He sounds very proud of himself
Peterson, Harris, etc....
- Thread starter prath92
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It would be hilarious if youtube also banned him.
It's pathetic how much he wants to be a victim. He used to ask fans to subscribe to his Patreon so that he would still have an income after the University fired him, which was going to happen any day now. It never happened.
It's the same thing with this. I think it's fairly obvious that he's been trying to cop a ban from twitter, but he's not willing to go all-out to achieve it, he wants to maintain a certain level of respectability (however little.) That didn't happen, but he did get a suspension that will only be lifted once he deletes the tweet that triggered it, so he's decided to refuse to do so and call it ban so that he can finally don the mantle of victimhood and claim to be persecuted.
Also,
at "I'm not taking down that tweet." It's already gone, lobsterman, but do go off.I would rather die than delete the tweet. Hopefully it will not come to that, but who the hell knows in these increasingly strange days.
That's the cringiest and funniest part about the cancel culture wars. Alt right tires SO hard to get cancelled so they can play victim but they even fail at thatIt's pathetic how much he wants to be a victim. He used to ask fans to subscribe to his Patreon so that he would still have an income after the University fired him, which was going to happen any day now. It never happened.
It's the same thing with this. I think it's fairly obvious that he's been trying to cop a ban from twitter, but he's not willing to go all-out to achieve it, he wants to maintain a certain level of respectability (however little.) That didn't happen, but he did get a suspension that will only be lifted once he deletes the tweet that triggered it, so he's decided to refuse to do so and call it ban so that he can finally don the mantle of victimhood and claim to be persecuted.
Also,
This is going to be funny for a very long time, so enjoy a repost.That's the cringiest and funniest part about the cancel culture wars. Alt right tires SO hard to get cancelled so they can play victim but they even fail at that
This is brilliant.Tweet
— Twitter API (@user) date
See who cancels whom, you fecking philistine.
As I've flat out refused to ever click on anything that might give him any form of clout/money, this is the first time I've ever heard his voice. It's even better than I had hoped.
So Sam Harris has come out very strongly and clearly as pro choice and is extremely critical of the overturning of Roe vs Wade. He’s always been firmly anti-Trump and was on the side of the good guys throughout covid.
Is it still fair to lump him in alongside absolute shmucks like Peterson?
Is it still fair to lump him in alongside absolute shmucks like Peterson?
This is a bit like locking your dog and cat in a kennel to see what happens.
He’s not gonna shag you mate
He's never been as bad as Peterson, even when he's been pretty bad. Peterson is in a class of his own.
Thank you for this. Crazy how people would want to separate Harris and say he’s ‘better’ for some dumb reason. Here’s another one of his ‘black people are dumber’ dressed up in pseudo science.
Incredible that he’ll so confidently put it down to genetics, and not, say, the cultural bias of such tests, or the fact that African Americans have to navigate and rely on different intuitions than your average "caucasian." Or even discrepancy in nutrition.
I was a fan of Sam some years ago, but this and his blatant cheerleading for American hegemony and supposed good intentions show that he’s less of a clear thinker than I used to think.
in the quote above he says 50% to 80%, so it’s not like he has disregarded those other factors altogether, is it?
Why does it even matter?
If (huge fecking if) any ethnicities are slightly less intelligent than others, what does that change? They shouldn't be treated any differently in any way
For what it's worth, didn't Thomas Sowell say genetics aren't really a predicting variable in IQ tests? I remember him saying black people in the northern states would score higher than southern rednecks because they had better educations and such.
In other words: nurture does matter. And I wouldn't put too much stock in IQ test science anyway.
In other words: nurture does matter. And I wouldn't put too much stock in IQ test science anyway.
It’s certainly worth studying because the underlying causes (eg institutional racism) can be understood and addressed if need be
Maybe not but genetics is the main thrust of his point, as he builds it he eventually gets to the point that different groups have different genes, and it’d be weird if that didn’t lead to us seeing different IQ outcomes. Basically saying some ethnicities will (by this narrow measure) be less intellectually gifted. I think you want to be on firmer ground than he is when making this statement, because its implications can lead down sinister routes.
IMHO, and articulated on the fly. Pardon if it’s waffle.
That quote isn't what makes Harris bad on genetics. He's chosen those percentages because he doesn't know what heritability is, which is both funny and stupid, but genetics do influence whatever it is we call intelligence so even though it's wrong it isn't wrong wrong.
What truly makes Harris bad on genetics is that not only does he think white people are smarter than black people partly because white people have better genes for intelligence, but to make it even worse he thinks this is so obviously true that scholars who disagree have to be lying because political correctness gone mad.
He has a paper on free will i think, which is worth reading. Mainly because its total bullshit with really illogical, weird conclusions pulled from nothing. And it seems to be his only contribution to anything resembling a body of work. He's not the total clown that peterson has become but he's not really worth listening to either. When hes right its rarely for the right reasons.
Sam Harris is great. For sure one of the better ones in podcast world. Really good on meditation and related topics. His take on free will is correct as far as I can see
It might be. Just not for the reasons he thinks which he doesn't show any understanding of.
Here's a 3 hour video about Jordan Peterson and if you don't watch all of it you aren't allowed to criticize people who criticize Jordan Peterson. You need the full context, see.
It's genuinely baffling how some people can look at him and think he's actually intelligent, or worth listening to about anything other than maybe (but not really) his actual field.
It's genuinely baffling how some people can look at him and think he's actually intelligent, or worth listening to about anything other than maybe (but not really) his actual field.
Came to post this video. Would strongly recommend to everyone.
Don't know anything about Peterson but happy to accept he's a loon.
But will go to bat for Sam Harris because he has an excellent podcast, and has brought me countless hours of intelligent discussions with intelligent people across a huge span of interesting topics.
I think there are some folk that kind of miss what podcasting is about with regards to being obsessed or 'cancelling' Harris because of a single podcast (and subsequent discussion with Klein and so forth). The man has hundreds of podcasts out there. Are you going to agree with every guest, or what Sam says? Of course not. Does that mean there is no value to listening to philosphers, criminologists, astrophysicists, neurologists and so forth? Of course not.
I've listened to the offending podcast twice, larely to discuss on here (and follow the debate elsewhere, such as with Ezra Klein whom I also enjoy) with a few posters that it clearly means 100x more to than to Sam. Which is fine, I can dig that. But acting like a man who is clearly respected by a great many leaders of their fields doesn't deserve that respect because of a few lines from a single podcast just blows my mind. To me it's a type of anti-intellectualism. Folks dismissing everything he's said because they disagree with one thing.
I encourage people to go listen themselves. If you want a controversial one, listen to Harris' opinion on gun crime in the US. I don't agree with his position, but it's at least well researched and well made. Or pick some of the 'best of' episodes which are great. He's exposed me to a great number of really interesting conversations and subsequent chats with the missus and friends, I'd hate for people to miss out unnecessarily.
But will go to bat for Sam Harris because he has an excellent podcast, and has brought me countless hours of intelligent discussions with intelligent people across a huge span of interesting topics.
I think there are some folk that kind of miss what podcasting is about with regards to being obsessed or 'cancelling' Harris because of a single podcast (and subsequent discussion with Klein and so forth). The man has hundreds of podcasts out there. Are you going to agree with every guest, or what Sam says? Of course not. Does that mean there is no value to listening to philosphers, criminologists, astrophysicists, neurologists and so forth? Of course not.
I've listened to the offending podcast twice, larely to discuss on here (and follow the debate elsewhere, such as with Ezra Klein whom I also enjoy) with a few posters that it clearly means 100x more to than to Sam. Which is fine, I can dig that. But acting like a man who is clearly respected by a great many leaders of their fields doesn't deserve that respect because of a few lines from a single podcast just blows my mind. To me it's a type of anti-intellectualism. Folks dismissing everything he's said because they disagree with one thing.
I encourage people to go listen themselves. If you want a controversial one, listen to Harris' opinion on gun crime in the US. I don't agree with his position, but it's at least well researched and well made. Or pick some of the 'best of' episodes which are great. He's exposed me to a great number of really interesting conversations and subsequent chats with the missus and friends, I'd hate for people to miss out unnecessarily.
This is as always, along with the reflexive "out of context" stuff he shares with Peterson, the defense. And it's completely missing the point. Harris isn't being "cancelled", which as always is a euphemism for being criticized, for talking with or interviewing Charles Murray. He's being criticized for agreeing with Charles Murray.
Harris's own defense is that he doesn't agree with all the political opinions of Charles Murray, but that was never the charge. The point is that Harris agrees with Murray about his race realism; that the observed racial IQ gap between black people and white people is partly explained by genetic differences, and he's being criticized for the shoddy way he reaches that conclusion.
Some of his fans denies this, and we've been over this before so I know you're one of them and there's little point in repeating that, but the quotes are there in black and white so it's just denying reality. This is why a substantial portion of his listeners have moved on from this stance to just simply agreeing with Harris. Note that Harris himself has never objected to this, because he does in fact agree.
It's also not just about his race realism, it's a combination of his views on race. Ironically you're missing context.
It's also about his defense of Bloomberg and his unconstitutional stop-and-frisk policy. It's about his denial of unequal police treatment of black people and his vitriolic opposition to Black Lives Matter. His view that Liam Neeson wasn't being racist when he was roaming the streets looking for innocent black people to assault (!!). It's how he treats accusations of racism compared to other forms of bigotry: he doesn't think telling Americans in America to go back where they came from is racist and he thinks "I have a black friend" is a good defense, while he thinks Buttigieg polling low with black people is evidence of homophobia in the black community. He also has quite the sensitive ear for antisemitism.
These are so great his schtick fits perfectly with the wooden acting on C&C cutscenes!
his schtick fits perfectly with the wooden acting on C&C cutscenes!Half of the cancel culture argument seems to hinge on this odd concept that people like Harris or Peterson have some sort of right to my time, attention and respect. They don't. Like everyone else, they have to earn that stuff.
There are a thousand reasons we choose to spend our free time consuming the media we do, and the fact that there are lots of good podcasts out there hosted by people who haven't espoused racist views is a perfectly valid one.
There are a thousand reasons we choose to spend our free time consuming the media we do, and the fact that there are lots of good podcasts out there hosted by people who haven't espoused racist views is a perfectly valid one.
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Sam Harris is obviously not racist (and obviously a very smart guy). Him touching on controversial topic/s dosen't change that. The people who still go on about him being racist, etc, either really don't understand his arguments, are being dishonest (Klein) or ideology prevents them from reasoning in any usefull way.
Him and Lex Fridman might have the two best podcasts out there at the moment
Anyone who understands Sam Harris' arguments doesn't understand GCSE Philosophy.
Once again, not going to go down rabbit holes with posters who have already made up their minds (and are just making things up) but this is my take. If anyone here doesn't have an opinion, go listen to some podcasts. They're free. If you don't like him, or if they're too dumb for you or if his inherent racism permeates the very subtext of every argument then go find something else to listen to.
Sam does indeed argue that the BLM movement - in hindsight - probably did more harm than good. He agrees that defund the police was a hugely idiotic move politically and did more damage to the good that was coming out of the initial George Floyd protests than anything else. And I agree with him on that. Does that mean I'm a racist? Because I'm willing to challenge the notion that the pendulum swung too far, and images of rioting and looting - no matter how sporadic - give ammunition to the right to create a false narrative that enables the middle to sit this one out and avoid actual change? No, I think it's a perfectly valid view.
On Charles Murray - he did an experiment. The results were numerous, one of which was that in his experiment, IQ and race were shown to be correlated. His experiment has repeated and disproved. IQ tests in general are bunk science. There are countless reasons why there is no reason to believe IQ and race are in way tied. But having this discussion should not be taboo. Murray's book should not be burned, him appearing somewhere should not result in violence and him showing up on a podcast should not see the podcast cancelled. We should be able to acknowledge bad science, bad conclusions and challenge them in the public, rather than pretend their very existence is an affront. All the quotes you're taking from Harris are very much around this - cached in a 'well if we found genetics and X are correlated, we should be able to talk about it, not dismiss it because we don't like it'.
Also to suggest that Sam is so clearly racist I have to assume does a bit of a disservice to the countless black guests who choose to join him to discuss topics - including race.
Spot on. Not to mention his blinkered cheerleading when it comes to US foreign policy, which he constantly bails out with assertions of good intentions.