He might become a good player some day but I'd write off his chances of doing it here.
Who decided to sign Van De Beek?
- Thread starter Josep Dowling
- Start date
Unlikely. Based on what we saw, he's behind both Matic and Lingard in the pecking order. If Lingard doesn't leave by next Monday, what then? You still think he will get more chances than last season? Despite us having more players in the squad and him being further down the pecking order?
Signing the wrong player is one thing, it happens. Giving him a few minutes is a bit bizarre for an expensive signing, since those are normally allowed time to play themselves into form (Fred on his disastrous first season had more than double the minutes VdB had). However buying an expensive player, who is not even good enough to be used as a sub, then keeping him on in the summer instead of putting him on the transfer list and watching his value just dwindle... is something I think I have never seen before.
One of the strangest transfers ever.
I never thought he was that good. We should have tried to bin him back to Ajax.
I never thought he was that good. We should have tried to bin him back to Ajax.
Yeah almost a sackable offence
Or loan him out or something. Barca sent Coutinho out on loan after paying £150m for him, sending VdB out isn't remotely a big deal.
I just don't understand the point of keeping a player when he's clearly not even trusted to come on as a sub in EPL or CL matches. The player is never gonna find his feet while not playing, he's probably also completely demoralised by now, his value is just shrinking with every match he sits on bench staring forlornly at the pitch, meanwhile we're paying him £120k pw just to play him on some League Cup games with the rest of u21s and Mata where he can't do shit anyway (because the players he plays with and against is nothing like EPL level).
This is just so out of the ordinary, it might even be a world first at this level.
I agree.
I don't get it now. The fact Ole preferred Lingard to sub on instead of VDB is damning.
Yeah and when you think what we could have done with that money it's gut wrenching to say the least
He's on his way to going down as one of our worst ever transfers. Should have sold/loaned him out this summer if he's so out of depth
Is VDB dating Ole's daughter or something?
Can't believe he actually played Matic's corpse and Lindgard over him.
Disgraceful how Ole has treated VDB. Move him on if you don't rate him instead of wasting his career.
Can't believe he actually played Matic's corpse and Lindgard over him.
Disgraceful how Ole has treated VDB. Move him on if you don't rate him instead of wasting his career.
That would involve Ole admitting he got it wrong and lets be honest not got much form for doing that
He is fit, had a good pre-season preparations, featured in few friendlies before the season started, so he is readier than the likes of Sancho & Varane, yet he doesn't even come off the bench, let alone be trusted to start!!!
But this is still only 2 games in the season, after the Wolves' game next week, there is an international break, and then in there are 3 EPL games next month, let's see how much games/time he is given in Sept, after that, it should be clear if Ole even trusts him to play for us competitively or not.
but VdB also needs to step up big time when given the chance and force Ole's hand as well.
But this is still only 2 games in the season, after the Wolves' game next week, there is an international break, and then in there are 3 EPL games next month, let's see how much games/time he is given in Sept, after that, it should be clear if Ole even trusts him to play for us competitively or not.
but VdB also needs to step up big time when given the chance and force Ole's hand as well.
After the Wolves game, the transfer window closes which means VdB stays another year here staring at the pitch from the bench.
If we reach September to realise he's not even trusted as sub (something I say is already obvious) it's too late to do anything. If he's not trusted he needs to be moved this week on transfer or loan. Otherwise we're just wasting both his time and the club's money.
The way things are going DvB will never be given a real chance by Ole, he will leave for Europe and then come back in couple years to help Chelsea win a title #LukakuVibes #FeckThisBS
Today was the most logical time for DvB to play, since Pogba was playing Rashy position and we actually needed a creative midfielder. Instead, Ole starts Matic-Fred combo and then brings Lingard on, removing Pogba from the position in which he was the best player today. And shocker - we get dimmed.
Seriously it is very hard to make excuses for Ole sometimes. And I think he's done the best job of all managers since SaF, but in some games he acts like the worst one. Today was one of those.
Today was the most logical time for DvB to play, since Pogba was playing Rashy position and we actually needed a creative midfielder. Instead, Ole starts Matic-Fred combo and then brings Lingard on, removing Pogba from the position in which he was the best player today. And shocker - we get dimmed.
Seriously it is very hard to make excuses for Ole sometimes. And I think he's done the best job of all managers since SaF, but in some games he acts like the worst one. Today was one of those.
Maybe you are right on the bolded, it's just that we can't tell what's really going on, why Matic was preferred to him? why wasn't allowed to come off the bench yesterday or vs Leeds?
I'd accept him not being selected if he was shit, but he doesn't even play. I think this why the fans not sure what's really going on and Ole is quite about VdB's situation, even McFred duo came in late to the pre-season and didn't get much of pre-season, yet they started the Leeds game, I get why Ole trusts them both, but to prefer Matic over him in a game that requires energy & dynamism in midfield is perplexing, not that VdB is energetic himself, or maybe he is, who knows, we haven't seen much to say so.
100% on Ole this. There's no way that VDB doesn't get games and past it deadwood level players like Matic and Lingard are ahead of him.
Apart from a small amount of curiosity, I don't particularly care why Ole doesn't trust him. I think it's evident that he doesn't. The reasons we'll probably never know but the most likely scenario by far, is that he just thinks he's shit.
What I care about is that the deadline is approaching and Ole will have to make his mind up. He's had the player for over 12 months now, he should know by now if he's player he can use and trust in important games (not just League Cup games against 3rd division teams) or not. And if he doesn't think he can use him, then he should be moved on this week on loan or transfer. If he thinks he can use him, then he needs to start to use him.
Keeping him for another season and then just leaving him on the bench is unacceptable. That's damaging both to the player and club and it makes 0 sense. He's not a teenager, he's a 24yo that cost 40m a year ago. If you don't like him, move him.
So VDB is a defensive mid now? I genuinely don't know what is his usual position. Even on the caf, people want him in DM, CM, LM, LW, No 10.
Nobody wants him in DM, they want him next to a DM.
He started as a CM though in his and Ajax's best season in 18/19 he played more as AM. When De Jong left, the formation changed in 19/20 and he started playing more in CM again, as box-to-box. He's played quite few games in DM as well, but that was mostly in his younger days.
In any case he's seen mostly as creative CM who can play with a DM and another CM/AM in midfield. Yesterday he could have played instead of Lingard (not that Lingard coming on for 5 minutes mattered but hey) or could have come on for Matic, if Fred switched to play the defensive shield instead.
EDIT: All of that is quite moot though. It's clear he's not trusted in the slightest by Ole. In any capacity.
He's probably coming to training surrounded by super models with a Marijuana cigarette on one hand and with a huge kebab on the other hand. Else how on earth he's behind Matic and Lingard in the pecking order?
Seriously the Molde guy is ruining one of the most promising midfielders career
What makes his transfer even worse for me is that, if we decided to fork out an extra £20m (Diallo and Pellistri ended up costing us over £20m together so we had the money), we probably could've had Grealish before his asking price skyrocketed.
It's a great point. Not sure if it's evident that Ole hasn't figured out where to use him or whether he hasn't shown his strengths yet but to me it would me a cm. or a 10.
What do the numbers under the balls represent? at central midfield he has 39 under the first then 30 under the second. just quite confused by it.Nobody wants him in DM, they want him next to a DM.
He started as a CM though in his and Ajax's best season in 18/19 he played more as AM. When De Jong left, the formation changed in 19/20 and he started playing more in CM again, as box-to-box. He's played quite few games in DM as well, but that was mostly in his younger days.
In any case he's seen mostly as creative CM who can play with a DM and another CM/AM in midfield. Yesterday he could have played instead of Lingard (not that Lingard coming on for 5 minutes mattered but hey) or could have come on for Matic, if Fred switched to play the defensive shield instead.
EDIT: All of that is quite moot though. It's clear he's not trusted in the slightest by Ole. In any capacity.
It's the common way to show goals and assists. Black balls are goals, green assists.
Could barely get minutes with allowed 5 subs. Good luck with 3 subs format.
They don't play the same position, you can't replace matic with him.
Surely now is the time to give him a run of games and some confidence, let’s see what he can do.
I was asked by an Ajax fan about Van de Beek and said I hope we sell him this summer because he won't play.
It's crystal clear our current manager doesn't rate him but this club is too slow and reactive to move him on swiftly to ensure the best outcome for both parties.
This transfer reminds me massively of Herrera. Van Gaal would not play him and most of the fan base saw it for a stupid decision given the quality of our midfield at the time. You had some smartasses saying Herrera was not good enough but he was excellent for both Jose and OGS.
I think the same will happen here despite a vocal minority talking absolute nonsense about him not being good enough when he's barely played. A new manager or a different club and he'll thrive.
It's crystal clear our current manager doesn't rate him but this club is too slow and reactive to move him on swiftly to ensure the best outcome for both parties.
This transfer reminds me massively of Herrera. Van Gaal would not play him and most of the fan base saw it for a stupid decision given the quality of our midfield at the time. You had some smartasses saying Herrera was not good enough but he was excellent for both Jose and OGS.
I think the same will happen here despite a vocal minority talking absolute nonsense about him not being good enough when he's barely played. A new manager or a different club and he'll thrive.
We bought him for 40m or something is not like he came here for free. Something is not right with this one it stinks of Ole not asking for this guy.
Maybe if Ole uses him the board wont buy someone else?
we needed a goal…why would VDB be above Jesse in that scenario? I thought VDB was a CM?
Surely we should be finding a solution for this guy to go on loan or be sold?
It made no sense at the time, and clearly Ole never wanted him and still doesn't fancy him.
It made no sense at the time, and clearly Ole never wanted him and still doesn't fancy him.
Probably Ole. When he was managing Molde they played Ajax, and he said he was very impressed with him and always had him on his radar after that.
I find it interesting that Ole said VDB had/has his own fitness and training regime.
Suggests to me that he either isn't in the right physical condition or the club still feel he is too lightweight for a CM role in the premiership.
Ole has suggested that there's more to come from him this season, I don't see the issue with him not getting minutes, we need our Manager to be ruthless, and if he isn't showing what's needed in training or isn't in the right condition then he shouldn't play.
Again, don't see anything wrong with that.
Suggests to me that he either isn't in the right physical condition or the club still feel he is too lightweight for a CM role in the premiership.
Ole has suggested that there's more to come from him this season, I don't see the issue with him not getting minutes, we need our Manager to be ruthless, and if he isn't showing what's needed in training or isn't in the right condition then he shouldn't play.
Again, don't see anything wrong with that.
Him being a CM is pure fantasy. It's people on the cafe hoping he'll turn into a CM to solve our midfield problem.
He's a #10 and always has been. He can't play CM.
This is turning out a historically bad signing, especially with the money we paid. Hope he gets his chances and turns it around though.
I'm not sure what the board is smoking. Sell the lad if he's not in our manager's plans. OGS in no way has shown that he would play Donny regularly so why not sell him while he still has some value? fecking hoarder mentality at the club.
I mean personally, I think what happened was the club realised they couldn't afford Sancho last summer so just made a random purchase, maybe with the vague logic that he may be a decent backup if Pogba left.
He was always going to spend most of his time on the bench though.
He was always going to spend most of his time on the bench though.
40m down the drain
Ole won't ever play him again
Ole won't ever play him again
I'm not sure why people were clamouring him to come in over Matic as the guy doesn't play deep and we eventually brought on McT to sit there instead who's obviously better at the role. VdB has always been our Pogba/Fernandes replacement and neither needed to come off yesterday. I 'spose you could ask why Lingard got the nod but he doesn't sit in the middle like VdB. You could see him drifting out wide a lot when he came on.
Still an enigma but I don't think the decisions in yesterday's match were anything major.
Still an enigma but I don't think the decisions in yesterday's match were anything major.
We are two games in guys... Chill the feck out. The kid will get his time this season. It's not really weird Ole preferred to give Jesse some minutes over him, he was literally the hottest thing in the league last spring.
I think the main problem is that we decided to sign him and Bruno and then Bruno showed that we basically can't do without him in the team and well that means almost no play time for Donny.