Having more possession usually goes hand in hand with doing less running than your opponent because you make the ball do the work for you, whilst your opponent has to spend the majority of the game chasing it. So, I ask again, what is going on that requires so much running?
Jurgen Klopp Sack Watch
- Thread starter Samid
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik @Rood and Imran @Annihilate Now! start with the good news by celebrating Manchester United Women's emphatic FA Cup win over Spurs at Wembley and the future of manager Marc Skinner.
Then it's the bad news and the ever worsening form of our Men with losses to Arsenal and Palace.
Finally the main debate - ETH Out now or keep him until the end of the season - if not longer. Are you Team Nik or Team Imran?
Frankly they are doing better every day, would not be surprise they will win it within 3 years
Attacking with speed and excitement and flashyness
They have an easy Home game next V a team who can't beat Stoke at home
You can do all of that without each player having to make 59 sprints in a game, and run the further than your opposition. The ball will move quicker than any player.Attacking with speed and excitement and flashyness
They do it mainly in order to stop the opposition from having the ball and attacking. It's hugely important for defence. Barcelona also have many sprints. And City too. Modern football is all about moving the ball quickly and pressing the opposition so that they have fewer attacks.
Actually that is a myth. there is no statistical correspondence between 'letting the ball do the work' and distance covered.
Theyre starting to look the real deal. Will drop some silly points but they'll be so good against the big teams.
Cool, I was sure you did too. The comment I made was for other eyes.I do agree with that. Think I said so, too.
edit - didn't I just an' all,
Great to watch I'll say that but still think it's an unsustainable style of football.
A couple of injuries and that pace and creativity will be gone from their attack. That new goalkeeper makes Mignolet look commanding.
A couple of injuries and that pace and creativity will be gone from their attack. That new goalkeeper makes Mignolet look commanding.
Do they have 59 sprints per player, per game though? That just seems an absurdly high number to me.
I get pressing the opposition so that they have fewer attacks, but surely part of that is done while you still have the ball, because you should have forced your opposition in to positions that are far deeper on the pitch, bringing their lines closer together, thus giving them less space to distribute it to a teammate should they win the ball.
I'm not disputing this because I've nothing concrete to counter it with (although I think there is some merit to the ball doing the work
), but where do you actually go about finding stats like this? I've realised that whilst the near 600 sprints per game stat looks insane, I've nothing to compare it to.Despite this, I'm still not convinced this style of play is sustainable.
Showed at Dortmund, pundits at the time were saying it wasn't sustainable and he runs players into the ground.
They won't win the league but it'll be their best season since rafa
588 total sprints
6 games
10 outfield players in each game (not including subs)
9.8 sprints per player per game. Some players will have more sprints than others and with subs the number doesn't seem that high at all really.
The graphic clearly states "sprints per game" and has that number as 588.
Ah christ, so it did. Yeah I see what you mean.
Just happenstance. Was in the news somewhere a few years ago that a team of sports scientists had done a study on whether teams run more or less when in possession.I'm not disputing this because I've nothing concrete to counter it with (although I think there is some merit to the ball doing the work
You still need lots of movement off the ball when you want to turn possession into goalscoring chances. Compared to a deep sitting defence that invites pressure onto the backline and then counterattacks over the whole pitch, possession football needs at least a similar effort off the ball. If you combine it with pressing, you'll have to outrun most of your opponents.
If you're really static in possession, your opponent doesn't really chase the ball. He's just shifting the backline a few meters according to where the ball is and nullifies most of the danger without getting physically tired. Only once your own players start making runs off the ball all the time, the opponent has to chase something.
Yet players of teams in Europe will more than likely (depending on how far their clubs progress) run further over the season. It's a lazy argument to put up that lacks consideration.
Suggest you actually watch a match before commenting. Or maybe you are tactically clueless ? Pretty much everyone knows how we press on the opposition's half.
We'll have to wait and see. I have doubts as to whether you can sustain it though.
I don't think it's possible to compare the Bundesliga back then and the Prem now. Dortmund really only had to be at their best v Bayern. Now the Prem is arguably the most difficult league around.
It's quite conceivable that we will be without Champion's League football again next season based on what City, Liverpool, Spurs and Arsenal have showed so far this season. Obviously that would be catastrophic for our sponsorship deal etc, but it just goes to show that the Prem is difficult for any club.
All the more reason for him to run the legs off the players.
That's what I mean, his training methods and demands from the players had a couple people predicting the huge drop in performance.
Now it won him 2 league titles so I'm sure if I offered that to a Liverpool fan now they'd rip my hand off.
But as you said the prem is a different animal so that drop may happen sooner
You realise he managed Dortmund for 7 years right? This massive drop off only happened in his last season with them, he had a lot of injuries to a lot of key players also. You would have hoped however he would have learned a few things also from that. My main concern atm is we're an injury to Mane away from looking blunt again, we need to replace that pace in behind in the squad, its such a key dimension of our attacking game and the only other player who has that kinda pace in the squad is Ojo and he isnt ready yet.
Xavi used to have the highest distance covered stats in his peak.
City would finish 5th in the Spanish league. The EPL is not that hard, mate.
Barcelona and the Madrid sides are better than City, but Villarreal and Sevilla aren't.
Not that I don't agree with your underlying point.
Did he win the league 7 times no, your post only highlights my point even further, imagine having European football (I know that's hard for Liverpool, jokes, sorry) and then having the prem fixtures, players will fall apart
They looked great against Swansea, but don't think they have enough depth if they suffer injuries.
We looked good in the second half. We were very poor in the first half and Swansea did a good job of stopping us from building any momentum, whilst creating some chances themselves. I think our best performance was Hull at home.
They are a shoe-in for top 4 no matter what happens but looking at their form, they will challenge for the title but its still early in the season. I reckon Tottenham or Chelsea might take their place if they drop off.
Their fixtures over the next few weeks make me think that they could find themselves in a very good position going into Christmas. The issue with Arsenal is how they respond to a setback because when they've had one in the past it's seemed to have a domino effect that see's them drop more points afterwards.
I know the rival banters and all.
But, it is funny people come in and say oh hey they will drop off and lose a lot later because basically they are playing too good now.
Well, we wish we had that kind of problem to worry when we played that kind of football.
But, it is funny people come in and say oh hey they will drop off and lose a lot later because basically they are playing too good now.
Well, we wish we had that kind of problem to worry when we played that kind of football.
We have players under performing where as liverpool are pretty much what you'd expect, I know I'd rather have our manager with our squad
Not the point.
It's a point that makes yours pointless
Nobodies expecting him to win the league 7 times, and yes youre right if we do have CL football next year it remains to be seen how he handles that with an english schedule and no winter break. However as I stated, you would certainly hope that his last season at Dortmund taught him a few things and that he'll be prepared for it. He's a top class manager and if he's as good as he showed at Dortmund, then handling a CL and PL schedule shouldnt be as much of an issue for him as it proved to be for Rodgers. Of course we would bite your hands off for a couple league titles and consistent CL football during his tenure here and if hes as good as the vast majority of people think he is me included, then he'll be able to do that without burning the players out. He's been coaching this way at the highest level for a very long time now, I wouldnt assume hes going to crash and burn anytime soon.
I think he would have, and i was one of his advocates ahead of moyes to replace fergie.
I swear this thread was the same exactly this time last year? Klopp still has a worse win percentage than Rodgers...
I am slightly jealous because some of the football they play is great but that style of football will take it's toll, as it did last year. They have also conceded loads.
Without a winter break it's a miracle if you don't have a few players sidelined with injury by halfway in the PL, let alone playing a style of football that requires both stamina and explosive speed at all times.
I am slightly jealous because some of the football they play is great but that style of football will take it's toll, as it did last year. They have also conceded loads.
Without a winter break it's a miracle if you don't have a few players sidelined with injury by halfway in the PL, let alone playing a style of football that requires both stamina and explosive speed at all times.
oh really?
Liverpool are looking pretty impressive so far but it won't last. Klopp's teams are notorious for burning out towards the end of the season due to the high intensity pressing. They have some good players but no squad depth; this will be their downfall.