Westminster Politics

Ramshock

CAF Pilib De Brún Translator
Joined
Nov 20, 2007
Messages
45,425
Location
Swimming against a tide of idiots and spoofers
it's like when obama became president and racism ended forever in america. they prefer to dress up their really non-representative operation with the symbolic veneer of representation. it's only this which keeps people looking toward politicians at all. as soon as you check out of the personality cults and party partisanship, the game is over.
wtf even is this post?
 

Ramshock

CAF Pilib De Brún Translator
Joined
Nov 20, 2007
Messages
45,425
Location
Swimming against a tide of idiots and spoofers
they were in office when the crash happened. it was the gop in america. whoever was in office at that time, by and large, got the blame for it in their host country. the irony is that they all deserved some of the blame but that the opposition party is just as terrible. truthfully, most democracies now offer very little choice between the parties that can *realistically* be elected. there is some, a country like france is better than britain or america for example, but overall the picture is bleak and that's a feature of democracy, or has been for the past four decades.

if labour were in office, they'd be doing more or less the same thing. starmer went to the centres of business and asked them "what do you want from me as labour leader". that's his default attitude. if he was to ask business' opinion and then weigh it against the overall public good, that would be something else, but i think it's clear by now that he's another version of blair without the economic base to back it up. he was elected on corbyn's manifesto. corbyn but not corbyn was the pledge; corbyn like manifesto but different personality and "healing". commenced a purge of the "left" and said pledge is long since broken.

two shades of the same shit and it's called capital(ism).
Cant really argue with any of that, especially the last line.
 

MoskvaRed

Full Member
Joined
Sep 24, 2013
Messages
5,232
Location
Not Moskva
Little America it is then.
It’s the system. The majority of people in the UK are not hard-right and there is even a small majority in favour of EU membership (if that were possible). Problem is, a large number of those people are concentrated in the cities. Under our constituency-based, FPTP system, the minority can exercise disproportionate influence. So, you’re right, a bit like America.
 

Pexbo

Winner of the 'I'm not reading that' medal.
Joined
Jun 2, 2009
Messages
68,738
Location
Brizzle
Supports
Big Days
Jibes like captain hindsight aren’t off the cuff remarks that just so happen to land, they’re carefully planned by their advisors and script writers and crowbarred into their responses. The right wing media are in cahoots with Johnson’s team and the drilling home of soundbites like that is a pincer action repetition by both the traditional media and the many bot networks that are a cancer to social media.
I don’t know if it’s a phrase Truss used but case in point all the same:
 

Smores

Full Member
Joined
May 18, 2011
Messages
25,541
So sounds like we know what their strategy is going to be going forward. Refocus on tax and then offer tax cuts at a general election. The old classics basically.

Hopefully every policy the Tories claim they can't fund will be compared to the excess profits they've allowed oil companies to keep.

If they did even a small windfall tax you're talking tens of billions that could be fed into renewables drive.
 

Pexbo

Winner of the 'I'm not reading that' medal.
Joined
Jun 2, 2009
Messages
68,738
Location
Brizzle
Supports
Big Days
Surely they know how easy this is to spot and how ridiculous it looks.
My theory is that Truss’ team has sold them all down the river there. Boris‘ had his client journalists and it was obviously to anyone who was really taking notice but I expect they worked a lot harder to brief them all individually and keep it relatively ”natural”. Who ever is leading Truss’ COMs has lazily sent the same cookie cutter tweet to all the journos sucking on the Tory teet and embarrassed the lot of them. Disappointed with Ridge, I don’t watch Sky News but have seen some of her interviews go viral and thought she was one of the better ones.
 

neverdie

Full Member
Joined
Oct 26, 2018
Messages
2,401
My theory is that Truss’ team has sold them all down the river there. Boris‘ had his client journalists and it was obviously to anyone who was really taking notice but I expect they worked a lot harder to brief them all individually and keep it relatively ”natural”. Who ever is leading Truss’ COMs has lazily sent the same cookie cutter tweet to all the journos sucking on the Tory teet and embarrassed the lot of them. Disappointed with Ridge, I don’t watch Sky News but have seen some of her interviews go viral and thought she was one of the better ones.
The Historic Collapse of Journalism
I have never gotten over a story The New York Times ran in its Sunday magazine back in May 2016. Maybe you will remember the occasion. It was a lengthy profile of Ben Rhodes, the Obama administration’s chief adviser for “strategic communications.” It was written by a reporter named David Samuels.

These two made a striking pair — fitting, I would say. Rhodes was an aspiring fiction writer living in Brooklyn when, by the unlikeliest of turns, he found his way into the inner circle of the Obama White House. Samuels, a freelancer who usually covered popular culture celebrities, had long earlier succumbed to that unfortunately clever style commonly affected by those writing about rock stars and others of greater or lesser frivolity.

Rhodes’ job was to spin “some larger restructuring of the American narrative,” as Samuels put it. “Rhodes is a storyteller who uses a writer’s tools to advance an agenda that is packaged as politics.” A professional flack straight out of Edward Bernays, in plain English. A teller of tales trafficking in manipulable facts and happy endings. “Packaged as politics:” a nice touch conveying the commodification of our public discourse.

Rhodes and Ned Price, his deputy, were social-media acrobats. Price, a former C.I.A. analyst and now the State Department’s spokesman, recounted without inhibition how they fed White House correspondents, columnists, and others in positions to influence public opinion as a fois gras farmer feeds his geese.

Here is Price on the day-to-day of the exercise:

“There are sort of these force multipliers. We have our compadres. I will reach out to a couple of people, and, you know, I wouldn’t want to name them…. And I’ll give them some color, and the next thing I know, lots of these guys are in the dot-com publishing space and have huge followings, and they’ll be putting out this message on their own.”
Rhodes gave Samuels a more structured analysis of this arrangement:

“All the newspapers used to have foreign bureaus. Now they don’t. They call us to explain to them what is happening in Moscow or Cairo. Most of the outlets are reporting on world events from Washington. The average reporter we talk to is 27 years old, and their only reporting experience consists of being around political campaigns. That’s a sea change. They literally know nothing.”
I wrote at length about the Times piece in Salon, where I was foreign affairs columnist at the time. There was so much to unpack in Samuels’s report I hardly knew where to begin. In Price we had a complete failure to understand the role of properly functioning media and the nature of public space altogether.

Rhodes described a White House press corps comprised of post-adolescents thoroughly dependent on the geese-feeding arrangement, especially when they reported on national security questions: “They literally know nothing.”

Rhodes and Price were describing some qualitative turn in the media’s relations with power. I do not mean to suggest these relations were ever in living memory very good, but at some point there had been a swoon, a giving way from bad to worse. “When you read routine press reports in the Times or any of the other major dailies,” I wrote of the Rhodes profile, “you are looking at what the clerks we still call reporters post on government bulletin boards, which we still call newspapers.”


Why is this? Why do I settle on Sept. 11, 2001, as the point of departure?


Jill Abramson went on to serve as The Times’s executive editor. Although that interim ended when she was fired after two and a half years, she was a journalist of very high stature, if not of high caliber. Here is what she said when she explained to her Chautauqua audience the reasons the American press caved so cravenly to Ari Fleischer’s objectionable demands. “Journalists are Americans, too. I consider myself, like I’m sure many of you do, to be a patriot.”

These two sentences flabbergast me every time I think of them. For one thing, they are an almost verbatim repeat of what scores of publishers, editors, columnists, correspondents, and reporters said after Carl Bernstein, in the Oct. 20, 1977, edition of Rolling Stone, exposed more than 400 of them as C.I.A. collaborators. Joe Alsop, columnist at the New York Herald Tribune and later The Washington Post and a Cold Warrior par excellence: “I’ve done things for them when I thought they were the right thing to do. I call it doing my duty as a citizen.”
full article here
 

Fluctuation0161

Full Member
Joined
Aug 8, 2016
Messages
8,165
Location
Manchester
We need to stamp that shite out.
It'll take 10 years to see any output and it won't impact prices. But the current short term crisis is being cited as justification.

Not surprising now that our PM is an ex Shell employee and our energy minister is a climate change denier, they are not investing in green energy for the future.
 

Solius

¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Staff
Joined
Dec 31, 2007
Messages
86,641
My contact in the treasury says the energy bills solution isn't what they would do. It will benefit people who are doing ok and who are well off, but not those struggling :rolleyes:
 

neverdie

Full Member
Joined
Oct 26, 2018
Messages
2,401
the kind of sums being spoken about, and the way in which the government intends to raise said funds, would, in a democracy, necessitate a popular vote. since covid, we're talking about 100s of billions of pounds being added to the public debt column and not a single meaningful chance for the public to have its say. it's a farce.

imagine a referendum along the lines of a) support government initiative; b) support nationalization and eventual creation of publicly owned renewable company; c) support a wealth tax as the means by which to achieve either a or b. but then the electorate does not refer to the people but to capital. what passes for democracy is fundamentally broken. or, if you're well off or exist to make money for people who are well off, then I suppose it's all fine.

the last election came down to "get brexit done". ignoring whether you supported brexit or not, because it was mostly a wedge issue which divided people even if I'd have voted remain, the effect is that the people are locked out of the representational mechanism. the media plays a key role in this. it's telling that you can find people with more substantive opinions to add on a football sub-forum than you can on the majority of corporate media websites and channels the majority of the time. the press really has become a class of clerks. they just amplify whatever it is officialdom or capitaldom has told them on any given day. it's not like it was incredible in terms of integrity fifteen years ago but there has been an incredible decline nonetheless. from bad to abysmal.
 
Last edited:

Jippy

Sleeps with tramps, bangs jacuzzis, dirty shoes
Staff
Joined
Nov 19, 2009
Messages
57,456
Location
Jet fuel doesn't melt steel beams
My theory is that Truss’ team has sold them all down the river there. Boris‘ had his client journalists and it was obviously to anyone who was really taking notice but I expect they worked a lot harder to brief them all individually and keep it relatively ”natural”. Who ever is leading Truss’ COMs has lazily sent the same cookie cutter tweet to all the journos sucking on the Tory teet and embarrassed the lot of them. Disappointed with Ridge, I don’t watch Sky News but have seen some of her interviews go viral and thought she was one of the better ones.
Disappointed the Guardian is in there.
 

Maticmaker

Full Member
Joined
Nov 8, 2018
Messages
4,717
So, sounds like we know what their strategy is going to be going forward. Refocus on tax and then offer tax cuts at a general election. The old classics basically.
Exactly, a return to Tory values, as the majority of the Tory party sees it.... that's why the membership voted for Truss.
It's a great pity the Labour membership don't get to do the same with electing their leader.
 

Smores

Full Member
Joined
May 18, 2011
Messages
25,541
My contact in the treasury says the energy bills solution isn't what they would do. It will benefit people who are doing ok and who are well off, but not those struggling :rolleyes:
Whilst that's true on balance I think this is probably the right solution for the economy isn't it. Choice is between solely help those who need it most who don't have the money to spend in the economy OR help everyone a little and businesses will see less losses.

If it was me we'd do both but I'm a filthy lefty who thinks the poor should be helped.
 

Solius

¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Staff
Joined
Dec 31, 2007
Messages
86,641
Whilst that's true on balance I think this is probably the right solution for the economy isn't it. Choice is between solely help those who need it most who don't have the money to spend in the economy OR help everyone a little and businesses will see less losses.

If it was me we'd do both but I'm a filthy lefty who thinks the poor should be helped.
How dare you not think about the economy.
 

Maticmaker

Full Member
Joined
Nov 8, 2018
Messages
4,717
How dare you not think about the economy.
But he is thinking about helping the present economy, people who are struggling even without the energy crisis... except of course hes not may be thinking about future generations who will pick up the bill.... "like the poor, they are always with us"!
 

TheGame

Full Member
Joined
Jul 30, 2002
Messages
19,297
Location
In the Land of Saints and Sinners
Truss looks so out of her depth in the HoC, staring blankly while other MPs talk all around her. May has to intervene to sound a bit sensible. Kwarteng looks like he's been caught in the headlights.
Will she last till Xmas?
All the press where giving it large by saying Labour underestimated her yesterday at PMQs. She will come undone when people begin to unpick her policies. She is like someone you put as the face of the company when other people are actually running it.
 

Fingeredmouse

Full Member
Joined
Aug 10, 2014
Messages
5,646
Location
Glasgow
Anyone know who Natasha Barnaba is? She donated 100k within 2 days... google says she's a 39 year old interior designer with no significant other information.
No, but Alessandro Barnaba is associated with Clinova, a healthcare company.