Hard to think of anyone in F1 I feel less sorry for. Those dominant Mercs covered up his personal failings for years.What a dramatic race! This is why you don't switch off until the very end.
I do feel for Bottas, he got the blame for the wheel mishap a few weeks ago and Toto tried to deflect blame when it was Hamilton's fault today. I love Lewis but Bottas is treated like such an afterthought.
He'll never get an offer to go to Red Bull again, I think those bridges have been burnt. The only step I feel he'll make is to Alpine in the future.Also the Gasly redemption arc continues, he's been so impressive back at Alpha Tauri. It's just a matter of time before he'll get a bigger seat if he doesn't want to wait for a Red Bull opening again. However I'm not sure there are many midfield cars better than the Alpha Tauri at the moment, but that can all change next year.
I think if he keeps performing as he does, or even improving, he may have to get an offer to go back there, probably when they decide to move on from Perez. However I'm not sure Gasly will stick around that long or even be willing to go back to the team where you will be in Verstappen's shadow. I agree Alpine would make sense, there's the obvious French connection, however presently that would be a step down so a move like that would massively depend on the fortunes of each team after the new regulations. Alpine being a works team certainly has the potential on paper.He'll never get an offer to go to Red Bull again, I think those bridges have been burnt. The only step I feel he'll make is to Alpine in the future.
He burned his bridges internally with the team, and specifically Adrian Newey, I'm pretty confident they won't be offering him anything again. He would have been ahead of Perez in the picking ground after his best ever season last year. That should tell you everything about his relationship internally with Red Bull.I think if he keeps performing as he does, or even improving, he may have to get an offer to go back there, probably when they decide to move on from Perez. However I'm not sure Gasly will stick around that long or even be willing to go back to the team where you will be in Verstappen's shadow. I agree Alpine would make sense, there's the obvious French connection, however presently that would be a step down so a move like that would massively depend on the fortunes of each team after the new regulations. Alpine being a works team certainly has the potential on paper.
Bottas is not solid. Look at Perez protecting Max from Hamilton at the front 3 while Bottas was back in 10th place!I'm wondering whether they will give Bottas a new Chassis. This has happen in the past before where a driver and team cannot workout what is wrong with one car out of the pair. A new Chassis is built (at a cost of something like £750,000) and suddenly the struggling driver isnt struggling anymore.
Also if as i expect Lewis signs on for another 2 years, i think he may request/demand/ask that Bottas remain in the team. After all he has Bottas under control and the relationship in the garage is much better than it was with Rosberg. A young hungry, with a point to prove Russell isnt what Lewis needs for next two seasons while he fights Max and whoever else for WDC's. A solid no2 like Bottas is what he will want beside him.
Surely if he's on the way out the team he should step up so he can get signed?Mercedes shouldn’t bend over to Hamilton just “because” and to be honest I very much doubt Hamilton would demand anything in regards to his team mate.
This season so far has proved you need two drivers on top form to succeed. Bottas for me is driving like a guy that knows he’s on the way out the team.
He's a confidence driver, he has never been good once his confidence is knocked. If he leaves Mercedes one of the mid pack will pick him up just to get some Mercedes knowledge for a season or two, he's still a quick driver on his day, he just has no business being in a top car anymore.Surely if he's on the way out the team he should step up so he can get signed?
Fair point. He has been terrible.He's a confidence driver, he has never been good once his confidence is knocked. If he leaves Mercedes one of the mid pack will pick him up just to get some Mercedes knowledge for a season or two, he's still a quick driver on his day, he just has no business being in a top car anymore.
Except if Bottas brings in a lot of sponsorship money, why would anyone want to hire him for 2022 if Mercedes kick him out? He's not up-and-coming, a proven winner, or anything like that. Given his performances over the past few years, why would anyone think he'd be a good addition to the team?Toto doing what Toto does, there was no defending Lewis and he admitted his mistake.
Bottas is a strange one, its like he has given up, its no secret he is going at the end of the season, he will get another drive in 2022 I have no doubt, could be s swap for Russell at Williams, could they do it during this season, I dont think so , but stranger things have happened in F1.
Nice post, some excellent points, when he is on form Bottas is an excellent driver, if he had been in the Merc and Lewis, I think he would have had 1 maybe 2 WC.We'll find out for definite by the summer break as Mercedes said they will finalise their line up for next season by the summer.
I think Lewis will extend for 2 years and Bottas will be extended for 1 more season possibly his last after this with Mercedes.
Two reasons for this, 1) Keeping Lewis happy. Bottas is a known quantity for Lewis, Russell isnt.
2) More importantly, the biggest changes in F1 for 30 years. Ground Effect areo returns after being banned in 1982. 18 inch tyres, no tyre blankets, torsion bars, heave springs and inerters banned. Gearboxs frozen from development till 2025. Engines frozen from development till 2026. One set of pads and discs per race. Cars in park femme from start of FP3. Sliding scale for aero wind tunnel time and CAD time depending on how well you do in the Constructors championship the season just ending. Theres loads more stuff, without doubt the biggest changes for 30 years to F1.
The cars will be heavier and slower by up to 4-6 seconds compared to this season. All of the above mean its essential that you have known reference points for your new cars. Hence i think Bottas will stay as he is a known reference for the team, experienced and Russell isnt. Otherwise if it wasn't for the huge rule changes id expect to see Russell in the other seat.
Regardless, someons is going to nail / come up with a unique idea ala brawn double diffuser and no-one knows who that will be. You can't really rule any team out. Therefore stability in your driver lineup will be key, hence i expect to see pretty much the same lineup for all the teams next season. Its why Alonso came back and went to Alpine and Seb to Aston Martin because you might just get luckily for one season and end up a WC like Button did with Brawn.
Long winded explanation of why i think Bottas will stay next season. Btw personally i don't rate him as a driver.
All good points, my only thoughts in the other direction is would Mercedes potentially risk Russell moving to another team for the sake of another year of Bottas.We'll find out for definite by the summer break as Mercedes said they will finalise their line up for next season by the summer.
I think Lewis will extend for 2 years and Bottas will be extended for 1 more season possibly his last after this with Mercedes.
Two reasons for this, 1) Keeping Lewis happy. Bottas is a known quantity for Lewis, Russell isnt.
2) More importantly, the biggest changes in F1 for 30 years. Ground Effect areo returns after being banned in 1982. 18 inch tyres, no tyre blankets, torsion bars, heave springs and inerters banned. Gearboxs frozen from development till 2025. Engines frozen from development till 2026. One set of pads and discs per race. Cars in park femme from start of FP3. Sliding scale for aero wind tunnel time and CAD time depending on how well you do in the Constructors championship the season just ending. Theres loads more stuff, without doubt the biggest changes for 30 years to F1.
The cars will be heavier and slower by up to 4-6 seconds compared to this season. All of the above mean its essential that you have known reference points for your new cars. Hence i think Bottas will stay as he is a known reference for the team, experienced and Russell isnt. Otherwise if it wasn't for the huge rule changes id expect to see Russell in the other seat.
Regardless, someons is going to nail / come up with a unique idea ala brawn double diffuser and no-one knows who that will be. You can't really rule any team out. Therefore stability in your driver lineup will be key, hence i expect to see pretty much the same lineup for all the teams next season. Its why Alonso came back and went to Alpine and Seb to Aston Martin because you might just get luckily for one season and end up a WC like Button did with Brawn.
Long winded explanation of why i think Bottas will stay next season. Btw personally i don't rate him as a driver.
Theres nowhere to go to though. Everyone is pretty much locked in for 2022 other than Mercedes. Besides Russell is contracted to Mercedes stable and on loan to Williams.All good points, my only thoughts in the other direction is would Mercedes potentially risk Russell moving to another team for the sake of another year of Bottas.
Real reason Red Bull called for the red flag was to get Perez in to change tires without dropping a place and also to see if the rest of the race could be called off. If the race gets called off, they'll take the position from the previous lap which would have meant Max gets the win.Yeah, they occasionally do a transcript as well as the audio and I enjoy that. Shame they don't do it more cos we do miss out on so much. I've really enjoyed the new team/race director radio, wasn't sure at first but getting to hear the Red Bull guy calling for the red flag so everyone could change tyres was especially great, partly so we could find out it was for that and not just the race director trying to inject some drama but also for the insight of knowing that the failure seemingly came out of nowhere like Silverstone last year.
That said, if they played a lot more driver radio, this thread would become even more unreadable due to all the drivers being accused of "whining" so swings and roundabouts.
There would have been outrage from fans the world round if Max had been given that win despite crashing out. Hotrible ruling the count back is. Should exclude anyone who cause the red flag incident.Real reason Red Bull called for the red flag was to get Perez in to change tires without dropping a place and also to see if the rest of the race could be called off. If the race gets called off, they'll take the position from the previous lap which would have meant Max gets the win.
The reason for the call of the red flag was that he had a significant hydraulic issue that they were managing which, under red flag conditions, they could address and patch up in the pit lane. The tyre call was a bit of a smokescreen. It's why Perez was told to stop the car so quickly after turn one after taking the chequered flag.Real reason Red Bull called for the red flag was to get Perez in to change tires without dropping a place and also to see if the rest of the race could be called off. If the race gets called off, they'll take the position from the previous lap which would have meant Max gets the win.
Yeah, I know Red Bull wanted it to help Perez, it was why race control decided to go for a red flag rather than just continuing with a safety car given that a red flag is normally thrown if there is damage to barriers and I don't think there was. My initial thought was that they didn't want to risk the race ending under a safety car and wanted a more exciting finish, so cynically threw a red flag but pausing the race because half the field might be on unsafe tyres and there'd be no warning if they were about to burst is a much more valid reason. Given Pirelli later said that they found a large cut on Hamilton's rear left, it was 100% the right call from them.Real reason Red Bull called for the red flag was to get Perez in to change tires without dropping a place and also to see if the rest of the race could be called off. If the race gets called off, they'll take the position from the previous lap which would have meant Max gets the win.
To be honest I don't think any of that really makes a difference. There will be zero reference points for the car apart from the powertrain (which Russell already uses)We'll find out for definite by the summer break as Mercedes said they will finalise their line up for next season by the summer.
I think Lewis will extend for 2 years and Bottas will be extended for 1 more season possibly his last after this with Mercedes.
Two reasons for this, 1) Keeping Lewis happy. Bottas is a known quantity for Lewis, Russell isnt.
2) More importantly, the biggest changes in F1 for 30 years. Ground Effect areo returns after being banned in 1982. 18 inch tyres, no tyre blankets, torsion bars, heave springs and inerters banned. Gearboxs frozen from development till 2025. Engines frozen from development till 2026. One set of pads and discs per race. Cars in park femme from start of FP3. Sliding scale for aero wind tunnel time and CAD time depending on how well you do in the Constructors championship the season just ending. Theres loads more stuff, without doubt the biggest changes for 30 years to F1.
The cars will be heavier and slower by up to 4-6 seconds compared to this season. All of the above mean its essential that you have known reference points for your new cars. Hence i think Bottas will stay as he is a known reference for the team, experienced and Russell isnt. Otherwise if it wasn't for the huge rule changes id expect to see Russell in the other seat.
Regardless, someons is going to nail / come up with a unique idea ala brawn double diffuser and no-one knows who that will be. You can't really rule any team out. Therefore stability in your driver lineup will be key, hence i expect to see pretty much the same lineup for all the teams next season. Its why Alonso came back and went to Alpine and Seb to Aston Martin because you might just get luckily for one season and end up a WC like Button did with Brawn.
Long winded explanation of why i think Bottas will stay next season. Btw personally i don't rate him as a driver.
What will a russell ultimatum achieve if there are no seats available other than bottas's seat at Merc next season. Theres a reason why we will have a static grid for next season. All the money is going towards the 2022 cars. Its the biggest chance in god knows how long, to upset the established order.To be honest I don't think any of that really makes a difference. There will be zero reference points for the car apart from the powertrain (which Russell already uses)
The cars are completely changing, what better way than to give Russell his chance to step up on an even playing field?
I think it's clear Russell has given them an ultimatum, give him a chance or let him leave. With the way Bottas is performing right now there is no way they keep him. He's closer to 10th than he is to 1st in nearly all the races this year!
I think Hamilton stays another year, if not 2. Russell will be their lead driver when he goes.
Russell is hot commodity, teams will be fighting to take him if Mercedes released him.What will a russell ultimatum achieve if there are no seats available other than bottas's seat at Merc next season. Theres a reason why we will have a static grid for next season. All the money is going towards the 2022 cars. Its the biggest chance in god knows how long, to upset the established order.
What teams? He's not going to go to Haas who has a worse car than the Williams.Russell is hot commodity, teams will be fighting to take him if Mercedes released him.
Obviously in his situation he'd probably have to be 'content' with another year at Wiliams, but he's making noises already that he's not happy sitting at the back. I don't blame him either.
When he looks across at Norris who was his rival in F2 he's seen him walk into Mclaren and become a star. Russell was just as highly rated if not more at that point, he's done his learning at Williams and needs to take the next step.
I think Mercedes know Bottas is a busted flush now, they'll move him on this summer i'm sure of that.
With 2022 we don't know who will rise to the top yet, Williams might end up being an upper mid table team yet so maybe he'll be happy.What teams? He's not going to go to Haas who has a worse car than the Williams.
All the Ferrari powered teams are out and so are the red bulls. That leaves him with Renault, Aston Martin and McLaren. McLaren aren't going to can Lando for Russell and given how much they're paying for Ric, he's not going to be sacked either. Stroll isn't going to sack his son or a former 4 time world champion who just got them their first ever podium. That leaves him with Alpine, who'll be aiming for Gasly if they're moving on from Ocon, because Alonso brings in way more sponsorship money than Russell.
Honestly the F1 Youtube Channel is pretty good now - they went and got Craig Scarborough, and do some really good technical analysis as well as behind the scenes interviews etc.Are there any F1 sites/YouTube channels/podcasts anyone can recommend? I’ve been watching Drive to Survive on Netflix and realising there’s a lot more behind the scenes that is really interesting
Driver | Team | Time |
---|---|---|
1) Valtteri Bottas | Mercedes | 1:33.448 |
2) Lewis Hamilton | Mercedes | +0.335 |
3) Max Verstappen | Red Bull | +0.432 |
4) Sergio Perez | Red Bull | +0.745 |
5) Esteban Ocon | Alpine | +0.881 |
6) Daniel Ricciardo | McLaren | +1.196 |
7) Fernando Alonso | Alpine | +1.245 |
8) Pierre Gasly | AlphaTauri | +1.251 |
9) Lando Norris | McLaren | +1.259 |
10) Yuki Tsunoda | AlphaTauri | +1.399 |
11) Charles Leclerc | Ferrari | +1.502 |
12) Antonio Giovinazzi | Alfa Romeo | +1.668 |
13) Kimi Raikkonen | Alfa Romeo | +1.687 |
14) Lance Stroll | Aston Martin | +1.827 |
15) Sebastian Vettel | Aston Martin | +1.841 |
16) Carlos Sainz | Ferrari | +1.894 |
17) Nicholas Latifi | Williams | +2.164 |
18) Nikita Mazepin | Haas | +3.203 |
19) Mick Schumacher | Haas | +3.881 |
20) Roy Nissany | Williams | +4.433 |
Driver | Team | Time |
---|---|---|
1) Max Verstapen | Red Bull | 1:32.872 |
2) Valtteri Bottas | Mercedes | +0.008 |
3) Lewis Hamilton | Mercedes | +0.253 |
4) Fernando Alonso | Alpine | +0.468 |
5) Charles Leclerc | Ferrari | +0.678 |
6) Esteban Ocon | Alpine | +0.813 |
7) Pierre Gasly | AlphaTauri | +0.824 |
8) Carlos Sainz | Ferrari | +0.826 |
9) Kimi Raikkonen | Alfa Romeo | +0.914 |
10) Lando Norris | McLaren | +0.950 |
11) Antonio Giovinazzi | Alfa Romeo | +0.959 |
12) Sergio Perez | Red Bull | +1.049 |
13) Yuki Tsunoda | AlphaTauri | +1.083 |
14) Daniel Ricciardo | McLaren | +1.207 |
15) Sebastian Vettel | Aston Martin | +1.575 |
16) Lance Stroll | Aston Martin | +1.760 |
17) George Russell | Williams | +2.394 |
18) Nicholas Latifi | Williams | +2.459 |
19) Mick Schumacher | Haas | +2.640 |
20) Nikita Mazepin | Haas | +2.679 |
Driver | Team | Time |
---|---|---|
1) Max Verstapen | Red Bull | 1:31.300 |
2) Valtteri Bottas | Mercedes | +0.747 |
3) Carlos Sainz | Ferrari | +0.895 |
4) Sergio Perez | Red Bull | +0.938 |
5) Lewis Hamilton | Mercedes | +0.966 |
6) Lando Norris | McLaren | +1.036 |
7) Fernando Alonso | Alpine | +1.324 |
8) Esteban Ocon | Alpine | +1.381 |
9) Pierre Gasly | AlphaTauri | +1.407 |
10) Daniel Ricciardo | McLaren | +1.459 |
11) Charles Leclerc | Ferrari | +1.520 |
12) Antonio Giovinazzi | Alfa Romeo | +1.717 |
13) Lance Stroll | Aston Martin | +1.751 |
14) Sebastian Vettel | Aston Martin | +1.900 |
15) Kimi Raikkonen | Alfa Romeo | +2.028 |
16) George Russell | Williams | +2.064 |
17) Yuki Tsunoda | AlphaTauri | +2.124 |
18) Nicholas Latifi | Williams | +2.284 |
19) Mick Schumacher | Haas | +2.843 |
20) Nikita Mazepin | Haas | +3.342 |