I think the mistake today, was playing him from the start. You could tell that him and Maguire weren't used to each other at the start of the game and he grew into it. Unfortunately, that indecision cost us.
6
Season Average Rating
- Appearances
- 45
- Clean sheets
- 20
- Goals
- 1
- Assists
- 0
- Yellow cards
- 10
- Status
Do you actually have stats for that or is this just one of these "Premier league is biggest, fastest , fittest, strongest" statements that some people love.
I don't think it is "hating on Martinez." It's calling a spade a spade to analyse a performance. There isn't a way to dress that up as a good defensive performance, and yes - barging people over in the box asks the ref a question we don't want to be doing too often. That's not going out of the way to find something to criticise, it was a clear as day mistake.
As long as it's kept in perspective, it's his debut at OT, the team didn't play well, he did some good things on the ball, then I don't see the problem. Sancho became a protected species last season because he was a new player - that's the other danger with analysing new signings.
Absolutely terrible performance. Very fortunate not to concede a penalty in the 2nd half. Hopeless first half. Almost comical the way he got booked at the end of the first half, having had possession of the ball. Welbeck treated the Martinez/Maguire partnership as a joke, could do whatever he wanted.
Being so short is a big enough issue for the team that Martinez simply cannot afford to be so poor at every other aspect of the game. He was a massive liability, as was his CB partner.
Being so short is a big enough issue for the team that Martinez simply cannot afford to be so poor at every other aspect of the game. He was a massive liability, as was his CB partner.
Brilliant on the ball.. but he will struggle defensively.
Damn you people that compare him to Blind.
He was poor on the ball as well. I don't know what you guys were watching.
He played a couple of hospital passes, and let the ball roll under his foot once.
He played a couple of hospital passes, and let the ball roll under his foot once.
I have stated multiple times we will see him as DM by October. I will change that to second half of September, because he's better on the ball and worse off the ball and at actual defending 1on1 to what I expected.
I also believe no money thrown at CBs will solve our problems without having some structure and decent quality midfield - the weakest link. For this reason I didn't get very excited when he joined.
Was a bad decision to start him though, what happened to Lindelof?
I also believe no money thrown at CBs will solve our problems without having some structure and decent quality midfield - the weakest link. For this reason I didn't get very excited when he joined.
Was a bad decision to start him though, what happened to Lindelof?
Showed good technique early on. Clearly a DM and not a centre back in this league.
Everybod should remember how bad EVRA Was on his Debut!!!
and see how he turned out!
and see how he turned out!
I thought Martinez played fairly well. His passing was good and I felt his play made Maguire at least try to be a bit more ambitious in his passing. Grew into the game and def needs some work. Would certainly be interested in seeing him in midfield in the future. Don’t understand the negativity esp when he was one of the only ones trying to rise to the challenge instead of shrinking away like others
Honestly though, we can have the debate about "Was Martinez better or worse than Maguire today" until the cows come home, the reality is that neither of them were causing the bulk of our problems today.
United NEED to stop trying to fix every defensive problem we have by signing new centre backs and start actually attempting to sort out the root of the problem, which is a midfield incapable of controlling a game or effectively protecting the defence and a keeper who is not proactive in the slightest.
United NEED to stop trying to fix every defensive problem we have by signing new centre backs and start actually attempting to sort out the root of the problem, which is a midfield incapable of controlling a game or effectively protecting the defence and a keeper who is not proactive in the slightest.
you people have a real DM fetish 
He's not going to play as DM, maybe when everybody else is injured.
He's not going to play as DM, maybe when everybody else is injured.You never had a clue about football. Stick to something you understand better.
They endlessly lumped it up to Martinez to lose a header, which is not ideal but whatever, but they always surrounded him to just pick up the knockdown and our surrounding players just stood and watched. Every time. They had so much time and space to pick up every second ball it was annoying and painfully obvious.
At 5'9" he's too short to play CB in PL, today's game clearly showed thatyou people have a real DM fetish
He's a baller, our midfield is as shit as they come.
He didn't produce a brilliant performance by any means but he was the least of our problems today. Probably the only player apart from Eriksen who looked comfortable on the ball throughout.
Doesn’t look like the quickest player around. If you’re going to have a midget at the back, you’d at least hope he’s very quick and nimble. All the more so when he’s paired with the human fridge in Maguire.
Some good, plenty of bad.
Fantastic composure and ability to play out of pressure with the ball, very aggressive and combative, will win a lot of duels, great attitude and in a dominant team he will be a superb ball winning CB keeping attacks going but he needs to adapt to the pace and physicality of the PL.
Welbeck gave him, and Maguire, a bit of a chasing for the first hour, held up the ball superbly and then spun behind to great effect. A high line with 2 players in Maguire and Lisandro who both lack top end recovery speed is going to cause issues. Should have given away a pen for the barge on Welbeck, another one in the long list of dubious VAR nonsense.
Still, first game, like a lot of what I saw.
Fantastic composure and ability to play out of pressure with the ball, very aggressive and combative, will win a lot of duels, great attitude and in a dominant team he will be a superb ball winning CB keeping attacks going but he needs to adapt to the pace and physicality of the PL.
Welbeck gave him, and Maguire, a bit of a chasing for the first hour, held up the ball superbly and then spun behind to great effect. A high line with 2 players in Maguire and Lisandro who both lack top end recovery speed is going to cause issues. Should have given away a pen for the barge on Welbeck, another one in the long list of dubious VAR nonsense.
Still, first game, like a lot of what I saw.
Which was always the main issue during his transfer thread before the oh so tedious height joke circus began. Small, can be worked around, slow can be worked around, small and slow is a problem.
That barge on Welbeck was a penalty. ETH will be roasted on a grill if Lisandro does not improve fast.
To be fair both aren't really that slow. Welbeck's movement created more of an issue than his pace did. They just didn't anticipate as well, which if we are being generous can forgive for lack of playing time together.
Having a keeper rooted to his line meaning if defender's play a high line, they need to cover 30-50 yards instead of 20-35 makes a big difference too.
That is very true, there were a few times today when Brighton just lifted the ball down the channel on a diagonal and Welbeck was just running away from Lisandro/Maguire, maybe a more aggressive sweeper keeper deals with a few of those.
Maguire is slow on the turn and to get going but probably has decent top speed when he gets going, but it takes so long to get there that he is effectively slow. Lisandro is quick and agile in the short distances and in reacting to breaking balls but over distance he lacks top speed. Not a good combination in a high line for the PL to me but we will see, need to get full backs more switched on to help and the midfield spaces can not be as stretched as they were today.
Welbeck put on an exceptional CF display today, unselfish running, hold up and linking, playing for the team. Superb stuff, put another 15-20 games of that together and he might go to the World Cup.
Fair to remember he's played about 45 minutes in pre season and barely trained 2 weeks? He did pretty well considering he must be lacking sharpness.
And all good decisions can be made off the back of one game of course
If he plays CB all season we won't finish top 6. I know it's been said a million times and become a bit of a meme but he's just not big enough. Ivan Toney and Darwin Nunez are going to ruin him.
He actually dealt with Nunez just fine last season.
he's actually dealt with a lot of big physical strikers just fine, but for some reason people have it in their heads that the PL is so much bigger and stronger than anywhere else.
I've made a few jokes about his height but I don't think that was an issue at all today.
He was mostly fine other than losing the ball in midfield once (through over confidence) and nearly conceding a pen whilst on a yellow.
New league and new team mates. Give him a month or two before really judging.
He was mostly fine other than losing the ball in midfield once (through over confidence) and nearly conceding a pen whilst on a yellow.
New league and new team mates. Give him a month or two before really judging.
If Varane can get fit, I'd like to see him tried in the pure DM role.
He struggled with Welbeck today and should have conceded a pen too. He should be playing in DM role for me as he has the passing ability for it and defensive discipline to do it.
he's actually dealt with a lot of big physical strikers just fine, but for some reason people have it in their heads that the PL is so much bigger and stronger than anywhere else.
He's not even quick either so not only is he on the small side he's not even fast and we have Harry Maguire as his partner.
Reckon it was a forced decision? Lindelof was not on the bench as well. Was he injured? I was pretty sure he would start this game.
He doesn't really inspire confidence at the back but he dealt with a couple of tricky situations okay when we threw everyone forward in the second half.
Passing / control was really good on several occasions but it does feel like he needs some time to get used to the league.
Passing / control was really good on several occasions but it does feel like he needs some time to get used to the league.
He was poor. Over enthusiastic and nervous. But its his first game, who remembers Vidic Evra debuts in far better sides.
I thought he grew as the game went on. He is the one player I am excited about this summer. The positive side was he wanted to do things on the ball, he tried to organise the defense and shout at people and he wants to get stuck in.
Poor start, but I see a player there which bar Bailly I havent seen in a defensive signing for us in soem time....yeah maybe that isnt a good comparison as he has been poor.
I thought he grew as the game went on. He is the one player I am excited about this summer. The positive side was he wanted to do things on the ball, he tried to organise the defense and shout at people and he wants to get stuck in.
Poor start, but I see a player there which bar Bailly I havent seen in a defensive signing for us in soem time....yeah maybe that isnt a good comparison as he has been poor.
What he shows today suggests he is still a bit short of match fitness. But he also shows,
1. Very good acceleration
2. Low gravity but also very strong to deal with press
3. Very calm and very good ball control with bags of tricks under pressure to connect with goalkeeper and the other players
4. Very good anticipation
5. Good passing range
He seems an upgrade on Lindeloff.
That’s a wildly optimistic summary of a pretty shit individual performance. You could see glimpses of quality there and he might well go on to be a good player for us. He was pish today though. Spent most of the match being bullied by one of the worst strikers he’ll play against this season.
You say that but he'll be facing our strikers in training week in and week out.
Stam, Vidic, Evra all had far worse starts in my opinion. His height doesn't concern me at all, i'm more worried by him and Maguire having a lack of recovery pace when strikers get in behind.
How he didn't concede a penalty is pretty strange. Got away with one there
How he didn't concede a penalty is pretty strange. Got away with one there
Really poor debut. But its just that; one game. Hopefully he’ll get better in the coming weeks/months.
- Status