Jurgen Klopp Sack Watch

[Mindhunter]

Was definitely not meant to sound like that, I didn't bring it up myself but rather as a a counter-argument, playing devil's advocate in my response to someone who thought that you had been great this season. Let me just say that I 100% agree that you have all the reasons to be enthousiast and optimistic about your team right now - you're top of the league (and most fans rightfully won't care how you got there) and your team has a lot of potential.

Sorry, should have read more of the context. We haven't been great really (losing 6-1 to Spurs, although coincidentally we are 1 and they are 6 right now on the table). Majority of the United fans are just happy that we finally have a team that can play like title contenders which is where we should be every season. That's a far cry from the depressing and boring football we have played since SAF retired.

This isn't a world dominating team (yet) by any stretch of imagination and still lacks creativity outside of Bruno but we are headed in the right direction.

 

[pratyush_utd]

I hope we play counter attack, long balls and win with dubious penalty. Klopp meltdown will be worth it

 

[TrustInOle]

I hope we play counter attack, long balls and win with dubious penalty. Klopp meltdown will be worth it

I'm leaning towards this to.

But I think we shread them on the counter.

 

[Buchan]

As gratifying as these scenarios undoubtedly would be, I’d love to absolutely batter them by three or four more than anything else.

I don’t want them weaselling out of any post-match discussion with their usual “The Mancs are spawny, la” shite. Their league season is on the precipice and I sincerely hope we are the side to violently and remorselessly toss them over the edge.

0-3 or 0-4, ta.

 

[Steve 007]

I did the maths on this earlier and I’m pretty sure it’s wrong in terms of united, although the Liverpool number seem to be correct. Looking at united we would have dropped two points each against Villa, Brighton and West Brom i.e. six points (compared to Liverpool’s seven). This would put us on 30 points level with Spurs I think? Maybe someone can correct me if I’m wrong.

Did you count the points we’d gain if we had no penalties against us?
I think we’ve gained 6 but dropped 3 at Arsenal then.

 

[Chicharo]

Sorry if already posted

Just mind games. Hope Ole knows how to handle it. After all he had a chance to learn from the best

 

[Klopper76]

As gratifying as these scenarios undoubtedly would be, I’d love to absolutely batter them by three or four more than anything else.

I don’t want them weaselling out of any post-match discussion with their usual “The Mancs are spawny, la” shite. Their league season is on the precipice and I sincerely hope we are the side to violently and remorselessly toss them over the edge.

0-3 or 0-4, ta.

The funny thing is that if we end up winning through a dodgy penalty or bad call everyone on here will cry LiVARpool all night long. You've all been thinking up conspiracy theories for the last two years to explain away why we've become so good under Klopp. Ironically like we used to do about United. It's always the opposition missing chances, refereeing, VAR, luck etc.

We both know it won't end up a heavy victory for either side unless something ridiculous like an early red happens.

 

[Buchan]

The funny thing is that if we end up winning through a dodgy penalty or bad call everyone on here will cry LiVARpool all night long. You've all been thinking up conspiracy theories for the last two years to explain away why we've become so good under Klopp. Ironically like we used to do about United. It's always the opposition missing chances, refereeing, VAR, luck etc.

We both know it won't end up a heavy victory for either side unless something ridiculous like an early red happens.

True. But you lot are spawny, though. That’s the difference...

Regarding the result, it’s highly likely it’ll be a narrow win if there is to be a victor on Sunday. I wonder if we’ll see a cagey affair with both sides being subconsciously happy with a point despite publicly saying nothing of the sort.

A loss for either side, whilst not fatal at this juncture of the season, would be a heavy blow. Probably for Liverpool more than United at this point, but United cannot afford any slump having worked very hard to bridge the gap the past few weeks.

 

[RobinLFC]

True. But you lot are spawny, though. That’s the difference...

Regarding the result, it’s highly likely it’ll be a narrow win if there is to be a victor on Sunday. I wonder if we’ll see a cagey affair with both sides being subconsciously happy with a point despite publicly saying nothing of the sort.

A loss for either side, whilst not fatal at this juncture of the season, would be a heavy blow. Probably for Liverpool more than United at this point, but United cannot afford any slump having worked very hard to bridge the gap the past few weeks.

I think both sides will ultimately be disappointed with a draw, and rightfully so. Liverpool because it doesn't get us any closer (and you should be winning home games against direct rivals), and Utd because we are there for the taking (or at least, based on our form as of late).

A loss would indeed be a bigger blow to Liverpool than to Utd, agreed.

 

[Klopper76]

True. But you lot are spawny, though. That’s the difference...

Regarding the result, it’s highly likely it’ll be a narrow win if there is to be a victor on Sunday. I wonder if we’ll see a cagey affair with both sides being subconsciously happy with a point despite publicly saying nothing of the sort.

A loss for either side, whilst not fatal at this juncture of the season, would be a heavy blow. Probably for Liverpool more than United at this point, but United cannot afford any slump having worked very hard to bridge the gap the past few weeks.

We are now and then but when you look at chance creation, touches in the opposition area etc over the season you'll normally see us close to the top of that. We're also pretty good at keeping shots against us down as well, more so at home. Our away form has tanked this season and post lock down. That's why we're where we are. I mean 2 points from West Brom, Newcastle and Southampton isn't good enough.

I think a loss hurts us more than you. A draw is fine but I think we need to win. Failing to do so means four league games without one and we might not even be in the top four after Sunday. If you lose it's disappointing but you're still in a good position. I suppose it would depend how you respond mentally to a defeat.

 

[Remember the geese]

I think both sides will ultimately be disappointed with a draw, and rightfully so. Liverpool because it doesn't get us any closer (and you should be winning home games against direct rivals), and Utd because we are there for the taking (or at least, based on our form as of late).

A loss would indeed be a bigger blow to Liverpool than to Utd, agreed.

Not a chance that United will be disappointed with a draw.

 

[njred]

So Clattenbutg admits bias in the SAF years. Christ, I wonder how many more refs were doing the same thing. Everyone’s suspicions confirmed.

 

[united_99]

So Clattenbutg admits bias in the SAF years. Christ, I wonder how many more refs were doing the same thing. Everyone’s suspicions confirmed.

There is usually „hidden“ bias towards all top teams. Plus he said the same aura is not there anymore, not the decisions. And mediocre Liverpool getting more penalties in the EPL era than 13 times champions United makes this whole bias discussion completely useless anyway.

 

[Cpt Negative]

I did the maths on this earlier and I’m pretty sure it’s wrong in terms of united, although the Liverpool number seem to be correct. Looking at united we would have dropped two points each against Villa, Brighton and West Brom i.e. six points (compared to Liverpool’s seven). This would put us on 30 points level with Spurs I think? Maybe someone can correct me if I’m wrong.

Brighton would be 2-1 to us as they also scored a penalty

 

[Dec9003]

Was definitely not meant to sound like that, I didn't bring it up myself but rather as a a counter-argument, playing devil's advocate in my response to someone who thought that you had been great this season. Let me just say that I 100% agree that you have all the reasons to be enthousiast and optimistic about your team right now - you're top of the league (and most fans rightfully won't care how you got there) and your team has a lot of potential.

We got there by being the best team in the league this season, that’s sort of the point of the league table. We’ve gone on a run of winning matches, have the most points and the most wins. Nobody cares if you think we’ve been great or not, we’ve been better than your lot and every other team so far.

 

[thegregster]

I did the maths on this earlier and I’m pretty sure it’s wrong in terms of united, although the Liverpool number seem to be correct. Looking at united we would have dropped two points each against Villa, Brighton and West Brom i.e. six points (compared to Liverpool’s seven). This would put us on 30 points level with Spurs I think? Maybe someone can correct me if I’m wrong.

You have to take away penalties for all teams.

 

[Random Task]

Sorry if already posted

Just mind games. Hope Ole knows how to handle it. After all he had a chance to learn from the best

This a poorly thought-out attempt at a WUM that's easily debunked.

The point this guy is trying to make would only be relevant if all of those penalties were unjustly awarded, which they were not. Only one of our penalties this season was a dubious call that could have gone either way.

 

[Bocca9978]

I think both sides will ultimately be disappointed with a draw, and rightfully so. Liverpool because it doesn't get us any closer (and you should be winning home games against direct rivals), and Utd because we are there for the taking (or at least, based on our form as of late).

A loss would indeed be a bigger blow to Liverpool than to Utd, agreed.

I’d take a draw. But really hope to see Klopp lose his shit if we win. Even if we battered them he’d moan about something.

 

[RobinLFC]

We got there by being the best team in the league this season, that’s sort of the point of the league table. We’ve gone on a run of winning matches, have the most points and the most wins. Nobody cares if you think we’ve been great or not, we’ve been better than your lot and every other team so far.

That is such an incredibly flawed way of looking at things. The best team in the league doesn't always sit top of the league. Or would you argue then that up until a week or so ago Liverpool had been the best team in the league? And that Lyon is the best team in Ligue 1?

Fecking hell.

 

[Posh Red]

Did you count the points we’d gain if we had no penalties against us?
I think we’ve gained 6 but dropped 3 at Arsenal then.

Brighton would be 2-1 to us as they also scored a penalty

But I thought the article only referred to penalties awarded not against?

edit: just checked and some headlines have it correct whereas some have it worded wrong (e.g the one posted by @Chicharo above) but yeah you’re right

 

[MadDogg]

or 3 titles on the bounce (how many times?) and only an injury time goal from the Berts prevented how many on the bounce when they won on goal difference?

In the last seven years of Fergie's reign we won the title five times, lost it on goal difference once and lost it by one point once. It tends to be forgotten just how close we came to winning seven seasons in a row. Add in a CL title, another two CL finals (losing to arguably the best football team of all time) and injuries probably costing us another CL title in 06/07 when Milan were able to take advantage of pretty much our entire defence being out in the semi (and Ronaldo playing with an injured ankle), and it really was a period of domination.

 

[Crustanoid]

That is such an incredibly flawed way of looking at things. The best team in the league doesn't always sit top of the league. Or would you argue then that up until a week or so ago Liverpool had been the best team in the league? And that Lyon is the best team in Ligue 1?

Fecking hell.

By that logic we should just do away with trophies and have a public poll to gage who everyone thinks the best team is. With all the time you guys have on your hands you’d smash it in terms of click/phone votes.

 

[Sassy Colin]

https://www.manchestereveningnews.c...n-united-liverpool-klopp-penalty-19622054.amp

 

[RobinLFC]

By that logic we should just do away with trophies and have a public poll to gage who everyone thinks the best team is. With all the time you guys have on your hands you’d smash it in terms of click/phone votes.

No, whoever is top of the league at the end of the season deserves to be champion, and objectively they'll have had the best season of any team.

Utd has had the best season of any team right now and that's why you're top, you can say that. That doesn't mean you are the best team in the league necessarily, I don't see why that's so hard to grasp. PSG is the best team in the French league yet Lyon are first right now.

 

[Redcy]

Trust me if United did win the league, the rest of the fans, the media would make it clear we weren't the best team and we won because of dodgy decisions. To counterbalance that it would make me smile all the more, as for 13 years thats what Liverpool, City, Leeds, et al claimed

 

[InterFan1998]

Sorry if already posted

Just mind games. Hope Ole knows how to handle it. After all he had a chance to learn from the best

How does this calculation work btw? For example, Liverpool had a penalty against Fulham that they scored. So I assume this article takes it away. But how does the article account for whether Liverpool would have scored an equalizer from open play potentially and vice versa?

 

[ValenciasDrilledCrosses]

How does this calculation work btw? For example, Liverpool had a penalty against Fulham that they scored. So I assume this article takes it away. But how does the article account for whether Liverpool would have scored an equalizer from open play potentially and vice versa?

It doesn't. Any of these 'subtract the penalty' calculations are surface level and don't tell us anything at all for the most part. Just that both United and Liverpool have had some game-changing penalties.

 

[Ladron de redcafe]

So Clattenbutg admits bias in the SAF years. Christ, I wonder how many more refs were doing the same thing. Everyone’s suspicions confirmed.

Slight correction. Clattenberg claiming that situation X occurred doesn't make it true. He isn't "admitting", anything. He's making a claim.

This is a man who toured with Liverpool and was thrown off an Everton match because of the uproar given his closeness with Liverpool.

I'll gladly sit here and go through all of the contentious decisions United got/didn't get in the Ferguson years, and compare them with those of the other contending teams.

There were many occasions in which United felt they were shafted, and some glaringly incorrect ones nearly handed the titled to our opposition (case in point the decision to award Thierry Henry's 2nd goal in the 2-2 draw at Highbury in the run-in of the 2002-03 campaign).

We're open to any discussion as it pertains to refereeing, but let's not be disingenous. Equating the claims of an anything-but-objective Liverpool-friendly referee with "proof" is risible.

 

[Fridge chutney]

So Clattenbutg admits bias in the SAF years. Christ, I wonder how many more refs were doing the same thing. Everyone’s suspicions confirmed.

What a pathetic and bitter comment.

 

[roonster09]

What a pathetic and bitter comment.

Shame better Liverpool posters were all banned as part of Cull and WUMs like njred, Dumbstar somehow survived.

 

[Ladron de redcafe]

What a pathetic and bitter comment.

@njred In other words, it would be equally frivolous if we (as United fans) were to say "So Clattenbutg admits that Liverpool players dived and cheated for penalties in the Klopp years. Christ, I wonder how many more refs were doing the same thing. Everyone’s suspicions confirmed.

Do you see how that would be inductively fallacious? A claim doesn't constitute proof, and adducing a man's opinion without a breakdown of all the supposed unfairly awarded decisions, is quite ridiculous.

 

[Chicharo]

How does this calculation work btw? For example, Liverpool had a penalty against Fulham that they scored. So I assume this article takes it away. But how does the article account for whether Liverpool would have scored an equalizer from open play potentially and vice versa?

I suppose they don't deal with these types of situations. They just seem to considerate the number of penalties given to a team

 

[simmee]

Shame better Liverpool posters were all banned as part of Cull and WUMs like njred, Dumbstar somehow survived.

A bit unfortunate. Klopper is the only reasonable one these days.

 

[MDFC Manager]

So Clattenbutg admits bias in the SAF years. Christ, I wonder how many more refs were doing the same thing. Everyone’s suspicions confirmed.

Source?

 

[MDFC Manager]

Shame better Liverpool posters were all banned as part of Cull and WUMs like njred, Dumbstar somehow survived.

Most amusing is how robin survived.

 

[RedChisel]

How is a Man United forum full of Liverpool supporters spouting conspiracy theories? No other forum would put up with this nonsense.

 

[Judas]

Did any actually get culled? All the ones I'd have expected to go are still here

 

[ClaytonBlackmoorLeftPeg]

Did any actually get culled? All the ones I'd have expected to go are still here

it’s baffling.

 

[Withnail]

So Clattenbutg admits bias in the SAF years. Christ, I wonder how many more refs were doing the same thing. Everyone’s suspicions confirmed.

It's the last line of the article and it's followed with an exclamation mark so I think that was a bit tongue in cheek.

I am the only referee to give three penalties to the opposition at Old Trafford, and that was for Liverpool, of all teams, in 2014.
But David Moyes was manager — I'm not sure that would have happened when Fergie was there!

 

[RobinLFC]

Most amusing is how robin survived.

My contributions to the Other Sports section might make up for my crappy football views, if it's any consolation