I like Matic's take on it, it's like a husband saying he and the missus share equal blame for the marriage failing because she wouldn't just let him shag prossies once a week and have a mistress or two.
Supposed to be to counter the Russian and Chinese threat, don't forget the EU army and not forgetting the USA Nazi Democrats, plus all the remaining nations on Earth Johnson would have p!ssed off, got to be prepared.
I did not say both were to blame, I said it does not matter now, at this point in time, who was to blame, the world has moved on, that ship has sailed etc.
Yes, she never really read or understood the pre-nuptial agreement... where have we heard something similar before?
I can only see one side having issues with the current arrangement in regards to the actual trading relationship and impact on trade though. If it's a Mexican stand-off it's with one person holding a gun vaguely in the area of someone who has long since wandered off to get a coffee and baguette.
It seems like it's 2 plus the breaking of international law and the GFA from 3.
I think you are probably right and wrong with this one and it is something that perhaps many of us in the remain camp failed to appreciate and probably haven't appreciated for decades.
That final paragraph is also proven now by the many business-owners that have been in the news who are caught by surprise that Brexit isn't paradise and suddenly their business is in danger. They may have had other motives to vote for Brexit, such as the points @Maticmaker listed (which I am not dismissing at all); but as you say, there was certainly (also) an economic motive for some/many.
The entire leave campaign was a long list of lies and leavers now telling remainers what they should have done to win is the icing on the top of a huge pile of flaming brexiteer bull shit. The basis of leave is decades of indoctrination and misinformation, not some simple mistake the remain campaign made
(Even if they did make many)´.Sure you didn't
You are equalizing the reaction of the EU to something that the UK has started. every time. As said, no shame
Not quite sure why you are on about shame?
Any chance you'll address the actual point that @4bars made?
Is he making a point?
No he was telling you that you did indeed equate the two when you protested that you didn't "both were to blame". You didn't want to answer that point so you clung on to the comment about shame. And you know exactly what you're doing right now.
We have past the point of who is to blame, the results in and both sides have to deal with the here and now, that's all I have been saying.
"Both sides are to blame for this"
The UK is 100% to blame. They left seeking unicorns and the EU bent over backwards to help and got grief for not totally capitulating to the UK to have everything on their own terms.
Exactly!
On the basis that it was us who chose to leave, then of course we are to blame.
Well, you could argue that the EU made far more concessions for the UK than anyone, the UK included, expected them to, so I think they did. The EU made it an absolute priority to preserve the GFA in the face of overwhelming idiocy from the Tories.
Accepted
Wow this is even worse then I thought.https://www.theguardian.com/busines...apse-of-uk-food-and-drink-exports-post-brexit
I'm sure I remember Gove saying trade was barely affected by Brexit
One quote is "They put the collapse in trade down to a combination of Brexit and weaker demand in Europe where restaurants, hotels and other hospitality outlets remain closed. "
Brexit must be high on the list of stupidest decisions made after WWII. And we still have people wanting a ‘Nexit’ around here. Not a lot fortunately.
Presume a rain dance is part of the entertainment.
We're taking back control of the weather!
Could be about the British wind they were they said they were producing a couple of weeks ago.
Yes because the EU isn't an absolute shambles at the moment is it...
Getting a bit ahead of yourself. Let's not forget that Britain could see the end of itself due to Brexit due to Scotland potentially leaving.
You are right although my response was designed that way due to the other poster getting ahead of themselves with the WW2 nonsense.
They made a mistake with the vaccines but would be incredibly stupid to leave the EU because of that.
Off-topic, but I'm not sure what the reference to the EU as a shambles is about? Vaccine procurement and the management of its fall-out has been an absolute mess (but note that roll-out is done individually by each state), but that's a small aspect compared to the EU project as a whole. What else is going horribly wrong?
You've just answered the question. A number of countries are unhappy with how the EU have handled the pandemic as it's highlighted the issues in collectively trusting the EU to deal with such matters.
They've certainly handled the vaccine procurement and roll out significantly better (pains me to say it).
Ah okay. I think you're overrating the impact that has on trust in the EU within the EU though. I suppose it's now the main thing you hear about the EU in the UK, and so it might come across as a major talking point regarding the usefulness of the EU; but reading Dutch media myself, this is really not something that is considered to say much about the EU as a whole. And I'd also think myself that's a very minor thing among everything the EU stands for and does.
