Finneh said; "In my opinion it'd be like buying Jagielka to replace Jones."
Rafael da Silva | 2010-14 Performances
- Thread starter amolbhatia50k
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Oh sorry, I thought you replied to my post. It's not a like for like comparison at all. I like Coleman, it's a proper good football story about his progression from a relative unknown to a first choice started for Everton FC. But I do think if Rafael can overcome his current injury problems, he'll be a better full back. He's hardly Rohnny Johnsen yet.
Mata has put in 35 crosses - completed 5. Smalling's completion rate is better than 1 in 3 - the best in our squad. Evra is close to 1 in 4 (25/106). Valencia and Young are a little bit better than 1 in 6. Rafael has completed 8 of 49 (a little worse than 1 in 6). I love everything about his game, but if he can't learn to pick out a target he's not going to be our RB in the long term. [Edit: Keep forgetting that Giggs is still in the squad - he's always completed about half his crosses. Phenominal.]
Sorry if you'd like Rafael shipped out because of that, you need to be looked at.
He was so good last season that the idea to get replace him doesn't cross my mind, the only justification would be due to his injuries(which is the only justification people give anyway) Here's some highlights from last season; beware, lots of gifs.
This was the norm last year, bursting forward creating so much space;
He really was brilliant last season, and the linkup play between him and Valencia was a lot better.
This was the norm last year, bursting forward creating so much space;
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How can anyone seriously say Rafael should be shipped out? IMO he has a lot of potential, and he's a wonderful full back. Granted at times he switches off defensively, and maybe he needs to compose himself before putting in a final ball, but his energy is amazing. I think we need to think long and hard and carefully before we start going after players who will die before they stop burning energy and give in in a game. That is not enough to play for United true, but that combined with Rafael's obvious ability is something our squad needs.
I would never want him shipped out. Trouble is, I don't make the decisions and Moyes is used to fullbacks who cross more accurately. (For the record, Coleman completes better than 1 in 4 and has scored 5 this season.)
You don't even need to justify why using cross success rate is a stupid idea when deciding if a FB is good. All you need to do is actually watch the game and not just read numbers to see Smalling has absolutely nothing on Rafael as a right back. This fact alone shows that cross success rate is a ridiculous thing to use, when it shows the exact opposite.
Nobody is denying that Coleman is doing a better job at Everton this season, but we aren't buying for one season and playing for Manchester United is a whole lot different than playing for Everton in all fairness. Look at Young, he would have produced 1000 times better statistics at Villa, but no joy here. If you are even thinking about arguing that Smalling is a better right back on Rafael based on the completed crosses, then we might as well sack all our scouts and managers and get Microsoft office with Excel and Visio and manage from there. There's just so much more that Rafael contributes by being available as a right outlet to make a difference to our game.
Nobody is suggesting that Smalling should play RB. The point is that, with Mata on the right side of attacking midfield, the RB is going to be who provides the penetration on the wing. His crossing ability is a big part of our attack in that area. With Valencia playing, even when Rafael overlaps, Valencia rarely gives him the ball so crossing ability is less relevant.
Would hate for Rafael to leave. He is a class player that has unfortunately been under performing this season. Put in a good performance on Satutday and needs to show that on a more regular basis.
Great performance from him, one of our most important players IMO.
Did he come off injured? We need him for the next 2
Did he come off injured? We need him for the next 2
This all started when Striker 10 said: "Jones and Smalling are not full backs. They can't cross to save their lives". I pointed out that Smalling was in fact the most successful crosser in the squad (baring Giggs - but he's hardly in the squad any more). That doesn't mean that I want Smalling to play RB - I want Rafael to play RB. Having said that, Rafael has a weakness that may become more important now we have Mata. Hopefully it's something that he can work on, both individually and with his potential targets in the box.
Jones would be a very good right back if he wasn't needed more elsewhere.
The point is he's younger and has a much higher potential (in my opinion). Why buy an older player with less potential just because the former has had a few injury problems? Also 2 years doesn't sound like a massive gap age wise, but given the position (I'd say the most physically demanding on the pitch), most only have around 6 years at the top level. Therefore 2 years could be around 1/3 of his top level career.
The reason it's most bizarre though is that 12 months ago Coleman was merely a solid full back in a good team, whilst Rafael was arguably the best right back in a League winning team. If twelve months changes things that drastically then we might as well flog RVP and try to bring in Sturridge.
I agree that he has a higher potential to Coleman but not by loads. When the player you're buying isn't that much below in terms of potential and has better current ability then it's not that bizarre. Like i said, the next few years will be pretty big for Rafael in terms of those niggling injuries as it will be the time he's going to start coming into his prime.
If you only read the papers then that would be correct. You'll find quite a few posters stating that Coleman had a very good season last year also, and he's now notched that up a level to have an excellent season this year.
Think we will have to agree to disagree here.
I don't get why most of you seem to get riled up by Barney or Silentwitness. If you can't see that Rafael is a key player for Utd and what a difference he makes when he plays... I mean last year he dominated that right flank like Evra dominated the left flank during his heyday. Can't receive higher praise than that for a fullback.
Re: Coleman, I understand why we would be linked with him due to Rafael's injuries but you'd still be crazy to let Rafael go.
Re: Coleman, I understand why we would be linked with him due to Rafael's injuries but you'd still be crazy to let Rafael go.
No chance of him going anywhere. We already have so many voids to fill this summer, I'm not sure if moyes wants another problem. Besides he's been one of our best performers this season as well.
Against West Brom, I thought Gera and Brunt were going to give him a few problems given that Mata wasn't really tracking back, but he didn't do so bad to deal with both of them. During the first 10 minutes, he somewhat struggled against Gera and Brunt, but he got much better since then and dominated the right side so much so that West Brom's only outlet was Anichebe.
That knock late on is really worrisome. He's had that happen to him in the last 5-6 matches that he has started. This is a huge concern as we don't really have another natural right back in the first team.
That knock late on is really worrisome. He's had that happen to him in the last 5-6 matches that he has started. This is a huge concern as we don't really have another natural right back in the first team.
Don't get me wrong, Coleman is having a very good season and is a very good player. Likewise he had a good season last year.
The finances involved and our inability to promise him guaranteed game time without seriously harming Rafael's development mean that it just wouldn't make sense to me. For us to even consider buying a first choice right back I'd say he'd have to be a guaranteed World Class player who would be an upgrade on Rafael, even when fit.
I disagree that Coleman has better current ability also. I don't believe Coleman has had a period in his career that puts him at the ability that Rafael consistently showed last season. If Coleman has been an 8/10 this season, Rafael was a 9/10 last season. Injuries and the curse of Moyes this season doesn't extinguish that.
I agree that the next 2-3 years are huge for Rafael. He could establish himself as one of the best few full backs in the world or he could be injured 50% of the time and be replaced. However buying someone who may push him out of the starting lineup and deprive him of the chance to prove himself at the moment would be ridiculous.
Not sure on the whole statistics thing but, watching the game, at least to me it seems Rafael has a lot better technique and ability to cross the ball. It's kind of like the Nani versus Valencia better crosser debate for a while. Nani's ability to vary his crosses, the shape he puts on them to many, myself included, felt that he is a better crosser. Valencia maybe had a better set of stats at the time but, because of how limited his crossing is, to me it never made him the better crosser.
This season Rafael has been a bit more wild in his crossing, just not quite himself. Not sure if that's him going forward but, I like to think it's lack of continuity coupled with anxiety in a lot of situations to make things happen. When he is playing within himself - he has some really good crosses in him, far better than Smalling.
Also, to echo what others have said - it's plain as a bright sunny day in Manchester that when Rafael is in the team, whether the results reflect it or not - he add a lot more than Smalling or Jones on the right. Other than the way he plays, his demeanour and fire is something is something we could do with a lot more of. Smalling definitely doesn't give us that edge, especially when we are chasing a result.
This season Rafael has been a bit more wild in his crossing, just not quite himself. Not sure if that's him going forward but, I like to think it's lack of continuity coupled with anxiety in a lot of situations to make things happen. When he is playing within himself - he has some really good crosses in him, far better than Smalling.
Also, to echo what others have said - it's plain as a bright sunny day in Manchester that when Rafael is in the team, whether the results reflect it or not - he add a lot more than Smalling or Jones on the right. Other than the way he plays, his demeanour and fire is something is something we could do with a lot more of. Smalling definitely doesn't give us that edge, especially when we are chasing a result.
Rafael's biggest problem, so far, had been his bad crossing. Defensively, he has been sound, hence why opponents have always targeted the left side/weak central defender. It's just tat Rafael's crossing and overall offensive output hasn't been that good, this season, hence why he was often substituted for Valencia during the fall fixtures.
However, his offensive output against West Brom was much better and something we would expect from Rafael. Let's hope his fitness issues don't stagnate his development,
However, his offensive output against West Brom was much better and something we would expect from Rafael. Let's hope his fitness issues don't stagnate his development,
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Further to the megathreads announcement, this megathread has been renamed and should be confined to discussing Rafael Da Silva's performances this season. For any other discussions about Rafael Da Silva, please bump or create separate threads.
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Further to the megathreads announcement, this megathread has been renamed and should be confined to discussing Rafael Da Silva's performances this season. For any other discussions about Rafael Da Silva, please bump or create separate threads.
Thanks!
Grow a fecking brain. Should've been sent off.
Our best player on the pitch give away a penalty and should've been off. Says it all.
I'm his biggest fan but that was so stupid.
Other than that he was very good.
Other than that he was very good.
It's annoying because he's played well apart from the stupidity of two moments of feck-wittery. He just doesn't learn, too rash.
What brain has to do with it, it's instictive reaction, he raised his arm as soon as Suarez tried to make a move.
Jones has been far better. Rafael knew what he was doing getting booked for diving in on Gerrard and was then extremely lucky not to be off. He's just so immature still
A hotheaded player, but still in my opinion our most threatening player in attack. We would be even more stale without him today.
He almost tried to move his arm away after realising what he'd done. It should be a booking though, and he should be off.
Yeah I think he just got caught out by that; bad defending though. His foul on Gerrard was brainless though.
Will probably be attacked over this but give me Coleman over him anyday. Better in attack, better in defence, much more disciplined.
I'm sick and tired of his rash decisions and then those decisions being excused by passion or youth.
I'm sick and tired of his rash decisions and then those decisions being excused by passion or youth.
He's stupid, simple as that. Tough man wannabe
He needs to start learning and fast otherwise he will never be the player we all want.
Needs to be fined and take a college course on ethic or psychology. Two terrible decision in under a few minutes does not give me confidence in his mentality.
He's still been our only attacking outlet.
Remember Fellaini should have given a pen away too, so is he stupid and immature? If you put your arm across the opponent in the box expect them to fall over most of the time and get a penalty.
He's a donkey.
You lot are funny. Little things like that happen to everybody, he'll be okay like everyone else once we get a new manager.
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