Outside of Antony, which ones were they?
Erik ten Hag - Manchester United manager
- Thread starter sewey89
- Start date
Mount and Onana
You could argue Eriksen and Casemiro were poor signings in the scheme of things also. Neither have contributed much past a few decent months last season. Malacia also.
If we hadn't negotiated we would have paid even more for Mount. The problem isn't the price, we shouldn't even have gone for him at all, with Mainoo breaking through. Rasmus' price was set from the start, it didn't increase over time. The only one was Antony, because Ajax also lost some other players in the window. Again, someone who we shouldn't have targeted in the first place.
Our negotiators aren't great, but they were set up for failure by the managers insistence for specific targets.
I think it was a lot more than his signings. For me they are:
- His inability to implement even a semblance of a playing style that can be sustainable in the long term.
- His inability to understand the PL despite claiming that he learned from Pep's experience about the need for physicality in the PL.
- His lack of belief in the concept of rotation. He only ever rotates once he runs the players into the ground. I firmly believe that this season's injury crisis and lack of form of our players has a lot to do with him not rotating them properly last season.
- His signings and squad building skills seem very very poor.
- His poor in-game management skills. He just lets the game drift and is afraid to make changes.
- His lack of charisma.
- His lack ability of adapt.
By Mount you mean the bloke who was pushed massively also by Murtough, who overpaid in panic to stop going to Arsenal or Liverpool?
Jurys out on Onana, it's his debut year. Generally keepers in a United shirt do shite in their first year.
Mount has been injured , not ETH fault, although I do know some people who even think injuries are ETH fault which is stupid nonsense
Onana was the keeper whose team goto CL final. Ferguson struggled to replace Schmeichal and arguably didn’t really do it until van de Saar. Barthes was a bit of a clown and prone to high profile errors.
Replacing a keeper isn’t easy , especially when you can’t even play a consistent back 4 game to game let along for a season. Liverpool and city didn’t just land on their current Gks with Pep/Klopps first try.
Anthony is the stand out bad signing. Every other signing has been injured or done well relative to any other transfers made since 2013.
What has he said back to Carragher? Just saw the Athletic have released an article about but not had a chance to read it yet.
Oh didn't you hear, It was the management's fault for not snatching candy from his overgrown bald kid, despite this overgrown bald kid asking for a definite say in his right to eat candy as a prerequisite for joining us.
It's a new one, but it's fascinating.
For the millionth time, the club shouldn't be bowing to a (brand new) manager's insistence on signing specific targets, and especially not when they're obviously ludicrously overpriced.
Ten Hag didn't set the negotiators up to fail because he wanted Antony. The club did by not being able to identify any alternatives.
You could argue the club got Casemiro and Erikson it couldn’t supply the manager with any better alternatives.
See how this works? Some of you onlh consider the worst possible probability with ETH when it’s a guess on your part as much as trying to work out what actual alternatives ETH was offered by the club or indeed how much our clubs sh*t transfer record played a role in who we signed.
He’s panicking. A season ago, he’d have given an erudite tactical rebuttal to Carragher questioning his methods on MNF. Now he’s grasping at calling him an anti United analyst.
See, I dont believe this to be true, because we have a precedent for giving managers a list. Starting from Moyes to LVG to Jose to Ole's list of 500 rightbacks. Those targets were never reported, or the manager wasn't interested. There's no way our 160 scouts only came back with one name for the RW, and its the name they walked away from. They just weren't reported, and nobody leaked anything to throw the manager under the bus.
Its just like your name. It's like we hired a bald genius, but has the tendencies of a junkie, and we have to keep him wrapped up in cotton.
Yup, the writing is on the wall. He'll be gone when the season ends, if not earlier. Right now it's all about saving his reputation and attacking the messenger. It's sad to see that we have come to this stage again with another manager, but ultimately he has failed spectacularly and the blame lies with him.
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Dont forget Amrabat.
Defeat tonight, Defeat on Sunday, sacked on Monday.
Just thinking, he needs to be sacked to prove to the players that underperformance will no longer be tolerated. Those players have seen the Glazers fail to react to poor management for years now and of course have followed suit with their own underperformance.
But ETH spent 400 million. He made the calls to the clubs , did the deals and write the cheques. In fact Ajax would have accepted 50 mil for Anthony and Ten Haag did a Woodward special by offering 80 mil as a starting bid.
ETH is also responsible for the injuries cause it’s the only explanation.
He also drove Rashford to drink in Belfast. He forced the glazers to have a one year long drawn out sale that destabilised the club leaving all futures up in the air. All the other dramas could of been handled better cause I think so.
He insisted on Weghorst over every other striker in the world; as our only striker. He insisted on keeping martial which meant he couldn’t get another striker. He wanted spurs third choice LB and could of gotten roberto Carlos instead.
There’s other things but as soon as ETH leaves we can get a manager who is infallible and makes us play great , winning football from day one , there’ll be no setbacks and most importantly even if we lose we will play good football and will support the manager cause we are patient and know the future.
And we know what we know so don’t be arguing stuff that’s just excuses. Cult of manager , what , you ETH son or something ?
Hes a busted flush , out of his depth, it’s science. XG , possession, shots conceded oh my.
Why do you hate United? I care more than you because I want ETH sacked and only a person who hates the club doesn’t. Why do you want United relegated?
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Is that what he said?? Damn, the end is very fecking nigh then.
What a waste of a post
This pretty much. ETH has not gotten it as badly as Ole and Rangnick from the press.
That’s ironic considering it’s exactly how many of you post
Now you know how we feel reading the constant bullsh*t narrative and verbal diarrhoea of those who blame ETH for absolutely everything and factor in nothing.
As much as I didn't like a lot of Ole's work (or lack thereof), there's never been a manager in history more ridiculed for achieving decent results and I always hated that part of it. We'd be City pretty consistently and every time it was thought of as some miracle as if we were bottom of the table.
Literally not single one of those bullshit narratives you sarcastically posted has been said by any of us. Congrats on grossly exaggerating everything to a comical point because you're getting emotional I guess.That’s ironic
Now you know how we feel reading the constant bullsh*t narrative and verbal diarrhoea of those who blame ETH for absolutely everything and factor in nothing.
Since many of you are able to engage on the topic outside of “ETH has to be sacked”, I get why you think it’s an over exaggeration.
Weird that Xabi Alonso is able to do that yet ETH can't. Speaks volumes.
Where's the evidence of this?Mount from Athletic looked to be a joint pursuit driven massively by Murtough who panicked and overpaid because he was scared about Liverpool nabbing him. I mean, come on
All I've seen is that Mount preferred United and we were the clear frontrunners for him as he'd ruled out Arsenal and Liverpool.
I think it's clear to many that he "has a system", but you can have a system and still be tactically clueless/stubborn. None of those are mutually exclusive. The pressing structure/out of possession shape is an obvious example as something we are clearly drilled on yet is ineffective every match, but is never tweaked or adjusted by the manager.
Yeah that's what I'm hoping will happen too
I'll have to say it again.
A team with Bruno and Rashford as main attackers and irreplaceable starters, will never challenge. Good enough for top 4 and a cup win here and there. Nothing more.
Our key attackers are limited footballers who excel at counterattacking football. You can't coach them into KDB and Foden.
Sure, Bruno has comparable stats with KDB, but when you watch them play, you know difference is night and day.
Next manager after ETH is fecked if these two remain and that's a fact that we prefer to close our eyes to.
If we aspire to be champions, there are only handful of players in are squad that are good enough.
A team with Bruno and Rashford as main attackers and irreplaceable starters, will never challenge. Good enough for top 4 and a cup win here and there. Nothing more.
Our key attackers are limited footballers who excel at counterattacking football. You can't coach them into KDB and Foden.
Sure, Bruno has comparable stats with KDB, but when you watch them play, you know difference is night and day.
Next manager after ETH is fecked if these two remain and that's a fact that we prefer to close our eyes to.
If we aspire to be champions, there are only handful of players in are squad that are good enough.
If total control of transfers (a responsibility he's never had before) was a prerequisite for him to accept the job then the club should have sent him packing and moved onto the next shortlisted candidate.
However, given our track record, we probably didn't have another candidate lined up.
Additionally, for someone who apparently wanted total control of transfers (a responsibility he's never had before) as a condition of being our manager, he's seemed awfully willing to accept that control being taken away by INEOS.
This whole thing stems from one interview answer that can just as easily be interpreted as him wanting at least some say as he doesn't want random players thrust onto him out of nowhere (which is the far more reasonable and likely meaning behind his comments).
The list of 500 right-backs and us having 160 scouts just shows how ineffective our recruitment is.
160 scouts is an insanely high number, and you have to question what, exactly, they're feeding back to the club, and how this data is organised and analysed (hint: it won't be efficiently).
500 players for one position is just an incredibly stupid number. That's basically going on that year's football manager, selecting "DR" as position in the player search options, sorting the results by overall ability, and copying the top 500 as your "shortlist".
Even if our 160 scouts have somehow managed to thoroughly scout 500 right-backs, when £50 million odd on Aaron Wan-Bissaka emerges as the best option, it's clear that there are major flaws in whatever methods they're using to analyse the data and rank the targets.
And to keep it on Antony, and if we accept that our 160 scouts did provide a proper shortlist of right-wingers, a properly run club doesn't just bin all of that work and spunk £80 million on a player that didn't make the cut just because the manager likes him. It's still not on Ten Hag that the club is run like a circus.
Moyes shouldn't have been allowed to bin off whatever targets we had lined up to instead chase Fellaini and Baines all summer, van Gaal shouldn't have been allowed to just sack off most of the team to make room for shite like Darmian and Schneiderlin, same shit for Mourinho, same shit for Solskjaer, and same shit for Ten Hag.
There is literally no point in the club having these scouts and analysts if we're not actually going to make use of them because any given manager can just chuck their work in the shredder and direct the club to spend silly amounts on one of their former players.
Ten Hag did it at Ajax, and Alonso hasn’t done it at United.
Postecoglu at Spurs this season hasn't had a lot of time to change the squad to suit how he wants to play but he's made it work for the most part too. After losing his best player as well.
Well one of them is about to win a league title after improving his team's style of play and the other is likely to be sacked after making his team worse.
But this is a reality that only exists in your head.That’s ironic considering it’s exactly how many of you post
Now you know how we feel reading the constant bullsh*t narrative and verbal diarrhoea of those who blame ETH for absolutely everything and factor in nothing.
The rest of us in the real world blame ETH for everything that he's responsible for and recognise that the mitigating circumstances, and there are several, are still not a valid excuse.
You keep citing this to say that Mount essentially wasn't really ETH's choice and he just went along with it (so it's not "his signing") but I can't find anywhere in these athletic articles that states that. By all means they all state ETH was an admirer of Mount from the Vitesse days, was convinced we needed an attacking/energetic 8, and was convinced Mount was a player that would rise to the challenge.
The staff he had did the coaching and those same staff are implementing them at other clubs. Pretty sure it was just the Ronaldo transfer and not getting the DM he wanted when trying to change the style. Declan Rice instead of Ronaldo and Ole would not have lost his job.
It was from the Athletic and there was a deep dive into the wider workings of our transfer market by Murtough. It was a writeup on him/Arnold more than it was about Ten Hag.
Fun fact - Ole didn't even know how much certain transfers were going to cost - they kept him in the dark. So you can imagine how difficult it is for any manager to operate under such a structure.
No I think Ten Hag was certainly an advocate of Mount but I disagree with this notion that he wanted us to go into overdrive for him. The gung-ho panic button was very much Murtough - he just overpaid out of fright of losing him to a rival, as Athletic reported.
It was certainly a club pursuit as much as it was a managerial one - and it's also worth noting that Klopp & Arteta were very keen on him. Using Mount as a stick to beat Ten Hag alone with is a bit harsh, he was widely chased after but he's been a crock since.
Perhaps our medical team need to take a look at themselves, since Mount was clearly very injured at Chelsea, I wonder how he even passed the medical, since it appears he can't really get through more than 2 games before breaking down.
I am definitely not closing my eyes to the problem,however how far up the selling priority list do the club see those two. My gut feeling is that they are near the bottom or not even on it.
He didn't really place too much value on his staff it seems - at least from this - https://www.manchestereveningnews.c...news/man-united-news-carrick-mckenna-22257413
I think Athletic might have also reported how he trained all pre-season for 4-3-3 and then decided to sack it off and never deploy it.