Drifter
American
- Joined
- Jan 27, 2004
- Messages
- 68,403
This won't go down well with hard Brexiteers
It should have been a multi-stage referendum*, like New Zealand did for their fecking flag, but we didn't do for the fundamental direction the country takes.Well yeah a referendum based on 3 choices is weirdly unheard of. So agree there it would be quite unique. I was arguing more along the third option to say that revisiting Brexit as a whole isn’t completely out of the question, even if democracy and all that had its say.
That's the thing, it doesnt seem to be going down as badly as it should. Im sure the reaction is just a bit delayed, Im sure there is a WhatsApp Brexit group somewhere that is pinging furiously right now as MPs plot their resistance. But if you look at the newspapers, it seems like they are pretending this is something other than total capitulation. Im finding it a bit disconcerting to be honest.This won't go down well with hard Brexiteers
Yeah it is weird. The Sun currently going with "hard won" and the Mail with "breakthrough", which is just pro-May propaganda.That's the thing, it doesnt seem to be going down as badly as it should. Im sure the reaction is just a bit delayed, Im sure there is a WhatsApp Brexit group somewhere that is pinging furiously right now as MPs plot their resistance. But if you look at the newspapers, it seems like they are pretending this is something other than total capitulation. Im finding it a bit disconcerting to be honest.
Farage as called it pathetic at least .Most papers are just relieved that some progress as been made .When it get's digested then you will see the anger from hardlinersThat's the thing, it doesnt seem to be going down as badly as it should. Im sure the reaction is just a bit delayed, Im sure there is a WhatsApp Brexit group somewhere that is pinging furiously right now as MPs plot their resistance. But if you look at the newspapers, it seems like they are pretending this is something other than total capitulation. Im finding it a bit disconcerting to be honest.
The focus is just on moving forward rather than context or quality. You have to wonder if they purposefully left it til the deadline so they could proclaim a victory.Yeah it is weird. The Sun currently going with "hard won" and the Mail with "breakthrough", which is just pro-May propaganda.
Yep this is still a shitshow though, essentially will be worse off then we were before. It's very much better than a hard Brexit but the politicians who ran on Brexit have put us in a terrible situation.Any hardliners causing disruption now aren't going to win any public favour by destabilising things at this stage. I'd imagine most sane people are relieved to see progress towards a deal which doesn't destroy the economy.
The headline is all that matters. The reading age of the Sun readership averages at 8 years old - and I'm not making that up.The focus is just on moving forward rather than context or quality. You have to wonder if they purposefully left it til the deadline so they could proclaim a victory.
They'll soon change the narrative at the end of the day the papers as always play to their readership. Most of them don't understand the implications of Brexit and explaining it would be a little too difficult
I just hope there is a clause hidden somewhere in Phase 2 that enables the UK to reenter at the previous terms once the old guard of Little Englanders have died off.Yep this is still a shitshow though, essentially will be worse off then we were before. It's very much better than a hard Brexit but the politicians who ran on Brexit have put us in a terrible situation.
They were always going to be.So - we can all live, work and study in Europe, and Europeans can do the same here - that's great. However, this no-change-at-all is costing us billions of pounds and we won't have representation in the European Parliament.
All those who voted "leave" because they wanted the Bulgarians to go home will be disappointed.
Is that the bottom line?So - we can all live, work and study in Europe, and Europeans can do the same here - that's great. However, this no-change-at-all is costing us billions of pounds and we won't have representation in the European Parliament.
All those who voted "leave" because they wanted the Bulgarians to go home will be disappointed.
I don't think they've gone that far, it appears its just citizens currently living in the UK/EU (or up until the exit date) with exceptions made for family members joining later.So - we can all live, work and study in Europe, and Europeans can do the same here - that's great.
The eurosceptics might feel their cause would be in better hands with Corbyn and McDonnell, they have been anti-EU for a lot longer than May has.I don't think they've gone that far, it appears its just citizens currently living in the UK/EU (or up until the exit date) with exceptions made for family members joining later.
It's an interesting trap May has laid for the eurosceptics, they must be furious right now, but if they rebel then they'll almost certainly destroy the government and force an election. That's basically handing power to Labour and then they'll probably end up with even less than they have now. It'll be interesting to see whether they still retain enough sense to keep their mouths shut or whether the eurosceptic extremism that has divided the party for decades will prove too strong for them to resist.
If I'm not mistaken, it's only for the ones that are already in the UK or on the continent. For the rest, it will depend on the deal, even though the lack of Irish border will almost inevitably lead to a full single market adhesion and therefore all freedoms will be enforced.Is that the bottom line?
Probably will be acceptable given not all EU members are part of Schengen. It's also in the EU's best interest for a soft Brexit as well.By the way, if I'm not mistaken all EEA/EFTA members are also Schengen members. I wonder if the current members are willing to offer an exemption if the UK were to join them.
It's not about the EU though, the question is whether Norway, Iceland, Switzerland and Liechtenstein are fine with it.Probably will be acceptable given not all EU members are part of Schengen. It's also in the EU's best interest for a soft Brexit as well.
You think this is a stunning deal?Stunned silence in this thread this morning....
It'd be a foolish risk. Labour voters split about 2/3 in favour of remain. Any Labour leader who tried to push for hard Brexit would be basically shooting themselves in the face.The eurosceptics might feel their cause would be in better hands with Corbyn and McDonnell, they have been anti-EU for a lot longer than May has.
The fact that such an enormously complex and heavily nuanced topic was dumbed down to a simple one line question with one word responses was so unimaginably stupid it really beggars belief.It should have been a multi-stage referendum*, like New Zealand did for their fecking flag, but we didn't do for the fundamental direction the country takes.
[*So the first stage lists a number of Brexit options and the public votes for their preferred one, Remain isn't listed at this stage. The second stage pits the winning option vs remain]
I guess only they know, Schengen is not a presumption of EFTA as far as I am aware. In any case this is a particular special scenario, so no idea what kind of deal we will end up with.It's not about the EU though, the question is whether Norway, Iceland, Switzerland and Liechtenstein are fine with it.
There is no point. You will have all the rules you had before, pay in money, only now they have no seats on the council and will not receive funding in return.What is the point of brexit to have a soft brexit? Seems like a lot of hassle for no real change apart from some feeling like they've won. Better than a hard one though, so guess I can at least be happy with that.
Well this is still would still be a Brexit. Unless of course we do a full U-turn.Turns out Brexit didnt mean Brexit after all.
Imagine if on Friday morning there is a breakthrough and the Irish Border issue is resolved which no matter how they word it basically means the UK remains in the Customs Union, then what..
Turns out Brexit didnt mean Brexit after all.