Do we want to lose to City?

[ti vu]

Until the Summer is over, we have no idea who is capable of winning the CL.

For the club right now, for Ole, for confidence going into next season, for feel good factor, for player pull etc etc etc, the best thing is CL football.

Uh no again. Feel good factor in regarding to just to play some CL football is a bubble.

We're not competing for signature of proven world class players with Barcelona, Juventus, Madrid and the likes, especially when now we're having this United way project.

CL football for one season is not the sole reason for players pull!! It's the project. Pogba, Zlatan in Mourinho first season proved. That project failed, but the point can't be mistaken for mere CL qualification.

 

[BeforeKeanetherewasRobson]

Hope the mods can make a poll.

A loss to Shitty could probably cost us a top 4 spot, but also likely prevents the dippers from winning the league.

I am deeply conflicted, can't decide if I want shitty to beat us 1-0 or properly thump us so it helps their goal difference.

Opinions?

any joy on the poll?

It'll start civil war in here

 

[SirAF]

any joy on the poll?

It'll start civil war in here

That’s half the fun though. We need a new civil war soon

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

CL football for one season is not the sole reason for players pull!! It's the project. Pogba, Zlatan in Mourinho first season proved. That project failed, but the point can't be mistaken for mere CL qualification.

CL isn’t the sole reason no, but do you honestly believe Zlatan & Pogba would’ve signed with Solksjaer as gaffer rather than Mourinho cause I fexking don’t.

Whether or not ”confidence” is a bubble, it can take you a long way, like with Ole’s first few months here, or Leicester’s PL win etc etc.

There’s much more chance players (current & recruitment) will believe in Ole & his project if he somehow pulls off what looked like a miracle when he took over.

 

[breakout67]

any joy on the poll?

It'll start civil war in here

It won't be a civil war. It'll be a clear victory for losing. All the contrarians want us to win so we can have a 10% chance of qualifying for the top 4 while the sensible among us acknowledge that top 4 is a stretch and we can try again next season without half a season off.

 

[ti vu]

CL isn’t the sole reason no, but do you honestly believe Zlatan & Pogba would’ve signed with Solksjaer as gaffer rather than Mourinho cause I fexking don’t.

Whether or not ”confidence” is a bubble, it can take you a long way, like with Ole’s first few months here, or Leicester’s PL win etc etc.

There’s much more chance players (current & recruitment) will believe in Ole & his project if he somehow pulls off what looked like a miracle when he took over.

Money played apart, sure. They were subjected to this clause in the first place. Now Pogba happened to change his mind despite not improving in consistency of his performance since. Nothing change in that regard, just the entitlement/ego.

I meant, if he doesn't believe in the project in OGS, then requesting more money(!!!) for the confidence, feel good factor would do jackshite. If they're to believe in the project, then they should know to take responsibility of the consequences as a team member.

Professional footballer ain't that naive to thing there is no possibility of managerial change down the year, unless you're talking about profesionism in the first place!

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

Money played a part, sure.

Professional footballer ain't that naive to thing there is no possibility of managerial change down the year, unless you're talking about profesionism in the first place!

Of course money played a part, but it’s not the sole reason. Both Zlatan & Pogba signed for the one of the best manager’s in the World and I don’t believe for a second that either would join now in the same situation. Both were on massive money & had other options to make mega money.

I don’t think what I’m saying is even controversial, money is massive and we can still get players even outside the CL, but belief in a club/manager/project also plays a part. Players will have more belief in a club run by Ole if he pulls off this miracle so if they are deciding between a few clubs, it might just edge it. Being in the CL is always better than not being in it and the more dominant City are, the weaker we look to everyone.

 

[ti vu]

Of course money played a part, but it’s not the sole reason. Both Zlatan & Pogba signed for the one of the best manager’s in the World and I don’t believe for a second that either would join now in the same situation. Both were on massive money & had other options to make mega money.

I don’t think what I’m saying is even controversial, money is massive and we can still get players even outside the CL, but belief in a club/manager/project also plays a part. Players will have more belief in a club run by Ole if he pulls off this miracle so if they are deciding between a few clubs, it might just edge it. Being in the CL is always better than not being in it and the more dominant City are, the weaker we look to everyone.

This is where the difference between your opinion and some people like me.

The project played a huge role. Mourinho plays a huge role on it, but ultimately is just part of the project. The project theme is different now vs Mourinho's. It's the United way aka chance for young players. You may question what is different between this and Tottenham, Arsenal, Dortmund...? The difference lies with United is associated with ambition, not a nursing ground. (The execution, executive management, is a different talking topic).

It's already a missed chance. We're not looking ultimately at overthrowing City anymore, but a start of another rebuild, new transition. Again, it's the question of club structure which every managerial change is a restart and lack continuity. From the horse mouth itself, we're not into quick fix anymore, so temporatorily out of CL wouldn't affect supposed long term project! The whole CL money only hurts certain somebody.

 

[ROFLUTION]

Yes.

 

[Green_Red]

Can we have a poll? @Damien

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

This is where the difference between your opinion and some people like me.

The project played a huge role. Mourinho plays a huge role on it, but ultimately is just part of the project. The project theme is different now vs Mourinho's. It's the United way aka chance for young players. You may question what is different between this and Tottenham, Arsenal, Dortmund...? The difference lies with United is associated with ambition, not a nursing ground. (The execution, executive management, is a different talking topic).

It's already a missed chance. We're not looking ultimately at overthrowing City anymore, but a start of another rebuild, new transition. Again, it's the question of club structure which every managerial change is a restart and lack continuity. From the horse mouth itself, we're not into quick fix anymore, so temporatorily out of CL wouldn't affect supposed long term project! The whole CL money only hurts certain somebody.

Our opinions on this differ hugely, CL qualification and a great end to the season followed by one massive coup in the transfer market (Koulibaly or Dembele or Sancho for example) could set a ball rolling for the rest of the Summer & help us start the season on a completely different footing.

It’s my opinion that getting that ball rolling as soon as possible is more important than giving too many shits about what Liverpool or City do.

 

[ti vu]

Our opinions on this differ hugely, CL qualification and a great end to the season followed by one massive coup in the transfer market (Koulibaly or Dembele or Sancho for example) could set a ball rolling for the rest of the Summer & help us start the season on a completely different footing.

It’s my opinion that getting that ball rolling as soon as possible is more important than giving too many shits about what Liverpool or City do.

There is no great end to the season just by finish any where in top 4 without a title challenge. Arsenal years of top 4 trophies proved. They even finished 2nd without title challenging not long ago and still on track with their decline!

Massive coup in transfer market is subjective. We did have massive coup of transfer windows during so called failure of past 2 regimes. Didn't help solving the root cause of issue at the club (the commitment to go all the way than shiny new thing bounce). OGS and the news surrounding the club is that we're doing differently in the coming window. Whether it worked is another story, but you're talking about different things.

Liverpool winning the title can place massive pressure on this club. They're our biggest rival despite their barren spell after all. They become successful again do play a part in the scheme of thing. IMO, more than us missing CL football for a season. It would be us comparing to them ocnstantly, rather than us focusing on our thing like SAF reigning over all the rebuilding all these years.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

There is no great end to the season just by finish any where in top 4 without a title challenge. Arsenal years of top 4 trophies proved. They even finished 2nd without title challenging not long ago and still on track with their decline!

Massive coup in transfer market is subjective. We did have massive coup of transfer windows during so called failure of past 2 regimes. Didn't help solving the root cause of issue at the club (the commitment to go all the way than shiny new thing bounce). OGS and the news surrounding the club is that we're doing differently in the coming window. Whether it worked is another story, but you're talking about different things.

Liverpool winning the title can place massive pressure on this club. They're our biggest rival despite their barren spell after all. They become successful again do play a part in the scheme of thing.

Of course it’s a great end to the season for Ole and all of his staff, it’s an absolute miracle considering where we were when he took over.

And just because things haven’t gone right before doesn’t mean they will now, same goes for being out of CL, didn’t help LVG, didn’t help Mourinho.

That said, I maintain Solskjaer and all of his staff we be absolutely desperate to make the CL as like me they are fully aware of the advantages.

Liverpool have won the CL in recent history, them winning a league worries me very little, City will still be favorites to win every single title until Guardiola leaves & probably even afterwards if they keep spending the way they do.

 

[izec]

Liverpool double would be too much. Throw the game away!!

 

[Member 90887]

I wouldn't cheer for city against us but i sure as hell wouldn't care if we lost against them next week's game.

We're already planning a rebuild. the chance of winning the CL next year is a remote one, we are still far from that, so while i'd would clearly prefer us to be in the CL next year, i put it out of my head by december already when Jose was still here and winning the europa league could be a good stepping stone for next year.

 

[ti vu]

Of course it’s a great end to the season for Ole and all of his staff, it’s an absolute miracle considering where we were when he took over.

And just because things haven’t gone right before doesn’t mean they will now, same goes for being out of CL, didn’t help LVG, didn’t help Mourinho.

That said, I maintain Solskjaer and all of his staff we be absolutely desperate to make the CL as like me they are fully aware of the advantages.

And my counter argument is the Liverpool point winning the league point. I believe if Liverpool were proper title challengers all these years against SAF, we would have been either more ruthless to be as successful, being less successful with dame approach given the constant pressure by such rivalry always at its peak.

Being out of CL did help LVG to focus on getting top 4 in his first season while rebuilding. Mourinho to win EL to qualify for CL, with hipuge swing in philosophy in his first season. Look out side of this, even Klopp benefit from not being in European at all, wrapping up top 4 spot in his first full season, and Conte winning the league just to bemoaning the congested schedule the following season when being back in CL while not doing well in transfer window. It's the case of taking a step back before serval step forward. In a sense, it's not only doing no harm, but also doing more good aka proactive forward thinking.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

And my counter argument is the Liverpool point winning the league point. I believe if Liverpool were proper title challengers all these years against SAF, we would have been either more ruthless to be as successful, being less successful with dame approach given the constant pressure by such rivalry always at its peak.

We had to be ruthless when it came to Blackburn, Chelski & the arabs.

I maintain City are the bigger long term domination threat and if you can’t see this you haven’t been paying attention.

 

[marktan]

I'd much rather we win and get top 4, and Liverpool win the league. Maybe it'll serve as a wake up call, we as a club and fanbase seem to have accepted mediocrity, and risk spending the next 5+ years falling further and further behind.

Fyi to people wanting us to lose, just because there's Manchester in front of the other club doesn't make it ours.

 

[ti vu]

We had to be ruthless when it came to Blackburn, Chelski & the arabs.

I maintain City are the bigger long term domination threat and if you can’t see this you haven’t been watching.

Not to the extend had it be a direct rival who in direct fight for total trophies tally, an endless fight.

If we were that ruthless, we wouldn't have lost common targets easily to Chelsea and City when they're early into their building/rebuilding.

I am talking about Madrid vs Barcelona level competition/pressure on the smallest of things. Liverpool being successful again, can bring that, and with us being a our lowest, it may be a reverse of SAF reign instead of us standing up to them.

 

[King Eric 7]

Given the lack of support for our team amongst our own fans, I am going to go and watch this in a pub in Liverpool. I bet the scousers will be cheering us on more than our own fans.

 

[17 Van der Gouw]

@Damien poll pressure

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

I am talking about Madrid vs Barcelona level competition/pressure on the smallest of things. Liverpool being successful again, can bring that, and with us being a our lowest, it may be a reverse of SAF reign instead of us standing up to them.

Bloody hell that’s melodramatic!

And why are you completely ignoring that City are far and away the biggest risk of long term domination in this league, not Liverpool, not close! There’s currently talk of City dropping 120m on a Portuguese kid this summer and every year they win a PL, they get bigger & bigger globally and their pull as a club increases.

 

[Judge Red]

Either way, most of our players don’t care enough to make this an issue. We’re losing.

 

[ti vu]

Bloody hell that’s melodramatic!

And why are you completely ignoring that City are far and away the biggest risk of long term domination in this league? There’s currently talk of them dropping 120m on a Portuguese kid this summer and ever year they win a PL, they get bigger & bigger globally.

Why? Emptihad is a term for some reason. Liverpool despite of their lack of success never fail to maintain a strong fan base for a reason.

The whole City project is a just statement for the group behind them, not the football fan going though thick and thin for the club. With that, City success ain't sustainable as it's depended on the owners' own money! If their owners are all for football interest, they would have be solely focusing on their own countries football affair rather than selling their political image to the world via a proxy club. Their success can go away as quick as it came with this kind of approach.

Liverpool and this club are depended on their fan base.

 

[Starkie_1]

Got a spare ticket no one wants for this so on that consensus the majority aren’t arsed at all.

Me, I’d happily have us dicked 6-1 again and confirm the players we have are utter shite and a total rebuild is needed. As it has been for the past 6 years. If that helps City win the league and stop the scousers, that’s a massive bonus isn’t it.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

Why? Emptihad is a term for some reason. Liverpool despite of their lack of success never fail to maintain a strong fan base for a reason.

The whole City project is a just statement for the group behind them, not the football fan going though thick and thin for the club. With that, City success ain't sustainable as it's depended on the owners' own money! If their owners are all for football interest, they would have be solely focusing on their own countries football affair rather than selling their political image to the world via a proxy club.

Why isn’t it sustainable? City’s owners have a feck tonne of endless money and City fill their stadium for most games these day, they only really struggle in midweek. I can tell you that even here in Sweden, I see more and more City shirts every year that goes by.

Ignore it all you like, but City are a force and they aint going anywhere soon, they are a much bigger threat to any future United success than Liverpool.

If City win the league this year that’s 4 titles in 8 years and they’ll be favorites again next year to make it 3 in a row & 5 titles in 9 years.

 

[MDFC Manager]

Why isn’t is sustainable? City’s owners have a feck tonne of money and City fill their stadium for most games these day, they only really struggle in midweek. I can tell you that even here in Sweden, I see more and more City shirts every year that goes by.

Ignore it all you like, but City are a force and they aint going anywhere soon, they are a much bigger threat to any future United success than Liverpool.

If City win the league this year that’s 4 titles in 8 years and they’ll be favorites again next year to make it 3 in a row & 5 titles in 9 years.

Oh their fanbase is certainly growing. It's not hard to see why, they play an attractive attacking brand of football. That's what attracts any young impressionable watcher of football. For now this is similar to how arsenal fanbase increased in the early 2000's

 

[ti vu]

Why isn’t is sustainable? City’s owners have a feck tonne of money and City fill their stadium for most games these day, they only really struggle in midweek. I can tell you that even here in Sweden, I see more and more City shirts every year that goes by.

Ignore it all you like, but City are a force and they aint going anywhere soon, they are a much bigger threat to any future United success than Liverpool.

They have feck tones of money but do they have infinite love for football? I meant, their ambition is clearly not for the good of football. When they get what they want, that's the end of the project.

"Only" midweek That's the issue. These type of fans would easily turn away once they smell the fun is all over, and their whole club operation is run on solely on the money and the interest of their owners.

 

[breakout67]

City's stadium is absolutely not full on matchdays. It's usually full on big games, a big CL game or Manchester derby is where they are the most likely to be at full capacity. Man City have countless season ticket holders that do not attend games often. It will take a decade or so for their fan base to increase due the success they are having now, as then new generation of football watchers choose a team to support.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

They have feck tones of money but do they have infinite love for football? I meant, their ambition is clearly not for the good of football. When they get what they want, that's the end of the project.

"Only" midweek That's the issue. These type of fans would easily turn away once they smell the fun is all over, and their whole club operation is run on solely on the money and the interest of their owners.

You have this idea that there is an end game, there isn’t, they let others run the club & they pump money in because money is no object. The idea they will one day “get bored” is pure fantasy, with their investments in sister clubs it’s obvious they are in it for the long term.

 

[ti vu]

You have this idea that there is an end game, there isn’t, they let other run the club & they pump money into because money is no object. The idea they will one day “get bored” is pure fantasy.

At least I can back it up with pointing out to Abramovic affair with Chelsea these days.

Others already chipped in regarding City season ticket holders not turning up for games, and not filling up the stadium as often as you initially said.

Your turn to you prove it as fantasy...

 

[WR10]

City's automated off-the-ball attacking pattern of triangles down opposition's fullback positions will tear us completely apart. It's an absurd thread to discuss when we really don't have a fecking chance against them. It will be Barca all over again. Either an easy 1-0 win to them or 3/4-0 for City.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

At least I can back it up with pointing out to Abramovic affair with Chelsea these days.

Your turn to you prove it as fantasy?

Abramovic has won as many titles as City since SAF retired, no other club has won more.

He also isn’t financed by an entire state. Comparing the Russian and these Arabs is like apples and oranges and it’s just wishful thinking on your half. Abramovich would be less “bored” if a richer player hadn’t rolled in town.

 

[Siorac]

City's automated off-the-ball attacking pattern of triangles down opposition's fullback positions will tear us completely apart. It's an absurd thread to discuss when we really don't have a fecking chance against them. It will be Barca all over again. Either an easy 1-0 win to them or 3/4-0 for City.

How I'll laugh at your predictions when we lose 2-0!

Wait, shit...

 

[wr8_utd]

City's automated off-the-ball attacking pattern of triangles down opposition's fullback positions will tear us completely apart. It's an absurd thread to discuss when we really don't have a fecking chance against them. It will be Barca all over again. Either an easy 1-0 win to them or 3/4-0 for City.

They really don't win many games by thrashing teams anymore. If they win it's likely to be another early goal and then they possession all game.

 

[Smallings biggest fan]

I would never hope United would lose. And failure for Liverpool should never weigh more than success for United.

So offcourse I hope United will win against City. I just hope a victory for United won't be enough for Liverpool to be champions.

 

[ti vu]

Abramovic has won as many titles as City since SAF retired, no other club has won more.

He also isn’t financed by an entire state. Comparing the Russian and these Arabs is like apples and oranges and it’s just wishful thinking on your half. Abramovich would be less “bored” if a richer player hadn’t rolled in town.

Same Abramovic let Chelsea being criticized by Conte for not being able to deliver players he requested. Abramovic ain't showing up for less Chelsea games as we saw. Doesn't look like his interest being the development of football but just his own enjoyment.

What a political state has to do with football development of an overseas club? How much of it is stemmed ffrom political purpose? And what is the goal? What will happen after that goal being occurred?

Such club being built on questionable goal of the owners, what their fan base stand for in long run?

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

Same Abramovic let Chelsea being criticized by Conte for not being able to deliver players he requested. Abramovic ain't showing up for less Chelsea games as we saw. Doesn't look like his interest being the development of football but just his own enjoyment.

What a political state has to do with football development of an overseas club? How much of it is stemmed ffrom political purpose? And what is the goal? What will happen after that goal being occurred?

Such club being built on questionable goal of the owners, what their fan base stand for in long run?

How and when do you think the “goal” you speak of will be complete?

 

[ti vu]

How and when do you think the “goal” you speak of will be complete?

CL triumph. Same symdrone as Moratti, Abramovic being more chill after their teams achieved this goal.

CL domination is not achievable as the elite clubs would protest and the creation of Super League would be a reality as they wouldn't want oil money being unchecked ruining their status.

 

[breakout67]

Man City ownership is interested in getting their foot in specific countries/industries, for sociopolitical gain. Chelsea ownership was a hobby with a side of russian money laundering.

Man City are here to stay, because they are playing the long game, the only way they leave is if we all of a sudden become extremely hostile towards Abu Dhabi.