European Super League

[sullydnl]

Do the Glazers own all of the other signed up sides? Barca and Real too?

The point (imo) is that the football landscape has been changed by both petro-state owners and those like the Glazers who were not only interested in making money from United but had a distinct agenda for the future of top-level football. Barca and Real buying into this super-league is a reflection of that changed landscape.

Ultimately this is football reaping what it sowed.

And a lot of the fans who will now complain about are among those who would dismiss concerns about Glazer ownership and/or welcome the idea of Saudi investment in the club without thought to what it does to the way football works.

 

[balaks]

"treason", bloody hell. I think so many fans are getting too emotional, they want it to replace the CL, we've replaced the old EC in my time, we've been banned from it for years too.

People hate change, but makes no mistake, the takeovers of PSG and City have forced this.

It's a total dead rubber of a tournament they want that no fans are remotely interested in and at the same time it's a slap in the face to all the other clubs in Europe. It's utterly shameless and every fan should be outraged.

 

[Fanta Stick]

Beckham, Ronaldo, Rooney. Scape goats for poorly managed teams that the media convinced everyone would win the World Cup.

That clears that up for me.

 

[Berbasbullet]

Of course he did, he's probably the footballer whose benefitted most from Sky's dominance.

I must have missed Gary ripping Sky a new one over their above inflation price increases at the time of pandemic.

And Sky trying to charge PPV games.

 

[Eckers99]

Why are the Glazers getting all the shit for this? Not the only ones.

Never hear the media criticizing FSG.

I'd imagine similar things are being said about other owners in their own countries / via their own local reporters. Naturally, a United forum will gravitate towards the local view of our own parasites.

And it's only a couple of hours since Neville reserved his most scathing criticism for Liverpool on Sky.

 

[Nogbadthebad]

Christ, not only is it absolutely mental from a fan perspective, with most away games needing a trip abroad, and it won't be long before United Liverpool is played at the Raymond James Stadium in Tampa too, but its just random teams.

I mean you could put Arsenal in a league of one and they'd still find a way to come second at the moment.

 

[Tevez's Mum]

Definitely feels like the idea came from America. They don't use the system of people being relegated or promoted. NFL and NBA teams are fixed...not matter how bad they are.

 

[elnorte]

Feck this arrogant attitude. They've been letting in "shite" teams for all over Europe since back when it was called the European Cup. What changed is that they started letting in teams that didn't win their leagues.

Sadly the fact that the person you are replying to is unaware of this very basic fact is of no surprise.

 

[justsomebloke]

Ehh, history is history. Did we lose any when the PL was formed?

The formation of the PL was a minor act of rebranding compared to this, which will radically alter the European football landscape. No comparison at all.

 

[DavidDeSchmikes]

 

[Topgun1]

You think City would be happy if they were the traditional big club and Utd came from nowhere with cash from some oil rich Prince? Of course they wouldn't.

State ran clubs are the reason this idea is even being floated and I hate it. I want football to go back to when clubs actually earned their way to the top. But those days are done.

PSG and City have taken the piss and big clubs have had enough.

I see your point, but in football, success usually breeds more success i.e. clubs that "earn their way to the top" usually stay at the top for a long time unless something disruptive happens (like new money injected into other clubs for example).

Effectively United had monopoly over Manchester and Arsenal had monopoly over London until Chelsea & City had serious money injected into their clubs.

Without that money, United & Arsenal would continue to have a chokehold over Manchester and London pretty much permanently.

Btw, I shouldn't have said that I have no respect for your opinion, I think that was rude and uncalled for, so apologies for that.

(I should also add that the PL benefited somewhat from serious investment. We could conceivably have 4 English finalists in European competitions yet again -Arsenal/United/Chelsea/City are all European semi finalists)

 

[UncleBob]

The point (imo) is that the football landscape has been changed by both petro-state owners and those like the Glazers who were not only interested in making money from United but had a distinct agenda for the future of top-level football. Barca and Real buying into this super-league is a reflection of that changed landscape.

Ultimately this is football reaping what it sowed.

And a lot of the fans who will now complain about are among those who would dismiss concerns about Glazer ownership and/or welcome the idea of Saudi investment in the club without thought to what it does to the way football works.

Welcomed in by the PL and UEFA.

 

[Ronaldo's Love Child]

Well....I am going to call it now.

I don't think this will happen.

The clubs must be aware that there is a very real risk that the domestic leagues will kick them out so that means no FA Cup or Premiership (how the hell do away fans travel to matches in a Super League?). No Champions League meaning the running thread that is the CL and was the European Cup will end.

A very real risk that FIFA and UEFA will ban players involved from playing in the World Cup and Euros so would be interesting to see how players would react to that.

 

[Nou_Camp99]

for sure I can see that to an extent. I will say the Glazers bought Utd and raped it of profits and used it as a bank loan. that’s different to oil money. I’d suggest totally blaming city is a little rich. If you read my post it was to cross boundaries and we are all fans. however each have their own views. Id suggest this has grown and grown. Greed and egos.

Don't get me started on our owners. They are parasites. But we are relatively competitive in spite of them.

This whole idea is awful I agree but it's definitely partly in response to City n PSG. I have no doubt about it.

 

[Murder on Zidanes Floor]

The point is that we have been here before with people up in arms about change in football. Senior English footballing stakeholders have a terrible track record in supporting the development of the elite game. If it was up to England, there would have been no World Cup, have been no Euros, have been no European club competitions.

So six teams should leave the league?

 

[DomesticTadpole]

Exactly!

Its all about the TV & online streaming revenue

I won't be watching if it means I have to find even more money. I am sick of being ripped off. I will just watch the PL without United if it happens. Sky would be mad to kick the Big 6 out, unless they sneakily renegotiate to contract for less money.

 

[cyberman]

I think that's the idea yeah, all clubs involved will be extremely rich. Right now clubs like Barca are haemorrhaging money just to try and compete, the idea of this league is surely to try and level the playing field financially somewhat.

Heres the thing, i think somethings needed and its thanks to the EPL. We were a Newcastle away from having another oil club in our league. Can you imagine the Saudis, City, a well run Utd and Chelsea all pushing each other?
England would be a super league in itself. Winning the league is fast appoaching being harder to win the the European cup.
This isnt the answer though. No club has a right to be at the top which Barca and Madrid (especially) are saying with this. We get to bully other clubs in the market but when the other shoe falls we need to revamp the CL..ok El Classico.
The likes of Utd, Spurs etc have been battling oil money for a long time now, just join in on the struggle at this point.

 

[mu4c_20le]

The formation of the PL was a minor act of rebranding compared to this, which will radically alter the European football landscape. No comparison at all.

True, but the point is that history is written. I have my own reservations about this, but that isn't one of them.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

It's a total dead rubber of a tournament they want that no fans are remotely interested in and at the same time it's a slap in the face to all the other clubs in Europe. It's utterly shameless and every fan should be outraged.

I'm not outraged, because of the bigger picture. If City and PSG were stopped, I'd be dead against it, but feck the U.A.E and the FA, the fecking cnuts have utterly devalued the competition and City's domination is accelerating, no team can compete against a state without massive reform.

 

[Tincanalley]

Okay apart from the loyalists in here most people don't want it. Big wheels turning, us minions have no idea. I have to wonder if its a phoney war, that something else is the real target. #GlazersOut

 

[sullydnl]

Welcomed in by the PL and UEFA.

Indeed. I certainly have little sympathy for those whose failures of governance have brought us to this point.

 

[Ranchero]

Significant financial advantage, yes. But also significant financial mismanagement. The greed of these clubs is sickening.

I agree. I am beyond appalled that execs at our club have even discussed breaking away from English football. What would be left? Leicester, West Ham and Everton, Leeds, Villa....

Good on Bayern for coming out at rejecting it. Show more feeling for our game than the money-fixated execs in charge of our club. It is a shameful shameful chain of events.

 

[Swedish_Plumber]

How are Man City even fecking invited, they’ve won a few league titles, never won a champions league, got about ten fans, what criteria have they met other than having shitloads of money?

Because this whole idea is based on greed. No surprise that they’d be invited in too. No clubs involved here are better or worse than each other. It’s all completely indicative of how the world runs.

 

[Mickeza]

You think City and PSG would agree to that?

Their entire clubs exist as PR machines for states. They need to be at the top table which this would be.

 

[Ludens the Red]

Yeah this is it for me. We are lucky in that we are a huge club but even when you look at how the PL allowed the Glazer's come in a straddle us with their debt accrued from buying us is disgusting. I mean Liverpool (the joint most successful English team of all time) came close to bankruptcy. The likes of Leeds and Wigan paid the price and the PL didn't do jack shit about it. They talk about 'fair play' but they have allowed so many clubs be taken over by predatory owners.

Now they scream about fairness while showing clips of that Aguero goal, with no mention of the murderous regime that funded that shit. It's all a bit like Ted Bundy preaching about ethics to Ed Gein overall.

Yup. Didn’t even really think of us but yeah you can definitely make a point that we’ve been victims to this.
We should have taken some lessons from Germany with ownership regs.

 

[Berbasbullet]

Great, now I’m for it, cheers Johnson.

 

[GhastlyHun]

Oh right, if Boris is against it, I'm willing to give it the benefit of doubt.

 

[crossy1686]

Will 100% happen now

 

[Mainoldo]

Fans will feel passionately about this and rightly so, but please make your own minds up and don’t be sucked in by this ridiculous narrative being pushed by Sky. The way they bang on and moralise, the competition they have helped create is some Marxist utopia where all clubs compete on a level playing field and fans pay thru’penny bit to watch their local heroes play for the love of the game. Rubbish.

Let’s not kid ourselves. The Premier League has always been about money. It was about creating wealth for the original twenty breakaway teams and Sky Sports. Furthermore, its always been a “closed shop” dominated by a handful of rich sides. The only teams who have successfully broken into the top few sides are those who have had billions pumped in by shady owners. What’s so great about the current set-up, dominated by a Championship-sized team who have had the ill-gotten gains of corrupt trillionaires poured into “their” club?

I can’t understand what legitimate arguments exist against the ESL. All of the arguments against are emotive. People don’t like the idea or don’t feel comfortable with it, which is fine. But let’s not pretend it’s some major shift in direction away from what’s already been happening in football for 25 years. The game gave into greed long, long ago. The Premier League and UEFA had their chance to reform and did nothing. Now they are scrambling, along with Sky.

Very good post. Mainly because a lot of people are angry based on not actual thought of what they actually believe.

Neither side is wrong but let’s logically look at what is being proposed.

 

[sullydnl]

He's fecking shill. Sully you've made more informative posts in 12 months than Ducker and Ogden have did in years. Last time Ogden got something right was when he said that United wanted Lukaku on Phill Brown's show. I mean he's a total fecking shill. It would be awkward if you were that ugly looking creature.

Nope I am safely someone else.

 

[Brophs]

I struggle to imagine this happening in reality but i can see this being the end of collective bargaining if the English clubs can be persuaded to stay. That's the pot of gold.

 

[RedDevil@84]

Respect to the German clubs

True. When you have zero competition and every lad in the country is born dreaming of playing for Bayern and you can just pick any player in the league just by blinking eyes at them, then it's so easy to be good on moral compass

 

[balaks]

I'm not outraged, because of the bigger picture. If City and PSG were stopped, I'd be dead against it, but feck the U.A.E and the FA, the fecking cnuts have utterly devalued the competition and City's domination is accelerating, no team can compete against a state without massive reform.

Neither city or PSG have even won the champions League in the past decade. What are you on about?

 

[VeevaVee]

What's so annoying is that football is clearly due a shakeup, and these clubs obviously have the power to do it, but of course when they do it's not for the benefit of football or the fans in any way

 

[Salus Populi Suprema Lex]

Fans will feel passionately about this and rightly so, but please make your own minds up and don’t be sucked in by this ridiculous narrative being pushed by Sky. The way they bang on and moralise, the competition they have helped create is some Marxist utopia where all clubs compete on a level playing field and fans pay thru’penny bit to watch their local heroes play for the love of the game. Rubbish.

Let’s not kid ourselves. The Premier League has always been about money. It was about creating wealth for the original twenty breakaway teams and Sky Sports. Furthermore, its always been a “closed shop” dominated by a handful of rich sides. The only teams who have successfully broken into the top few sides are those who have had billions pumped in by shady owners. What’s so great about the current set-up, dominated by a Championship-sized team who have had the ill-gotten gains of corrupt trillionaires poured into “their” club?

I can’t understand what legitimate arguments exist against the ESL. All of the arguments against are emotive. People don’t like the idea or don’t feel comfortable with it, which is fine. But let’s not pretend it’s some major shift in direction away from what’s already been happening in football for 25 years. The game gave into greed long, long ago. The Premier League and UEFA had their chance to reform and did nothing. Now they are scrambling, along with Sky.

You make a lot of good points there. Football has indeed been heading this way for a long time. At the top level wages are far too high and tickets far too expensive, to name just a couple of issues. The wealth gap between the richest clubs and the rest is widening all the time. The national associations, UEFA, FIFA and the broadcasters like Sky have enabled it all. This latest proposal is the clubs trying to take control, in order to maximise income. It's a high risk strategy, one that ignores the fans (yet again) and one that might backfire. It just provides further evidence that the fans are nothing to the owners: just customers who get no say in what happens. Well done to the German clubs, where things are very different.

 

[El Zoido]

Well no. were regulated and we can get regelated and were abided by the very same rule that lowest club is. Do you really want to end that?

No, what I want is a league that stops Roman Abramovich buying Chelsea. That stops the Glazers buying United and plunging us in to debt. That stops the Sheik buying Man City and letting them financially dominate the sport. Football hasn’t been for the fans for decades now, so I simply don’t care anymore. I don’t like the idea of a super league but I didn’t like any of the above either and it all happened, and was as shitty as I knew it would be. So at this point it’s all irrelevant as far as I’m concerned.

 

[mancan92]

Of course he did, he's probably the footballer whose benefitted most from Sky's dominance.

I must have missed Gary ripping Sky a new one over their above inflation price increases at the time of pandemic.

Its as if there isn't levels to corporate greed. 10 clubs taking up the entire football world and losing the hundreds of clubs in Europe is a different level of corporate greed to increasing the price of sky.

 

[Ranchero]

That's not why they were able to take Ronaldo, it's because he wanted to leave.

And to take him required what? Money. Real cant get players from us just because the player wants to leave. They have to pay the cash. That is how transfers work. It is why we didnt get Sancho. No dough? No go. Simples

 

[Zlatan 7]

Tottenham out of all teams got an invite for this and they are a nothing club.

They’ve got a cheese room though so it’s understandable

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

The likes of Utd, Spurs etc have been battling oil money for a long time now, just join in on the struggle at this point.

And from nothing City have won 5 from 10 Premier Leagues, accelerating now to be soon 3 from the last 4. No-one can compete, it's getting harder and harder.

That's the point many are missing, we're looking at a U.A.E total domination unless a bloody Saudi buyer comes in.

Who the feck wants that?