So you are expecting total football from this squad, some struggle to play bloody football nevermind total football. The club need to get players in who he can implement what he wants. Until then it will be results first.
Erik ten Hag - Manchester United manager
- Thread starter sewey89
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik @Rood and Imran @Annihilate Now! start with the good news by celebrating Manchester United Women's emphatic FA Cup win over Spurs at Wembley and the future of manager Marc Skinner.
Then it's the bad news and the ever worsening form of our Men with losses to Arsenal and Palace.
Finally the main debate - ETH Out now or keep him until the end of the season - if not longer. Are you Team Nik or Team Imran?
I am really sorry to say this but a bunch of our fans seem to be delusional. Just look at the damn game from yesterday and you will see, we are never able to put one grain of football into these players.
They cant keep or hold the fecking ball for 3 seconds if their nana’s life depended on it. I couldnt see three consecutive passes over the fecking middle line! These prima donna’s are horrendous and The cherry on the cake is Ronaldo, sabotaging our team just in the hopes to get himself a goal the narcissist.
We should be thankfull for Eric and thanking god on our knees for this manager. He is not afraid to bench Our captain and the narcist Ronaldo. Step by step he will improve our squad into what it needs to be, but he cant teach McTom or Fred to pass over 1 meter, The cnut Rashford to move and ask for the ball (didnt see that guy yesterday 1 sec on the ball). He needs to tweak and pray his team into their capabilities so we dont play championship next season. We need men that can work in his system… he was spot on with Martinez and Malaccia until now (fingers crossed). Lets give him praise and time and our support. The other bunch of prima donna’s can deliver or feck off
They cant keep or hold the fecking ball for 3 seconds if their nana’s life depended on it. I couldnt see three consecutive passes over the fecking middle line! These prima donna’s are horrendous and The cherry on the cake is Ronaldo, sabotaging our team just in the hopes to get himself a goal the narcissist.
We should be thankfull for Eric and thanking god on our knees for this manager. He is not afraid to bench Our captain and the narcist Ronaldo. Step by step he will improve our squad into what it needs to be, but he cant teach McTom or Fred to pass over 1 meter, The cnut Rashford to move and ask for the ball (didnt see that guy yesterday 1 sec on the ball). He needs to tweak and pray his team into their capabilities so we dont play championship next season. We need men that can work in his system… he was spot on with Martinez and Malaccia until now (fingers crossed). Lets give him praise and time and our support. The other bunch of prima donna’s can deliver or feck off
The very lazy LVG comparisons are tiring. It takes time for a manager to implement their style especially when they haven’t had a full preseason with their new signings. Give him time, he hasn’t reverted back into anything and even said post game that there was a lot of room for improvement.
We don't have players to implement a system. If you're used to conducting the royal philharmonic orchestra and you walk into a room full of 9 year olds playing Three Blind Mice on the recorder, you adapt
Man, the criticism is so tiring . I can name the posters who actually came out with Knife after the Brighton and Brentford games. Fecking 2 games.
Hope they do us a favor and stay out of the thread for sometime.
Hope they do us a favor and stay out of the thread for sometime.
I'm excited by ETH adding more quality to our attack but I've still such a niggling worry that our midfield will feck him over. It's still not been fully addressed even with the addition of Casemiro. Which is why he probably wanted FDJ also. I just don't think we've enough quality there to dominate the likes of Southampton the way he wants to especially in those last 20 minutes.
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Seemed quite obvious to me that he rewarded the team that beat Liverpool by going with the same starting XI. It wouldn’t have been great for morale had he dropped anyone after it.
Have no doubt Casemiro comes in for Scott next game.
Have no doubt Casemiro comes in for Scott next game.
NDJ? Nigel De Jong has retired a long time ago and is even older than Ronaldo now haha
But seriously now, it is obvious we need more quality, but if FDJ doesnt want to come w eneed to move forward. He is not Messi or Mbapoe to linger so long for. He is not even the best midfielder of Barcelona.
I agree. The thing with LVG was he wanted to play his system, but was not particularly bothered about building a team who could play it. ETH is a different kettle of fish, he will implement the style gradually once he has players in all positions to suit it. We will see gradual changes and improvements and I am perfectly happy to wait.
maybe, but I fully expected Martial to come into the team if he hadn't picked up that injury. With Casemiro, it just makes sense to me that he'd get subbed on his first game to get a first taste of the PL and then start against Leicester.
People should give him a break until he gets a GK he wants that fits what he does. DDG is basically the antithesis of it. Had Henderson not been hell bent on leaving I think he would be the #1. If we bring Dubravka in on loan I think all it will take is for 1 howler of a game from DDG for Dubravka to come in.
I can't believe some of the shit I am seeing.
The guy is the real deal but needs time.
The guy is the real deal but needs time.
Yeah I swear away from home we drop points almost every year to them?
21/22: 1-1
20/21: 1-1
19/20: 3-2 (late winner Cavani)
18/19: 1-1 (they had a man sent off as well)
17/18: 2-2
These guys basically thought ETH would easily implement the football he achieved with Ajax with this squad and failed to realize that style of play requires the right players as well.
It is very clear that most of these posters only were interested in ETH based on the similarity of his style of play to Pep and Klopp. Once they don't see the football, they throw the toys out of their pram. To me, ETH has proven that he is adaptive to different type of tactics as long as the game can be won, which is what a top level manager needs to have. You cannot be too stubborn by focusing on the system above everything, otherwise the only way to win is by having a perfect squad that suits the system.
So did LVG, so I'm not sure if that is even an insult anymore. I've always said that he is similar in some ways, but more progressive and better man management. Our biggest mistake was appointing Mourinho afterwards and going the other way completely.
I thought there was glimpses, the build up to the goal, how we came out in the second half and there was a great bit of build up in the first half as to how Ten zHag wants us to play. One / two touch football with movement, it’s going to take time but there’s signs there that the players are beginning to buy into his philosophy
Think LVG was the right idea, but at the wrong time. I think at that stage of his life he didn't want to build a team which was what we needed, so just OK'd a lot of signings the club made with no planning at all.
I cannot believe some people actually expected us to be playing total football after 4 matches. If some people are arguing that they can't see any signs on the pitch, then they must be blind. We're already getting that right now. Our goal vs. Southampton was complete control straight from ten Hag's coaching from defence to attack.
It should be obvious that it's going to take time for us to become consistent. We're playing vs. opponents who've had years to practice their methods, whilst we're starting from zero. It's logical that ten Hag has decided to keep us solid, whilst incorporating his changes gradually. Brighton & Brentford showed that the team isn't ready just yet, and that any mistakes made are waiting to be pounced upon. We can't just write off a few months whilst the team gets up to speed, we need the results now too.
When Casemiro & Antony are bedded in, and whether Martial can stay fit or we bring in another striker, the process will then progress faster, but up to this point I'm extremely happy with ten Hag so far.
Is this real though or just some random knobheads on twitter?
I am seeing a lot more posts complaining about people complaining than any actual complaining. In fact redcafe seems pretty sensible in that loads of people are saying he needs time in here.
Think there are a couple of post in here and in the post match thread saying they cannot see any improvements.
You'd expect that though with thousands of posters, there's gonna be some morons and trolls.
Just give it a few months and ETHouters vs ETHinners will be a proper war.
Very likely. If his signings are playing well, then maybe they should be looking at the others.
Is this the first time a manager has been backed post SAF?
Not so much about financially, but signing players with some thought about them, definitely.
You have gone to another side of extreme. You think our existing players can’t play his game. It’s very nonsense.
The positional play like any other philosophy can be trained and done in short time (months). It just takes time and games to get everyone into it. Of course, you can always find a new player functioning better in a position/role than others based on context. The squad is built to met the demand bit and bit. A big part of it is adapting as you have said. That I agree with you.
One of the major issues with this club is a complete lack of foresight. Anyone with a brain was saying months ago Maguire will not be suited to Ten Hag's high line and expansive football (as well as not being good enough in general), he should have been put on the market this summer and take whatever fee you can get. It's took Ten Hag 2 whole games to realise this himself and he'll now most likely spend the season sat on the bench while his transfer market plummets even further.
LVG failed in trying to make us competitive using a possession based style.
Mourinho didn't even bother trying.
Ole failed to improve us in possession too.
But sure ETH will whip us into shape in no time. Love your optimism and can only hope you are right.
Shame we did not manage to sign a creative midfielder. I feel that will prevent us from playing his envisioned football
ETH is very adaptable and his style is not like LVG's at all.
The problems we have had so far have been both midfield and forward related. We have also had a different playing pattern and it shows with some of our players.
1. Our midfielders aren't great defensive. Fred and Mctominay have been exposed under ETH. Under Mourinho and Ole, they both played a low block to cover the midfield's weakness in actually covering space. In an open games, neither can win back possession and neither can stop counter attacks.
2. Our midfield also didn't have enough Intelligence to help us build up from the back. Even under Ole, the only time we played good football was with a midfield of Pogba and Matic. So far with ETH, both have had to play, that wouldn't be the case moving forward.
3. Our forwards have also not been great at holding play.
4. Ronaldo and Eriksen( when he was a false 9) have not been good pressers of the ball. Making it easy for the opposition to play out.
The problems we have had so far have been both midfield and forward related. We have also had a different playing pattern and it shows with some of our players.
1. Our midfielders aren't great defensive. Fred and Mctominay have been exposed under ETH. Under Mourinho and Ole, they both played a low block to cover the midfield's weakness in actually covering space. In an open games, neither can win back possession and neither can stop counter attacks.
2. Our midfield also didn't have enough Intelligence to help us build up from the back. Even under Ole, the only time we played good football was with a midfield of Pogba and Matic. So far with ETH, both have had to play, that wouldn't be the case moving forward.
3. Our forwards have also not been great at holding play.
4. Ronaldo and Eriksen( when he was a false 9) have not been good pressers of the ball. Making it easy for the opposition to play out.
Eriksen is a creative midfielder
Anyone with sanity would go pragmatic with this squad.
This is not like LVG though. LVG still stuck by his total football principle. But the pragmatic version of it is safe pass to death.
ETH shows some flexibility in let DDG boot it long. Not persist with short slow safe build up trying to get some win awaiting reinforcements. Result oriented is something that is unLVG.
But better up top imo
LVG played Fellaini a lot and had no problem hoofing the ball to him.
Id actually rather have a manager who changes the way he has his team play if he realises there might be a struggle on the cards against certain teams.
Better to have a plan B or even C than sit on your Plan A and look utterly lost when it doesn’t work.
Better to have a plan B or even C than sit on your Plan A and look utterly lost when it doesn’t work.
Surely people realize that after years hoofing the ball up front and playing counter attacking football this squad will take time to learn to play a new way. And that it's not going to happen in a few weeks or even month. It will take more than a year i guess and in the meantime the most important thing is to get results while step by step playing more attraktive football. How long did it take Klopp or Pep to get the players playing consitent good attacking football?
Played Fellaini, and pin pointed ball at him doesn't make it less total football.
Blind, Martinez under ETH plays long ball to Haller is not rare. Of course less often than short build up.
Having a targetman way up top with no supporting players is another different matter. Hoofing to forwards without competent aerial ability, to release pressure at the back, and counter press is different to pint pointing a targetman to bring the ball down to his teammates.
Juanfield game is an example of the latter scenario based in total football. An lob pass is another way to pass the ball. Make use of Fellaini aerial ability to bring the ball down, and combine with our players, while we dominated possession and controlled the flow of the game.
It's not the same as kicking it aimlessly that even Fellaini wouldn't be in position to compete.
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Come on, for everything that we have done wrong recently, hoofball is not something that we can be accused of.
I think our midfielders are a big part of why we can't control the game. They all don't know how to keep the ball
Hard to disagree with you, but I also feel we have to go through some growing pains to improve our possession play, but the media and some fans will have their knives out.