well in what way? Pressing? Running around? Enlighten me please because I know what I saw in those games and he was average.
And if being average equates to playing well, no wonder Ole keeps picking him and we’re where we are. How the standards have fallen at this club.
Actually you could see his quality for the first team too, unlike Chong. No idea why you lump Gomes and Chong together. Gomes' problem hasn't been him making awful decisions, and looking technically inept. His performances have merely been quiet. And I think this was exacerbated by him being played on the left wing in 2 starts. There is more of an onus to dribble past players and causing havoc by running at defenses when on the wings. So failing to do that can make you look like you've done nothing. Just think of Greenwood's time on the wings. It's not like he's been terrorizing defenses from the wing. He's just succeeding at translating his finishing onto the first team when given an opportunity. A lot of his performances have been reliant on his goal scoring, so that him being more passive (not forcing the issue) is much more tolerable on the wings.
This is a better critique of Gomes
I agree. I think he does need to get better with his movement off the ball. However, it's hard to learn that when not playing for the first team. He gets more time and space for the youth teams.
I don't think it's due to arrogance. He's just a very patient player who only takes what defenses give him. My critique in 2017 was this exact criticism. He was being too passive a bit like Kagawa. This is why I used to cringe whenever newbies would label Gomes as a future Messi, when he's more like Iniesta (ignoring quality, only playstyle- although those newbies were ignorantly serious in their hype). That's also been a reason why I feel like he can work as a deeper midfielder, because that passive criticism goes out the window. Gomes is very much a midfielder. I think Greenwood is similar in that he's not a bundle of energy, but his quality shines through with his decision making and his final third quality.To some degree, I agree. But I worry because it looks a bit attitude related. I might be wrong. But his style is so arrogant. Chong is not as talented, and his movement is not good, but at least he moves alot!
The only way to make the best use of your players, and especially upcoming youth players, is to identify their strengths and weaknesses and use them in such way as to maximimise their strengths and minimise their limitations. For most, if not all of our youngsters, it's pretty easy to analyse them as you've done. The question is why our coaching staff don't see what's obvious, and continue to play a not established kid as a winger when he hasn't got the attributes to succeed their. Especially against a static defence and with his team being terrible.I don't think it's due to arrogance. He's just a very patient player who only takes what defenses give him. My critique in 2017 was this exact criticism. He was being too passive a bit like Kagawa. This is why I used to cringe whenever newbies would label Gomes as a future Messi, when he's more like Iniesta (ignoring quality, only playstyle- although those newbies were ignorantly serious in their hype). That's also been a reason why I feel like he can work as a deeper midfielder, because that passive criticism goes out the window. Gomes is very much a midfielder. I think Greenwood is similar in that he's not a bundle of energy, but his quality shines through with his decision making and his final third quality.
Chong is more like Williams. Both players are bundles of energy. These traits are all present even when they (Gomes, Greenwood, Chong, Williams) excel for the youth teams. So it's not a case of these youngsters having upped their standard in attitude. All of them are playing like they would for the youth teams, but obviously the men's game gives them less space, less time, and a tougher physical battle.
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Tbh he should be ahead all 3 of Mata, Lingard and Pereira simply because of how shite the other 3 are.Done well today I thought. Showed some nice bite to win the ball back for the goal.
If he isn't ahead of Lingard for the number 10 spot by now then I don't know what to say.
Thought he was positive from him today (we desperately need him on this forum but he needs to be stronger on the ball.Tbh he should be ahead all 3 of Mata, Lingard and Pereira simply because of how shite the other 3 are.
Precisely.Tbh he should be ahead all 3 of Mata, Lingard and Pereira simply because of how shite the other 3 are.
I can see the quality but he looks so casual off the ball. One big reason no one passed to him, he was strolling around and not making any runs. Does he not realize there are two City players next to him? They will rob him of the ball if they try to pass to him.
Really, why? He didn't do anything spectacular. I'm saying this as a Gomes fan.First time I have been impressed with him in a senior competitive game.
This.Tbh he should be ahead all 3 of Mata, Lingard and Pereira simply because of how shite the other 3 are.