Watching him bounce players off yesterday was such a buzz!
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Season Average Rating
- Appearances
- 43
- Clean sheets
- 19
- Goals
- 1
- Assists
- 6
- Yellow cards
- 7
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik @Rood and Imran @Annihilate Now! start with the good news by celebrating Manchester United Women's emphatic FA Cup win over Spurs at Wembley and the future of manager Marc Skinner.
Then it's the bad news and the ever worsening form of our Men with losses to Arsenal and Palace.
Finally the main debate - ETH Out now or keep him until the end of the season - if not longer. Are you Team Nik or Team Imran?
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How stupid was Janmaat who actually tried the kick and run routine against Valencia - sure he had a head start, but that's just stupid. The Norwegian commentator said towards the end that Valencia had him safe and sound in his back pocket. And that was the second lb he had put in that pocket - nice to have some company, I suppose.
He really is mr consistency these days, but at no less than a 7/10 performance. If Ibra had his finishing boots on, he would easily have had an assist as well. I don't agree with those saying he is less of an attacking threat as yesterday also proved that his crosses are pretty good. He mixes them up a lot more this season. I do wish he had the ability to whip them in sooner at full pelt though, like Nani could.
This just sums him up and shows how wrong people who say he cant cross are.
Think it rather more shows how misleading stats can be tbh.
This just sums him up and shows how wrong people who say he cant cross are.
if this was an individual stat then I would agree but comparing many wingers/full backs keeping all of them in equal footing, surely the parameters for everyone would have been the same.
to me its quite telling that other fullbacks either dont cross as much or arent accurate with their crosses.
Vevside that fits better with your narrative? It's like listening to people say that I don't believe in those numbers or stats because in MY experience. And, to your eyes...
But what does accurate mean in this context?
In this stat it means completing a cross. Why is it better to compete a cross to a player because you've over hit it than have it cut out by a player on the opposition team even though you've put it in the right area?
I simply don't think quality of crosses are a quantity that can be measured in terms of completion rates.
I think stats have their place, but too often in football they're devoid of context to the point of becoming almost meaningless. This is a prime example.
Hes becoming a legend here. Don't think I'd swap him for any other full back in the Prem right now.
To sum up, you believe that his crossing is shit whereas I, and quite a few others here, think his crossing is fine and that he varies it quite a lot. Stats back up our argument, not yours. Of course you think that they are devoid of context. If they backed up your argument, I think you would feel otherwise. The fact of the matter is - he crosses more than any other player in the league, and he's a fullback, and he also completes more crosses than any other player in the league with the highest hit percentage. Seeing as all those players are probably measured using the same methods, I'm not sure how your argument is valid.
It, to me (and I have had this discussion before so I won't go back into it) really puts into perspective the amount of useless head-down fenneling the ball into the box there is instead of taking a touch, looking up and addressing the situation with creative on-ball movement. But we've been there and done that so I won't get into it. He has nearly 20% of our teams crosses for this season as well. We're sitting close to last seasons entire total at around 650 from memory (last year was 7XX something).
I don't really think he should be up there above actual wingers in crosses attempted. That kind of says he's not using the ball to get to the box/byline enough. But ho hum, he's a solid all-round player and not much more can be used as a stick to beat him with. He's having a good season.
I don't really think he should be up there above actual wingers in crosses attempted. That kind of says he's not using the ball to get to the box/byline enough. But ho hum, he's a solid all-round player and not much more can be used as a stick to beat him with. He's having a good season.
I don't think it's a particularly difficult sentence I've written above which explains my problems with the particular stat, but by all means have a try at reading it again because your reply is scarcely relevant to what I have said.
You get the feeling that some on here won't be happy unless Antonio is 100% completion rate on crosses and every one is also an assist 
You think stats can be devoid of context. It was a stat that showed the number of crosses and how accurate they were. How was that stat devoid of context? He crosses more than anyone else in the league and more accurately. I don't quite understand your problem with that. You thinking the stats are somewhat wrong is just pure speculation. The fact is that you have an opinion that is NOT backed by stats, whereas I and others have an opinion that IS backed by stats. The fact is also that he could easily have had an assist against Watford if Ibra knew how to finish in that match, and if you watch the video below, you will see that he could have had many more if not for poor finishing.
Yeah that was great. Just one of those moments where you think "That won't work" and low and behold, Valencia wins the ball.
Nobody gets past Valencia with that routine, he's not Darmian.
People have always complained about Valencia's crossing. It was initially because we had loads of Nani fans who were irate at Valencia getting the nod on the right wing. Valencia's never been one for really whipping a cross into dangerous areas, so aesthetically his crossing can look poor compared to players who put a lot of bend on the ball. His reputation also took a hit in the post-Fergie era when the whole team fell to bits and Valencia's mental anguish was most evident in him slamming the ball into the shins of the nearest defender.
When he's playing well, he actually delivers a hell of a good ball from wide areas, hence the good stats re completion above. He doesn't curl the ball, though. He picks someone to aim for and basically passes them the ball. Should have had two assists yesterday from doing exactly that.
When he's playing well, he actually delivers a hell of a good ball from wide areas, hence the good stats re completion above. He doesn't curl the ball, though. He picks someone to aim for and basically passes them the ball. Should have had two assists yesterday from doing exactly that.
Would like to see how many crosses led to goals for each of those players too. Somehow Valencia's crosses don't end up in goals as often as they should. But that is partly a function of how defensive opposition teams usually are with us, leading to a packed box.
This just sums him up and shows how wrong people who say he cant cross are.
His poor crossing came from when he was figured out as a one trick pony, since he almost never cut back inside, he did one move 99% of the time so most of his crosses were being blocked by the opposing fullback, i guess that lead him to always be trying those low and hard crosses to try and get it in before the defender had a chance to block them, but they usually got blocked anyway.
Once again you've simply missed the point.
I do not think completion rates are a good measure of quality of cross: an uncompleted cross can (and often is) more dangerous than a completed cross. It tells you nothing. Darren Fletcher made a similar point about obsessions with pass completion rates in the modern game in an interview he did the other day, and if its true for pass completions (which it is to an extent) then its even more true for crosses.
I have very little problem with Valencia's crossing this season and think he's markedly improved that aspect of a game, along with virtually everything else, but any suggestion that he's the best in the league – which that table would indicate – has to be treated with a massive pinch of salt.
I agree that completion rates is not necessarily a good measure of quality, but any other measure would be purely speculative. Therefore we need to use both our eyes and stats. The fact that he crosses the ball more than anyone else speaks volumes. I think both De Bruyne and Özil, for instance, are better crossers, but they still don't put in as many crosses thus creating potential chances as Valencia does. This season, Valencia has produced a number of chances that could and possibly should have resulted in goals.
Otherwise, I agree with your Darren Fletcher quote - Smalling has over 90% pass completion. That doesn't mean he's a better passer than Blind or similar to Carrick.
Leroy Sane, who is very fast, did the same earlier this season - he never tried it again
Darmian is a weird one - pretty good top speed, but awful acceleration and as such he is skinned so easily.
it's a stereotype Valencia's crossing however despite his crossing is pretty accurate, he often doesn't have enough power on the cross, I like rashfords crosses better, Nani had great early crosses too, the ones from Tony V are just floating forever, even though I understand we have Zlatan there who can reach them with his strength and height, he should do more of the cutbacks like for that Zlatan goal against Leicester, sth he used to be very good at when he first joined us and was hailed by SAF as a best winger in the world, right now he's only best rightback in the world and despite not watching regularly any big competition hard to argue with that statement from José, he's outstanding, nothing can beat him, can keep the ball under pressure and he's always there to attack, sometimes alone that right wing. Some ppl might still argue about his crossing or overall attacking contribution but we should think about him as a RB and for a RB he's done fantastically well going forward..
This just sums him up and shows how wrong people who say he cant cross are.
I have no stats but it was interesting to me that Valencia didn't actually see that much of the ball compared to past games as we seemed to play it more to Martial and the ball came to Miki/Mata more as they like to come central (from wide). This helped us because, duh, getting Martial is always a good thing and Valencia could pick and choose his moments to come bombing forward. Less is more.
What the actual feck is going on in here?
Let me get this straight, there are really people walking around this earth who don't think cross completion is a worthy stat? I need some help understanding this.
Somewhere around age 8-10, players who are learning the basics of the game are taught to pick out a player when they cross instead of wildly whacking a ball across with the hope someone will get on the end of it. Sure, sometimes a blind cross can find its target, but to minimize the ability to spot a runner and put in a cross that connects is ridiculous - especially when running at the speed of our Antonio.
It's a quite amazing statistic and in reality, states that Valencia comes close to setting the table for a goal nearly 1 out of every 3 crosses - good on him.
Let me get this straight, there are really people walking around this earth who don't think cross completion is a worthy stat? I need some help understanding this.
Somewhere around age 8-10, players who are learning the basics of the game are taught to pick out a player when they cross instead of wildly whacking a ball across with the hope someone will get on the end of it. Sure, sometimes a blind cross can find its target, but to minimize the ability to spot a runner and put in a cross that connects is ridiculous - especially when running at the speed of our Antonio.
It's a quite amazing statistic and in reality, states that Valencia comes close to setting the table for a goal nearly 1 out of every 3 crosses - good on him.
Probably a better measure would be to see how many crosses resulted in shots. Case in point: Valencia swung in two absolutely brilliant crosses against Watford, one of which Ibrahimovic shanked, and the other resulted in a shot from Pogba that forced a good save from Gomez.
Regarding the stats themselves: maybe it's a bit of a reflection that it's more difficult to score from crosses these days. The kind of wing play that Valencia thrives on is much less common in the modern game. It's no coincidence Valencia has been converted to a fullback, and I don't know if you could find a true equivalent for the player Valencia was when we signed him in the game today. Certainly you wouldn't find one as productive.
Man Utd 3:0 St. Etienne
Is he told to not bother defending at all tonight? Absolutely terrible, I was criticising Bailly earlier but Valencia is the main reason why Bailly is playing so poorly, leaving him exposed all the time.
Mata is not very useful in terms of protection of a RB.
Bit hard to protect him when Valencia isspending most of the time in front of him. Hes playing far too high and getting caught time and time again. He needs to learn he can't do that when we aren't keeping possession well.
Worse half of the season from Valencia? He's constantly in an in between position,
Neither attack nor defense
Been shit so far. Outmuscled a few times. For the first time I can remember as well. Has absolutely no protection from Mata though.
Did he forget he's a RB tonight?
He's abandoned that right flank all night.
He's abandoned that right flank all night.
Valencia has left Bailly exposed a couple of times and has had a poor game but that's not to blame for Bailly's numerous brain farts. Both been poor tonight and don't seem to have an understanding.
How can he protect Valencia when Valencia has no idea how to defend, at least tonight. All over the place, reminded me of Valencia under van Gaal who was terrible defensively.
Yeah, Bailly's been poor with ir without Valencia, I agree with that. Not defending him, but it must be ridiculously hard to play next to Valencia tonight.
Yeah. Bailly is decent IMO I won't blame Bailly tonight
Poor first half, but very good second half. I swear he is faster in the second half of matches than in the first. In the first he looked a little sluggish and even his first touch was a little off. Some of the sprints in the second half was absolutely ridiculous though, so fast. A game of two halves, so to speak.
He is just too frustrating for me, no matter how good he is at lot of things, he is terrible at some key things. For a player who is allowed to attack so much and who actually gets so many good balls he is creating very little. Should have created at least two or three chances more tonight by simply not messing the pass or cross and he couldn't do it. That's something that happens in every game.
I simply can't rate a fullback so highly who is so poor whenever he actually has to do something effective with the ball.
I simply can't rate a fullback so highly who is so poor whenever he actually has to do something effective with the ball.
I never thought six years ago I'd be saying Valencia is a great defender and a poor attacker.
His crossing.
He should have had an assist for Lingars,easily. He also had a deflected shot and at least one decent cross. His crossing was a little off tonight.
However, not many fullbacks create more than he does or offer more in attack. He carries that right side on his own and always gets better as the game wears on.
I think you just don't like him much
This just sums him up and shows how wrong people who say he cant cross are.
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