You don’t pay £50m for a backup centre back. And players don’t leave the Italian champions to come and sit on the bench of the team that finished 3rd, at best, in the premier league. He may be better than Maguire (which even in itself is arguable) but he’s definitely not better than Varane or Martinez.
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Who said he would be backup?
As for the last line, I‘m not convinced.
Also we paid more for Maguire and about that for Lindelof
Anyway this is the Maguire thread so moving on
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Thats great has he signed a new deal?
Nothing in the public dormain from him/club.
So what you’re saying is he has a release clause of less than 50m that could be activated. Cool.
If you want me to be in agreement with you on an unauthenticated newspaper report as fact, then you are scraping the barrel here.
I am saying no club can get him for less than 60m this summer.
I'm waiting to be shot down in flames, but I want to pay respects to Harry here. He is obviously the butt of many jokes and moans, but he has never come out moaning and whingeing. He has always acted professionally and , I thought, he had a goix game against Betis. If he had more pace he would be the best in the Premier League. And therein lies the problem. Respect though.
Pace is his weakness but he is not Robinson Crusoe there.
All of our CBs have a weakness but Harry seems to attract the most attention for some strange reason but we can't help that.
Erik relies on him so that is good enough for me.
EtH doesn't rely on him, that's why he is 3rd or 4th choice CB.
He relies on him to be 3rd or 4th choice, surely.
In that case EtH relies on every single squad member.
If he is selected to start then Erik relies on him. The days are gone when a top team just relies on two CBs.
Its a fact he has a release clause hence the club want to renew. If you want to deny that, thats fine
Yeah every player that he puts on the pitch.
Hardly strange the club captain attracts more attention than rest of the squad. Especially as he can't force his way to 1st choice
Yeah, it’s probably a cop out to say ETH relies on every player. CB is a key position. It’s not like wide forward where you can try out a sparky rookie. Maguire is probably first backup to Varane and ETH needs to be able to rely on a certain level when Varane is injured, rested or suspended.
Quite interesting that Maguire is never played at LCB any more, where he always played for us in the past and often for England. He had some brilliant games at LCB. And some shockers of course.
So it is because he is the Captain
Tell me this then...It is obvious that Erik is his own man so why does he still have Harry as Captain?
Sorry, not sure I understand your point. I just said it's not unreasonable a club captain who isn't 1st choice will invite more commentary than other players?So it is because he is the Captain
Tell me this then...It is obvious that Erik is his own man so why does he still have Harry as Captain?
Erik was never going to come in day one and remove the club skipper, especially in what was at the time by all accounts a fractured dressing room. And tbh, from the outside he's been fine as captain, just can't get into 1st choice.
There are no indications that he has already signed a contract renewal. And he has implied in the past that his ultimate dream is to move to the EPL. Of course if Napoli can keep all their players, win the league and make better transfers, he might stay or will extend his contract. However, we are talking about the current situation which is that he has in fact an affordable release clause activating for two weeks next during summer and it would be stupid not to follow his situation in believe that he will certainly extend.
The conversation isn’t primarily about the existence of a clause. It’s about us getting a replacement better than Maguire for less than 60m.
I stand by my statement, Napoli will not sell him for less than 60m this summer.
I am trying to figure out what makes it factual. Because of the source or no one is denied it? I don’t think I’ve come across the the player/agent or club being quoted on this.
Pretty sure thats a significant part of it
Maguire has played 461 mins in league, only player who played less are Garnacho, Martial, Elanga, Sabitzer. So a young kid who was promoted from academy, CM who was signed in Jan and a player who is always injured. If you consider mins played/mins available ratio, Maguire is probably last in the squad.
Overall including PL, Europa, League cup, FA cup Maguire has played 1056 mins, only players who played less are the same players mentioned above.
So if people can come up with "EtH relies on Magurie", whyis it wrong to say EtH relies on every squad member?
He does rely on every squad member. But I think my point was that it is a truism to say it and not a useful statement (even though I said it myself). Yes, if they are in the squad he relies on them in some way even if just to provide competition to the guys who are starting.
In the post you quoted I went on to distinguish between that general kind of reliance to the more specific kind where you are talking about a key position where Maguire is the main back up and probably the main competition for the RCB role, regardless of how many minutes he actually played.
Looks like we’re in some kind of philosophical debate about what the word “rely” means.
Surely if the team he inherits has a fractured dressing room then the first thing that would need attention would be the current Captain?
You and couple of others are making him to look more important than he is. He is the least used squad player when it comes to played/available mins. Even among CBs he is the least used but somehow you and others are trying to imply how EtH relies on him.
Every position is a key position, even if we agree CB is more important position, he is the least used CB and EtH even used Shaw as CB in few games when Maguire was available (IIRC).
Erik inherited the Captain and kept the status quo to give the players a chance to prove themselves to him. Pretty standard practice and good man management.So it is because he is the Captain
Tell me this then...It is obvious that Erik is his own man so why does he still have Harry as Captain?
Do you think Maguire will be Captain next season?
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Inherited a fractured team so keep the status quo and that is good management practice....not sure about that as players have the chance to prove themselves regardless of who the captain is under a new manager but if Harry is still captain after that process then Erik would have deemed he was the man for the job.
It would all depend if he is here next season regarding the captaincy but given the fact that he bought Lisandro to be a starting CB and Varane in good form will automatically take the other spot and Erik knew this early on and still made Harry captain it is anyone's guess.
I think the outcome will be that Harry wants to play on a regular basis and he will not get that at Utd so he will be happy to move to a West Ham or a Spurs and he will not be the sort of player that will sit on the sidelines at our club and just stay for the huge wage.
Erik didn't make Maguire captain. He inherited him as captain. There is a big difference.
If Maguire stays at United next season do you think he will be captain?
So a new manager has to keep the same captain as the previous manager did??
Refer to the second paragraph in my previous post reg your question........I am not a mind reader.
Managers rarely come in and make big changes like changing captains.
I see what’s going on now.
I don’t know what others are saying or how you’ve interpreted it but, as I said, this has turned into a debate about what the word “rely” means.
I’m not saying he is any more or less important than he is.
I wouldn’t dispute the amount of game time he’s had. I already made the point that he is not used at LCB any more. Shaw did great when he played there. If Shaw is selected ahead of Maguire at RCB that will surprise me because Maguire seems to be back up to Varane.
All positions are important but CB is not a place where a rookie like Garnacho, Pellistri, Elanga, or who knows who, might have played more minutes than Maguire so you can’t use minutes alone to say how unimportant Maguire is.
He is very clearly not in ETH’s preferred starting side, everyone knows that, but it seems pretty mean-spirited to go on a crusade to convince everyone that he is the least important player in the squad. I don’t know what you think you’ll gain from it.
I think we were a team that needed big changes
I didn't say he is the least important, I said he played least mins and at the bottom of the list for mins played/mins available.
In this conversation I didn't even talk about his qualities, I jus said EtH doesn't rely on him and if you say EtH relies on him then you can say he relies on every squad player. I don't know how or why it's controversial or argument worthy statement.
Why do you keep saying he has played least minutes when it is not in dispute?
I think ETH is talking him up to sell him
I think it would suit everyone if he left. However, he would need to be replaced with someone better and able to challenge Varane for a starting position.
I don't think he needs to do this to be honest, first choice for his country, and as clear as day that he just doesn't fit what ETH wants from a CB, and tbf he's been kept out by two of the best CB's in the world.
He should be really easy to sell for a decent fee, espcially as he'll want to leave himself.
I have been very impressed with his attitude and behaviour after Ten Hag joined. Very professional and giving his best when given the chance. Don't think he is good enough to be a starter but certainly cannot fault his behaviour.
Fat Ron replaced Wilkins with Robson. That’s the only time I can remember the incumbent captain being ousted at United. Wilkins was perma-crocked at the time.
Bruce was made joint captain with Robson until the latter retired.
I’m not sure it happens often elsewhere. Xakha was sacked as Arsenal captain for acting like a twat towards the fans; something Maguire has never done.
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