Erik ten Hag - Manchester United manager

[Garethw]

Yeah you've just pointed out what's up - a large portion of the squad don't have anywhere near the same drive and desire to win that the manager does. They beat Barcelona, won a trophy, and then after seeing any outside chance of winning the league finally evaporate with that drubbing at Liverpool, half of them called it a day.

They're not winners. Only a few of them deserve to be here. Do you think SAF would have signed someone like Sancho? Not a chance! Would have taken one look at him and seen that despite all the ability, there just isn't any fight in there.

EtH can see it too. It's not surprising that after the Newcastle game a few journos have started reporting that he wants to have a massive clear out, which includes Sancho. He's just as sick of the half hearted performances some of them put in as we are as fans.

Personally, I still blame Woodward. Had no talent for his role, no vision, no grasp of how to build the footballing side for the long term. It's left us with the complete mess of a squad, most of whom are massively overpaid compared to higher performing players at rival clubs.

Let’s hope he gets fully backed in the summer as this squad needs gutting.

 

[SadlerMUFC]

That was a very confusing sub that he made yesterday. For one, we were only down by 1 and as much as 3 points would be great, they weren't needed. What we did need in that situation was at least a tie. So why take off your 2 best central defenders and replace them with our (arguably) 4th choice central defender? Especially considering Newcastle were constantly putting balls into our 6 yard box. The right move (as many would probably hate to hear it) would have been to bring on Maguire for Martinez, but keep Varane on the field. Especially considering he also took off McTominay. We ended up having a very small line up. Martial for Wout was a no brainer. It was like playing with 10 men before Martial came on, and the quality Martial brought to the hold up play was plain to see. I hope he can stay healthy now. The rest of the subs were just weird. If we tied we still would have been 3 points up. So don't panic and just make subtle changes. going to a 3-5-2 with Lindelof, Shaw and Dalot as the back 3 was suicide. Especially with a keeper who is afraid to leave his goal line. These are the subs I would have made:

Martial on for Wout
Maguire on for Martinez
Fred on for McTominay (would have actually started Fred over McT)

I thought Antony was having a decent game and wouldn't have taken him off. If we were still down a goal going into the 80th minute then I would have put on Sancho or Pillestri for Sabitzer and moved Rashford up front and dropped Bruno into the #8 and played a 4-4-2 for the rest of the match...

 

[Irwin99]

This still isn't EtH's team yet, not by a long shot, and it might be worth remembering that, aside from the two emergency loan signings, five of the players starting against Newcastle (and quite a fair few on the bench) have been here for over 5 years in both Jose and Ole teams that have gone from seasons finishes of 6th, to 3rd, to 2nd, to 6th. They have a mixed history of semi-decent consistency followed by catastrophic falls. The squad still needs some surgery.

I really don't think we will miss out on champions league football next season but if that did happen i've seen enough encouraging signs that we have an excellent coach and i'd bet most fans would be willing to give him more time.

 

[Yakuza_devils]

Judging from the comments here, safe to say that ETH's honeymoon period is over. His honeymoon lasted longer than Ole's.

Just pray that he is the real deal rather than another Ole. As many have said, he has been lucky this year Chelsea and Liverpool somehow can't get their shit together. Next year will be much more competitive with City, Arsenal, Newcastle, Spurs, Chelsea, Liverpool and Man Utd fighting for Top 4.

Next season we really need 2 ST and 2 MF as minimum. WW, Martial, McT, Sabizter, Fred are not players to challenge the Big 7 next year.

 

[Strelok]

Exceeded expectations? What did you expect? For me, every season outside top 4 is huge disappointment. Huge.

I wrote off this season before it even started considering last season and the Ronaldo affair.

For me results don't matter as long as we can make progress. So far I'm absolutely happy with ETH. Surely he made some mistakes here and there, he's new to the league and human after all. But overall his performance has been top imo. The most important thing is he has fixed our culture, handled the dressing room really well and implemented a progressive modern football. It's been ages since SAF we would dominate and win against the smaller clubs with ease on a regular basis. And he won a cup too it's our first silveware like in 6,7 years.

I have no doubt he'd win the league next season if we can buy a top midfielder and a top #9 this summer.

 

[Stacks]

Poll from before the season started:

https://www.redcafe.net/threads/where-will-we-finish-this-season.471974/

61.6% predicting we'd finish outside the top four, 80.1% predicting we wouldn't finish better than fourth. And that poll was somewhat optimistic compared to the bookmakers odds, which had us finishing 6th rather than 5th.

Those were the expectations before the season started, so a top four finish and a cup win would certainly be exceeding them. If you expected more than that you were in a relatively small minority.

And that was before a ball was kicked. After the opening games expectations plummeted from there.

we also hadn't made all our signings by then i imagine. After spending 250m it was top 4 or bust for me

 

[Beachryan]

We just have too many gaps in our first XI right now. We're missing our entire central midfield, and a striker. That's the spine of a team. We can't get the forwards involved because one is championship-level and no one can pass to the other 3.

Get Eriksen, Casemiro and Martial back and we're a totally different prospect.

 

[shabin_d_great]

Considering our squad is mostly average, just wish ETH would tinker with his formation. Like play mctom-fred-sabitzer as midfield and rash-bruno-antony as front three with Bruno as false 9.

 

[Rocksy]

Considering our squad is mostly average, just wish ETH would tinker with his formation. Like play mctom-fred-sabitzer as midfield and rash-bruno-antony as front three with Bruno as false 9.

Agree that he should go with a three in midfield. Even though that's the weakest section of players, it's way to open with a two.

 

[always_hoping]

I've been very happy with him and we have to understand fatigue, injuries and suspensions were always going to catch up to us, but his persistence with Weghorst is wearing my patience thin. Why do all our managers have these blinkers for one, horrifically poor player? Weghorst will end up costing him his job if he signs him in the summer.

Most certainly should yet I suppose you'll always get some on here and twitter that will chose to ignore it.

 

[Licha-Vidic]

Considering our squad is mostly average, just wish ETH would tinker with his formation. Like play mctom-fred-sabitzer as midfield and rash-bruno-antony as front three with Bruno as false 9.

Not even now only, but it should 3 man midfield going forward with the players available.

At all times, we need 3 competent midfielders on the pitch, and Bruno is not a midfielder.

This will offer better control even if our passing will still be garbage.

 

[NLunited]

We have lost every game away against the top 9 teams. But it’s always the players and only the players. Ok, no point discussing then

You can futz with the line up all you want, but we have no one currently who can play the 6 position properly except Casemiro.

We were playing with a makeshift midfield. Couple that with a lack of effort and it could have been 5-0.

Your solution is to play Fred and McTominay in midfield? I think we have tried that a few times.

In hindsight McTominay should have played deeper instead of Bruno. That MIGHT have been better.

And let me ask you, do you think the team effort was good enough? Did you see enough passion and desire on the field?

It starts with that, and only then does a line up or formation make a difference.

 

[Gandalf Greyhame]

Newcastle was bounced from the FA cup by...Sheffield Wednesday. Oh...and they aren't in any European league. Thats sort of a big difference when you consider the rigors of managing a squad. Last I checked we were still in both tourneys and had probably two of the best games of the season against a very motivated Barca. Newcastle's signature win this year is probably beating us at home.

On a side, having to handle the Ronaldo situation to start the season was incredibly difficult, and handled with amazing care by ETH. These are massive club issues that Howe rarely needs to address frankly.

The loss against Sheffield Wednesday was only 1 of 5 Newcastle have had this season - the other four being twice against Liverpool, once against City away and the last against us in the final. In the league, they've got a +18 GD on us. They have a wage bill that's one third of ours, spent 80m lesser than us, and even after that their top two signings, Isak and Gordon, have a combined 900 minutes, 6 goals and 0 assists between them - basically money with no returns so far. They did not beat Barca in the EL, sure, but they didn't lose 7-0 at Anfield, 6-3 at the Etihad or 4-0 at Brentford, either. There are ways to show EtH is making progress without trying to belittle Eddie Howe's achievements this season.

My post was not solely to downplay EtH's achievements, it also reflects on the quality of the squad itself and how we are extremely dependent on the likes of Casemiro and Rashford and drop points when they both are absent/have off games. While, I do believe EtH is the best we've had since SAF, I'm cautious about whether he's better than his counterparts at the top clubs we compete with for silverware without knowing if we'll upgrade the squad wisely. A comparison with Eddie Howe's Newcastle was made only to illustrate that we're still closer to Newcastle than we are to City, and that it's not as rosy as some are trying to paint it, and that we have very long way to go.

You can't look at the positives like Barca and ignore the negatives like how poor we've been of late and the hammerings we've received this season - that would be cherrypicking.

Absolute nonsense. Eddie Howe would not have done what ten Hag did to Barcelona.

Agreed - we were exceptional in some games this season, Barca tie being one of them. But Eddie Howe didn't get thrashed by City and Liverpool, either.

Plus an FA cup and Europa run?

And being in the fa cup semi final. And being in the Europa League quarter finals. Very different being level on 3rd when you are succeeding in every cup competition vs someone who has done nothing but focus on the league essentially.

Howe has done a great job, but purely results wise, United is having an excellent season. Because cups obviously matter and cups obviously have an impact on league games.

Given we've played 13 more games than Newcastle this season and had impressive runs in all of the cups, I don't think this is true at all.

I agree that simply relegating our Europa + FA Cup run (and all the games involved) to 'context' is perhaps misrepresentative. But the point wasn't to downplay EtH's progress, it's to highlight that even after that, we're closer to Newcastle's season than City's, and that we've got a long long way to go before we are convinced he's the man to compete for the top silverware - especially since our squad is heavily reliant on performances of two-three players at the moment.

 

[bosnian_red]

The loss against Sheffield Wednesday was only 1 of 5 Newcastle have had this season - the other four being twice against Liverpool, once against City away and the last against us in the final. In the league, they've got a +18 GD on us. They have a wage bill that's one third of ours, spent 80m lesser than us, and even after that their top two signings, Isak and Gordon, have a combined 900 minutes, 6 goals and 0 assists between them - basically money with no returns so far. They did not beat Barca in the EL, sure, but they didn't lose 7-0 at Anfield, 6-3 at the Etihad or 4-0 at Brentford, either. There are ways to show EtH is making progress without trying to belittle Eddie Howe's achievements this season.

My post was not solely to downplay EtH's achievements, it also reflects on the quality of the squad itself and how we are extremely dependent on the likes of Casemiro and Rashford and drop points when they both are absent/have off games. While, I do believe EtH is the best we've had since SAF, I'm cautious about whether he's better than his counterparts at the top clubs we compete with for silverware without knowing if we'll upgrade the squad wisely. A comparison with Eddie Howe's Newcastle was made only to illustrate that we're still closer to Newcastle than we are to City, and that it's not as rosy as some are trying to paint it, and that we have very long way to go.

You can't look at the positives like Barca and ignore the negatives like how poor we've been of late and the hammerings we've received this season - that would be cherrypicking.



Agreed - we were exceptional in some games this season, Barca tie being one of them. But Eddie Howe didn't get thrashed by City and Liverpool, either.








I agree that simply relegating our Europa + FA Cup run (and all the games involved) to 'context' is perhaps misrepresentative. But the point wasn't to downplay EtH's progress, it's to highlight that even after that, we're closer to Newcastle's season than City's, and that we've got a long long way to go before we are convinced he's the man to compete for the top silverware - especially since our squad is heavily reliant on performances of two-three players at the moment.

Peps first season at City, where he took over in a MUCH weaker league, with a MUCH stronger squad:

• 3rd in the league
• Semi final fa cup
• Round 4 of league cup
• Round of 16 for Champions League

Expecting a manager or criticizing a manager who is reliant on implementing a system of play drastically different than what the squad knows, to come in and challenge for the title in the 1st season with a mashed up squad is just not realistic

 

[UNITED ACADEMY]

Did the tiki taka Barca do high pressing? Did they always try to lauch immediate quick counters after taking the possesion back? That tiki taka football was considered so boring to watch by many for a reason. That tiki taka football was probably less 'quick counter football' even than Jose's dinosaur football I'd say. While Jose's football had no high pressing whatsoever. And it's not because someone said so on a random website it must be the absolute truth.

Anyway we should agree to disagree I think. This won't go nowhere.

There is difference between high pressing and pressing. High pressing is about winning possession of the ball near or inside the final/attacking third to score a goal on a fast attack. The definition of ''high'' is referring to winning it near the opposition penalty box. If a team was able to win the ball from opposition defender, you don't retain the possession, you expose it by trying to score a goal on a fast attack. A pressing without the word of ''high'' is just pressing to regain possession, it's different to high pressing. The tiki taka of Barcelona back then did less high pressing, there is a reason why some people argued before Xavi came that Barca must evolve from their tiki taka and fuse it to the modern day of high pressing.

 

[Swordsman]

After 27 matches 22/23 Season with WC winning defenders

W 15, D 5, L 7, GF 41, GA 37, GD 4, PTS 50


After 27 matches 21/22 Season under Ragnick with Maguire/Varane/Lindelof/Jones/Bailly, McFred

W 13, D 8, L6, GF44, GA34, GD10, PTS 47

Scored less, conceded more and just 3 pts ahead at the same stage.

 

[Yakuza_devils]

After 27 matches 22/23 Season with WC winning defenders

W 15, D 5, L 7, GF 41, GA 37, GD 4, PTS 50


After 27 matches 21/22 Season under Rangnick with Maguire/Varane/Lindelof/Jones/Bailly, McFred

W 13, D 8, L6, GF44, GA34, GD10, PTS 47

Scored less, conceded more and just 3 pts ahead at the same stage.

It's pretty shocking if you put it this way. But to be fair he won us Carabao Cup and going into last stages of FA and Europe Cup. He is definitely doing much better than Ole and Rangnick. He is competing all out on all fronts. And it's only his first season.

He was also not being helped by our non existent scouting department and football structure. He was forced to mainly sign from Ajax, Dutch League and a Real Madrid legend.

Next year with proper investment (pray the bastards Glazers will be gone) he should be doing much better.

Next year we have Big 7 and not Big 4 anymore.

 

[Tommy79]

After 27 matches 22/23 Season with WC winning defenders

W 15, D 5, L 7, GF 41, GA 37, GD 4, PTS 50
After 27 matches 21/22 Season under Rangnick with Maguire/Varane/Lindelof/Jones/Bailly, McFred
W 13, D 8, L6, GF44, GA34, GD10, PTS 47
Scored less, conceded more and just 3 pts ahead at the same stage.

Hmm, Rangnick EPL record according to the Premier League's website, is played 24, won 10 games in the league and not 13 as you claim, drew seven, and lost seven, 33 scored and 33 against, so please if you are going to use stats to attack ETH at least get them right.


https://www.premierleague.com/managers/48399/Ralf-Rangnick/overview

 

[croadyman]

Judging from the comments here, safe to say that ETH's honeymoon period is over. His honeymoon lasted longer than Ole's.

Just pray that he is the real deal rather than another Ole. As many have said, he has been lucky this year Chelsea and Liverpool somehow can't get their shit together. Next year will be much more competitive with City, Arsenal, Newcastle, Spurs, Chelsea, Liverpool and Man Utd fighting for Top 4.

Next season we really need 2 ST and 2 MF as minimum. WW, Martial, McT, Sabizter, Fred are not players to challenge the Big 7 next year.

Would you take the likes of Thuram/Dembele as a backup striker provided we got a Kane/Osimhen as starter.

Presume you are talking about 2 midfielders being made up of a backup for Casa and a number 8 to partner him.

Just praying that Erik doesn't get forced into second best players again due to the ownership farce still not sorted out.

 

[croadyman]

I wrote off this season before it even started considering last season and the Ronaldo affair.

For me results don't matter as long as we can make progress. So far I'm absolutely happy with ETH. Surely he made some mistakes here and there, he's new to the league and human after all. But overall his performance has been top imo. The most important thing is he has fixed our culture, handled the dressing room really well and implemented a progressive modern football. It's been ages since SAF we would dominate and win against the smaller clubs with ease on a regular basis. And he won a cup too it's our first silveware like in 6,7 years.

I have no doubt he'd win the league next season if we can buy a top midfielder and a top #9 this summer.

Erik needs more than that to win league

 

[city-puma]

After 27 matches 22/23 Season with WC winning defenders

W 15, D 5, L 7, GF 41, GA 37, GD 4, PTS 50


After 27 matches 21/22 Season under Rangnick with Maguire/Varane/Lindelof/Jones/Bailly, McFred

W 13, D 8, L6, GF44, GA34, GD10, PTS 47

Scored less, conceded more and just 3 pts ahead at the same stage.

It looks aweful but the data you listed lack of context.
This season in the cup competitions, as compared to last season, we played 5 more league cup games, 3 more FA cup games, 2 more European games (Barca). In total, it’s 10 more games. And those 10 more games result in us playing two games every week. We started to lose players to injuries and suspensions, ie, our squad depth was depleted. The drop in performance level started just before the winning of league cup. It’s really a squad depth issue so that we can’t handle such a dense game schedule.

 

[ti vu]

After 27 matches 22/23 Season with WC winning defenders

W 15, D 5, L 7, GF 41, GA 37, GD 4, PTS 50


After 27 matches 21/22 Season under Rangnick with Maguire/Varane/Lindelof/Jones/Bailly, McFred

W 13, D 8, L6, GF44, GA34, GD10, PTS 47

Scored less, conceded more and just 3 pts ahead at the same stage.

3​	Chelsea FC	27​	14​	9​	4​	52:23​	29​	51​
4​	Arsenal FC	27​	15​	3​	9​	42:34​	8​	48​
5​	Tottenham Hotspur	27​	15​	3​	9​	40:32​	8​	48​
6​	Manchester United	27​	13​	8​	6​	44:34​	10​	47​
7​	West Ham United	27​	13​	6​	8​	46:34​	12​	45

Context: After this we still had many tough opponents ahead: Man City, Tottenham, Arsenal, Chelsea, Liverpool, Everton, Leicester. We know how it turned out. Already out of all other competitions. With the easy run of opponent before week game 28, we could have taken over Chelsea for third place last season at this point, but we didn't make the most of the fixture list.

Final table reads

3​	Chelsea FC	38​	21​	11​	6​	76:33​	43​	74​
4​	Tottenham Hotspur	38​	22​	5​	11​	69:40​	29​	71​
5​	Arsenal FC	38​	22​	3​	13​	61:48​	13​	69​
6​	Manchester United	38​	16​	10​	12​	57:57​	0​	58​
7​	West Ham United	38​	16​	8​	14​	60:51​	9​	56​

So 11 points in the next 11 games. -10 GD for this 11 game run after conceding extra 23 goals.

Back to ETH, I had maintained my view that we're not entirely on different level from previous regime several time in different threads. The "we're back" bridgade jumped the wagon. We're pretty much still in rebuild foundation phase. It's a good foundation to build on success/trophy. It's to be seen we can build on the initial smaller success and make other step next.

 

[AshRK]

I still think we will finish top 4 but not convincingly like we all thought in early March. I think we will limp to top 4. Our next 2 games are very important. Anything less than 6 points would be concerning.

Let us wait till end of the season before judging whether good or bad.

 

[city-puma]

People loosing belief now should watch again our games against Barca. They showed quite a lot of what we are heading to. Remember that even in Fergie era, we could rarely play them toe-to-toe, across their different era with Rivaldo, Ronaldino, and Messi.

 

[Sir Erik ten Hag]

People loosing belief now should watch again our games against Barca. They showed quite a lot of what we are heading to. Remember that even in Fergie era, we could rarely play them toe-to-toe, across their different era with Rivaldo, Ronaldino, and Messi.

That's what 10 years of disaster would do to anyone. We've had too many false dawns that we suffer from a reverse "Boy cry wolf" syndrome now.

 

[Bebestation]

It’s just losing Casemiro & Eriksen whilst arguably also not having a striker.

It’s just too much shit instead of quality.

 

[redcafe_reader]

We have lost every game away against the top 9 teams. But it’s always the players and only the players. Ok, no point discussing then

Can you actually afford to do so? I am sure you will come back now and again to tell us how ETH is the one to blame and to "I don't want to defend our player BUT"

I keep saying how every single manager will lose the PR war again our players, as they are experts on it and have the whole media behind them, and this guy is a prime example.

Let's just sack ETH, and rehire Ole so we can win some occasional big games, win no title or cup, and our media will tell us everything is fine and our players are actually great. Let's also give them 500k per week just in case.

 

[Judas]

Judging from the comments here, safe to say that ETH's honeymoon period is over. His honeymoon lasted longer than Ole's.

Just pray that he is the real deal rather than another Ole. As many have said, he has been lucky this year Chelsea and Liverpool somehow can't get their shit together. Next year will be much more competitive with City, Arsenal, Newcastle, Spurs, Chelsea, Liverpool and Man Utd fighting for Top 4.

Next season we really need 2 ST and 2 MF as minimum. WW, Martial, McT, Sabizter, Fred are not players to challenge the Big 7 next year.

Wont happen. Every year people say this, it’s never the case. Not all of those top teams will be firing on all cylinders. At least one or more won’t be at their best.

 

[Longshanks]

The disparity between our home form and away from is alarming. We have been terrible away from home so far this season even in the games we have won we haven't been great.

And at home in all honesty although our results are great our performances on the most part have been patchy. Winning moments and defending deep well.

Far from finished article, much work to do. Interesting though that in a previous regime all the problems we are seeing was blamed on the coaching.... Now of course it's the players.

 

[nainaisson]

We just have too many gaps in our first XI right now. We're missing our entire central midfield, and a striker. That's the spine of a team. We can't get the forwards involved because one is championship-level and no one can pass to the other 3.

Get Eriksen, Casemiro and Martial back and we're a totally different prospect.

If we got back the Martial from three years ago, maybe, but the current version is totally shot. I'll be amazed if he manages 60 minutes in any game for the rest of the season.

 

[A-man]

I wrote off this season before it even started considering last season and the Ronaldo affair.

For me results don't matter as long as we can make progress. So far I'm absolutely happy with ETH. Surely he made some mistakes here and there, he's new to the league and human after all. But overall his performance has been top imo. The most important thing is he has fixed our culture, handled the dressing room really well and implemented a progressive modern football. It's been ages since SAF we would dominate and win against the smaller clubs with ease on a regular basis. And he won a cup too it's our first silveware like in 6,7 years.

I have no doubt he'd win the league next season if we can buy a top midfielder and a top #9 this summer.

Making progress is my number one also, however my absolute lowest level of that is at least top-4. Winning the cup was nice and a good achievement, but not a measure of progress considering the teams we faced.
Over the last years, we have finished 2nd in the league twice, played two EL finals and won one, plus won the League cup once. I want a step up from that result wise. I am more than willing to give him time, since I finally see a coach with a plan, and a plan I like, but I won’t call it success until we are established as top-4 and seriously fight for the PL title.

Two years ago we went to EL final and finished 2nd in the league, basically playing every match with the players who now sit on the bench. We have a squad good enough for a top position.

There are things that matter outside of the league. So far we are meeting expectations in the league, achieving targets, whatever you want to say. We are on pace for 3rd, we are favourites for 3rd, and every other top 4 competitor would rather be in our position in the top 4 fight, as our fixture list remaining is by far the easiest.

In the cups, Ten Hag has won 1 trophy, in the semi final for the FA Cup, and in the quarter finals for the Europa League. First season in the club after needing to shake up a lot of the club, probably finishing 3rd and winning 1, maybe 2 or even 3 trophies? Yes, that is literally exceeding expectations.

If we finished 3-4 it’s good although not a huge process but it’s ok to take small steps. It’s good that we can achieve well in cups, that experience is needed later when we want to fight for the CL. But as written above, I personally want a step up from the last years. Hopefully we will see that but I can’t say we have so far.

 

[Dec9003]

Style of play has taken a down swing with the build up of fixtures for sure. But also - its a mix and match squad, we have injuries and suspensions to key players where the system doesn't have adequate backups, other players who are there because we have nobody else, and so on. It's hard to criticize style of play when we had plenty of games where it very good, very clear patterns.. and then recently seeing it decline with no eriksen (our only reliable passer in midfield), no casemiro (our only DM), weghorst being our only striker as Martial is perma crocked...

We play de Gea every week and likely will next season too, yet a ball playing goalkeeper is vital for Ten Hags system. As is a press resistant deep midfielder. And we likely won't have either next season. It's about incremental improvements while ten hag tries to get the results despite not having his own squad that fits him.

Just out of interest, how would you define the very clear patterns in Ten Hag’s setup at United? I agree that he doesn’t have the ideal squad for him, but from what he’s said he would like to keep players like De Gea, so I have less sympathy at that point.

 

[erikcred]

People loosing belief now should watch again our games against Barca. They showed quite a lot of what we are heading to. Remember that even in Fergie era, we could rarely play them toe-to-toe, across their different era with Rivaldo, Ronaldino, and Messi.

Well yeah, probably because they had Rivaldo, Ronaldin(h)o, Messi. I don't think our "toe-to-toe" performance against a mediocre Barca is quite making your point.

I want to see performances that ETH's Ajax put up in that CL run to the semis. Against truly big names. And I'm happy to give him time.

 

[ForeverRed1]

Exceeded expectations? What did you expect? For me, every season outside top 4 is huge disappointment. Huge.

I never expected a trophy by April and to still be in the semi and quarter final of two others along with top 4. Of course every season outside of the top 4 is a disappointment but we don’t always make it. Chelsea and liverpool are having freak seasons but if they weren’t what’s to say we’d be there? Next season if they sort out their issues, tottenham get a good manager and Newcastle spend big, you’ve then got city, arsenal, liverpool, Chelsea, tottenham, Newcastle and us all wanting a top 4 spot. Top 4 isn’t a given at all. Easily the toughest league in the world when you look at it.

so yes, this season so far, isn’t bad at all for his first go at it, with the squad he has.

 

[Skills]

The most worrying thing for me is he doesn’t seem to be able to motivate the team at the moment.

A top manager gets players running through walls for him.

I’m extremely worried at the moment. We desperately need a decisive win against Brentford to get back on the right track.

I think he might have used a lot of the emotional goodwill tbh. We've been thumped so many times now, and his way of getting a reaction has always been the same (questioning their desire etc), that it must get tiring. The players have responded, but even they realise that everytime they're away from home against a top team they're thoroughly outclassed and that's not just due to desire and attitude.

 

[RazorOz]

The way some people are talking is like top 4 is gone. We're still in a position where we'd pretty much have to throw it away to not finish top 4 from here. 2 games in hand on Tottenham, have already played all of the top 3 + Liverpool twice. Yes, we're not playing well atm, but it was only about a month ago Newcastle couldn't buy a win, now people are talking like it's a given they finish top 4. It won't take much for us to get back on track and look in a much better position.

 

[sugar_kane]

On the pitch it looks a bit like the players have accepted that they’re playing too many games to maintain a decent standard of football or that they can’t win without Casemiro.

It’s Erik’s job to get them to snap the feck out of that mode of thinking.

He needs to be mindful as well of maintaining his aura given how mentally weak this group is. He needs to be seen as the calm, measured tactician for them to believe. He doesn’t need to be infallible but persisting with Wout or doing mad shit like subbing both Varane and Martinez at once will quickly erode the faith in his leadership that our season so far has generated:

 

[OJKernow]

Some of the comments in this thread man!

1. Carabao Cup win - First silverware in six years
2. FA Cup Semi Final still to play
3. Europa League Quarter Final still to play
4. 5th in the league, level on points with 3rd and 4th, with two games in hand over 4th

This is clear progress, and we have been competing on all fronts this season which recently has shown the lack of depth in the squad as we pick up injuries, suspensions and general fatigue from playing twice a week, almost every week.

The team, on the whole over the season have been much better on the eye, with obvious patches where standards and performances have slipped (and some shocking results too admittedly). But on the main, it's been so so much better. You can see that ETH has a plan, even when it doesn't always work, and you can tell he's no nonsense and will have no issue shipping anyone out who he doesn't think fits his system or mentality.

A few years ago, Roy Keane said leopards don't change their spots when it comes to performances getting managers sacked, and it's clear there are still characters in the squad who fall into that camp. I expect a few departures and signings again in the summer, but as it's not football manager, mass clear-outs, and signing a whole new squad of players doesn't happen in one season, so as always, patience is important.

 

[Nou_Camp99]

I wouldn’t be downheartened if we finish 5th with just a League Cup.

Don’t forget we are seriously handicapped by having to sack Ronaldo and due to the ownership situation, not being able to afford an adequate replacement, meaning we’ve had to sign a striker on loan from a Championship team(!). We have another striker who’s been out for over 30 games this season so far and we have another striker who’s on suspension for allegedly being a scumbag.

Plus a potential new ownership with plenty of cash to spend and the Glazers finally gone is akin to winning the league in my opinion.

The ownership situation isn't the reason we didn't properly replace Ronaldo. We are dangerously close to breaking FFP rules.

 

[MadMike]

Can you actually afford to do so? I am sure you will come back now and again to tell us how ETH is the one to blame and to "I don't want to defend our player BUT"

I keep saying how every single manager will lose the PR war again our players, as they are experts on it and have the whole media behind them, and this guy is a prime example.

Let's just sack ETH, and rehire Ole so we can win some occasional big games, win no title or cup, and our media will tell us everything is fine and our players are actually great. Let's also give them 500k per week just in case.

What an atrocious post, this is. I never said sack ETH. And I was never a fan of Ole as manager. I'm simply criticising him because I want him to do better for the sake of the team and I have specific criticisms of his tactics and team selection. Playing 4-2-3-1 with Weghorst upfront is clearly not leading to good results away from home and we've been bleeding points in the league for quite a while now.

It's also rather bizarre behaviour attributing everything good that happens to the manager and everything bad that happens to the players. Have a word with yourself, if you can.