[stw2022]

The thing is for the longest time the debate around Rashford has been based on stats without context.

That example of whet he ignored Casemiro is a perfect example of something he did that looks great on his statistics sheet - shot on goal "looking dangerous" - but was the wrong thing for the team

There's so many examples of that.

In a month's time what was a poor performance against Burnley and Brighton will get lauded simply because of the number of shots he took.

Looking at Spurs there's always the ambition to play the ball quick around opposition area. If there's a player in an advantageous position they try to find him. Rashford doesn't allow us to do that as he dwells on ball constantly, allowing defences to regroup and snuff out any danger before he's decided what he wants to do with the ball.

Tottenham's second; Rashford wouldn't have played in Song. He'd have dwelt on the ball, allowing the defence to get players back, put his head down and run he ball off the pitch only trying to cross once ball had already gone out of play

 

[hobbers]

Disaster on the pitch and disaster behind the wheel.

 

[MackRobinson]

Navigation system told him to pass the car in front, but the instructions were unclear to him.

 

[Marwood]

Big part of his problem when not playing well is he doubles down. Instead of getting back to basics he does more of the bad stuff. More hesd down running, more playing like an individual.

Someone needs to get hold of him and flip that around.

 

[philippexyz]

Man management. That's potential responsible. He's become an arrogant, lazy, petulant, sulky and selfish player lauded and praised well beyond his abilities largely due to his off the field ventures. His home grown status and admirable PR, and maybe his nationality, means there's been a huge reluctance to come to that obvious conclusion

Nicely said. Agree with everything.

 

[KranjskaKlobasa]

I think he was better - less selfish and tried to pass more to Hojlud and others. This on the other hand affected his decision making a bit as there were one or two occasions where he should shoot instead of opting for a pass. His letargic defensive work still needs improving.

 

[Mercurial]

He used to be so likeable and energetic, it's all half assed nowadays, wonder where the issue is.

 

[KikiDaKats]

Thought he was good defensively yesterday and physically certain things us fans would expect, is physically impossible for any human to do for 90mins.
My area of worry was the attacking phase because he’s seem to have gone back to school and trying to think now. Long term it’ll come together but right now we’ll be seeing a lot of very bad decisions.

 

[InspiRED]

He has all the tools to be pretty complete, you could see that when he played for England and is surrounded by other top players, his passing game was great. I think he suffers from being the main outlet and goal threat in a completely unbalanced side but it looks like he's being well instructed to link with Hojlund in a bid to stop this ineffective trend.

He is nowhere near the frustrating player of 3/4/5 seasons ago but his work effort is and has always been pretty shite. I dunno if it's fair to just pin it on laziness as I do reckon he spends the game 'saving himself' for the big moments and chances. Trouble is, it's just not a sustainable method because it only takes a few games of not scoring or being in poor form to set the whole team back.

It's up to the coaching staff to sort it out, but it can't continue. It's not nice to see posters piling in on his ability level though. When he's on it he looks genuinely different class imo. I pin all the blame on Ole, as some other posters have. I think it's fair, he turned into this perennial outball 'moments' player under Ole and it has never really evolved. I didn't think Burnley and Bayern were so bad though, looks like he's trying to form a good playing relationship with Hojlund which explains some of the odd decision making.

Restate it again that he has all the tools to be a top player for us, but he needs to evolve into a system player and that's also gonna mean learning how to press for the team. I don't think you can blame him too much for way he's developed as he's gonna look around and think 'well no-one else is scoring are they?'.

 

[Waynne]

He is morphing into Valencia. He will sprint ahead. Then come to a complete stop trying to beat the defender. Give up then turn back and pass back to our defender.

At least Valencia will track his runners and attempt a tackle. Marcus just gives up and then throws his arms in the air.

Get him the feck out of this club. Sick and tired of players just not giving a feck.

 

[RedStarUnited]

He has all the tools to be pretty complete, you could see that when he played for England and is surrounded by other top players, his passing game was great. I think he suffers from being the main outlet and goal threat in a completely unbalanced side but it looks like he's being well instructed to link with Hojlund in a bid to stop this ineffective trend.

He is nowhere near the frustrating player of 3/4/5 seasons ago but his work effort is and has always been pretty shite. I dunno if it's fair to just pin it on laziness as I do reckon he spends the game 'saving himself' for the big moments and chances. Trouble is, it's just not a sustainable method because it only takes a few games of not scoring or being in poor form to set the whole team back.

It's up to the coaching staff to sort it out, but it can't continue. It's not nice to see posters piling in on his ability level though. When he's on it he looks genuinely different class imo. I pin all the blame on Ole, as some other posters have. I think it's fair, he turned into this perennial outball 'moments' player under Ole and it has never really evolved. I didn't think Burnley and Bayern were so bad though, looks like he's trying to form a good playing relationship with Hojlund which explains some of the odd decision making.

Restate it again that he has all the tools to be a top player for us, but he needs to evolve into a system player and that's also gonna mean learning how to press for the team. I don't think you can blame him too much for way he's developed as he's gonna look around and think 'well no-one else is scoring are they?'.

Why do people say this, or rather why do you say this. If he didn't have speed tell me which other part of his game is outstanding to you?

His much lauded shooting/finishing I think is just decent. He hits everything with power and never tries placing it. If theres a crowd in front of Rashford best believe he is gonna smash it into them and not try curl it around them.

 

[tomaldinho1]

If his physical attributes are waning which would be early but not that crazy - his debut was very early, he’s played a lot of football and played through injuries for prolonged periods unwisely - his decline will be unbelievably fast. I do worry watching him there’s a spark missing now, he doesn’t seem to have that electric speed anymore and that’s by far his greatest asset.

 

[AltiUn]

He's doing my head in lately.

 

[Em765]

This is just who he is.
He has been the same level for about 5 years now.
Capable of brilliance but also inconsistent and sometimes infuriating and lazy.
Gotta take good with the bad but he cannot absolutely cannot be your star player.

I do think Garnacho will surpass him as a player in like 2 years.

 

[golden_blunder]

I think he was better - less selfish and tried to pass more to Hojlud and others. This on the other hand affected his decision making a bit as there were one or two occasions where he should shoot instead of opting for a pass. His letargic defensive work still needs improving.

I agree it’s bad but for all we know he may be told to stay up top to use his pace to catch them on the break

 

[golden_blunder]

Re the accident with his car, it sounds like he was speeding and lost control? Sounds familiar

 

[Doracle]

I agree it’s bad but for all we know he may be told to stay up top to use his pace to catch them on the break

He seems to have instructions to press the CB and then sprint back to cover the full back if they go forwards. It’s not really sustainable and he has looked shattered in the last 10 minutes of the last couple of matches trying to do it (Bruno was also struggling trying to do the same at the end against Burnley when he switched to the LW and he doesn’t have the same responsibility of also being the main outlet ball on the counter).

Hopefully, it’s just a temporary system until we have a decent midfield structure. We can’t have our main goal threat playing like some form of auxiliary wing back.

 

[philippexyz]

I hope Garnacho starts rapidly developing, improving and eventually, potentially even replacing Rashford as our starting left winger. I don't like Rashford's attitude, selfishness, sulkiness, casually strolling on the pitch like he's a model on a fashion week instead of pressing and tracking back to help the defense. He might think he's on the same level as Mbappe, and he's delusional if the truly believes so(he certainly behaves like a spoiled frontman, prima-donna, main star of the band).

Needs to be humbled, but Garnacho is still too raw and young so Rashford can't really be dropped, yet. We'll have to tolerate his inconsistency and attitude for some more time, who knows how long.

 

[IRN-BRUno]

Re the accident with his car, it sounds like he was speeding and lost control? Sounds familiar

At least both he and the woman are okay, nearly had our next scandal with him driving into an OAP!

 

[stw2022]

At least both he and the woman are okay, nearly had our next scandal with him driving into an OAP!

Remember when Rooney got in hot water smashing an OAP in the rear

 

[fezzerUTD]

If you are quoting Paul Parker, then you might as well start quoting Gabby Agbonlahor (sadly as I loved Parker as a player for us). He’s endlessly negative about United. Here’s a couple of Paul Parker’s previous quotes:

“He [Weghorst] has everything about him that a player like Anthony Martial doesn't," Parker told Soccernews. "Martial comes out and wears gloves. I'm not saying that we are the warmest country in the world but come on… We are in May.”

"Bruno Fernandes is the kind of person, if the boat was sinking, he would be the first person to jump out of it. That says it all in my opinion.”

Apart from Weghorst not having Martials natural ability, the 3 quotes are spot on.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

Tottenham's second; Rashford wouldn't have played in Song. He'd have dwelt on the ball, allowing the defence to get players back, put his head down and run he ball off the pitch only trying to cross once ball had already gone out of play

One of the maddest things to see on redcafe is when someone goes all in on a player they dislike. Ranting and raving about them after every single performance. So angry about this player that they start creating fictional scenarios to criticise the player, that never actually happened. When you start criticising moments from a performance that is entirely a creation of your own mind it's probably a good sign to take a deep breath and walk away from the thread.

The other classic trope of these "all in" lunatics is that they are always the most prolific poster in that player's thread. I intuitively knew you'd be right up there at numero uno before I'd actually checked and sure enough...

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[Craig Ward]

Body language is shocking.
Workrate is shocking

He's not doing it offensively and a massive hindrance to the team with zero workrate. Not finding his passes and very slow in decision making.

If he was working his backside off and looking sharp I wouldnt say a word, but he is clearly in low confidence and his mindset isn't right.

He's big pals with Sancho and I cant help think he's downed tools for Ten Hag. He's not playing like a committed player and his best pals had a stinker calling the manager out. Needs to be dropped

 

[Remember the geese]

Quality, with high work rate. Every player without exception who plays for this club should be ticking both boxes. Not one or the other. Both. This should be a prerequisite moving forward because it quite obviously hasn't been viewed as such in the past.

 

[stw2022]

Sorry i think Rashford is the barrier to us pushing on. He is SO wasteful almost every time he touches the ball. It isn't even in high profile goal-mouth moments, it's all over the pitch. With Rashford involved in every attacking move we undertake we essentially have to completely write off 60-70% of every attack to the Rashford factor.

Aggravated by the fact he's so greedy despite his limitations. There's no way we should be finishing games with him getting the overwhelming majority of the chances we create. I don't have figures for the Burnley game but for Brighton he has 9 chances vs Hojlund's two.

This "agenda" accusations and "it's mad when.." nonsense - we would not be in this state of Rashford didn't cockblock almost everything we try and create due to his laziness, his selfishness, his inability to look up, his preference to dwell on the ball for way too fecking long - or a combination of any of the aforementioned.

 

[GMoore23]

Needs to perform on Saturday. If not, he should be dropped.

 

[Bwuk]

He’ll start over Garnacho at the weekend but he shouldn’t. Rashford needs a wake up call. He’s been pathetic this season.

Look at the running Garnacho & Pellistri offered tonight. He just doesn’t do that.

 

[Pughnichi]

Needs to perform on Saturday. If not, he should be dropped.

Why wait until Saturday. Drop him immediately. The team/players should be rewarded for their performance tonight and given the opportunity to sustain it. Throwing Rashford in after his horror performances sends the wrong msg.

Also would give him something to think about and perhaps when he gets reintroduced he won’t put in a woeful performances like we’ve become accustomed to this season so far

 

[Banana Republic]

Tonight all the attacking players worked their socks off.
Even Martial, in his usual, worryingly casual way, put some effort in off the ball.
Rashford should be on the bench on Saturday to drive home the point.

 

[croadyman]

Tonight all the attacking players worked their socks off.
Even Martial, in his usual, worryingly casual way, put some effort in off the ball.
Rashford should be on the bench on Saturday to drive home the point.

Yeah he does need to get the message he isn't working hard enough off the ball. There should be consequences for that in my opinion

 

[RuudTom83]

They are only so many fires the manager can put out at once…let ETH get a few more wins before we start making more.

Rashford will be fine. Maybe a few early substitutions is all it needs.

 

[Threesus]

I think maybe we should just sell him. It’s clear he is holding us back and we are going to win trebles and quadruples with garnacho and Pellestri. He is not even better than welbeck, so why are we coddling him?

 

[amolbhatia50k]

Tonight all the attacking players worked their socks off.
Even Martial, in his usual, worryingly casual way, put some effort in off the ball.
Rashford should be on the bench on Saturday to drive home the point.

It makes such a big difference. Not that I think we wouldn’t have won with Rashford. Maybe we’d have won even more but a football club needs to have a culture and ethic. Only footballers who are absolute anomalies can be allowed leeway in this regard. We don’t have any yet one thinks he is.

 

[stw2022]

Last night we moved the ball quickly, taking advantage of movement off the ball to create space and pull defenders around. There was quick, one touch football and inspite of the fact many players were vastly more inexperienced, there were not multiple instances brain-dead decision making. Nobody spent the night running down cul-de-sacs until they ran out of pitch or out of options. Nobody tried to see whether defenders legs were solid matter or whether the ball could pass through them. Players looked up, were aware of movement and position of team mates around them and made use of that.

What we did, particularly in the first half, flowed. And i think that's because Rashford wasn't on the pitch. It's the first time we've looked sharp this session and it's the first game where 90% of our attacking play hasn't been destroyed by having to go through Rashford and his nonsense.

 

[roonster09]

One of the maddest things to see on redcafe is when someone goes all in on a player they dislike. Ranting and raving about them after every single performance. So angry about this player that they start creating fictional scenarios to criticise the player, that never actually happened. When you start criticising moments from a performance that is entirely a creation of your own mind it's probably a good sign to take a deep breath and walk away from the thread.

The other classic trope of these "all in" lunatics is that they are always the most prolific poster in that player's thread. I intuitively knew you'd be right up there at numero uno before I'd actually checked and sure enough...

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Only when player is not playing well, check last season, barely a post in Rashford thread when he was scoring lot of goals.

Few love to dress up their hatred as "valid criticism" making up nonsense.

 

[stw2022]

He's scored 4 goals in his last 21 appearances. It's decent for a midfielder but it's not good enough when it's the player that will through - let's be generous and say self belief - take the lions share of chances for himself. In fact it's very problematic.

Observing this, and the fact that we seem to play with more creativity without him, is apparently an 'agenda' and there's going to be a Rumble video lashing out against this awful conspiracy any minute, no doubt.

 

[NoPace]

Apart from Weghorst not having Martials natural ability, the 3 quotes are spot on.

No way Bruno jumps off of a sinking ship. He'd try to fix it himself and decide in that moment that he's both captain of the ship and a fully trained engineer, yeah.

 

[roonster09]

Who knew Martinez was the one holding us back and Maguire is the way forward to dominate games, after all Maguire dominated this game.

 

[ohhrooney]

It was so good to see United as a team yesterday. More of no Rashford please, and more of how we played in the 2nd half.

 

[fezzerUTD]

No way Bruno jumps off of a sinking ship. He'd try to fix it himself and decide in that moment that he's both captain of the ship and a fully trained engineer, yeah.

Yeah. No.