Garnacho: What is his potential?

[DJ Jeff]

Like Garnacho then. Don't get me wrong I don't think he'll be as good as Bale or Salah but I think he has a great attitude, I see no reason why he can't go on and be a top class player.

I think he's got a great mentality on the pitch, seems to forget when he fecks up very quickly and try just as hard next time, head doesn't drop. Off it and in training there were some complaints about him last season from ETH and Fernandes, but it seems he's righted that and is doing well there now too. So hopefully no repeat of Januzaj.

 

[ShoePolish]

Couple more performances like against Villa, and he can definetly open up AG17 clothing line

 

[TwoSheds]

Garnacho doesn’t have that raw explosivity of the very top class of winger.

Relativity is pertinent. So when you say top class, I must ask: compared to whom?

I’m generally loathe to play down youngsters, but going too far outside of what I believe they are capable of sets them up for failure and there’s good reason why youngsters get bracketed as they do. A young:

- Rooney was being compared to: Charlton, Di Stefano and even Pelè for a brief period, as a teenager.

- Giggs was being compared to Best, at 18-years old.

- C.Ronaldo, to Best - Best even directly being fielded the question and answering it positively.

- Greenwood to Van Persie.

And so on and so forth. All of whom were not risible claims even if the players eventually fell short; their talent and ability had them bracketed as such for good reason.

If someone said there’s a kid coming through who is the potential successor to Giggs, everyone who saw Giggs in his pomp would either have scorn or lofty skepticism toward the claim, either that, or they’re expecting to see clear potential all-time talent shoot from the traps. So relativity is important.

Some players get to where they get through pure ability and others get there through having some talent and a good attitude to improve. Ruud for example or Gary Neville. Are you going to say they weren't top class players? I'm not going to make any spurious comparisons for Garnacho but as an example Alexis Sanchez or Son who've been mentioned in here weren't all time greats but still class players who at times in their career would have had a case for being amongst the league's best. I'd suggest that is where Garnacho could get to if it all goes right for him (by no means a certainty, it will need a lot of luck).

 

[TwoSheds]

I think he's got a great mentality on the pitch, seems to forget when he fecks up very quickly and try just as hard next time, head doesn't drop. Off it and in training there were some complaints about him last season from ETH and Fernandes, but it seems he's righted that and is doing well there now too. So hopefully no repeat of Januzaj.

Agreed, it can take him a long way I think. Best thing that could have happened to him was not going to that world cup with Argentina IMO.

 

[the_cliff]

This is a good shout as a peak honestly. Sanchez in his prime was a pain to deal with. I've actually gone for Martinelli as a more reachable outcome which would still be an excellent player but if he got to Sanchez level thats a fantastic outcome.

I don't think Garnacho quite has the technique to reach the highest of levels and really become an elite player, but he can definitely be a level below that.

I get the comparison tbh especially in terms of style of play but I do think Garnacho is a more natural finisher and better dribbler.

People seem to forget that Garnacho is currently the age of Martinelli in his 2nd season at Arsenal. I don't remember Martinelli being as good at a similar age.

 

[El Jefe]

Ronaldo and Bale did. So did Salah.

Salah yes but not Ronaldo and Bale. Bale came through as a 17yo that was described as the new Giggs, it took him a longer while to get there but the talent was there from the beginning.

I remember watching Ronaldo as an 18yo and saying he’d be the best player in the world one day. Just watching his game against us when we played Sporting and his first two games against Bolton and Charlton you knew you were watching a potential superstar.

Salah had a later breakthrough but again I remember watching him at Basel, think we even played them in the CL and he was a huge talent. I guess if he came through a typical route European and South American players take his talent and potential would have been more widely known earlier.

In my opinion there are just levels when it comes to talent and Garnacho hasn’t shown that he has the potential to be up there with some of the names mentioned.

 

[TwoSheds]

Salah yes but not Ronaldo and Bale. Bale came through as a 17yo that was described as the new Giggs, it took him a longer while to get there but the talent was there from the beginning.

I remember watching Ronaldo as an 18yo and saying he’d be the best player in the world one day. Just watching his game against us when we played Sporting and his first two games against Bolton and Charlton you knew you were watching a potential superstar.

Salah had a later breakthrough but again I remember watching him at Basel, think we even played them in the CL and he was a huge talent. I guess if he came through a typical route European and South American players take his talent and potential would have been more widely known earlier.

a) Bale was a left back who took a mean free kick, it was clear he had ability but nobody was calling him as a future global superstar.
b) you said most wingers don't go through quantum leaps and yet all 3 of the above did.

 

[El Jefe]

a) Bale was a left back who took a mean free kick, it was clear he had ability but nobody was calling him as a future global superstar.
b) you said most wingers don't go through quantum leaps and yet all 3 of the above did.

Even if I agree with you for argument sake, look at the names we are talking about Salah, Ronaldo and Bale. Those are the best wide players we’ve had in the league so surely they are an exception rather than a standard.

If you point is that those three did it so why can’t Garnacho, then I would agree if you extend that courtesy for every other 19yo winger playing at a decent level.

 

[TheRedHearted]

I’ve seen it with many of our youngster where people have unrealistic expectations and underestimate just how good you have to be here to excel for many years.

I remember talk on here about Rashford and Martial being potentially as good as Salah and Mane. Fast forward five years later and they aren’t even close.
.

If klopp had been here past five years they both would either be out the door or twice the player they are now.

 

[Fortitude]

Some players get to where they get through pure ability and others get there through having some talent and a good attitude to improve. Ruud for example or Gary Neville. Are you going to say they weren't top class players? I'm not going to make any spurious comparisons for Garnacho but as an example Alexis Sanchez or Son who've been mentioned in here weren't all time greats but still class players who at times in their career would have had a case for being amongst the league's best. I'd suggest that is where Garnacho could get to if it all goes right for him (by no means a certainty, it will need a lot of luck).

I outlined why it tends to be different for wingers, so tend to keep discussion about wingers separated from the trajectory of other positions on the pitch, much in the same way you could about keepers who mature ridiculously late.

You interjected at a point talking about mostly wingers who are one kind of pinnacle or another, my point to that was wingers don’t often make the meteoric leaps where a Garnacho will ever be on the same kind of tracks or trajectory as the wingers I primarily objected to, and that even the next brackets down would be difficult (to my eye). Nothing is set in stone, but these things aren’t prone to great deviation, which is why you don’t hear of the next <insert phenomenal winger> claims often.

My mind’s not made up on Garnacho in terms of what I believe he can ultimately go on to become (outside of reaching the ceiling of true wing greats), so it is something to keep an eye on. Would love to be proven wrong and he look like a PL great, but I don’t have that baited breath I’ve had for other talents we’ve seen here or come through where the sky felt like the limit for them because they had everything in their game to go on and be ballon D’or contenders some day.

 

[Maticmaker]

At the moment his style and the playing with 'no fear' aspect is helping him, but its noticeable when he's on from the start, by mid-way through the second half, the opposing full backs have generally 'sus' him out in terms of his party-piece moves and he can then struggle. He does however have all the tenacity and skill potential, the decision making and reading of the game will come... but think he's is much more dangerous on the right wing than the left, his options are better, as we saw against Villa.

 

[Partridge]

His potential is massive. Weather he makes it to the very top is another question.

 

[Fortitude]

This is 1993. Committed so much, it’s an official VHS, which tells you the standing Giggs had barely a fully fledged professional. You could not make a similar case for Garnacho comparing him to a Best or Giggs, it’d be absurd.

Nothing slighting Garnacho, just again a driving home of how superior a talent a young Giggs was. Further to that, put any young PL winger against Giggs and the outcome is exactly the same, so there’s no shame in it, just not a name that should be mentioned in any form in such a discussion.

 

[the chameleon]

His potential is massive. Weather he makes it to the very top is another question.

This! So many players with massive potential have come and gone. Many show early promise and think they have already made it and then start acting like stars. Hopefully, he keeps his head down and works on his craft.

 

[TwoSheds]

I outlined why it tends to be different for wingers, so tend to keep discussion about wingers separated from the trajectory of other positions on the pitch, much in the same way you could about keepers who mature ridiculously late.

You interjected at a point talking about mostly wingers who are one kind of pinnacle or another, my point to that was wingers don’t often make the meteoric leaps where a Garnacho will ever be on the same kind of tracks or trajectory as the wingers I primarily objected to, and that even the next brackets down would be difficult (to my eye). Nothing is set in stone, but these things aren’t prone to great deviation, which is why you don’t hear of the next <insert phenomenal winger> claims often.

My mind’s not made up on Garnacho in terms of what I believe he can ultimately go on to become (outside of reaching the ceiling of true wing greats), so it is something to keep an eye on. Would love to be proven wrong and he look like a PL great, but I don’t have that baited breath I’ve had for other talents we’ve seen here or come through where the sky felt like the limit for them because they had everything in their game to go on and be ballon D’or contenders some day.

It sounds like we're largely aligned on what we think of Garnacho, I just don't really get your "wingers don't make quantum leaps" thing. Are you suggesting that only really talented ones can make quantum leaps? It's quite demonstrably true that some players make leaps and others don't. Aaron Lennon for example never really got any better than he was at 19 where's Shaun Wright-Phillips made a big step around the age of 21/22. As I think did Damien Duff (though might be misremembering that one).

I would bet Garnacho will make big improvements as he goes personally.

 

[DJ Jeff]

This is 1993. Committed so much, it’s an official VHS, which tells you the standing Giggs had barely a fully fledged professional. You could not make a similar case for Garnacho comparing him to a Best or Giggs, it’d be absurd.

Nothing slighting Garnacho, just again a driving home of how superior a talent a young Giggs was. Further to that, put any young PL winger against Giggs and the outcome is exactly the same, so there’s no shame in it, just not a name that should be mentioned in any form in such a discussion.

Indeed, Giggs is not only an all time great, he was one of the all time great young players too, like Rooney and Brazilian Ronaldo.

 

[FrankDrebin]

Inbetween Alexis Sanchez and Pedro.

 

[Murder on Zidane's Floor]

Good but a decent player, not a top ten world player.

 

[Samid]

Right wing sorted.

 

[Salt Bailly]

99

 

[DJ Jeff]

Inbetween Alexis Sanchez and Pedro.

I'd say that yeah. Most likely Pedro. Which is still great to get from the academy. People comparing him to Ronaldo will be very disappointed.

 

[DWelbz19]

He’s got that South American dawg in him. He had a horrid first half against Emerson but he always keeps going and bagged two in the end.

 

[ZupZup]

Garnacho can be world class. His football intelligence is high for his age. He has bags of composure. He’s rapid. Great first touch and a very good finisher. His work rate is brilliant too. He doesn’t lack in any important area.

 

[ForeverRed1]

Massive. Potential to be world class once his decision making comes good.

 

[Mike Smalling]

The fact that he is also effective on the right solves a huge problem for us. Love him.

 

[MancunianAngels]

He's better than Ronaldo was at a similar age/stage of his development.

 

[AndySmith1990]

He's better than Ronaldo was at a similar age/stage of his development.

No

 

[Pronewbie]

He's better than Ronaldo was at a similar age/stage of his development.

Nope.

 

[crackers0seven]

Thank god he's able to play both sides. Great to see a player actually able to swap over again. Have we had any1 since ronnie or nani that cud do it??

 

[Swedish_Plumber]

Last two games he's been fantastic. He was playing well beyond his years at wolves.

 

[Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber]

Another solid display. Our first genuine two flank winger since Nani.

 

[roonster09]

He is playing much better as right winger.

 

[Lj82]

Was really impressed with his decision making. Made him even more dangerous as the defenders have to guess if he is going for goal or cutting back

 

[amolbhatia50k]

Not sure. He doesn’t really have the technical quality of an elite player but appears to have a dogged / persistent mentality, strong movement and good technical ability.

 

[Abraxas]

High potential. Sometimes his touch is a bit messy, that's my only concern. Not a Ronaldo or Rooney level talent where they were certainly going to be world class, but some tier below that which shows high potential but could go either way in terms of really reaching the elite.

But overall, he does have a bit of everything for a wide player. He's flexible, can use both feet, knows where the net is and can beat people. It's really important wide players know how to get into positions to score and can finish - gone are the days you're going to have a wide forward at United producing 3 goals a season and just being there as an outlet and providing for a striker. They need to be finding the net and he's good at that for such a young player.

 

[gerdm07]

He had a good match. Let's not get carried away though. His first goal was pretty lucky and the second was pretty easy. I still think Amad has the better future, but I love the competition. Antony is an after thought now IMO.

 

[Erictheking7]

He had a good match. Let's not get carried away though. His first goal was pretty lucky and the second was pretty easy. I still think Amad has the better future, but I love the competition. Antony is an after thought now IMO.

Amad ? 2 years older and yet to make any impact whatsoever on the first team. I like the look of him too but that's just a silly statement.

 

[King7Eric]

High potential. Sometimes his touch is a bit messy, that's my only concern. Not a Ronaldo or Rooney level talent where they were certainly going to be world class, but some tier below that which shows high potential but could go either way in terms of really reaching the elite.

But overall, he does have a bit of everything for a wide player. He's flexible, can use both feet, knows where the net is and can beat people. It's really important wide players know how to get into positions to score and can finish - gone are the days you're going to have a wide forward at United producing 3 goals a season and just being there as an outlet and providing for a striker. They need to be finding the net and he's good at that for such a young player.

I think it's a fair assessment. Someone mentioned Pedro and I think he can be that level. An integral part of a top team, but not the absolute star. He'll be a level below the likes of Vinicius, Bellingham, Haaland etc but can still be a top player.

 

[Trophy Room]

He wasn't great with his general play but still scored 2 and impacted the game. Says a lot.

 

[Hanky panky]

I will be dissapointed if he reaches "only" Pedro´s level. He has potential to be a better player than that. Ronaldo? I don´t think so. Robben and Sanchez? Maybe.