Should play further up, he lacks the intensity to shield a defense. Poor of the ball movement.
6
Season Average Rating
- Appearances
- 37
- Goals
- 6
- Assists
- 16
- Yellow cards
- 5
- Red cards
- 1
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik @Rood and Imran @Annihilate Now! start with the good news by celebrating Manchester United Women's emphatic FA Cup win over Spurs at Wembley and the future of manager Marc Skinner.
Then it's the bad news and the ever worsening form of our Men with losses to Arsenal and Palace.
Finally the main debate - ETH Out now or keep him until the end of the season - if not longer. Are you Team Nik or Team Imran?
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Pogba is a midfielder, he should be able to play in a midfield 2 or 3. Unfortunately he has shown yet again he is a liability when in a 2. He lacks game management, football intelligence and work ethic to play in a 2. Matic is getting all sorts of critique but if you look how isolated he was he didn't have much of a chance in there.
You can blame tactics, management of the player etc but the bottom line is, Pogba is labelled as a world class midfielder and he is simply not showing that.
With Pobga's ability, he should be able to play in a 2 but he doesn't seem to want to put any effort in. He has shown he can dominate games and is our most frustrating player by far. We need to sign midfielders who can actually play the midfield role properly and play Pogba further up where he looks to be more effective.
Shame we spent 90 million on a midfielder to run our midfield and he doesn't seem capable of doing so consistently.
Does he have the attacking quality to compensate for being given no defensive responsibility? Does he have the creativeness or goal threat of Eriksen, Ozil, KDB, Hazard, Griezzeman, Alexis etc? Not for me. So if we need a DM and a work horse midfielder in there just to get the best out of him why not get someone who is even better at attacking?
What made him so good for me was being good at attacking as well as having the all around ability to get in the middle and do the rough work too. Lately though he has no interest in that and doesn't even attempt to follow runners which is a joke. If we want someone to drift around and do whatever they want and defend whenever they want then there are a good few better options imo.
What made him so good for me was being good at attacking as well as having the all around ability to get in the middle and do the rough work too. Lately though he has no interest in that and doesn't even attempt to follow runners which is a joke. If we want someone to drift around and do whatever they want and defend whenever they want then there are a good few better options imo.
Didn't play well and got taken off. It happens. He's a fantastic player, but playing in the wrong system and with the wrong attitude last night in a game that went wrong under 60 seconds in. See what happens over the next few games. Individually he needs to bounce back with a good reaction, because if we don't bounce back as a team - from that shower - then we may as well give up.
Pogba was overwhelmed - once again - in a big game. Sevilla is another big test coming up. We shall see if there is improvement.
Pathetic performance, couldn’t be arsed.
BS claims and you know it he, he still makes mind-boggling decisions, gets sent off in the dumbest of manner vs. Arsenal, he hasn't improved at all if any.
Sadly it's true, the fact he keeps insisting on playing him in 4-2-3-1 after all this time is mind-boggling to say the least. Pogba is an amazing ATTACKING talent, the sooner Mourinho wraps his head around that the better for us and him.
You know you are talking shit, excuse me for not taking part in this.
It's incredible that a player with so much ability cannot even get to use a decent of part of it when playing as a midfield two. He has all the tools to be the best CM in the world but sadly not the brain
Yeah after claiming he's imported under Mourinho you fails to say how exactly just spouting some flimsy claims he's more involved and playing more responsibly
You want stats? It's not hard to check, maybe for you though as you are blinded by Jose hate it's hard for you see anything.Yeah after claiming he's imported under Mourinho you fails to say how exactly just spouting some flimsy claims he's more involved and playing more responsibly
Good on Jose to give him some bollocking. Absolutely deserved one, he was given the captain armband previously and he plays like that.
Said it few times on here, the guys lacks positional discipline. All over the place which allowed Spurs lots of space and left Matic exposed. I dont think he has the awareness to play in a midfield 2 which is a pity
Oh now you're trying to spin it around as hate towards Mourinho. Then I guess every single person who's questioning whether Pogba has improved under Mourinho is also blinded by hate towards Mourinho, yes?
Tell me exactly what part of Pogba's game has improved that much under Mourinho?
Meh check for yourself. This is playing most games in 2 man midfield rather than free role in 3 man midfield.
But he was the same before Alexis arrived. He seems to lack a fighting spirit when it is needed the most.
De Bruyne isn't a natural CM though. Pogba is a CM by trade. I expect Pogba to be able to play in a 2 more so than De Bruyne. I need to accept that to get the best out of him especially in big games he needs to play in a 3 because he's useless in a 2 but that's ridiculous.
Playing Pogba in a 2 is like driving a Ferrari like a Fiat but when that Ferrari can't handle the basic level of a Fiat you start questioning the Ferrari.
Stats can be ridiculously misleading especially if you're watching every game, his numbers may have improved because unlike at Juve he's pretty much the focal point of this team, but his game hasn't improved.Meh check for yourself. This is playing most games in 2 man midfield rather than free role in 3 man midfield.
Just for the sake of reference in most teams CB's have the most passes completed and the highest pass accuracy, does that make them the best passers in the team? Stats can often be misleading as I said and in Pogba's case that's evident considering how many people are questioning weather he's imported .
So you asked for my observation, I said he plays with more responsibility and then you made weird posts. I then back up what I said with stats and now you are saying stats don't tell anything.
So how exactly I should prove?
We are not talking about poor stats like pass completion which are misleading, he scored more goals + assists per 90 mins playing in 2 man midfield which means his productivity increased. He creates more chances and have better pass completion, which means his passing in final third has improved. He has better dribble completion rate which means he is making right choices. He even wins more duels.
So what exactly are you looking for?
Also just because many people started questioning doesn't make it fact. Most of them probably never even watched him play for Juventus except youtube videos, so thought he was perfect player for whole 90 mins.
OP has always been a bit of a hysterical teenage girl when it comes to football - just ignore him.
Yes he shouldn't have played in a midfield two.. but he's so embarrasingly casual sometimes which is very worrying if you ask me.
Good on José for subbing him.
Good on José for subbing him.
We have to accept that Pogba cannot play in the playmaker role deep in midfield but, alongside this, we also have to stop with the comparisons of Pogba with Scholes and hyping his ability to control a midfield, which he clearly cannot (to a high level ala Kroos, Modric etc).
Pogba is a class player but it's clear he is not being used to his potential. He is being played in a role he never had to play at Juventus and has never shown the ability to play for France. People can debate that he's played the role well for most of the season, but that is against lower teams who do not have the quality in midfield as the best teams in the league and Europe. Against those midfields, he needs to show the mental attribute to control the midfield and be able to distribute when put under significant pressure, he hasn't showed that for United or Juve or France.
It's been apparent that United need another midfielder to take that pressure away from him in these games and not force him to try and run the midfield. That midfielder can share the workload of holding possession and even remove Pogba of some of the defensive duties he lacks. In a way, Pogba's progress is very similar to Kroos. Kroos' best position was very clearly as a CAM early in his career but he slowly developed into a deep playmaker, first with Pep and then at Madrid. Though he was weak defensively at first, he's improved that aspect a lot in recent years and has even lately played in a midfield 2 for Germany (where he acts as the base of the midfield) when Germany have employed a 3 man defense.
United have 2 options, either buy a midfielder to complement Pogba him in the bigger games or wait on Pogba to develop the attribute of controlling the midfield and improving defensively. I'd rather United buy someone like Weigl and free Pogba.
Pogba is a class player but it's clear he is not being used to his potential. He is being played in a role he never had to play at Juventus and has never shown the ability to play for France. People can debate that he's played the role well for most of the season, but that is against lower teams who do not have the quality in midfield as the best teams in the league and Europe. Against those midfields, he needs to show the mental attribute to control the midfield and be able to distribute when put under significant pressure, he hasn't showed that for United or Juve or France.
It's been apparent that United need another midfielder to take that pressure away from him in these games and not force him to try and run the midfield. That midfielder can share the workload of holding possession and even remove Pogba of some of the defensive duties he lacks. In a way, Pogba's progress is very similar to Kroos. Kroos' best position was very clearly as a CAM early in his career but he slowly developed into a deep playmaker, first with Pep and then at Madrid. Though he was weak defensively at first, he's improved that aspect a lot in recent years and has even lately played in a midfield 2 for Germany (where he acts as the base of the midfield) when Germany have employed a 3 man defense.
United have 2 options, either buy a midfielder to complement Pogba him in the bigger games or wait on Pogba to develop the attribute of controlling the midfield and improving defensively. I'd rather United buy someone like Weigl and free Pogba.
"The deep playmaker role" is a dumb trend. The best players should be as high up the pitch as possible. Herrera, McTominay, Fellaini et cetera all could do the job that Pogba does in the deep midfield.
Regarding Pogba, I have to say, although people won't agree with me, that he isn't a player that you should build your entire team around. He will never be a great playmaker.
I'm getting sick and tired of his shit performances in the big games. Yeah, he played as a CDM, which isn't his position, but at least show some fight and fire in your belly. Hope Mourinho gave him a hairdryer treatment after the game.
I agree but he is one of those players that can still be massively effective without needing that positional discipline. Maybe that's his game. Allow him to have the freedom in a less restricted role and you see the best of Paul Pogba. Put him in a midfield 2 with any sort of instruction and he goes to pot. Its been covered countless times in this thread but he needs players behind him who can release him into that free role. We have set up correctly for him in the pastp but then we revert to a system which brings out the worst in him. Of course it would be nice if he could maximise his potential in every scenario and setup and for every game plan, but he is not that sort of player.
He wasnt good. The problem becomes even more highlighted when you look around and say nobody was good. So it wasnt just him dropping an abject performance and questions have to be made about the system / tactics / formation.
Its pretty damn obvious his best position is left of midfield three. It allows him to be closer to the opposition goal and still provides us with protection for the defence. In fact, that would allow the defence a few more options to pass it out the back instead of hoofing it away. (or turning around to give it to DDG to do the same).
Him playing deep in a 4231 works when we play at OT against lesser teams. In tough games or away games he should be played how he was against Everton.
And obviously, even though he wasnt good, he still created our two best chances last night.
Its pretty damn obvious his best position is left of midfield three. It allows him to be closer to the opposition goal and still provides us with protection for the defence. In fact, that would allow the defence a few more options to pass it out the back instead of hoofing it away. (or turning around to give it to DDG to do the same).
Him playing deep in a 4231 works when we play at OT against lesser teams. In tough games or away games he should be played how he was against Everton.
And obviously, even though he wasnt good, he still created our two best chances last night.
He and Matic spend half the season picking up bad habits against smaller teams. They play extremely casual and expect to be given a ton of time on the ball, Pogba whining to the ref exposing us to counters every game.
That would be Herrera. Head and shoulders the best player in the game and vs Chelsea. Maybe that is the key. He may need another CM to put in a world class 9/10 performance against a strong opponent so that he can also perform to a suitable standard. Maybe he had this at Juve as I saw Pirlo bossing games late in his career. But unlikely Pogba himself will be that player against the very best. Being a support type of player is fine in the odd game so no drama here. We just need another top top CM, due to his lack of responsibility/capability.
His all around ability and combativeness was maybe overstated. He can stick a leg in but isn't comitted to winning the ball like a Gerrard or Scholes was. Gerrard of course supported the club he played for so its a bit different
I said stats don't tell anything?
First read my post and then reply because I said that stats can be misleading. I actually watched quite a few of his games at Juventus and when you're watching the game and compare his performances here and back during his time and Juve you will struggle to find any significant improvement.
He's an attacking talent being forced to play in a deeper role, which alone is responsible for his lack of significant improvement under Mourinho. Getting him to play in a role that suits him (3 man MF, as a left cmf) would see him being far more involved in games and make even bigger impact. That would be improvement.
Sure he's putting up slightly better numbers but that is expected considering he's more of a focal point and creator (something he wasn't at Juve yet he was still banging assists and goals) and he's matured a bit.
Untrue.
Pogba has only played in 2 "big" games this season due to injury (Arsenal and Spurs). He played well vs Arsenal and got 2 assists.
Against Spurs who wasn't overwhelmed in our team? The problem was playing a 2 man midfield against a 3 man midfield and playing Pogba in a role too defensive for him.
Stats like pass completion can be misleading, not all stats. It's obvious he is putting better numbers in every department but yeah he hasn't improved at all.
He is focal point but he also plays deeper role, so yeah, Pogba putting better numbers is a big improvement.
Again, so he is team's focal point and creator but when I said he plays with more responsibility I was wrong? That's some logic.
Playing with more responsibility is improvement?
You keep whining about the numbers yet great majority of the people that are actually watching his games are saying he is misused and that he isn't as impactful as he was during his days at Juventus.
Obviously he is misused but still putting up great numbers, that itself shows his improvement.Playing with more responsibility is improvement?
You keep whining about the numbers yet great majority of the people that are actually watching his games are saying he is misused and that he isn't as impactful as he was during his days at Juventus.
Re bold part, as usual pathetic. Expected nothing better but was surprised you could make 2-3 decent posts. Anyways these are your days under sun as ManUtd lost. Enjoy,you will go back to your cave after Huddersfield game.
Playing with more responsibility and delivering is not improvement?
Nice day, not arsed anymore.
Harsh but fair. What makes him a special player is his ability to create and be an imposing physical presence in midfield. That combination is rare and the reason he's potentially such a special player. Unfortunately, the second part of that equation involves the sort of defensive diligence and effort that often seems to go absent in games like last night.
If you were looking at signing someone for our team purely to create and score goals you sure as shit wouldn't pick a player who has averaged about 6 goals and 5 assists each season in his career to date, so why should Pogba have the luxury of being that player?
I think the complete set up is wrong. We don't attack and defend as a team.
Playing 4-3-3 gives better balance, providing better stability in midfield and also gives more freedom for attackers. On paper it might look that we are compromising the attack but we won't as it gives us options in the midfield to pass and build the attack.
That's the thing though. Stop pretending like Pogba is a natural CM. He has no clue on how to play that position so we shouldn't pretend like he knows how and keep forcing him in as he gets shown up every time.
I've just accepted Mourinho isn't the manager to get the best out of Pogba. We shouldn't be having this debate and confusion over Pogba's best position 1 and half years after his arrival. Under Conte and Allegri he was immense but Mourinho doesn't know how to utilize Pogba and he's been here nearly 2 years.
Yet all of his stats under them are almost identical. Slightly worse, if anything.
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