When opposition teams try to lump the ball inside our box, he's pretty great. Not many beat him in the air, and he's also pretty good one on one, which several attackers have said. He does struggle a bit with the Aguero and Hazard type of players though in and around the box.
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Season Average Rating
- Appearances
- 36
- Clean sheets
- 18
- Goals
- 2
- Assists
- 2
- Yellow cards
- 0
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik @Rood and Imran @Annihilate Now! start with the good news by celebrating Manchester United Women's emphatic FA Cup win over Spurs at Wembley and the future of manager Marc Skinner.
Then it's the bad news and the ever worsening form of our Men with losses to Arsenal and Palace.
Finally the main debate - ETH Out now or keep him until the end of the season - if not longer. Are you Team Nik or Team Imran?
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The bold part is interesting in that you are right in a general sense but he makes a bigger attacking contribution than the other centre backs because he is the only one who scores goals.
With the exception of the 4-0 loss to Chelsea Smalling has handled both these guys pretty well in recent times. Not many forwards have the beating of Smalling one on one.
In the last three games he got beat by Danny Graham and Gabbiadini three times in a single game. Why do I say three times? Not because of an agenda against Smalling as you conspiracy theorists seem to suggest but because if you watched the whole game clearly his job was to man mark him wherever he was on the pitch. You could tell that because he was following him from the right fullback position, rcb, lcb and all the way to left fullback. He managed to lose him twice for the offside goal and the half time goal and got beat the third time while trying to take his shirt off instead of the ball.
Sure there were others fault wasn't all Smallings doing for two of the goals but we can't be going on with the myth that Smalling is the fastest strongest defender on one on ones because Michael Owen once said he's horrible to play against as a striker.
If we're going to contend for the Champions League he's going to have to play against the top top strikers in the world, the likes of Lewandowski, Muller, Suarez, Neymar, Messi, Ronaldo just to name a few. Solely the ocassion of coming up against them will get in his head and he'll shit his pants before the game has even started. Anyone who thinks Smalling can compete at that level is deluded.
So Nostradamus has spoken. We know what is going to happen. Future etched in gold. Is it necessary for poor Smalling to play against Lewandowski et al in real life now?
I thought Jones looked more comfortable on the ball than Smalling. But the last two league games we didn't concede with the duo Bailly and Smalling, so i'm not concerned
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This guy and @Jaybomb have nothing to add to this thread but hate and negativity. It's a repeating cycle of nonstop OTT bullshit. Should both be thread banned IMO
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Needs to learn how to pass it out of the back.
I know! Why is this? Perhaps it's Smalling's looks or lack there of ? Is it coz he's tall, gangly, awkward, & generally unattractive? Still as you say, rarely the worst defender on the day, yet most harshly criticized on the caf.
Agree with you again! Smalling is far from perfect but less likely than most, to let us down. His ability in the air is a beloved trait at least in Mourino's mind, and rightly so imho.
So many on here are slagging Smalling for not being a "leader". Is this based on going to games and watching & listening or from your armchair? I'd like to hear from regular match-goers who can see & hear whats happening on the pitch & when the camera is focused elsewhere.
Look, I know he's no Roy Keane, but few were/are. I think Smalling takes the responsibility of captain very seriously and that has helped him mature into a top CB which has in turn benefited United. He has been a regular choice (if not 1st choice) CB for going on six years now ... long before LVG?
Well said mate!
Smalling may/will never be as talented/good as Rio & or Vidic ... no argument form me there, but you'll die early if you consider Smalling's play infuriating; won't be good for your blood pressure
. He does far more well than he does poorly; take solace in the good & keep your glass half full ... you'll live longer I'm not so sure. If Jose is to be believed, and we bring in 2, 3 or maybe 4 players I'm not so sure a CB will be one of them. Notwithstanding the 2 goals against S'ton, the defense has been pretty solid for quite some time now, at least through the middle. One of the three new players will have to be a LB, another to replace Carrick and another will be up front. Not likely to see another CB
Posted without comment.
In more or less every game he doesn't play we look like conceding goals from goal kicks and useless punts up the field. Huge miss.
First game without him and we've lost our 5 game clean sheet streak in the league.
But it was all easy games, and he looks shaky and all that.
Against King and Afobe, I found it weird that Smalling was on the bench. He has the pace, strength and aerial ability to make mince meat out of athletic players. Jones looks like he's slower after all the injuries.
Indeed. He'll be exposed against better players! I wonder what Jones's excuse is
It was his first game in weeks tbf. Smalling didn't look great in his first game back from injury either.
He wasn't that bad. Jones was rubbish. Utter rubbish. A legit zero performance
Bournemouth tried to exploit the pocket of space than compete in 1vs1. I can't recall Bournemouth putting a cross into our box from open play that our CB needed to defend. Smalling is overkill. Jones had train wreck performance, but on paper RoJones style is suitable against Bournemouth' style. Their penalty call is from exploiting the pocket of space by shorter passes & quick movement, which Jones was so dumb to recklessly jumped into. The other dangerous 1vs 1 play Bournemouth created supposedly could be dealt with by any of our CBs. Smalling would be overkill for this, while Smalling would be preferred for the Rostov trip & arguably against D. Costa. Jones being this bad is miscalculated.
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Sums up our finishing this season. Missing chances after chances.
I agree with this one. Smalling should have play today. Pace, strength, aerial ability, the ability to stay on his feet, and great one on one. Suitable for the Bournemouth's players yesterday including that penalty, not to mention we played Carrick means there is already someone who can play the forward passes from the back.
I wouldn't say it was a mistake not to start Smalling. He's a better defender but Jones should have been capable of handling Afobe and King. After that performance though, surely Smalling has to start in Russia.
We need to admit that none of them is first team material. They will give a couple of good games but will do badly soon afterwards. There's a reason why 3 years after Rio-Vidic had retired we've yet to come out with a regular first team CB partnership. These gentlemen are not good enough
If you put Vidic next to any of United's 4 centre backs you would have a top class combination. They are all good enough to play in defence, just not good enough to organise and lead the defence.
Someone mentioned it in another thread and they were bang on. The current United defence is reminiscent of the Ferdinand, Brown, Silvestre days. Good on their day and capable of some quality performances but very inconsistent and equally capable of some terrible mistakes. Adding Vidic provided the organisation and leadership to develop a top class defence. That's why I was surprised United went with Bailly in the summer rather than a more experienced defender.
Beside David Luiz who ain't that much of a good organizer/ leader of defense, there ain't any top class experienced CB moving during last 2 transfer window. Fonte is overrated. He may be good CB but has doubt he can organize a defense for top club. Pepe was the leader of Portugal defense. City & Chelsea was hard on & ready to pay for Bonucci but Juventus didn't want to sell. Signing top class CB is very difficult given how few fit the bill & their clubs ain't interested to sell. We may end up signing experienced CB who ain't better than ours why wasting our transfer fee. With Bailly at least we see the high potential
So you're basically saying that if you put a world class defender to carry Smalling and co & do the thinking for them then they'll do fine? I guess you're right. After all Rio did that for quite some time prior to Vidic arrival. Sure when he got suspended the defence went into meltdown as orange man was always injured and Mickey could defend pretty much at the same level of Rojo, Jones and Smalling could do. But with loads of luck this he's ain't heavy he's my brother sort of thing can work.
There again, we're a top club and we should have a top quality side were players are there on merit not because they happen to be there. We reached the very top when we had two quality CBs (Bruce-Pally, Stam-Johnsen, Rio-Vidic). Not a top quality CB and not some donkey who made Afobe look like Messi on steriods
Also Bailly won a regular first team place over these guys in matter of weeks and that despite barely having any experience at a top league. It was so easy for him to shrug off competition that its almost embarrasing. We're not talking here about someone like Bonucci but a young kid who had some 30 matches at first team level. Surely the new Duncan Edwards, the Argie international and Smallingbeaur could provide a bit more competition for him. But they didn't.
The problem isn't Bailly, the problem is that none of these people are good enough. They had 3 years to win a first team place and they failed miserably. If at age 27 Smalling need a Vidic to hold his hand then when the feck is he going to stand up and be counted? These are not kids anymore
I cant help thinking that if Hodor and Jones were non British then most fans would be out for blood especially if there were blocking the path to some top quality British talent.
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Fair point. It may have been more due to what they could get rather than the optimum requirement for the club.
The point is more that Rio wasn't up to scratch either until he got a top class leader next to him. The defence was nowhere near good enough until Vidic arrived and settled.
Bruce and Pallister were a good partnership but weren't outstanding defenders individually. Bruce never even got an England cap. Johnsen was solid but I wouldn't say he was significantly better (or better at all) than the current 4. He also benefitted greatly from a world class partner.
I'm not a big fan of Jones. He's good but I never rated him as highly as many others did. The other 3 have a lot of talent. Bailly is impetuous, Smalling lacks confidence and Rojo is inconsistent but next to an experienced leader all 3 are plenty good enough for a title winning defence.
Pallister was a wonderfully talented defender, fast as feck, great in the air and very composed on the ball. I've no idea where you get he wasn't a excellent defender in his own right? Bruce was fat, slow and turned like a tanker. Pally covered his arse all the time. But Brucie was an excellent organiser and knew his weaknesses very well. Pally should have been an England regular & would walk into our current team, when he was in his prime.
Rio came into his prime as a defender, that when he stepped it up. You are doing a disservice to some of our past players.
Rio wasnt up to scratch? Seriously? Id say rio was the best defender of his generation and that was clearly shown prior,during and after his suspension. Vidic complimented him and he made us less rio dependent. But that was it. He was rio's equal not rio's guardian angel
All the defenders i mentioned didn't need to be nannied to do well like smalling, rojo and jones do. Thats the difference. At age 25-27
Cbs need to have a mind of their own but these gentlemen do not. Which makes me wonder why should we keep them? They are younger and more promising prospects around with more fuel in their tank then them to do the leg work. Bailly is a clear example to that
Id say get rid of jones and add bonucci (hes got issues with allegri). Then we will revise everything the summer after. Maybe this kick in the backside would be enough for smalling and rojo to react. However if by the end of next season smalling is still a reserve then its time for him to go. Theres no point keeping a 28 year old cb whose got the football brain of an 18 year old in the team. He will be the worst of two worlds
I agree with the general notion that all of our CBs (maybe bar Jones, I'm not his biggest fan) are good enough in terms of individual quality, but I think they all lack the ability to play beside each other because none really complement each other.
They/we really do need an 'organiser' - it's the same with Arsenal, I feel like Koscielny was a lot better beside Mertesacker than he has been with Mustafi. Likewise, Otamendi actually had some half decent games beside Kompany, and Stones probably would too.
They/we really do need an 'organiser' - it's the same with Arsenal, I feel like Koscielny was a lot better beside Mertesacker than he has been with Mustafi. Likewise, Otamendi actually had some half decent games beside Kompany, and Stones probably would too.
At 27 smalling he should be that organiser same as jones. If they can only do the domkey work then we might as well bring younger players who has more fuel in the tank to do that and they might develop in WC cbs
Well, I'm not sure about that. Too much squad turnover isn't necessary at all. One should go, with a first choice CB being introduced in their stead.
Smalling is faster than Pallister, every bit as good in the air and more difficult to dribble past. Yet, numerous people on here want him sold. Having a solid organiser like Bruce next to Smalling may see Smalling covering his fat arse too.
The point is, Bruce and Pallister are seen as a great United defence because as a pair they were outstanding. Jones and Rojo had a run of games earlier in the season and built a promising partnership. Even Smalling and Blind looked more solid the more they played together. There is plenty of talent in this defensive quartet. I don't think players like Pallister, Bruce or Johnsen are any better individually.
What do you mean by "nannied"? Have an organiser next to them? Of the 6 defenders you mentioned, Pallister, Johnsen and Stam were not good organisers in defence. Stam was an absolute colossus so didn't need to be. The key to those partnerships was that the pairs complimented each other so well.
Smalling is nowhere near as experienced as his age suggests. His lower league career and succession of injuries mean he's not played a lot of top level football and when he got 2 years relatively free of injury his form was outstanding. Jones and Rojo also looked very impressive after a run of games as a pair.
Talent wise, the current batch of defenders have great potential. They can be inconsistent and make mistakes but Rio was incredibly error prone pre-Vidic. Over the years he matured and the partnership brought the best out of him. He still had mistakes in his game but they were fewer and less costly with a consistent top quality partner next to him.
Nannied means having players to watch other cbs backs and make sure to do the thinking for them. None of our former legends needed that.
Also reread your post. Potential, seriously? We are talking of 25-27 year old here. They shouldnt be leading the defence. Instead we are still talking of potential and the need for an experienced nanny erm organizer who can "manage" our 28 year old defender. I find that ridiculous. If he plays like a kid than we might as well replace him with one. At least he will have the talent and the time to develop into a top quality cb
I think united deserve more then 2 cbs who can play well together for a couple of games. We need cbs who are reglar first teamers week in week out.
Rio incredibly error prone...jeez.
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This is simply not true and comes across as revisionism. Rio was never incredibly error prone. He was just as good and consistent as John Terry. Sure he made some mistakes as every CB is bound do but nothing excessively over the average. If anything between Rio and Vidic it was Vidic who was more prone to mistakes and poor judgment, things that led him to once get red carded three straight times against Liverpool. I think that's a record. Before Vidic got used to the prem (Evra suffered in that same period) he needed Rio and sometimes even Silvestre to bail him out.
Rio was 27 when Vidic signed and was far more experienced that the current quartet. He improved immeasurably in that partnership.
Revisionism is ignoring what the defence was like pre-Vidic. I remember the corn row twins. They were a laughing stock. Physical strikers bullied the United defence and lapses in concentration were common.
Revisionism is also "Rio was never error prone". As a young player he was basically John Stones. Even if you mean just at United, that isn't true either. He was a talented but inconsistent defender at United until he found an ideal partner in Vidic. I do think Vidic was the better defender but the partnership benefitted both equally.
My point throughout this thread is that there are talented defenders at the club. If they can develop good partnerships and grow in confidence they are certainly good enough to play in title winning teams.
He didn't improved immensely. The defense improved immersely. That's because we replaced a crock (Wes) and a fullback playing as CB (Mickey) with an absolute world class defender. We won the league immediately after we bought Rio and the defense absolutely crushed when he got suspended. Pre Vidic Rio wasn't our problem in defense, he was actually the one keeping the whole thing from sinking.
And seriously mate, stop saying porkies. Rio was a great defender even at Leeds and was one of the very few people who made SAF's eat his own words (the famous if Rio is worth 18m then how much does Wes cost, 30?)
I don't mind slagging off English players and I dare to say that if Smalling and Jones weren't British then most fans patience would have run out Looong ago. But you can't criticize Rio. In my opinion he was the best defender the world ever seen since Paulo Maldini played and there's noone as good as him at the moment (although Bonucci does come close). United would probably sell Glazer's sister for a Rio at the moment
Im sorry but this was never the case. Rio was heads and shoulders above Stones when he joined United at 23. He had a shaky start at Leeds but quickly asserted himself as one of their most crucial players and became captain at the tender age of 23. It's an insult to compare 23 year old Rio to 23 year old Stones. The major complaint about young Rio before United were his apparent lapses in concentration and in my opinion some of the criticism wasn't always warranted. Rio was never a typical English CB, his laid back style and confidence on the ball led some to harshly call him lazy I remember, but he was simply silky.
Im not saying he didn't have his share of mistakes but you're really reaching here when you say he was 'incredibly' error prone. Thats a damning summation. Brown was more error prone and I still wouldn't say he was 'incredibly' error prone. Silvestre probably was. I don't even know why you had to mention 'cornrow twins'. Laughing stock because of their hairstyle? I remember fans made fun of him for his hairstyles but he was never a laughing stock at anytime while at United for his game and his major struggles came about when he struggled for fitness later in his playing career
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