[TSE123]

Great again. Thanks to superb positioning Arsenal didnt attack once on uniteds right in the second half!
Maguire prob did his best game as well, but his positioning is still a bit iffy

 

[DWelbz19]

It really might be Lindelof plus one this season

 

[pablo__p]

My MoM. Excellent.

 

[BorisManUtd]

Our best centre back atm as Varane is yet to start his United career properly.

 

[TSE123]

Before all haters show up.
This game is a perfect example of where Lindelof has “less to do” in defence. But what people fail to see is ALL the hard work he does and exceptional positioning that prevents Arsenal from playing through right CB. its just not an option. Its easy to mistake this for passivity or not being involved, but instead its intelligent defending.

there were of course som good tackles etc as well.

 

[PoTMS]

He should be second in the centre back pecking order.

 

[ivaldo]

I think we need @golden_blunder to dampen the mood a little in here.

 

[Martial'sEmergingSmile]

Reads the game so well, and visibly spent the entire match talking to Dalot and building that partnership. I liked the Chiellini/Bonucci-esque high fives between the two of them after a few bits of good defending.

Eventually people are going to realise that he's just a really good defender.

Even his aerial duel success rate this season (and last) is very good. Top 7% of active centre-backs.

 

[Poborsky's hair]

Before all haters show up.
This game is a perfect example of where Lindelof has “less to do” in defence. But what people fail to see is ALL the hard work he does and exceptional positioning that prevents Arsenal from playing through right CB. its just not an option. Its easy to mistake this for passivity or not being involved, but instead its intelligent defending.

there were of course som good tackles etc as well.

It's always baffling to read comments like that, after some game that he's back and always has been and will beas good as today. Fecking gunpowder for all of your Victor fans isn't it? Obviously today I will give him credit, he's been great and I should end my comment here but since I started replying to your overly positive comment and defensive message which generalizes his play on a sample of this very game. I need to add this: Let's see if he can stay as intelligent like this in the coming games instead of getting bullied for strength, pace, in the air and iron out overal less impressive passive pieces of play which he had fecking shitload, noone can ever count, even this season alone.

 

[golden_blunder]

I think we need @golden_blunder to dampen the mood a little in here.

This is a circle jerk, I’m out

 

[ivaldo]

This is a circle jerk, I’m out

Ah. I see. You're more about the jerk circles.

 

[Rossa]

It really might be Lindelof plus one this season

More like Varane plus one, and that one should be Lindelof. I’m not a huge fan, but he’s been quite good lately.

 

[Adam-Utd]

He did play well today, although playing against Aubameyang in current form is probably the easiest job in the league.

I've seen enough long term to know he can't be trusted fully.

 

[anant]

Reads the game so well, and visibly spent the entire match talking to Dalot and building that partnership. I liked the Chiellini/Bonucci-esque high fives between the two of them after a few bits of good defending.

Eventually people are going to realise that he's just a really good defender.

Even his aerial duel success rate this season (and last) is very good. Top 7% of active centre-backs.

I'm surprised how people haven't noticed this. Even last season, people said he cost us goals because he's weak, but apart from a couple of goals, I don't think that was an issue last year as well.

We avoid more goals with him in the side than we concede because of him

 

[united for life]

He did play well today, although playing against Aubameyang in current form is probably the easiest job in the league.

I've seen enough long term to know he can't be trusted fully.

he did well. He’s been the better one in his partnership with maguire. But you are right, he isn’t a regular starter. This is why I still feel we need to strengthen in that position. Need to find a partner for varane. Lindelof gets run past far too much at time. But generally, he looks like a better defender compared to prior year

 

[Ekeke]

Did fine, Maguire did a fair bit more both on the ball and defending

 

[Oranges038]

Should be him and Varane as the first choice two. He's definitely been the better player between him and Maguire this season.

Still think both he and Maguire need to be upgraded on.

 

[TSE123]

It's always baffling to read comments like that, after some game that he's back and always has been and will beas good as today. Fecking gunpowder for all of your Victor fans isn't it? Obviously today I will give him credit, he's been great and I should end my comment here but since I started replying to your overly positive comment and defensive message which generalizes his play on a sample of this very game. I need to add this: Let's see if he can stay as intelligent like this in the coming games instead of getting bullied for strength, pace, in the air and iron out overal less impressive passive pieces of play which he had fecking shitload, noone can ever count, even this season alone.

Firstly: in writing, everything becomes more polarised and were we to discuss this face to face im sure it would be a much more moderate discussion where we probably would agree on some points so keep that in mind.

Having said that: Its always baffling to read comments on the lindelof thread after even a game like yesterday. Where people write negative comments about him, despite playing really well
From certain people the comments are always, and will always be ”suppose he was pretty good tonight, but will soon be sh*t again” and after one poor game “HIS ALWAYS SH*T”
Question: How many good games does it take for him to get a fair review?
Compare this to all the comments about Maguire which say: ”Had a fairly poor game today but is usually solid, will soon be back” and after one decent game “HIS BACK, KNEW HE WOULD BE”
The obvious truth starring everyone in the face is that Lindelof has consistently been the best (or one of the best) defenders all season - without exception, whilst maguire has been consistently sh*t without exception. Of course this has been in a team that lacks leadership and structure.
I think its clear, we value different things in a defender (i prefer the football playing style defender, not just an oafish brute). BUT have you looked at any statistics about aerial duels etc? Lindelof has not been bullied, more than on the rare occasion and statistically (read “factually and in real life”) is the better defender EVEN when it comes to physical attributes.

 

[golden_blunder]

Don’t talk nonsense. Lindelof has been very good at times but don’t say he’s physically better than Maguire (who’s been shit this season, so just remember you’re comparing to his worst form versus Lindelofs best form), Varane or even Bailly.

 

[TSE123]

Don’t talk nonsense. Lindelof has been very good at times but don’t say he’s physically better than Maguire (who’s been shit this season, so just remember you’re comparing to his worst form versus Lindelofs best form), Varane or even Bailly.

Its not nonsense in any meaning of the word. My reasoning expresses my point clearly, you may think it wrong, which is strange since statistics are not subjective in that way. So if you mean nonsense, as in foolish or wrong, then i suppose thats come back to bite you.
I stated that lindelof statistically has been better than maguire when it comes to aerial duels. Which is a fact. I havent compared any other physical attibutes, but if I were to then I would also claim that he is faster than maguire (but thats an easy point to make).

i would also like to point out that your opinion is that Lindelof is at his best and maguire at his worst. We disagree on this point as well. The whole of last season maguire was a disaster in many aspects of the game (the most serious one his positioning, although thats more difficult to spot if you dont look for it or want to see it) and Lindelof was consistent and pretty good (with the exception of 4-5 mistakes (that even a 5 year old could have spotted).

i think the differing opinion in the latter question is largely down to footballing culture, nationality of the player and ability to filter out the opinions of the one-eyed commentators who will, and always have praised the english players, the towering, wooden legged oafs and the strikers who are only able to run 100mph in straight lines (but nothing else).

 

[golden_blunder]

Its not nonsense in any meaning of the word. My reasoning expresses my point clearly, you may think it wrong, which is strange since statistics are not subjective in that way. So if you mean nonsense, as in foolish or wrong, then i suppose thats come back to bite you.
I stated that lindelof statistically has been better than maguire when it comes to aerial duels. Which is a fact. I havent compared any other physical attibutes, but if I were to then I would also claim that he is faster than maguire (but thats an easy point to make).

i would also like to point out that your opinion is that Lindelof is at his best and maguire at his worst. We disagree on this point as well. The whole of last season maguire was a disaster in many aspects of the game (the most serious one his positioning, although thats more difficult to spot if you dont look for it or want to see it) and Lindelof was consistent and pretty good (with the exception of 4-5 mistakes (that even a 5 year old could have spotted).

i think the differing opinion in the latter question is largely down to footballing culture, nationality of the player and ability to filter out the opinions of the one-eyed commentators who will, and always have praised the english players, the towering, wooden legged oafs and the strikers who are only able to run 100mph in straight lines (but nothing else).

First I’d like to point out that Lindelofs nationality is off no concern to me nor should it be.

you may want to be careful how you’re phrasing posts insinuating that our English players are wooden legged oafs and that they can only run in straight lines.

 

[Kostov]

That tackle I think it was on White, I loved it. Everyone was pussying and backing off, inviting pressure, and he stopped him brilliantly. More of that Victor lad, please.

 

[romufc]

That tackle I think it was on White, I loved it. Everyone was pussying and backing off, inviting pressure, and he stopped him brilliantly. More of that Victor lad, please.

THis is something we need to see more off, aggression from our players. Winning that ball in that position can set us up for a counter attack.

That play there is my biggest issue about us, White literally walked between McFred.

 

[Kostov]

THis is something we need to see more off, aggression from our players. Winning that ball in that position can set us up for a counter attack.

That play there is my biggest issue about us, White literally walked between McFred.

It was pathetic, and they did something similar when martinelli went on a slalom, on thing is they are very incompetent imo, but also very very stupid. You want see that happening against Chelsea, Liveerpool or City, there is always some player doing a slimy little foul that often goes without yellow. Our bunch is so nice and sincere. Credit to Lindelof, I loved that from him.

 

[romufc]

It was pathetic, and they did something similar when martinelli went on a slalom, on thing is they are very incompetent imo, but also very very stupid. You want see that happening against Chelsea, Liveerpool or City, there is always some player doing a slimy little foul that often goes without yellow. Our bunch is so nice and sincere. Credit to Lindelof, I loved that from him.

Yep, I think it happens too often against us, its either because both our CM's commit, instead of staggering their position so if the first player gets beat, the second should be able to intercept or make a foul that doesnt lead to yelloy.

I think Lindelof goes unnoticed in games, he needs to be consistent though.

 

[Vidyoyo]

First I’d like to point out that Lindelofs nationality is off no concern to me nor should it be.

you may want to be careful how you’re phrasing posts insinuating that our English players are wooden legged oafs and that they can only run in straight lines.

Agree, Sancho is great.

 

[Kostov]

Yep, I think it happens too often against us, its either because both our CM's commit, instead of staggering their position so if the first player gets beat, the second should be able to intercept or make a foul that doesnt lead to yelloy.

I think Lindelof goes unnoticed in games, he needs to be consistent though.

Yes there were couple of examples of this yesterday, either McT or Fred gets beaten, and the other one instantly steps up in no mans land, leaving the team exposed, zero defensive instinct imo.

And re Lindelof, I've been one of his harshest critics, and I am so so pleased to see him step up and hold that defense at times when Maguire has played like an amateur. Long may it continue.

 

[Cassidy]

Reads the game so well, and visibly spent the entire match talking to Dalot and building that partnership. I liked the Chiellini/Bonucci-esque high fives between the two of them after a few bits of good defending.

Eventually people are going to realise that he's just a really good defender.

Even his aerial duel success rate this season (and last) is very good. Top 7% of active centre-backs.

This is quite interesting given this was the stick many used to beat him with... Good he is making improvements there

 

[pratyush_utd]

This is quite interesting given this was the stick many used to beat him with... Good he is making improvements there

Stick is mostly from people who thinks every defender should play like Vidic. In well drilled team who defend as a team, he will be ahead of likes of Maguire and Eric. He is far better player on the ball than both of them

 

[mu4c_20le]

Interesting that MEN called him out on being uncomfortable on set pieces and basically rated Maguire higher. He was good in the air, but he's also had much better games than this.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

Yep, I think it happens too often against us, its either because both our CM's commit, instead of staggering their position so if the first player gets beat, the second should be able to intercept or make a foul that doesnt lead to yelloy.

I think Lindelof goes unnoticed in games, he needs to be consistent though.

That is exactly what’s happening. None of our CMs have any natural defensive instincts/positioning (apart from, arguably, Matic. Who is so slow his instincts aren’t enough)

 

[Adam-Utd]

This is quite interesting given this was the stick many used to beat him with... Good he is making improvements there

It's not really that interesting or useful out of context. He basically doesn't take an aerial duel unless he knows he will win it. You can't lose a duel if you don't go in for it.

When the ball is there to be won cleanly though then yes he will take it. You really don't need stats to tell you that Lindelof is not good in the air.

 

[Vidyoyo]

Interesting that MEN called him out on being uncomfortable on set pieces and basically rated Maguire higher. He was good in the air, but he's also had much better games than this.

He also got one of the lowest scores on the BBC. Basically people are idiots.

 

[bond19821982]

THis is something we need to see more off, aggression from our players. Winning that ball in that position can set us up for a counter attack.

That play there is my biggest issue about us, White literally walked between McFred.

Tactical fouling isn't something which we are used to. Think, it will get better with Ralf. You don't invite a CB with a ball to your half, even if you do that's an opportunity for us to get the ball and go for counter. I was literally pissed when White did that.

 

[golden_blunder]

Agree, Sancho is great.

Hmm not sure if you’re agreeing with me or him

 

[Andersons Dietician]

Firstly: in writing, everything becomes more polarised and were we to discuss this face to face im sure it would be a much more moderate discussion where we probably would agree on some points so keep that in mind.

Having said that: Its always baffling to read comments on the lindelof thread after even a game like yesterday. Where people write negative comments about him, despite playing really well
From certain people the comments are always, and will always be ”suppose he was pretty good tonight, but will soon be sh*t again” and after one poor game “HIS ALWAYS SH*T”
Question: How many good games does it take for him to get a fair review?
Compare this to all the comments about Maguire which say: ”Had a fairly poor game today but is usually solid, will soon be back” and after one decent game “HIS BACK, KNEW HE WOULD BE”
The obvious truth starring everyone in the face is that Lindelof has consistently been the best (or one of the best) defenders all season - without exception, whilst maguire has been consistently sh*t without exception. Of course this has been in a team that lacks leadership and structure.
I think its clear, we value different things in a defender (i prefer the football playing style defender, not just an oafish brute). BUT have you looked at any statistics about aerial duels etc? Lindelof has not been bullied, more than on the rare occasion and statistically (read “factually and in real life”) is the better defender EVEN when it comes to physical attributes.

Its not nonsense in any meaning of the word. My reasoning expresses my point clearly, you may think it wrong, which is strange since statistics are not subjective in that way. So if you mean nonsense, as in foolish or wrong, then i suppose thats come back to bite you.
I stated that lindelof statistically has been better than maguire when it comes to aerial duels. Which is a fact. I havent compared any other physical attibutes, but if I were to then I would also claim that he is faster than maguire (but thats an easy point to make).

i would also like to point out that your opinion is that Lindelof is at his best and maguire at his worst. We disagree on this point as well. The whole of last season maguire was a disaster in many aspects of the game (the most serious one his positioning, although thats more difficult to spot if you dont look for it or want to see it) and Lindelof was consistent and pretty good (with the exception of 4-5 mistakes (that even a 5 year old could have spotted).

i think the differing opinion in the latter question is largely down to footballing culture, nationality of the player and ability to filter out the opinions of the one-eyed commentators who will, and always have praised the english players, the towering, wooden legged oafs and the strikers who are only able to run 100mph in straight lines (but nothing else).

How has this guy not received two likes for these posts? Well structured, well mannered, well researched and putting forth some well thought out and interesting opinions. I’ve seen terrible posts getting likes before and this is not one of those.

I can agree with large sections of it, but as someone who has come around to Lindelof I do believe there are certainly occasions where he is physically bullied out-with just aerial duels. He can certainly be stronger in my opinion but I find he is better sweeping up than being the aggressor and given Varane hasn’t really had a chance to sustain performances surely Lindelof has been by far the best defender this season.

I actually think he was better last season than Maguire mainly as stated Maguires positioning is dead awful. Anyway, new manager, fresh start for many. We will see where they are all at in 6 months time.

 

[Vidyoyo]

Hmm not sure if you’re agreeing with me or him

Naw I'm agreeing with you that not all our English players are one legged oafs. Sancho's been very good the past few games.

 

[A-man]

It's not really that interesting or useful out of context. He basically doesn't take an aerial duel unless he knows he will win it. You can't lose a duel if you don't go in for it.

When the ball is there to be won cleanly though then yes he will take it. You really don't need stats to tell you that Lindelof is not good in the air.

Lindelof and Maguire have similar aerial stats so far this season and have made more or less the same amount of attempts.

Maguire is better in the air, but Lindelof has improved in that area and Maguire have declined a little.

Aerial duels from this season incl all games played for United (both have played 16 matches):

Lindelof
Total 47 (2.94/game)
Won 33 (2.06/game)
70%

Maguire
Total 46 (2.88/game)
Won 33 (2.06/game)
71%

 

[pratyush_utd]

It's not really that interesting or useful out of context. He basically doesn't take an aerial duel unless he knows he will win it. You can't lose a duel if you don't go in for it.

When the ball is there to be won cleanly though then yes he will take it. You really don't need stats to tell you that Lindelof is not good in the air.

This is a myth. Its funny how he gets slated here for losing aerial duel and called soft but when his stats shows he is similar to Maguire, this starts getting mentioned.

 

[Adam-Utd]

This is a myth. Its funny how he gets slated here for losing aerial duel and called soft but when his stats shows he is similar to Maguire, this starts getting mentioned.

It's not a myth. I watch every game and I see it with my own eyes.

If you're honestly trying to tell me Lindelof is as good as Maguire in the air, then I have the number of a good optician you might like to see.