Sounds like excuses to me, with all due respect
The “Ole doesn’t have the players to work with” myth
- Thread starter Rado_N
- Start date
Except Ole said he is happy with his squad
to be fair our manager would probably not be able to make it at Colchester. Same as Carrick, Fortune and Mckenna.
Well it was actually the following year we won the league with Cleverley in CM for 32 appearances. Jones played a shit load in midfield that season also.
My point stands, good managers find solutions and Ole's solution after a full international break of fecking Andreas and Fred was as clueless as decision as you'll ever see a top manager make. Why not drill Jones and the team for 2 weeks prior to get him back up to scratch in that role? Someone actually much more suited to it and with loads of experience of playing there?
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So the fact we changed formations and started a comeback is somehow a negative? We're missing Pogba, Mctominay, and matic. We're not gonna be good with them out as we don't have the depth currently. It takes more than one transfer window to fix the issues we had before Ole joined. Is it his fault that Jones couldn't clear a simple through ball and Pereira can't control a simple pass? Our current league position is just the level of our squad currently. We have a decent enough first XI as we can see from our record in big games but over the course of a season the other players have to make contributions and were just not getting it from them.
Yes he should pull a Mourinho and moan about it to the public. There is something called handling it I house, something people have forgotten during Jose era
I don't understand why people are defending Ole here. This is not our first poor result this season. West Ham, Bournemouth, Southampton...
Looking at yesterday's game - his in-game management was piss poor. Having miraculously got the lead and watching United dominate again, instead of going for the jugular and ending it he switches things up again and brings Tuanzebe on. It unsettled our back line again and we end up conceding. He's a rubbish manager.
He refused to replace the likes of Lukaku in the summer and said he was happy with the midfield when Herrera left. This is on him. If people are happy to accept a draw against the mighty Sheffield then it's just an indication of how far we have fallen.
Looking at yesterday's game - his in-game management was piss poor. Having miraculously got the lead and watching United dominate again, instead of going for the jugular and ending it he switches things up again and brings Tuanzebe on. It unsettled our back line again and we end up conceding. He's a rubbish manager.
He refused to replace the likes of Lukaku in the summer and said he was happy with the midfield when Herrera left. This is on him. If people are happy to accept a draw against the mighty Sheffield then it's just an indication of how far we have fallen.
We can blame players all we like but there is one fundamental in football and we are lacking in that every time we play away from home which is aggression.
How many times did our players specifically Perreira get bullied of the ball?
Surely Ole must demand aggression from his team?
How many times did our players specifically Perreira get bullied of the ball?
Surely Ole must demand aggression from his team?
You'd swear Ole was the first manager in the history of football who's had to deal with injuries to key players and use makeshift formations to handle them. According to people on here that means he's completely excused from our horrid results and football. Absolute madness. Good managers get the most out of what they have available, they compensate certain areas being weakened by making the most out of others.
We have still had the better team on the pitch in most of the games we've lost or drawn this season and that's all that matters. I mean most goals we score tend to come from a bit of individual/link up brilliance from players rather than great team play yet it's the quality of players that are apparently the problem. The man is clearly not cut out to manage at this level.
We have still had the better team on the pitch in most of the games we've lost or drawn this season and that's all that matters. I mean most goals we score tend to come from a bit of individual/link up brilliance from players rather than great team play yet it's the quality of players that are apparently the problem. The man is clearly not cut out to manage at this level.
So in your attempt to be clever you’ve actually answered your own question. “we don’t know” so how about we judge OgS on what we do know. For all you & I ‘know’ we could have been worse.
Take yesterday as the example, if we are unable to keep a clean sheet in the final 15 minutes because we are missing defensive juggernaut Paul Pogba [Martial played] then things are actually worse than I ever imagined.
People will fall over themselves to defend OgS based on fanciful what could have beens instead of actually judging him on what is.
I have no doubt with Pogba in the team we’d be better but team displays like yesterday can’t simply be put down to; “if Pogba plays who knows”.
If our hopes this season were based on our best 11 starting every game then don’t have Luke Shaw at left back or rely on Martial [historic muscular injuries] as your no.9.
We don’t capitulate at Bournemouth defensively because Pogba/Martial aren’t playing, so come off it. OgS is woefully mismanaging his limited resources.
As above.
He presided over the downsizing of our squad in the summer. He has to be held accountable for the decision to let so many players go without replacing them. A club with our resources should be made to look like a bunch of no-hopers just because one or two players are out injured.
Don't tell me that spending £80m on Maguire meant you didn't have the funds to make badly needed improvements in other areas of the pitch, because that was exactly what I was shouted down for suggesting in the summer.
I read a post in another Ole thread that stated they'd be happy giving Ole time until the end of the season, as long as we end up on a top half table finish. I mean, has our standards really dropped this low now?
Ole doesn't have the players . . . to get top 3. He does have the players to do a lot better than he is. Wilder is an example of a manager getting more from the team than the quality of the players would represent.
Was saying similar to a friend of mine last night.
Mourinho was hired to turn you into consistent title challengers again but he lost his job because he couldn't keep you in the top four. Solskjaer was hired to get you back into the top four but he'll lose his job because he can't keep you in the top six. Is your next manager going to eventually lose his job because he can't keep you in the top half?
It is not myth. It's a fact. Mourinho is mostly to blame for it.
The scary part for me is that some of the standards have been dropped so low, by some, that even if we finish well outside the top 4, but say between postions 6th and 10th, some would still defend Ole and want to give him time as it would be seen as an achievement and progress. Because apparently we're a midtable team.
About the bolded bit, what Ole says is spot on and IMO, he does get the club and what it is about. But the crux of it is that any manager worth his salt, is evaluated on their ability to implement and execute their strategy and vision onto their team. Otherwise any of us might as well go out and manage at the elite level because, you know, youth/attacking football/pressing/tactics etc. etc.
You weren't exactly the only one suggesting it this summer.
Sheff Utd are a good team though, or at least a team in good form. Why is that not allowed to be said?
Solskjaer got it wrong starting Jones in a 3 at the back.
No one is saying we'd win every game at full strength but like you say yourself we'd be better. Like I said I expected 6th this season so that's what I think of this squad.
As for your other comments. Defending is about more than the midfielders being 'defensive juggernauts'. If you have midfielders who can actually keep the ball for more than 2 seconds it takes pressure off the defence for one.
It seems we're headed in that direction, bud. It will be interesting to see what the Board does if OGS does not achieve top 4, as this was the measure of each of our previous managers. I personally don't see him getting axed if we remain in the top 6-8 because Woodward would do his utmost to back OGS to come good and save face on a potential 4th disastrous appointment of his reign. But yeah, interesting time.
Doesn't mean I wasn't shouted down.
So how have the other big teams done against Sheff Utd this season then Rado?
Why dont you ever take injuries and players form into consideration?
Its not always the managers fault, he was wrong in picked Jones but the players played poorly.
Have any of you cnuts ever coached at all?
Well he would say that wouldn't he.
As a comparison, the Sheffield United squad is on paper nothing like as good or as talented as ours.
But the difference is that they are prepared to run and scrap and get to the ball first.
And ours think that because they play for Manchester United, they don't have to do any of that.
You are acting as if it wasn't a widely shared and discussed point, many agreed and many disagreed. You weren't shouted down, I wasn't shouted down for saying the same thing and many other posters weren't shouted down, it just happens that some thought that the defense was the number one priority. As I said at the time and said to someone a few weeks ago, CB was maybe the fifth position to upgrade particularly when we had numbers unlike central midfield and wings where we lack numbers and quality.
Yup, it's just one game, that's what we're all basing this off. It has nothing to do with our form since fecking March. Nothing to do with being embarrassed by Newcastle, Palace, Bournemouth, West Ham.
Yes this cnut has coached and I've played at a high level, and yes, one off games or a run of poor form can be excused, but our poor form is here to stay, it's been here since March and if anything we looks more clueless and less coached.
Those of you with itchy trigger fingers every time we dont win a match are a huge part of the problem with our supporter base. You know it too but you still act like fecking spoiled children. The OP in this thread, as per usual with these kind of threads, completely ignored Sheff Utd's form this season and the fact we are missing our two best CMs. Whenever you have an agenda you omit facts to support your bullshit.,
What this does in turn is annoys the more reasonable fans among us who instead of rightly critiquing Ole..and Jose..and LVG etc etc are forced to just defend him because of the nonsense spewed by the plastics. Ole was at fault for the team selection, he must also be given praise for turning the game around. Injuries are an issue and we dont have a great squad but if NONE of you who call for his head cannot see the progress with the youngsters then you are just plain blind. Give the man time and let us grow a fecking team before shipping out another manager and bringing it the next temporary solution.
What this does in turn is annoys the more reasonable fans among us who instead of rightly critiquing Ole..and Jose..and LVG etc etc are forced to just defend him because of the nonsense spewed by the plastics. Ole was at fault for the team selection, he must also be given praise for turning the game around. Injuries are an issue and we dont have a great squad but if NONE of you who call for his head cannot see the progress with the youngsters then you are just plain blind. Give the man time and let us grow a fecking team before shipping out another manager and bringing it the next temporary solution.
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If you're not careful I think you could be putting yourself in the position Liverpool did a few years ago, where it gets harder and harder to get back into the Champions League the more time you spend out of it. Frankly, I think it's already happening. You signed three players this summer - two for big money - but they were all from British clubs who finished below you in the pyramid. I think Pogba was the last player you signed after going into battle against the other top clubs in Europe (maybe Fred, actually). Now whenever you go after that type of target they either stay at their current club (Eriksen, Dybala, Fernandes) or end up going somewhere else (De Ligt). Hell, even the CL-quality players in your squad have either agitated for a move in the past or eventually got the transfers they wanted (De Gea, Pogba, Sanchez, Lukaku, Herrera). I think the name "Manchester United" still means a lot in British football but I don't think it has anywhere near as much pull on the continent anymore. It's all well and good trying to sign players who'll get you back into Europe's elite but those players actually have to want to be part of the project, and the longer this period of stasis continues the harder it's going to be to convince anyone to join it. Putting a big-name manager - or even a remotely interesting up-and-coming tactics nerd - into your dugout might help matters, but I'm not sure what Pochettino or Allegri could really change at this point. I think they'd both get you back into the top four/six on a consistent basis but under this current regime I don't think they'd have the funds, the time, or the resources to do an effective job long-term. Your board are very reactive and impulsive when it comes to squad and staff management and until things change upstairs I can't see much changing on the pitch.
Why are you calling him a cnut? Who the feck are you to be calling a club legend a cnut? Also we dont look more clueless and less coached. He clearly has a team structure he is trying to build. If you had half a footballing brain you can see that. THE ISSUE with him is for me is either thinking 3 players last summer was enough or allowing Ed to say it was enough.
@Ramshock.... was it just Sheff U though, is that all people are basing this off? Not off the fact that we've 25 points in 22 league games since the famous PSG result.
Read that again man, and then look at how shitly coached we look. Only blind faith can help at this point, blind faith because a guy doesn't like mercenaries and "get's it".
Clearly true up until last summer. However they didnt buy enough of their targets.
You dont have a clue.
I called myself a cnut because that's what YOU called anyone critiquing Ole. Get a fecking grip of yourself man.
Footballing brain... haha, go PM and let's send each other some links of the sides we've played for.
You can't even read so...
Yeah, you summed it up - the Board/owners just seem clueless in the industry. I haven't done a ton of fact-checking - so this is jy my opinion/view but look at how Hicks/Gillette ran Pool, versus how FSG has done. So changing managers (again) will have a positive affect if the manager is better than what we currently have, but to compete long term is going to require structural changes (and hopefully even new owners/CEO!) above.
FSG made the same type of mistakes and lame transfers that we did. The turning point was the hiring of one of the best managers in the world and then fitting the organization to his needs.
Because they couldn't. They spent almost all of your summer resources on three players, two of whom cost upwards of £120m combined. Lukaku was hurried out to pay for it.
He has handled Nada in-house, zilch!!!
Mourinho could go toe to toe with the board and was not happy becuase his demands were not met (Maguire) for instance. LVG too has stated in recent times that our board prioritise finances over football. Those are managers who even though they didn't succeed here sure had high standards
Ole can't stand up to the board in any way. You know why? He is just happy to be in a job he is massively involved underqualified for. He is thankful everyday that Manchester United run on nepotism instead of meritocracy. There is no way he is handling anything! He is a stooge and just generally happy to be in a job where there is no pressure and where he can afford to sedate fans with talks of 'peaks and valleys', youth, 3 yers plan, Rome was not built in a day, the boys are showing passion in training and all that crap!
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Yup.
We however seems to think good ideals and a good transfer strategy is all that is required.
Lukaku was sold as he wanted to leave, not to balance the books. If that was the case, we wouldn't have agreed to swap Lukaku with Dybala and insisted on cash deal only.
Amazing how everyone just starts pulling theories from the air, like how the budge was spent on 3 players when no one even knew what the budget was.
Exactly. Good manager just makes everything click, poor manager makes everything look poorer than it is.