Maybe Jose has some use for Lingard. Guess we have to trust Jose for now.Mikel survived under Jose(and subsequent managers) for years.
Don't hold your breath.
Maybe Jose has some use for Lingard. Guess we have to trust Jose for now.Mikel survived under Jose(and subsequent managers) for years.
Don't hold your breath.
To me, it makes a lot more sense to have solid, hardworking squad options in defensive positions, or doing midfield dirty work.cleverley, evans, o'shea, fletcher, p neville, nicky butt etc.
All players who came from the ranks, all players who got the stick of blame for whatever reason. You get fans talking about how player should be loyal, when they cant even be loyal to their own.
Maybe it just means that the rest of our players are not good enough. That's not Lingard's fault.I don't dislike the lad, but I don't think he's good enough. We should be looking to have class throughout our starting eleven at the very least for a club of our stature.
He wouldn't get on the bench for City, Madrid, Barca, Bayern etc, yet he's a starter for Manchester United.
Absolutely. It speaks worse of the other players who aren't displacing Lingard despite being supposedly better.I understand many of the comments on here about him being limited and maybe shouldn't be playing as many games - but that's not the issue is it. It's the vitriol that you see poured out at the lad that's the problem. There really is no need for some of the personal comments I've seen on here.
How does the blame go to Martial for example for the Super Cup? He destroyed Real Madrid in the friendlies, he generally had a good preseason. Yet Jesse was picked ahead of him. I'm sorry but more often than not that narrative isn't true.The blame lies with the other more talented players for not seizing their moment. Martial and Mkhi in particular should be dominating teams but often disappear in games when they are capable of being world class. The fault is not the coach's but the other players
During a certain period, Mikel was a very good player for Chelsea. Don't let his last 2-3 seasons fool you because by then he was happy with the paycheck basically.Mikel survived under Jose(and subsequent managers) for years.
Don't hold your breath.
I'm 61, can't run much any more but I have fantastic attitude and desire for the club to win every match. I am expecting a call-up from Jose at any minute.
You could go back as far as you like and im pretty sure id know the players you would mention but it really dosnt matter either way,its not a whos the top red discussion.So what's your opinion on Jose, if LVG didn't have a clue?
Our club indeed is based on winning. As you clearly no so much about our club, could you please list the successful periods of our club & the players within that period? If you do, you'll notice hoe many of our youth players are included in that.
Of course Jesse isn't a "World Class" player. However, he is a "Manchester United" player. A player I put alongside the likes Butt, P. Neville, O'Shea, Fletcher etc. I'd go further back a little but I doubt you would know those players.
Not as awful as this insightful effort or your one above it....Tom cleverly,yeah i wish we'd been more loyal to him....he got england caps while he was with us which have dried up since he left and played over 50 games for us,a club who are so far above his level its unreal,as has been proven by his career path since he left....i think we done alright by him. Honestly i think some fans would still have luke chadwick running down the wing for us,good old academy lad ya see. Some academy lads just arnt good enough,hundreds get released without getting a sniff of the first team,some have a decent run in the first team squad and ultimately get sold on,fans arnt been disloyal because they dont rate a player from the academy,they just want the club to be successful.Awful post.
That is part of it. He's basically our only winger, and while he's not a very good player, he's probably as good a winger as the others who are played there out of position, just not as good a player.Maybe it just means that the rest of our players are not good enough. That's not Lingard's fault.
Of course, you didn't say that it was.
He's definitely not as good as park that's for sure, park worked hard but was a very good player as well but he sacrificed himself for the good of the team as it was clear that other attacking players were far superior to him.I've heard people say that Lingard is the equivalent of the likes of Ji Sung Park. Which is obviously doing a huge disservice to JSP.
Fixed. Certainly the case for me.all the social media stupidity, almost everything about this generation annoy me
I think Jose's a great manager. Has his flaws, like we all do. He also knows a lot more about the game of football than I do. He's been very successful. He continues to be successful. He's adapted to our squad and culture as a club. If he thinks Lingard is the man for that particular game, then I'll habe to agree.You could go back as far as you like and im pretty sure id know the players you would mention but it really dosnt matter either way,its not a whos the top red discussion.
Jose,i think he's one of the best managers in the world who still gets his fair share of things wrong just like every other manager ever,whats your opinion of him?
I dont need to bore everyone with lists of all the periods and players of everytime we'v been successful,the whole forum knows we'v had some great sides and a lot of great youth players have been a part of them but we wernt successful JUST because we had a lot of academy players in the teams,we were successful because the players both academy and the ones we bought were good enough,which is what i said..."preferably with as many youth players who are good enough to achive that"....A lot of fans,myself included dont think lingard is good enough,he had 1 goal and 2 assits in 25 league games last season,playing mostly as one of the 3 behind the striker,if your happy with that then thats fine but just because others arnt happy with that it dosnt make them plastic fans as you called them.
With regards to supporting him,iv wanted him to have the game of his life every single time he's played for us,id love it if he went out today and had a stormer,just because i dont rate him it dosnt mean i dont want him to do well.
Oh I completely agree with you. It was a bit of a throwaway statement in that if it were that simple, then Martial/Miki would just work harder.We have all seen what players like Miki and Martial can bring to the team. All players have an off day here and there, that doesn't justify them being sat on the bench for the next 6 games especially when replaced with subpar players like Lingard who then get hauled off at halftime replaced by another subpar player in Fellaini all to do a job while the more talented players get their act together and still end up doing it again the next game as some way to redeem themselves.
Miki is an experienced player, he's going to have a off day sometimes especially when we chop and change so much and his role changes from game to game. You have to keep playing him regardless as he's a player that can make a difference.
As for martial, he's still young and developing, we shouldn't expect world class performances from him, he's still learning his trade, experimenting what work for him and what doesn't and in the process of perfecting it. This requires game time, not training. As frustrating as it is it's the only way he's going to improve.
I can't say Rashford has improved from when he burst onto the scene, he needs to develop as a striker, playing him on the wing has improved him in some aspect but upfront is where he needs to develop and improve thus allowing martial to develop on the LW. Also with Lukaku coming it takes a lot of weight off Rashford shoulders knowing he'll be around for a while unlike Zlatan.
spot on!Also, I don't understand the criticism he gets personality wise
I'm glad to see him enjoying his football and life in general. He should be pinching himself every day for living the dream 99% of this forum has - playing for Manchester United and being paid handsomely for doing so. You couldn't surgically remove the smile from my face if I was in his position.
If I had scored that winning goal in the fa cup final for my beloved United I'd still be dancing now whilst retweeting the moment every minute for the rest of my life
I swear some people on here would rather we had a team of robots
Can't disagree with this. Work-rate is just one aspect as is talent, intelligence, speed. fitness etc.With forward players scoring and assisting are the most important, working harder than than most forwards should be an added bonus not the main quality
Selling him isn't the answer no, but playing someone who can contribute more than 1 league goal and 2 assists most likely will be. If you don't think that Lingard playing so many games had no connection to us being so dire last season in terms of goals scored then you would be deluded.There's always going to be one scape goat people want to put their negative energy on and selling him is definitely going to be the answer to all our problems. Happens every season.
Thats were we differ,whilst knowing full well that jose knows more about football than i could ever dream of knowing a million times over i still have my own opinion.I think Jose's a great manager. Has his flaws, like we all do. He also knows a lot more about the game of football than I do. He's been very successful. He continues to be successful. He's adapted to our squad and culture as a club. If he thinks Lingard is the man for that particular game, then I'll habe to agree.
Supporting a player when he's doing isn't very difficult, is it? Supporting a player when he's going through a tough time is supporting a player. Believe it or not, a football club isn't just based on the quality of players on the pitch. It's about the squad harmony. Who would you have instead of Jese? Player like him is worth more to us, than other clubs. The players I mentioned earlier were exactly the same. They will go to lesser clubs. They won't go to a top four club. But these guys will do more for us, on & off the pitch for us, than someone more talented, aka ADM.
What I don't understand is, how you can slate a player and support him at the same time? Also, how can he be so poor and be in a team that has picked up trophies in the past couple of years? He's not just been a bit part player, he's been an integral player.Thats were we differ,whilst knowing full well that jose knows more about football than i could ever dream of knowing a million times over i still have my own opinion.
Supporting a player and not rating a player are two totally differant things,i dont rate jesse but i support him every time he plays for us and not because he's doing well,it dosnt matter how badly he's played prevously or how badly he's playing during a game i still want him to do well the nxt time he gets the ball,he hasnt got a clue nor does he care that i dont rate him so me supporting him during good times or bad dosnt effect his performance anyways. Have you rated every single player thats came through our academy and played first team?
Whilst i agree squad harmony is important,using that as one of his qualitys rather than anything he does on the pitch speaks volumes and for all we know other players could be just as well liked amongst the group.
The players you mentioned earlier who you said you'd put jesse alongside i think your doing a massive disservice,especially butt and fletcher,i dont think lingard is anywher close to being as good or important to the club as these two,does that make you a plastic fan because you dont rate these 2 academy products as highly as i do...No,of course it dosnt,just like it dosnt make us who dont rate lingard plastic fans either.
Hating is justifed he/she saysHating him as a person, no. Hating him based on his ability is justified.
The blame should be on Jose though as we can all see that Lingard offers nothing and is completely shite yet he still plays. You would agree that might be fair IF we had no other options, however we have one of the best youth players in the world in Martial!! Lingard just isn't good enough and not United standards. The more he plays the more people will hate him because of it.
Similar the way people turned on Fellaini and Rooney. Not up to standard but won't seem to feck off.
Fellaini gets the worst by farI understand many of the comments on here about him being limited and maybe shouldn't be playing as many games - but that's not the issue is it. It's the vitriol that you see poured out at the lad that's the problem. There really is no need for some of the personal comments I've seen on here.
This.Don't know why you need to make it personal. He's a mediocre footballer who will end up at a team in the bottom half of the table within a couple years. Most of us can see this. Doesn't mean we hate the guy, or he's a "public enemy", or he's a scapegoat, or we have an agenda. That's making it personal and throwing such accusations around is childish.
Fact is not every player we have is good enough. It's OK to acknowledge that and be critical of them as players. Doesn't mean we hate them and want a public execution ffs. Just means we want to see better players at United so our team performs better and we get back to competing in the CL with the best teams, like we used to.
Voice of reason.Lingard sets a perfectly achievable target for the so called more talented players to meet if they want to take his place.
That certain players aren't willing or able to show the required qualities to take his place says more about them than it does him. I imagine Lingard is a dream for the manager, he works his bollocks off everyday and follows the managers orders to the letter on game day, he's also highly unlikely to kick off if he does find himself out of the team for a period and by all accounts is very popular guy in the squad.
If the likes of martial and mhiki knuckle down and give José what he wants then they shouldn't have a problem getting Jesse's spot. If they don't they either wait for the next manager who may well have a different approach to José or they'll continue not to play as much as Lingard.
With the exception of Madrid, would we argue about having every "squad player" that Bayern & Barca have? I mean, you reckon Barca's Rafinha would come straight into our 11? You think Gnabry would come straight into our 11? The answer would be no.Would love to see barca, Madrid, bayern fans arguing for a player like lingard to even be on their bench. That's the level we need to reach and that is never happening if Lingard plays as many games as he did last year.
Another thing, this blaming of our top players for not keeping him out the team? Martial won us the game against Middlesbrough, has been more productive than lingard in previous season... but still won't get starts. The feck else can he do?
Gnabry is much better than Lingard though to be honest.With the exception of Madrid, would we argue about having every "squad player" that Bayern & Barca have? I mean, you reckon Barca's Rafinha would come straight into our 11? You think Gnabry would come straight into our 11? The answer would be no.
Great reply. Truly an excellent addition to the thread.Hating is justifed he/she says
Its all you deserve. Rethink your lifeGreat reply. Truly an excellent addition to the thread.