Muffled cries of “I told you so” from behind a green and gold scarf / blame it on the glazers part V

[ClaytonBlackmoorLeftPeg]

Nothing extraordinary iirc. As an owner of a once 1 bn worth of asset which now stands at 4bn they off course took some form of dividents, profit or whatever they call it. But nothing extraordinary big.

A 700m debt now stands at 400m means they used 300m over the course of 10 years. Hardly anything extraordinary. 30m dividents per year.

They made united as a collateral for a loan. But people making it as if they sold parts of united for 700m.

I agree. A leveraged buyout and then refinancing is perfectly normal.

A lot of people don’t understand the concept of debt. Using your figures they had a debt to asset ratio of 70% when they purchased the club and now this is 10% - that’s incredible business.

You don’t expect people to go any buy their house with cash, they use a mortgage - the Glazers did the same (as a simplified analogy).

Anyone who takes on a £1bn business and grows them to a £4bn business deserves to be paid. Sorry we don’t live in a world of fairytails where our owners love the club and do everything for free. That ship sailed a long time ago for Football.

We sold our soul when we listed on the Stock Market, and before that Martin Edwards was trying to sell the club to anyone that had a few pennies.

 

[CA1]

Van Gaal was asked yesterday on Dutch tv about the problems at the club. He said the main thing he was surprised and disappointed with during his time at the club was that football wasn't the priority, commerce/money was. He said the club was run very different from Bayern, where football was the clear number 1 priority.

He's 100% spot on.

 

[Bloedrood]

Yes we can certainly do better in terms of footballing structure at the Club but I would take anything Van Gaal says with pinch of salt he lacks self awareness and it's in his self interest to support Mourinho and blame board completely for our failings that way he himself is absolved from any blame for his tenure with as well.

I don't know about that. He wasn't asked about his or Mourinho's failings specifically, but more about his opinion on the problems that United has had since Ferguson left. He didn't leave Bayern in a pleasant manner either, but that didn't stop him from speaking much more highly of them in this regard.

 

[Patrick08]

Woodward has several faults, but this wasn't on him. There is no proof to suggest that the managers were lying when they said they scouted/asked for the players.

Well lvg has said exactly the opposite of that in the press after his sacking, a year later after his contractual obligations have expired.

He keeps on contradicting this version everytime he speaks about united and Woodward. He has even went on to say di maria was not his signing. There is a lot of difference between , Like and exactly him.

Mourinho is widely known to like work horses wide players who can do jobs on both sides of the pitch, then him scouting a player like mkh casts serious doubts when players like Mane were on the market, while Lvg also wanted mane a year earlier after Pedro was snapped by chelsea but Woodward denied him the player and the targets changed. At the time even a regular watcher of united in the past could point out that mane was better suited to this club and the methods of mourinho, so him going for a player like mkh is very surprising as mourinho only wants his category of players who ticks those certain boxes he wants in a wide player.

I doubt managers have the full freedom to get their own players and there is a serious chance Woodward is interfering too much in the area after 3 managers are testifying against the man after their contractual obligations expired.

 

[flappyjay]

Yes we can certainly do better in terms of footballing structure at the Club but I would take anything Van Gaal says with pinch of salt he lacks self awareness and it's in his self interest to support Mourinho and blame board completely for our failings that way he himself is absolved from any blame for his tenure with as well.

The clown that sold/loaned all our wingers to only cry for the club to get him wingers the following season. He is the reason why he failed.

 

[Greck]

I agree. A leveraged buyout and then refinancing is perfectly normal.

A lot of people don’t understand the concept of debt. Using your figures they had a debt to asset ratio of 70% when they purchased the club and now this is 10% - that’s incredible business.

You don’t expect people to go any buy their house with cash, they use a mortgage - the Glazers did the same (as a simplified analogy).

Anyone who takes on a £1bn business and grows them to a £4bn business deserves to be paid. Sorry we don’t live in a world of fairytails where our owners love the club and do everything for free. That ship sailed a long time ago for Football.

We sold our soul when we listed on the Stock Market, and before that Martin Edwards was trying to sell the club to anyone that had a few pennies.

Agree with all of this. People demonising them don't even factor in the increased revenue as a result of the aggressive commercialization model the glazers employ. I read our sponsorship deals are now up to 250mil per year. If they uped our revenue by say 150mil for example, over a 10 year period they would have made us 1.5bil but people would still be talking about the 700m debt when we've profited 800m from their ownership.

I see the glazers as financial managers. You don't love or trust them but you choose to keep them around because their financial acumen makes you a lot of money

 

[pacifictheme]

I agree. A leveraged buyout and then refinancing is perfectly normal.

A lot of people don’t understand the concept of debt. Using your figures they had a debt to asset ratio of 70% when they purchased the club and now this is 10% - that’s incredible business.

You don’t expect people to go any buy their house with cash, they use a mortgage - the Glazers did the same (as a simplified analogy).

Anyone who takes on a £1bn business and grows them to a £4bn business deserves to be paid. Sorry we don’t live in a world of fairytails where our owners love the club and do everything for free. That ship sailed a long time ago for Football.

We sold our soul when we listed on the Stock Market, and before that Martin Edwards was trying to sell the club to anyone that had a few pennies.

Its not a great analogy as the house doesn't then pay the owner money as well as pay off the mortgage. The owner of the house does that.

 

[Adisa]

Its not a great analogy as the house doesn't then pay the owner money as well as pay off the mortgage. The owner of the house does that.

If you use the house as a commercial entity(which we are) it does.
I

 

[gajender]

The clown that sold/loaned all our wingers to only cry for the club to get him wingers the following season. He is the reason why he failed.

Oh absolutely agree he was the architect of his own downfall just like Mourinho is our board is soft target , their biggest fault is that they tend to place too much faith in the managers not the other way round.

 

[ClaytonBlackmoorLeftPeg]

Its not a great analogy as the house doesn't then pay the owner money as well as pay off the mortgage. The owner of the house does that.

50% of rental properties in the UK have a mortgage on them - so if you use the analogy of a BTL (Buy To Let) purchase then it works even better. Was just trying to keep it simple.

If you can find the right deal, you can buy a BTL with very little or none of your own money, and I have done this, the Glazers purchase was completely normal business practice.

 

[Johan07]

50% of rental properties in the UK have a mortgage on them - so if you use the analogy of a BTL (Buy To Let) purchase then it works even better. Was just trying to keep it simple.

If you can find the right deal, you can buy a BTL with very little or none of your own money, and I have done this, the Glazers purchase was completely normal business practice.

Yeah, exactly. It was, and the criticism towards the purchase is so emotionally driven. Which is understandable in a way I guess.
IMO the Glazers spending/not spending should be judged on our wage bill since they took over. And it has been the largest in the PL over those years and still is depending on what source one refers to. Which it should be considering our turnover.
This argument of them taking money out of the club by way of paying interest on the loans or "mortgages" is really quite stupid. We should look at two things when judging the Glazers: i) the wage bill that they have/are funding, ii) the money available for transfers (investments) which pretty much all managers including Sir Alex always have said is there if needed.
I am not a Glazer fanboy or anything like that but in general there was nothing wrong with the takeover and we have been managed quite well since then. IMO at least....

 

[Crustanoid]

The minute this cancer was allowed to take the club over was the start of the rot. That’s when football stopped being number one priority here. SAF masked it but the last 6 years overseen by their stooge Woodward has brought it all crashing down. Mourinho not being sacked quick enough is just a symptom of a rot that won’t go away until the leeches go.

 

[Oneunited26]

The minute this cancer was allowed to take the club over was the start of the rot. That’s when football stopped being number one priority here. SAF masked it but the last 6 years overseen by their stooge Woodward has brought it all crashing down. Mourinho not being sacked quick enough is just a symptom of a rot that won’t go away until the leeches go.

United won’t win the title under this lot again for my money, has long as they keep making money trophy’s are not the priority. For them trying to be number 1 requires spending money, getting top 4 does not require spending a big deal, and that’s a dangerous road to go down

 

[sugar_kane]

No offence to the OP but I despise the title of this thread for some reason (the scarf part)

That's not to say I don't agree with the general premise, there's just something fundamental irksome about the wording.

 

[Whiteside1985]

I agree with the OP to a huge extent.

Still doesn't take away from the fact that the current squad are hugely underperforming, though.

 

[Lentwood]

Actually, to quote single transfer values is disingenuous - we should look at totals. As is not looking at the build up to our current problems, which were 5-10 years of underspending with "no value in the market". While Fergie scraped by with little to no money to spend because he had to stop the club financially crumbling (like Leeds) under the Glazer debt.

Just look at the volume of debt and debt repayments the club had to make after the Glazer takeover. That's why we under invested for years. Playing catchup spending recently when tranfer fees are higher than ever is not enough to make up for that lost ground.

You won’t get far on here with logic my friend. Great post but you’re shouting into a void

I spent days doing an analysis of our spending, adjusted for transfer inflation, to show how City and Chelsea have both spent on average the equivalent of £100m more a season for 10yrs or so but couple of weeks later the thread barely gets touched and you’ve got the same simple minded people posting the same simple minded opinions

People don’t like complexity. They like simple, 1+1=2 type logic. The forums gone to the dogs since they opened it up and got rid of the ‘10 likes’ rule. You can’t have any kind of decent discussion without 90% of the forum placing all of the blame at the feet of the current manager (Moyes then LvG now Jose)

 

[shamans]

I agree. A leveraged buyout and then refinancing is perfectly normal.

A lot of people don’t understand the concept of debt. Using your figures they had a debt to asset ratio of 70% when they purchased the club and now this is 10% - that’s incredible business.

You don’t expect people to go any buy their house with cash, they use a mortgage - the Glazers did the same (as a simplified analogy).

Anyone who takes on a £1bn business and grows them to a £4bn business deserves to be paid. Sorry we don’t live in a world of fairytails where our owners love the club and do everything for free. That ship sailed a long time ago for Football.

We sold our soul when we listed on the Stock Market, and before that Martin Edwards was trying to sell the club to anyone that had a few pennies.

Okay and ten years before glazers what was our worth? Also take into account recent growth of other clubs and find our delta.

Just pasting a few numbers doesn’t hide the fact the glazers have done terrible for the club where it matters

 

[CA1]

No offence to the OP but I despise the title of this thread for some reason (the scarf part)

That's not to say I don't agree with the general premise, there's just something fundamental irksome about the wording.

This wasn't the title I made, it was changed by a Moderator to take the piss out of a fan not liking the Glazers.

It can only have been changed by somebody who isn't a United fan, I know there are Leeds and I think Arsenal fans moderating so I presume it was one of them.

 

[RedNed77]

From a previously fervent anti-Glazer background, I'm slightly conflicted. They have taken money out of the club but, I don't think the squad lacks from investment. They're like mosquitos, they're an intolerable parasite on the club, but they're not to blame for our current malaise?

 

[Fluctuation0161]

This wasn't the title I made, it was changed by a Moderator to take the piss out of a fan not liking the Glazers.

It can only have been changed by somebody who isn't a United fan, I know there are Leeds and I think Arsenal fans moderating so I presume it was one of them.

They shouldn't have changed the thread title. Could've been a United fan, many don't like criticism of the owners for some strange reason.

 

[ClaytonBlackmoorLeftPeg]

Okay and ten years before glazers what was our worth? Also take into account recent growth of other clubs and find our delta.

Just pasting a few numbers doesn’t hide the fact the glazers have done terrible for the club where it matters

What on earth is your point?

Mine is that a leveraged buyout is perfectly normal business practice. You don't go and buy £bl+ assets with cash. Furthermore from an investment perspective, 400pc growth is an asset in 10 years is tremendous.

Utd under the Glazers over the last 5 years have spent more money on transfers than anyone else in the world except City, we probably have the highest wage bill in the world. I'm ready not sure what else they are expected to do. Like it or it, we are a business and not a billionaire's plaything.

Are we now blaming the Glazers for the piss porr performance against Palace?

 

[el3mel]

What on earth is your point?

Mine is that a leveraged buyout is perfectly normal business practice. You don't go and buy £bl+ assets with cash. Furthermore from an investment perspective, 400pc growth is an asset in 10 years is tremendous.

Utd under the Glazers over the last 5 years have spent more money on transfers than anyone else in the world except City, we probably have the highest wage bill in the world. I'm ready not sure what else they are expected to do. Like it or it, we are a business and not a billionaire's plaything.

Are we now blaming the Glazers for the piss porr performance against Palace?

Why are people suggesting criticizing board or CEO means we are blaming them for the result ? It's like we are only supposed to slaughter the players and their managers while blindly ignoring who brought both to the club and that the club has been shite for years but was covered by Fergie who was managing everything in the club and after him we looked completely unable to take a single proper football decision.

 

[ClaytonBlackmoorLeftPeg]

Why are people suggesting criticizing board or CEO means we are blaming them for the result ? It's like we are only supposed to slaughter the players and their managers while blindly ignoring who brought both to the club and that the club has been shite for years but was covered by Fergie who was managing everything in the club and after him we looked completely unable to take a single proper football decision.

The fact that this thread gets bumped after a bad rest is a good combat indicator!

 

[el3mel]

The fact that this thread gets bumped after a bad rest is a good combat indicator!

It's bumbed because they deserve to get criticized, but no one has said they are the reason we played poorly against Palace. This is goal post shifting imo. They are criticized because they brought these managers and these players so everything end at them anyway. Just because they sent shite load doesn't mean they have their hand free of this mess, not when they had spent loads on average managers and players.

 

[Kapardin]

This wasn't the title I made, it was changed by a Moderator to take the piss out of a fan not liking the Glazers.

It can only have been changed by somebody who isn't a United fan, I know there are Leeds and I think Arsenal fans moderating so I presume it was one of them.

You have to admit it's funny and attracts more posters to read your thread though.

 

[shamans]

What on earth is your point?

Mine is that a leveraged buyout is perfectly normal business practice. You don't go and buy £bl+ assets with cash. Furthermore from an investment perspective, 400pc growth is an asset in 10 years is tremendous.

Utd under the Glazers over the last 5 years have spent more money on transfers than anyone else in the world except City, we probably have the highest wage bill in the world. I'm ready not sure what else they are expected to do. Like it or it, we are a business and not a billionaire's plaything.

Are we now blaming the Glazers for the piss porr performance against Palace?

Like I said compare the net worth time line of smaller clubs and you’ll notice what the glazers have done is not amazing at all. Anything less and it would be a disaster. You’re just getting impressed by raw numbers without seeing their relative value

 

[Sparky Rhiwabon]

This wasn't the title I made, it was changed by a Moderator to take the piss out of a fan not liking the Glazers.

It can only have been changed by somebody who isn't a United fan, I know there are Leeds and I think Arsenal fans moderating so I presume it was one of them.

I don't like this recent trend of mods changing the title of threads that they don't agree with, to belittle the OP - abuse of power IMO

 

[ClaytonBlackmoorLeftPeg]

It's bumbed because they deserve to get criticized, but no one has said they are the reason we played poorly against Palace. This is goal post shifting imo. They are criticized because they brought these managers and these players so everything end at them anyway. Just because they sent shite load doesn't mean they have their hand free of this mess, not when they had spent loads on average managers and players.

Unfortunately managers are on average in retrospect - managers are quite frankly a bit of a punt in the dark. The Glazers don't antually go and buy players.

Like I said compare the net worth time line of smaller clubs and you’ll notice what the glazers have done is not amazing at all. Anything less and it would be a disaster. You’re just getting impressed by raw numbers without seeing their relative value

They saw the potential 10 years ago. I'm not in anyway a Glazer fan boy - but aside from going out and buying Neymar and changing manager every 6 months, I'm not sure what else they can do!

Utd are at the forefront of commercial deals and sponsorships, other clubs get good deals because Utd go and set the benchmark.

 

[mitchmouse]

The clown that sold/loaned all our wingers to only cry for the club to get him wingers the following season. He is the reason why he failed.

he also got rid of any natural goal-scorers we had. He was a massive disappointment given how he let Holland play in the World Cup

 

[shamans]

Unfortunately managers are on average in retrospect - managers are quite frankly a bit of a punt in the dark. The Glazers don't antually go and buy players.




They saw the potential 10 years ago. I'm not in anyway a Glazer fan boy - but aside from going out and buying Neymar and changing manager every 6 months, I'm not sure what else they can do!

Utd are at the forefront of commercial deals and sponsorships, other clubs get good deals because Utd go and set the benchmark.

You’re definitely acting like a glazed fan boi here. Now other clubs are doing well because United get good deals? Like I said man compare the growth of United to other clubs around the globe in this same time you’re being “impressed” by raw figures.

 

[Johan07]

Unfortunately managers are on average in retrospect - managers are quite frankly a bit of a punt in the dark. The Glazers don't antually go and buy players.




They saw the potential 10 years ago. I'm not in anyway a Glazer fan boy - but aside from going out and buying Neymar and changing manager every 6 months, I'm not sure what else they can do!

Utd are at the forefront of commercial deals and sponsorships, other clubs get good deals because Utd go and set the benchmark.

Yep, hindsight is easy. Both appointments of LvG and Mourinho were hailed by the main part of the fanbase and media alike. We have the largest wage bill in the PL and have over time spent the second most money in transfer fees after City.
Yeah, LvG failed and Mourinho is outdoing him at it. This in spite Mourinho getting most what he has pointed at. Except maybe for a CB this summer. Its easy to forget that Pep has been denied his targets by his club more than Mourinho has. Players like Dani Alves, Sanchez and then Mahrez, who he had to wait for one year. Much like we will probably do with Aldeweireld. And still the narrative is that Pep gets everything he wants.
How this shitty performance this year so far is the Glazers and Ed´s fault is beyond me. They seem to have bent over backwards for Mourinho; the Sanchez-deal being the icing on the cake so to say.
EDIT
The Neymar thing: funny thing is that I dont think that there is a shadow of a doubt that the Glazers would have shelled out on him if he actually had wanted to come here and play under Mourinho. So cant really blame them for that either.

 

[ivaldo]

You’re definitely acting like a glazed fan boi here. Now other clubs are doing well because United get good deals? Like I said man compare the growth of United to other clubs around the globe in this same time you’re being “impressed” by raw figures.

You can't compare it to smaller clubs though, external factors like an exponential increase in PL money will help the growth of smaller clubs far more than it does the big ones.

 

[Fluctuation0161]

You won’t get far on here with logic my friend. Great post but you’re shouting into a void

I spent days doing an analysis of our spending, adjusted for transfer inflation, to show how City and Chelsea have both spent on average the equivalent of £100m more a season for 10yrs or so but couple of weeks later the thread barely gets touched and you’ve got the same simple minded people posting the same simple minded opinions

People don’t like complexity. They like simple, 1+1=2 type logic. The forums gone to the dogs since they opened it up and got rid of the ‘10 likes’ rule. You can’t have any kind of decent discussion without 90% of the forum placing all of the blame at the feet of the current manager (Moyes then LvG now Jose)

Sad but true. A reflection of wider society and not only football fans or Redcafe posters though, I suspect.

 

[Fluctuation0161]

I don't like this recent trend of mods changing the title of threads that they don't agree with, to belittle the OP - abuse of power IMO

Agreed.

 

[ClaytonBlackmoorLeftPeg]

You’re definitely acting like a glazed fan boi here. Now other clubs are doing well because United get good deals? Like I said man compare the growth of United to other clubs around the globe in this same time you’re being “impressed” by raw figures.

If you want to go and do that, then fine. I've presented my argument, if you want to start analysing other clubs as comparators then your welcome - thankfully I've got better things to do.

If Utd push the boundaries and get a massive shirt deal, then of course it sets a precident for other clubs to use as a benchmark. I wouldn't have thought that was difficult to understand?

 

[UnitedFan93]

If anyone thinks the sacking of Mourinho will solve all our problems then they are going to be extremely disappointed.

The reality is that the root cause of all our problems still remain and that is the Glazers. A new manager will be appointed, face the same challenges as Mourinho and will then be sacked in 2/3 years time. Rinse and Repeat. Let's face it Reds, the Glazers are only here for one thing and one thing only, and that is the money.

The treat the club as a personal ATM machine and couldn't care less if we play good football or not. They only care about the value of the club and whether Old Trafford is a full house for every game. Once the value of the club started to fall, and empty seats started to appear, they acted. That tells you everything you need to know about them! That was why Mourinho was sacked!

Under their ownership we are starting to fall behind in all areas, whether it's on the pitch (squad/playing style) or off it (stadium/training ground) It's not really a surprise however. Everyone knew that the debt that the Glazers placed on us would catch up with us one day. It's an absolute disgrace that £1.1 billion that left the club to service a debt that we never should of had. It's also an absolute disgrace that the debt still stands at £487 million! How much money is it going to cost us to be debt free? Probably £2 billion! It's probably going to cost the club close to 2 billion pounds to have the pleasure of being owned by the Glazers! How anyone defends them I don't know!

Until the Glazers go and the debt along with them, I repeat, nothing changes.

 

[Eric's Seagull]

If anyone thinks the sacking of Mourinho will solve all our problems then they are going to be extremely disappointed.

The reality is that the root cause of all our problems still remain and that is the Glazers. A new manager will be appointed, face the same challenges as Mourinho and will then be sacked in 2/3 years time. Rinse and Repeat. Let's face it Reds, the Glazers are only here for one thing and one thing only, and that is the money.

The treat the club as a personal ATM machine and couldn't care less if we play good football or not. They only care about the value of the club and whether Old Trafford is a full house for every game. Once the value of the club started to fall, and empty seats started to appear, they acted. That tells you everything you need to know about them! That was why Mourinho was sacked!

Under their ownership we are starting to fall behind in all areas, whether it's on the pitch (squad/playing style) or off it (stadium/training ground) It's not really a surprise however. Everyone knew that the debt that the Glazers placed on us would catch up with us one day. It's an absolute disgrace that £1.1 billion that left the club to service a debt that we never should of had. It's also an absolute disgrace that the debt still stands at £487 million! How much money is it going to cost us to be debt free? Probably £2 billion! It's probably going to cost the club close to 2 billion pounds to have the pleasure of being owned by the Glazers! How anyone defends them I don't know!

Until the Glazers go and the debt along with them, I repeat, nothing changes.

As much as i think you have some valid points there are some I disagree with, I think that getting rid of Jose is going to help to some extent as his toxic negativity well no longer fester about the place.

I agree with you that the Glazers are the problem but I don't think the same problems will occur. The best case scenario is they get a good Director of Football who has a vision and plan for the next 5 years, then choose a manager who will implement this vision and make sure they are working off the same sheet.

I never thought the Glazers should have been able to use a loan to buy us in the first place, initially I heard they were putting £50m a year into their pockets and I suspect this has increased significantly.

Agree 100% with the part in bold.

I would also like to see them go but I think they are milking so much out of our club that they are going to be around for the foreseeable future.

Which is a sad scenario.

 

[shamans]

If anyone thinks the sacking of Mourinho will solve all our problems then they are going to be extremely disappointed.

The reality is that the root cause of all our problems still remain and that is the Glazers. A new manager will be appointed, face the same challenges as Mourinho and will then be sacked in 2/3 years time. Rinse and Repeat. Let's face it Reds, the Glazers are only here for one thing and one thing only, and that is the money.

The treat the club as a personal ATM machine and couldn't care less if we play good football or not. They only care about the value of the club and whether Old Trafford is a full house for every game. Once the value of the club started to fall, and empty seats started to appear, they acted. That tells you everything you need to know about them! That was why Mourinho was sacked!

Under their ownership we are starting to fall behind in all areas, whether it's on the pitch (squad/playing style) or off it (stadium/training ground) It's not really a surprise however. Everyone knew that the debt that the Glazers placed on us would catch up with us one day. It's an absolute disgrace that £1.1 billion that left the club to service a debt that we never should of had. It's also an absolute disgrace that the debt still stands at £487 million! How much money is it going to cost us to be debt free? Probably £2 billion! It's probably going to cost the club close to 2 billion pounds to have the pleasure of being owned by the Glazers! How anyone defends them I don't know!

Until the Glazers go and the debt along with them, I repeat, nothing changes.

Just wait for the resident caf financial experts who just googled the term mortgage to tell you how loans arent bad because they increased the value of the club by 200 percent as if it's some achievement.

However I disagree that a manager won't change much. I mean even if were bad were not 7th position bad. At the very least we will be back to playing some football.

 

[Sandikan]

If anyone thinks the sacking of Mourinho will solve all our problems then they are going to be extremely disappointed.

The reality is that the root cause of all our problems still remain and that is the Glazers. A new manager will be appointed, face the same challenges as Mourinho and will then be sacked in 2/3 years time. Rinse and Repeat. Let's face it Reds, the Glazers are only here for one thing and one thing only, and that is the money.

The treat the club as a personal ATM machine and couldn't care less if we play good football or not. They only care about the value of the club and whether Old Trafford is a full house for every game. Once the value of the club started to fall, and empty seats started to appear, they acted. That tells you everything you need to know about them! That was why Mourinho was sacked!

Under their ownership we are starting to fall behind in all areas, whether it's on the pitch (squad/playing style) or off it (stadium/training ground) It's not really a surprise however. Everyone knew that the debt that the Glazers placed on us would catch up with us one day. It's an absolute disgrace that £1.1 billion that left the club to service a debt that we never should of had. It's also an absolute disgrace that the debt still stands at £487 million! How much money is it going to cost us to be debt free? Probably £2 billion! It's probably going to cost the club close to 2 billion pounds to have the pleasure of being owned by the Glazers! How anyone defends them I don't know!

Until the Glazers go and the debt along with them, I repeat, nothing changes.

This is lovely and all that, but do you think Jose could have done slightly better with £400m spent?
Did he need to treat some of the player the way he did?
Or set us up like some sort of lower league team away to giants?

You can't tell me another manager can't do better, with or without the glazers.

 

[Eric's Seagull]

This is lovely and all that, but do you think Jose could have done slightly better with £400m spent?
Did he need to treat some of the player the way he did?
Or set us up like some sort of lower league team away to giants?

You can't tell me another manager can't do better, with or without the glazers.

Answer to question 1) Definitely.
Answer to question 2) Definitely not.
Answer to question 3) No made us seem like a laughing stock.