Would you sack or keep Ole? (Poll reopened)

Sack or Keep OLE?


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Karlos PFC

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442 pages long thread :eek:

Thank god Mourinho left and took his toxicity with him :lol:
 

reddevil80

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Is it just me or is this thread just a moot point now? Whether season plays to a finish or it is finished already, Ole has kept his job and goes on into another season. I think this thread has run its course and will be back up and running next season.
 

Amir

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lysglimt

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Just a thought but that would work out as about £15mil per year.

Anyway, although I am not a fan of Poch, he didn’t really spend much. Fortunately for him he already had some very decent players in most positions. (Most of them improved under his coaching and he deserves credit for that. But also, a lot of our players have improved under Ole and I’d like to see him get wider credit too.)

True Ole has had a lot more money to spend (Utd always spend) and that is part of his job which he has done very well. It is not very useful to say “Imagine Ole working with £15m a year” because the Utd job involves spending - on the right players. My reluctance to join the clamour for Poch is my doubt about his overall management, not his coaching. Ole is showing an aptitude for managing this big club.
One of the main problems with Poch is that he spent it poorly. Sure he signed some really good players - but he wasted well over £100 million on crap
 

hmchan

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One of the main problems with Poch is that he spent it poorly. Sure he signed some really good players - but he wasted well over £100 million on crap
That's another major concern if we hire Pochettino as manager. It's undeniable that we are now a spending club and I couldn't imagine how he would invest all those money on.
 

lysglimt

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That's another major concern if we hire Pochettino as manager. It's undeniable that we are now a spending club and I couldn't imagine how he would invest all those money on.
There is that - and Before someone questions my comment on him wasting £100 million

£10 mill on Llorente
£20 mill on Aurier - who isn't crap - but certainly not good enough
£17 mill on Janssen - oh dear
£11 mill on Nkoudou
£30 mill on Sissoko
£40 mill on Sanchez - he isn't bad but after 3 years at the club, he doesn't look like he will ever be good enough

in addiiton Lukas Moura has been good but not great - for close to £30 million

For more or less the same amount of Money we signed Maguire, AWB, Bruno and Dan James
 

Harry Harries

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There is that - and Before someone questions my comment on him wasting £100 million

£10 mill on Llorente
£20 mill on Aurier - who isn't crap - but certainly not good enough
£17 mill on Janssen - oh dear
£11 mill on Nkoudou
£30 mill on Sissoko
£40 mill on Sanchez - he isn't bad but after 3 years at the club, he doesn't look like he will ever be good enough

in addiiton Lukas Moura has been good but not great - for close to £30 million

For more or less the same amount of Money we signed Maguire, AWB, Bruno and Dan James
Sissoko?! A bad first couple of years but I think he's seen as being a really useful player who's had some big moments for them. As hit and miss as Spurs have been in the market recently, we have been as equally uninspiring (with AWB, Maguire and Bruno looking like a potential corner turned), though with a far higher spend.
 

devilish

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There is that - and Before someone questions my comment on him wasting £100 million

£10 mill on Llorente
£20 mill on Aurier - who isn't crap - but certainly not good enough
£17 mill on Janssen - oh dear
£11 mill on Nkoudou
£30 mill on Sissoko
£40 mill on Sanchez - he isn't bad but after 3 years at the club, he doesn't look like he will ever be good enough

in addiiton Lukas Moura has been good but not great - for close to £30 million

For more or less the same amount of Money we signed Maguire, AWB, Bruno and Dan James
Pochs had previously lamented of him being a glorified head coach which kind of defeats your argument here. I can't see Levy relinquish his powers over something so expensive like transfers are especially at a time when they were either building their stadium or soon afterwards. He certainly won't be afraid telling his manager to either go for a cheaper option or shut up and do his job with no complains whatsoever
 

SAFMUTD

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There is that - and Before someone questions my comment on him wasting £100 million

£10 mill on Llorente
£20 mill on Aurier - who isn't crap - but certainly not good enough
£17 mill on Janssen - oh dear
£11 mill on Nkoudou
£30 mill on Sissoko
£40 mill on Sanchez - he isn't bad but after 3 years at the club, he doesn't look like he will ever be good enough

in addiiton Lukas Moura has been good but not great - for close to £30 million

For more or less the same amount of Money we signed Maguire, AWB, Bruno and Dan James
Damn thats an awful record, bar Moura and Sanchez all the rest are really poor.

i guess the grass is always greener on the otherside but I never thought Spurs had wasted so much on failed players.
 

Bestie07

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I was looking at the league table for the 2015-16 season and noticed that Liverpool only got 60 points that season. It took them less than 2 years from that stage to reaching the Champions League final. I hope our team's progression follows the same path.
 

Forevergiggs1

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I was looking at the league table for the 2015-16 season and noticed that Liverpool only got 60 points that season. It took them less than 2 years from that stage to reaching the Champions League final. I hope our team's progression follows the same path.
Having one of the top managers on the planet is why Liverpool have been so successful. Whether or not Ole has the same potential remains to be seen. Without wanting to sound too pessimistic but I don't think we'll be making any champions league finals in the next couple of years.
 

lysglimt

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Compare what we have today - with what we had 18 months ago - and it should be a no-brainer. Maybe he will prove not to be good enough to take United to the top, but at the moment he is making the job a hell of a lot easier for whoever is in charge in 12 months.
 

mancave bear

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Ole have done a fantastic job. We have struggled a little against teams who park the bus, but with Bruno and Pogba (or another creative midfielder), this want be a problem anymore. Ole have got great results against the best teams, showing his tactical skills. With 3-4 new top players, I belive we can reach the champions league finals and challenge for the Premier League title. The way he is building the team, it looks like we will stay among the top teams for a long time : )
 

romufc

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There has been alot of people giving Ole criticism, I did too but he is slowly changed my mind somewhat.

If we look back at the team that he took over, we had no clue where that team was going or even when we would compete with the best.

Since then, he has made ruthless decisions off the field by getting rid of players and bringing players in.

Fast forward 18 months, we have a team with the addition of 1/2 players could have one of the best attacks in Europe.

Ole has made mistakes, he has learnt from them and I feel he has improved as a manager.

It is a shame alot of people have made their mind up about him and keep ignoring the job he has done.
 

Paul_Scholes18

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I don't think he is the man to take us to the top . Although not sure we should change manager in the middle of the Corona crisis. I guess he knows the players so maybe better to keep him for next season. Not sure how much damage failing to get into CL will cost us though.

I am not convinced by our transfer strategy under Ole. Still not sure what we can get in the Corona market anyway. Bruno seems to be a top signing so maybe he will get it right more in the future.
 

TrustInJanuzaj

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Are you serious? Out of all out managers since Fergie, he's had the best transfer strategy.

For once, our signings are coming good.
That's the guy that thinks Lukaku is world class, no wonder he doesn't like our strategy. Clueless.
 

romufc

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That's the guy that thinks Lukaku is world class, no wonder he doesn't like our strategy. Clueless.
That says it all. I think fans need to get grip of reality here. We are rebuilding - one that most thought would take 2/3 years, OIe could potentially do it in 18 months.

There is not a signing he has made that I would complain about so far. Even Ighalo and James.
 

TrustInJanuzaj

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That says it all. I think fans need to get grip of reality here. We are rebuilding - one that most thought would take 2/3 years, OIe could potentially do it in 18 months.

There is not a signing he has made that I would complain about so far. Even Ighalo and James.
I completely agree with you fella.
 

RedPed

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Ole have done a fantastic job. We have struggled a little against teams who park the bus, but with Bruno and Pogba (or another creative midfielder), this want be a problem anymore. Ole have got great results against the best teams, showing his tactical skills. With 3-4 new top players, I belive we can reach the champions league finals and challenge for the Premier League title. The way he is building the team, it looks like we will stay among the top teams for a long time : )
Trouble is people want it all now, now, now. There's no arguing that Ole has massively improved United and although rival fans may not openly admit it, they wouldn't fancy coming up against us. I know Spurs were expecting a hammering just before the lockdown hit.

Considering where other other teams are squadwise, bar perhaps LIverpool, we're also in a good position with just a few more additions needed to push on. Apart from the Pogba conundrum, we don't really have any major issues to resolve playerwise. It's looking good and hopefully we can just continue the momentum pre-COVID. But then again everyone's in the same boat.
 

Van Piorsing

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His long stay here is strongly dependant on top of United's chain of command. Bruno arrived bit late, need to keep on with tempo, City or Pool won't wait on us.
 

romufc

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Considering where other other teams are squadwise, bar perhaps LIverpool, we're also in a good position with just a few more additions needed to push on. Apart from the Pogba conundrum, we don't really have any major issues to resolve playerwise. It's looking good and hopefully we can just continue the momentum pre-COVID. But then again everyone's in the same boat.
I agree. Alot of teams have question marks in their squad. As you say apart from Pogba, the biggest one I see is should we stick with Martial or not.

If we look at City, they need a CB? maybe a striker? maybe a Sane replacement ?

Liverpool as well, alot of their fans want a signing, the excitement of a new player, but they want a Werner, Sancho type player.

Chelsea have a settled team but lack a superstar IMO, will Tammy / Mount keep their form up? A LB? CB?

Arsenal have the Auby conundrum and lack quality in MF

Spurs - The squad needs additions.
 

Paul_Scholes18

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Are you serious? Out of all out managers since Fergie, he's had the best transfer strategy.

For once, our signings are coming good.
We can agree to disagree with that. Our position has been pretty low in the league. The players have been up and down a lot.
Our best players pre Bruno has been Rashford who has been here for a long time.

Things can improve and it did look much better near the end. Still it has not been overall good enough. You can say that it is down to coaching rather than the players we bought.
Still not seeing great value in those we got in. Maguire has been average and poor a lot. Wan Bissaka lacks in attack although has improved near the end in that area. James started well, but has struggled more as the season moved on.
 

Paul_Scholes18

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What?! Maguire, AWB, James, Fernandes, Ighalo... allowing for how cheap James was, that's a 100% success rate!
Given that we are 5th I would say no. We can all blame other players like Lingard who barely start, but these guys have not been amazing and all have big flaws. Which are fine, but people tend to look at only the positives for the new guys. Bruno has only played like 5 league games. 3 wins, 2 draws and being very good in most of them is a good record. Still it is too small of a sample to judge them. Ighalo as a backup did well in the cups too, but also not that many games.
The main problem I have is that we waited to invest in the attack that needed investment the most. That do not give me confidence for future signings being in the right areas.
 

Brightonian

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Given that we are 5th I would say no. We can all blame other players like Lingard who barely start, but these guys have not been amazing and all have big flaws. Which are fine, but people tend to look at only the positives for the new guys. Bruno has only played like 5 league games. 3 wins, 2 draws and being very good in most of them is a good record. Still it is too small of a sample to judge them. Ighalo as a backup did well in the cups too, but also not that many games.
The main problem I have is that we waited to invest in the attack that needed investment the most. That do not give me confidence for future signings being in the right areas.
That's not how football works. You don't assess a handful of signings by looking at whether their team has immediately won the league. You assess them by looking at their performances. All five have, to different degrees, been successful. There is more to come from all of them, too.
 

Paul_Scholes18

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That's not how football works. You don't assess a handful of signings by looking at whether their team has immediately won the league. You assess them by looking at their performances. All five have, to different degrees, been successful. There is more to come from all of them, too.
Let us agree to disagree regarding the performances so far. It is a team effort and we have not been good enough as a team. They are all not bad players obviously. We have a good squad. Although I am not sure they was the right types of signings we needed to be doing to get back towards the top. Before Bruno came we fighted around 5-10 in the league.
Bruno probably is a player for the very top. I have been very impressed by him, but it is a small sample. Will be interesting to see him with Pogba and if that can work.

How much more to come remains to be seen. I think this is the Maguire we got and he will always be flawed and not the quickest. Wan Bissaka can certainly improve his attack. Still he will always be a defensive fullback and Shaw is not the most attacking one either. James can certainly improve too and should function as a squad player at least.
 

romufc

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We can all blame other players like Lingard who barely start,
The players we say are not good enough are Lingard and Perreira.

Lingard has played 35 times this season and Perreira 41. Only Maguire 45 has played more than Perreira.

How much more to come remains to be seen. I think this is the Maguire we got and he will always be flawed and not the quickest. Wan Bissaka can certainly improve his attack. Still he will always be a defensive fullback and Shaw is not the most attacking one either. James can certainly improve too and should function as a squad player at least
Maguire will be flawed? in which way?

AWB is 21 and is the best defensive RB in the league, he will improve.

James will improve, he was never thought to have been a first choice.

So I am not sure how they are unconvincing?
 

Paul_Scholes18

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The players we say are not good enough are Lingard and Perreira.

Lingard has played 35 times this season and Perreira 41. Only Maguire 45 has played more than Perreira.



Maguire will be flawed? in which way?

AWB is 21 and is the best defensive RB in the league, he will improve.

James will improve, he was never thought to have been a first choice.

So I am not sure how they are unconvincing?
Maguires reacton time is pretty low. He gets turned pretty easily at times. If we want to play more expansive it could be a problem with less shielding from midfield if Pogba plays over Mctominay/Fred.
AWB is probably not the best right back in the league. He has a long way to go. Pereira, Walker and TAA has been better. Azpilicueta as a right back maybe too.
In terms of pure defending he is up there with his speed and power. Although he needs to read the game better at times.
We need a right winger for sure if James is not going to improve much. Greenwood might step up too hopefully.

The problem is not with what we got, but what we have not got. We still lack attacking options even if we now got a number 10 in Bruno.
 

He'sRaldo

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Even if you think he's the right man, given our showing this season, it's fair enough if there are people who don't.

What to me is peculiar is, I sometimes feel like the rebuild talk gets a bit into brainwashing territory. To the point where people are comfortable going seasons without trophies or even CL football, all because of the rebuild. We can't just drop all standards due to a rebuild we're not 100% sure will work, that's a sure-fire way of turning into Arsenal.

And the other aspect of the rebuild talk is emphasizing passion, work rate, etc over talent. I think they're equally important, and one shouldn't be viewed as overtly superior to the other. Looking at our season, despite the passion and work rate the players have shown, if we're honest very few have shown genuine consistent quality, and that's something which was evident when real quality briefly entered the pitch in the form of Bruno and Pogba.

With all that said, I'm still on the fence. There have been a lot of mistakes and lucky breaks for Ole, but there's also a huge amount of promise in what he's doing. He's gone far in both the FA Cup and Europa League, and we may have very well won both had the season not been cut short. As a fan of Ole, the club, and the whole concept really, I'm more inclined to be on the hopeful side... but not yet brazenly hopeful. Obviously he'll stay until the next season, but there needs to be some consistency at that point. We can't be in an inconsistent rebuild forever.
 

romufc

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Maguires reacton time is pretty low. He gets turned pretty easily at times. If we want to play more expansive it could be a problem with less shielding from midfield if Pogba plays over Mctominay/Fred.
AWB is probably not the best right back in the league. He has a long way to go. Pereira, Walker and TAA has been better. Azpilicueta as a right back maybe too.
In terms of pure defending he is up there with his speed and power. Although he needs to read the game better at times.
We need a right winger for sure if James is not going to improve much. Greenwood might step up too hopefully.

The problem is not with what we got, but what we have not got. We still lack attacking options even if we now got a number 10 in Bruno.
I think Maguire will grow into his position at United, likewise AWB. We will see how they fair when we get the season starts back up, and we can judge them then.
 

Paul_Scholes18

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I think Maguire will grow into his position at United, likewise AWB. We will see how they fair when we get the season starts back up, and we can judge them then.
Certainly should keep them and hope things improve. It did look better in the last 4 games after the break for everyone. Maybe we worked on something that helped or it was just getting some rest and Bruno into the team that gave us a boost. Maguire getting some goals should probably help his confidence too. Our poor set pieces have been interesting given that it should help having Maguire around for them.