Di Maria's angel
Captain of Moanchester United
@Twigginater You might want to read this -- http://www.bbmh.manchester.ac.uk/cmhs/research/centreforsuicideprevention/
Sure, but they were working under different conditions. Fergie could have got 3 years without winning the league and do crap in Europe, and no-one would have think to sack him? If Mourinho didn't win the league or UCL in any season, there was a good chance he was going to be sacked. You understand the difference? One was brought here to built the club, the other was hired from those clubs to win trophies? Win trophies even in a higher rate than Fergie was doing.Not how I see it. I see it as Mourinho got the most out of an aging squad, knowing that in the future it would cost these players form and fitness, and then resigned knowing he couldn't build the team back up.
One of Ferguson's most important qualities was the fact he always planned for the future. Not Mourinho. Fergie would give squad players and the like a game and get them ready for the future. Mourinho relies on his chosen players, sacrifices others (Lukaku, De Bruyne etc) and doesn't rotate at all. You end up with a team that physically and mentally can't cope any more.
Oh for sure I don't want Giggs anywhere near the manager's job. If it were between both, I would take Jose only for his experience and the fact he's won everything. Giggs needs to go away as I've said a million times, prove himself elsewhere. It would not be good for him to be thrown into this job - and worse for us.I'd rather him calling the shots rather than giggs and rooney calling them, just like how they lead a mutiny for having chips? Yeah right, makes me so wanted a stronf manager to tell them it's my way or the highway
The team wasn't supposed to be built back, Moratti had no intention of spending money. Mourinho's and Inter's ambitions were completely different.Not how I see it. I see it as Mourinho got the most out of an aging squad, knowing that in the future it would cost these players form and fitness, and then resigned knowing he couldn't build the team back up.
He's a lot less attack-minded than Hitler, that's for sure.
Pathetic.Ramshock said:Not one mention on Soccer Saturday
Mate no offense but you were posting the other day about not bothering watching the Stoke game, whereas I paid 45.00 to be there. There's a level of difference in our support to the club and I think I'm just more interested in the idea of Manchester United as some amazing romantic thing in my life whereas you obviously have different priorities.@Twigginater You might want to read this -- http://www.bbmh.manchester.ac.uk/cmhs/research/centreforsuicideprevention/
Yeah Mourinho's ambitions were "Oh shit I don't have unlimited transfer funds.... I better feck off without having to deal with this mess."The team wasn't supposed to be built back, Moratti had no intention of spending money. Mourinho's and Inter's ambitions were completely different.
He did finish 11th once, but my point isnt that he did.Fergie never dropped anywhere near as low
Well you can mock him for not winning trophies for years until recently, but Wenger did well to survive through the rise of City and Chelsea. A period which included his quality young players signing for rivals- not because of Arsene being shit, but because they were skint after building the new stadium.And he has been doing oh so well for Arsenal.
And of course, Wenger is an astute manager when it comes to signing players, which can be proven both from the number of trophies he has been winning in the past decade, and from the quality of the young players he has signed.
Inter got rid of Sneijder because of his wage, they literally forced him out of the club, it's not about unlimited fund, it's about a club who had no intention of replacing their retiring key players and on top of that wanted to get rid of all the big wages and valuable players.Yeah Mourinho's ambitions were "Oh shit I don't have unlimited transfer funds.... I better feck off without having to deal with this mess."
Soccer Saturday has become a bit of a joke of a programme now. I stopped watching it a long time ago.Not one mention on Soccer Saturday
He finished 11th before he made Utd into the force it became. But afterwards such was his consistency it was considered a crisis when we finished 3rd.He did finish 11th once, but my point isnt that he did.
Its that he was written off too. It got really bad at the time, with the 'shredding his legacy at every turn' article being the apex of it.
Yeah I know you were joking but I honestly completely forgot about my tagline all for gigsWhite text.
I hope it too. WOuld be very disappointed if he doesn't give at least some chances to Januzaj, Pereira, CBJ (English) and Wilson (English). I think that it would be more difficult for Wilson, cause Mourinho likes experienced strikers, but still.I hope he utilises the academy as there are talented players coming through (Even English ones, believe it or not Revan), but it's not an absolute deal breaker like some of his more aggressive actions in the past would be for me.
Perez maybe.. but he struggled with other major political players in the team, like Casillas, Ramos and Ronaldo. Galactico power is strong at the club. At United once Rooney goes.. no such issue.Perez did not interfere with him at all. He gave him control over almost everything, and fired Valdano for him. Mourinho had far more control over at Madrid than any coach has had in recent years.
Because he has a tendency to fall out with the entire squad which is a tad different than falling out with a player or two every now and then.SAF consistently fell out with plenty of his players and most of us accepted he knew best.
Why the double standards with Jose?
Maybe Mourinho will be able to tell us how to get twice what they're worth when we sell our players, rather than half.Nah he will just feck off back to Spain, if Mourinho gets appointed. I wonder how much of our £37m we will get back, my guess is less than half.
HeadshotMate no offense but you were posting the other day about not bothering watching the Stoke game, whereas I paid 45.00 to be there. There's a level of difference in our support to the club and I think I'm just more interested in the idea of Manchester United as some amazing romantic thing in my life whereas you obviously have different priorities.
Now that I can live with.Maybe Mourinho will be able to tell us how to get twice what they're worth when we sell our players, rather than half.
As regards the vote, it's not a straight Yes/No answer. Not happy, no, but I would accept that now he's probably our best option.
Good for you Katie I am all in. José is our man.Ah screw this, I'm in. Just behave, Jose.
You must be new here.Have I missed something? Everyone seems to be talking about this as though he's definitely going to be our new manager but all I've seen is a report on the BBC that there have been talks. Is everyone just assuming this is fact or was there something more concrete?
Even in other threads about players etc, it's "if Mourinho wants him" and the like....
you might have a point if we're not that far behind, say 2nd or 3rd after Fergie, but desperate times needs drastic measures. The next 2-3 years will decide the fate of Manchester United, whether it'll become THE United or another Liverpool in the making.Oh for sure I don't want Giggs anywhere near the manager's job. If it were between both, I would take Jose only for his experience and the fact he's won everything. Giggs needs to go away as I've said a million times, prove himself elsewhere. It would not be good for him to be thrown into this job - and worse for us.
Also, Giggs has an incestuous business relationship with Lim and probably would be very easily influenced by Mendes - even if indirectly. I mean, Giggs and co92 are no match for those kinds of bastards. I can also see Giggs putting his friends in key positions behind the scenes whether or not they have the skill to do the job. So appointing him would be bad in more ways than one. In effect, it would lead to Mendes/Lim or whoever else is co92 business partners put their mits into United and bleed it dry whilst probably leaving us with dross like at Valencia (as I've said).
My wish is that we give no manager too much power from now onwards and that there is someone else there that they will be accountable to, whilst that person looks to move on our footballing set up. That's all I'm trying to say. And I don't trust Jose to do this with integrity.
You won't be around when he's no longer manager. If he joined another club you'd be going and discussing that team. The rest of us will still be around and caring about Utd while you won't.No, he wasn't the manager since the early nineties, was he?
Yes and No. I joined this site because I was very happy that the greatest club in England hired a great manager, it was an audicious choice that fit the club and I felt like giving and discussing a bit of background information on the new manager as I'm quite familiar with his work. Appearantly this was appreciated because I got suddenly and prematurely promoted from the newbie forum and I continued oosting.
What players were rumoured to have caused problems for Moyes (and Van Gaal if there were any)? I remember reading about Ferdinand and Giggs, but Ferdinand is gone and Mourinho will probably get a different assistant (if I were Mourinho, I would not want him as my assistant). Were there any other players? All club have these types of players that have power in the dressing room and who like to throw their weight around. If Mourinho can start the job without these types of players, then he will be in a very good position. Not many managers get to start working at a new club with all of the heavyweights in the dressing room removed, even managers of small clubs have to deal with such players. That said, when some big players in the dressing room are removed, others take their place. When Raul and Guti were at the club, Ramos did not have much power in the dressing room. When they left, he took their place.Perez maybe.. but he struggled with other major political players in the team, like Casillas, Ramos and Ronaldo. Galactico power is strong at the club. At United once Rooney goes.. no such issue.
Fergie wanted to keep Pogba, so not really the same.Even under Fergie we lost Pogba, Rossi, Pique to another clubs... All of them have been doing well.. Rossi been unlucky with injures tho.
Since when did solid evidence stand in the way of the caf declaring the second coming of Christ?Have I missed something? Everyone seems to be talking about this as though he's definitely going to be our new manager but all I've seen is a report on the BBC that there have been talks. Is everyone just assuming this is fact or was there something more concrete?
Even in other threads about players etc, it's "if Mourinho wants him" and the like....
They are?I guess we've got carried away then even the BBC are now saying it's just a rumour...
Moyes had all of SAFs squad intact. RVP, Rooney even someone like Hernandez had an ego. We had Evra, Rio, Giggs and the likes of Neville and Scholes off the pitch.The problem was every star player we had was past their peak and yet had a huge ego... so Moyes was put in a horrible position considering he had zero experience of dealing with that calibre of players.What players were rumoured to have caused problems for Moyes (and Van Gaal if there were any)? I remember reading about Ferdinand and Giggs, but Ferdinand is gone and Mourinho will probably get a different assistant (if I were Mourinho, I would not want him as my assistant). Were there any other players? All club have these types of players that have power in the dressing room and who like to throw their weight around. If Mourinho can start the job without these types of players, then he will be in a very good position. Not many managers get to start working at a new club with all of the heavyweights in the dressing room removed, even managers of small clubs have to deal with such players. That said, when some big players in the dressing room are removed, others take their place. When Raul and Guti were at the club, Ramos did not have much power in the dressing room. When they left, he took their place.
I dunno, the kind of cloud Mourinho tends to leave in his wake when things go wrong might just put us right back where we started post-fergie. A one-season wonder wouldn't stop people (those within football) looking at us like we are in terminal decline, we need some kind of consistent success over the longer term.I'll settle for one league title and him feckin' off. The one massive thing for me is somebody... anybody winning our first post-Fergie title. Once we know we're not doing another 26 year barren spell, we'll be fine.
Chelsea were in that bad state, that they reached the finals of UCL in the same season he left, with virtually every player being a Mourinho player.
He left Madrid in a terrible position. The team was that bad that they won UCL the following season.
And apparently he left Inter in a mess. Winning a treble means that the team was in a mess.
The only team he really left in a bad position is Chelsea now. But the legends grow, and Twigginater will find himself supporting a club who wins trophies, but hating their manager. It would be fun.
Exactly. As much as a lot of the fans are wary of his antics, and rightly so, we didn't really have much of a choice. He wants to manage us, there's no other real alternatives esp once Ancellotti went to bayern. We could try poch but that would be a riskier option esp given pep is going to be there across the town.The club are pushed into a corner with City signing Pep. The club cannot afford any more experiments. Although I will not enjoy his antics and playing style with me being a traditionalist and an old romantic (4-4-2), I don't think United have a choice and there's no one out there with as good a CV and stature as Mourinho.
Again, my main point was to emphasize how Fergie came back from being written off , and facinf a massive low point in his career which included being knocked out of the UCL group stages in 2005, to taking lessons from that and going on to create his best ever side.He finished 11th before he made Utd into the force it became. But afterwards such was his consistency it was considered a crisis when we finished 3rd.
Traditions has nothing to do with the matter. Having your own youths in the team makes sense irrespective of tradition. It's a cheap way of bringing talent to the team and considering that they tend to be more loyal to the average mercenary, youth talent are great in terms of players retentionYouth is part of the traditions of the club, some supporters (like me) enjoy seeing youth team players come through more than signing big names. You shouldn't be that surprised by this considering the clubs history is built around the busby babes etc. It's not about blindly supporting any young player that gets a shot. For me it's that it is better to at least start with positive intent and support them rather than knock them from the off.
For what it's worth I disagree with you on Lingard, I think he is going to make it. The jury is still out for me on McNair but again I'd rather support the lad than knock him from the get go. As I said earlier to @devilish, I remember him knocking P Nev in much the same way he is knocking McNair. I think most would agree P Nev was a great servant during his time here and had a decent career in the end.
As I say, I just don't think the default position on youth should be 'they aren't good enough'. The nature of a young player is that they probably aren't good enough. But it's much more rewarding as a supporter to at least give youth a chance and SUPPORT them I think. Every team has to have its journeymen. There's nothing wrong with that.