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2018-19 Performances


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kouroux

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Then we miss what he can bring deeper in terms of his driving runs and long range passing ability. He has everything needed to succeed, hopefully he plays like a man with something to prove vs Valencia.
I hope so. The man drive me nuts like no other United player has ever. From moments of pure awe to moments of serious "wtf is he doing?"
At the end of the day, I'm a United fan and if Monsieur Pogba doesn't wanna perform at 100% most games then he can go. It's one thing to analyze the elements in our general football that can prevent from being at his best and enjoying himself the most (playing with lots of off the ball movement etc etc..) and another to do your job individually. I have no issue with Jose benching him if it can lead to him getting back on track
 

VJ1762

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The way I see it, Jose has successfully managed to turn a section of the fanbase on two of our most creative attacking players (martial and Pogba), at different points in his 3 years with us.

Do people really forget how clueless we looked in attack when Pogba went off with an injury in a CL group match last year? We were struggling to score and left in the dust by city. And when he came back against Newcastle, it was the first time we looked potent in attack after some time. And same thing after his red card against Arsenal. City came and humiliated us( that was the match City won the title last year imo). With Pogba, things might have been different, as evident in the Emptihad when he dragged us back to victory alongside Sanchez( another player who looks a shadow of his Arsenal days). Are people really still debating the worth of Pogba to the team when our midfield had been crying out for a player of his ilk for how long?( which was a problem even in the final years of SAF's reign, that he even asked Scholesy to come out of retirement.)

I am not saying that Pogba has been blameless during his time here, what with his cryptic tweets and his cnut of an agent, but people are pointing to his one poor performance vs Southampton, whereas he has been our best player in many of our matches this season. Isn't it also Mourinho's job to make sure that the team plays to his strengths? Why can't he put out a midfield of Fred, Pogba and Herrera. Two 'mad dogs' with a decent passing range along with Pogba would make our midfield so much better. Matic clearly looks tired, man has a turning radius of an oil tanker and he has been playing continuously throughout this year. The way Jose has handled players like Martial and Pogba is a far cry from how he handled Zlatan( read Zlatan's autobiography.)
It is clear that Jose's famed man-management skills have not had the desired effect.

Shaking my head at posters saying we would be better off without him. We need to add quality players to the squad, not sell them and start over. Coaches like Conte and Deschamps have not had problems with him, so it's not like there is precedent. We need to see him and Martial under a new manager who won't throw his players under the bus, stifle players by 'playing without the ball' tactics and blame said player for tactical problems.
 

Thepinhead

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Even going by distance covered stats in CL, Pogba covers 10.5Kms per 90 mins, Matic 11.5. That's hardly a big difference.
That is nearly 10%. 10% is a lot on such a high level. If everyone worked 10% harder that could mean the difference between a win and loss.

For a pro cyclist 10% would give you 2 min on a 40 km time trial. Within elite sports you can't afford to play on 80 or 90 %
 

roonster09

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That is nearly 10%. 10% is a lot on such a high level. If everyone worked 10% harder that could mean the difference between a win and loss.

For a pro cyclist 10% would give you 2 min on a 40 km time trial. Within elite sports you can't afford to play on 80 or 90 %
Who said he is playing at 80% or 90%? It's like saying Matic is playing at 80% considering how much Brozovic, Kante covers. This also doesn't include sprints and Pogba makes lot of attacking runs even in the last mins.
 

el3mel

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If there are only one or two players really suited to high pressing, the team can't do it. We've seen what happened with Fred earlier in the season for exactly that reason - he'd press high, the opposition would pass around him and suddenly there would be a huge gap that they'd run into where Fred had left his position while everyone else was sitting deep.

We can cover for one or two players who don't press massively hard, although they would be expected to do more than they do in our normal sit deep and let the opposition come to us style. Martial against Arsenal was the perfect example. He pressed fantastically at times, far better than he normally does. The reason that he could do that is because the rest of the team was also doing it, getting our entire team on the front foot and making it easier for Martial to do it both physically (he wasn't having to also run all the way back every time we lost the ball) and mentally (yes that is somewhat a sign of weakness with him, but it's important to know how to get the best out of your best players).

As such, if the only 'lazier' players we had in our front six were Martial and Pogba and they were surrounded with the likes of Herrera (probably the most important person), Fred, Pereira, Rashford, Lingard and Sanchez, it should work well. But if not many of those players are playing and we're instead putting out a lineup mostly made of Matic, Pogba, Martial, Lukaku, Fellaini, McTominay, Mata, etc...we're not going to be able to press properly and it's exceedingly likely we'll play slow boring football.
Ok, you didn't answer my question : why can't Pogba do the high pressing himself if Herrera and Fred aren't around ?

Maybe when he was younger. He's been exceedingly low-working for years now.
And Pogba is young.
 

joleb

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Pogba is lazy on the field. Come on, surely you guys can see that?

And i dont believe some members are saying that last night game plan was all Pogba s doing!
 

Roboc7

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Pogba wants out which is understandable given his relationship with Mourinho. Shifting blame to Pogba is Mourinho’s last play, it’s woeked temporarily but I think that’s all it is.

What I have never understood is why he chose Matic as partner for Pogba and his insistence on playing Fellaini regularly with one or both of those players as well. Their not suited to playing with each other, don’t think you should ever pick
more than one of them.
 

Sultan

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The Pogba debate very much reminds me of Berbatov and Tevez during their time together at United which very much divided opinion.

You were either a Berbatov or a Tevez fan. Both complete opposites. Berbatov was either depicted as a genius or a wasted talent, Tevez when compared to Berbatov gave his all. It was inspiration versus perspiration. Berbatov could play smoking a cigar and be in his slippers. Tevez was ever scrapping away to succeed. Both successful in their own right.

Pogba is such a genius. An artist. Don't expect him to be a warrior. He thrives when people around him and upfront are on similar wavelengths. Some of the passes he made when Zlatan played were jaw-dropping.
 

Sultan

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Pogba wants out which is understandable given his relationship with Mourinho. Shifting blame to Pogba is Mourinho’s last play, it’s woeked temporarily but I think that’s all it is.

What I have never understood is why he chose Matic as partner for Pogba and his insistence on playing Fellaini regularly with one or both of those players as well. Their not suited to playing with each other, don’t think you should ever pick
more than one of them.
I'd love to see stats when Matic and Fellaini play together. I know my eyes hurt. I'm not sure about the results.
 

Fluctuation0161

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We as fans are obsessed with players who can put a shift in. We don't need that right now. We need quality.

If Pogba had failed for us consistently under a number of managers I would totally get the calls to sell him..

But honestly this is a player that has shown that he has the quality. I love someone like a Fellaini with all that heart. But we need talent. And we need to get the best out of it now.
We need both talent and hard work, actually.

Pogba has been managed terribly.
 

westmeath

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The Pogba debate very much reminds me of Berbatov and Tevez during their time together at United which very much divided opinion.

You were either a Berbatov or a Tevez fan. Both complete opposites. Berbatov was either depicted as a genius or a wasted talent, Tevez when compared to Berbatov gave his all. It was inspiration versus perspiration. Berbatov could play smoking a cigar and be in his slippers. Tevez was ever scrapping away to succeed. Both successful in their own right.

Pogba is such a genius. An artist. Don't expect him to be a warrior. He thrives when people around him and upfront are on similar wavelengths. Some of the passes he made when Zlatan played were jaw-dropping.
I get the point about Berbatov and Tevez and i was in the camp that said that Berba didn’t look bothered. I think it was easier to carry him though because he wasn’t constantly giving the ball away in dangerous areas, ala Pogba. If he is a genius, then he only shows it very fleetingly. I think he is just a bit shy of genius in terms of talent and if he had 10% more honesty / work ethic he’d be a hell of a player.
 

Siddharth

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The Pogba debate very much reminds me of Berbatov and Tevez during their time together at United which very much divided opinion.

You were either a Berbatov or a Tevez fan. Both complete opposites. Berbatov was either depicted as a genius or a wasted talent, Tevez when compared to Berbatov gave his all. It was inspiration versus perspiration. Berbatov could play smoking a cigar and be in his slippers. Tevez was ever scrapping away to succeed. Both successful in their own right.

Pogba is such a genius. An artist. Don't expect him to be a warrior. He thrives when people around him and upfront are on similar wavelengths. Some of the passes he made when Zlatan played were jaw-dropping.
In my opinion, we should first see how he does under another manager before taking a call on him about his long term future here. What do you think?
 

Sultan

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I get the point about Berbatov and Tevez and i was in the camp that said that Berba didn’t look bothered. I think it was easier to carry him though because he wasn’t constantly giving the ball away in dangerous areas, ala Pogba. If he is a genius, then he only shows it very fleetingly. I think he is just a bit shy of genius in terms of talent and if he had 10% more honesty / work ethic he’d be a hell of a player.
Pogba takes risks no arguments. He's the type of player people pay to watch.

I understand Mourinho isn't the type of manager to generally allow such leeway and freedom to players but to players of Pogba's talent he needs to let up. Pogba is a luxury player and has to be given some semblance of freedom to play his expansive and risky game. Keep him away from danger areas. That is why it's been argued he's not being played in his best position. Most of his games at United have been in a Midfield 2 with Matic and only this season he has played in a Midfield 3 consisting of players who are slow out of form and don't give him options. Surround him with players such as Herrera, Fred and Pereira and he'll be a different player. He has proved it at both Juve and France.

He's not the player who'll play safe and within himself. He'd be pointless and would become another Matic or Fellaini.
 

Sultan

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In my opinion, we should first see how he does under another manager before taking a call on him about his long term future here. What do you think?
Definitely!

A world cup and multiple champion at Juventus.
 

MadDogg

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Ok, you didn't answer my question : why can't Pogba do the high pressing himself if Herrera and Fred aren't around ?
Because he's not great at it. He could be a cog in the machine in that regard, but he can't be the main man. And if, as he always is, has the likes of Matic, Lukaku, Martial, Fellaini and Mata all also in there, then we don't have a single player in our team (bar maybe Herrera and even he would struggle) who could do it when lined up with them.

If we lined up correctly, I would expect Pogba (just as Martial did against Arsenal) to do his share. It would still be a bit less than the likes of Herrera, Fred,etc, but he would be compensating for that by obviously providing a lot more on the ball.
 

Marcelinho87

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Involved in more goals than our main striker in less games.

Pogba is potentially our best player but he is frustrating as hell. Not sure he has the mentality to match the intensity required from JM.
 

Moiraine

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He is on his way out. I hope he leaves in January. He is just so lethargic, look at his wages and the effort he is putting in in the past few games.
 

Thepinhead

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Who said he is playing at 80% or 90%? It's like saying Matic is playing at 80% considering how much Brozovic, Kante covers. This also doesn't include sprints and Pogba makes lot of attacking runs even in the last mins.
I haven't seen the stats for sprints. I am just questioning the stats you provided. Looking at the past 2 games it looks like Mourinho want his team to run and sprint more so maybe we shouldn't look at passing stats so much and more at the sprint and running stats. Mourinho clearly want to play more direct and that requires more sprinting and running where as the way LVG played required better ball control and passing abillity.
 

Smores

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The argument over him being unable to play it simply and instead showboating sums Pogba up far more than workrate. I honestly don't think Sir Alex would have put up with him in that regard either.

He'd be one of the best players in the world if he kept things simple rather than wanting to produce showboat clips.
 

Xaviboy

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We all know that when he leaves he will excel at another club as that manager will accomadate him but if mourinho ends up staying then we need to replace Pogba with a player or 2 in the mould of Herrera. The intensity of Herrera pressing and how he keeps the ball moving with one and two touches does make a difference to our play, this is where Pogba struggles always needs that extra touch or 2. Got huge talent but needs to move if Jose stays.
 

GM K

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We need both talent and hard work, actually.

Pogba has been managed terribly.

Pogba has been managed terribly?

Goodness me, Pogba sure needs a babysitter at this rate.

I am all for blaming Jose for everything he has done wrong but come on, Pogba needs to take responsibility at some point in time. I don't think in all my years of watching football, which is about 4 decades, I have seen a player like Pogba that more adjustments have been made in a team to 'unlock his potential'. Formations have been tweaked for Pogba; different partners have been tried for Pogba; different roles have been given to Pogba; the captain's arm band has been tried. Mourinho has praised him. Mourinho has criticized him. Mourinho has taken on ex-United players for him. Etc. I can go on and on.

Anyone who denies Pogba's incredible talent, does not know football. His talent is unbelievable but Pogba is inconsistent. In one game, he is untouchable, in the next, he plays like he doesn't care. That is down to him, not to any manager.
 

haram

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Pogba has been managed terribly?

Goodness me, Pogba sure needs a babysitter at this rate.

I am all for blaming Jose for everything he has done wrong but come on, Pogba needs to take responsibility at some point in time. I don't think in all my years of watching football, which is about 4 decades, I have seen a player like Pogba that more adjustments have been made in a team to 'unlock his potential'. Formations have been tweaked for Pogba; different partners have been tried for Pogba; different roles have been given to Pogba; the captain's arm band has been tried. Mourinho has praised him. Mourinho has criticized him. Mourinho has taken on ex-United players for him. Etc. I can go on and on.

Anyone who denies Pogba's incredible talent, does not know football. His talent is unbelievable but Pogba is inconsistent. In one game, he is untouchable, in the next, he plays like he doesn't care. That is down to him, not to any manager.
Exactly. Jose has done everything to try to motivate Pogba. What more does Pogba need to just play for the club and the fans, forget about the fecking manager.
 

Sing you a song

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The way I see it, Jose has successfully managed to turn a section of the fanbase on two of our most creative attacking players (martial and Pogba), at different points in his 3 years with us.

Do people really forget how clueless we looked in attack when Pogba went off with an injury in a CL group match last year? We were struggling to score and left in the dust by city. And when he came back against Newcastle, it was the first time we looked potent in attack after some time. And same thing after his red card against Arsenal. City came and humiliated us( that was the match City won the title last year imo). With Pogba, things might have been different, as evident in the Emptihad when he dragged us back to victory alongside Sanchez( another player who looks a shadow of his Arsenal days). Are people really still debating the worth of Pogba to the team when our midfield had been crying out for a player of his ilk for how long?( which was a problem even in the final years of SAF's reign, that he even asked Scholesy to come out of retirement.)

I am not saying that Pogba has been blameless during his time here, what with his cryptic tweets and his cnut of an agent, but people are pointing to his one poor performance vs Southampton, whereas he has been our best player in many of our matches this season. Isn't it also Mourinho's job to make sure that the team plays to his strengths? Why can't he put out a midfield of Fred, Pogba and Herrera. Two 'mad dogs' with a decent passing range along with Pogba would make our midfield so much better. Matic clearly looks tired, man has a turning radius of an oil tanker and he has been playing continuously throughout this year. The way Jose has handled players like Martial and Pogba is a far cry from how he handled Zlatan( read Zlatan's autobiography.)
It is clear that Jose's famed man-management skills have not had the desired effect.

Shaking my head at posters saying we would be better off without him. We need to add quality players to the squad, not sell them and start over. Coaches like Conte and Deschamps have not had problems with him, so it's not like there is precedent. We need to see him and Martial under a new manager who won't throw his players under the bus, stifle players by 'playing without the ball' tactics and blame said player for tactical problems.


I can’t remember seeing a post with so many points that I vehemently disagree with !

“ In the emptihad when he dragged us back to victory “ After a 1 st half when he was absolutely useless probably the worst player on the pitch and I for one was staggered that he even came out for the second half and we should be grateful that he decided to put some effort in for the second half if ever a display sums up Pogba it was that ..he doesn’t play for the shirt ,the club , the fans ..just when he feels like it .

“Our team has been crying out for a midfielder of his ilk for years “ yes we have been crying out for a world class midfielder but one that performs consistently at the highest level not one who decides to turn up occasionally and has the worst pass completion rate in the premiership ( up to last weekend he had given the ball away over 250 times this season)

“Mad dog Fred “...are you serious ?

“How Jose handled Zlatan “ Zlatan was the complete team leader on the pitch , leading by example motivating the others and 100% effort every game , The complete opposite of Pogba

“It’s Mourinho job to make sure they plays to Pogba’s strengths “ unbelievable comment ! It is
Pogbas job to do as he is told , play to whatever the team tactics and set up is and put in maximum effort into every minute this in Manchester United for gods sake we shouldn’t pander to one prima donnas demands .

The last 2 games have clearly illustrated that we are better without him ,the team now looks together and committed .

I hope so much we sell him on he will be far better in easier lge like Italy again or Spain when he can play for the dominant team in a crap lge , play at walking pace have the time to make sure his passes go to someone wearing the same shirt and look world class again .The prem is far to tough , fast and aggressive for him
 

el3mel

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Because he's not great at it. He could be a cog in the machine in that regard, but he can't be the main man. And if, as he always is, has the likes of Matic, Lukaku, Martial, Fellaini and Mata all also in there, then we don't have a single player in our team (bar maybe Herrera and even he would struggle) who could do it when lined up with them.

If we lined up correctly, I would expect Pogba (just as Martial did against Arsenal) to do his share. It would still be a bit less than the likes of Herrera, Fred,etc, but he would be compensating for that by obviously providing a lot more on the ball.
He needs to press and track the runners, because these are basic stuff for any midfielder, especially in England. I mentioned this example seveeal times but you can see why Fabregas fell out of favor for Chelsea in CM for some good years now despite his quality. You can't be a midfielder without doing these basic stuff, if you can't, then you need to play away from middle of the park or on the bench.
 

arthurka

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But the thing is, attitude is the most important thing for a professional football player, especially one that plays for United. If Pogba sorts this out, he won't have a problem with his manager and some United fans. He will also become the very best midfielder in the world because he is incredibly gifted.
Do you think half of this isnt down to Mourinho?
 

Litch

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Generally don't know what my assessment of any player but I know 100% in any workplace including football, your relationship with your manager plays a massive impact on your performance. I'm not sure why we question it as even under the great SAF, this has happened. Now I trust SAF motives more that Jose's who has history of using star players to deflect from him ultimately being the problem. Remember the criticism of Hazzard? I know people talk about Pogba's 'attitude' but this is a word I heard used against so many talented players and there is something about these players that separates them from others that can be misplaced or misunderstood.

I'd like to see Pogba under another manager but I think he'll be gone before Jose does....
 
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GM K

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Do you think half of this isnt down to Mourinho?
I don't think even a tenth of it is down to the manager. In that same team, there have been others who have had spells on the bench, been dropped, been criticized, etc yet made no drama of it. The world is at Paul Pogba's feet if he focuses and commits, regardless of who the manager is. We are talking about a player who has the talent to be put in the same conversation as the elites of the elites. At that level, players consistently deliver while their managers are being constantly changed. You don't see their forms drop because of some manager.
 

EwanI Ted

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He needs to press and track the runners, because these are basic stuff for any midfielder, especially in England. I mentioned this example seveeal times but you can see why Fabregas fell out of favor for Chelsea in CM for some good years now despite his quality. You can't be a midfielder without doing these basic stuff, if you can't, then you need to play away from middle of the park or on the bench.
He managed that at Juve for four years in a team no one could describe as soft centred. It just needs the players and/or system around him to maximise his talent. Now if Jose doesn’t want to build his team in such a way, well that’s his choice, but it certainly can be done.
 

Litch

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I don't think even a tenth of it is down to the manager. In that same team, there have been others who have had spells on the bench, been dropped, been criticized, etc yet made no drama of it. The world is at Paul Pogba's feet if he focuses and commits, regardless of who the manager is. We are talking about a player who has the talent to be put in the same conversation as the elites of the elites. At that level, players consistently deliver while their managers are being constantly changed. You don't see their forms drop because of some manager.
Like I've just said, it depends on your relationship with the manager and not whether managers are changed. If you go into work tomorrow and whether you are delivering or not, if the manager sends a negative global email to everyone in your company and then to your customer, wouldn't this effect your performance especially if you weren't delivering anyway. I can't remember a manager at any club that throws players under the bus. I'm not saying I'm a Pogba fan but people think money guards ultimately a young man from feeling criticism. Sorry I'm not performing for a manager that doesn't protect me. Yes criticise me but there is no rational for Jose going about it they way he does with star players. Jose has history......
 

NinjaFletch

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Not sure what you are talking about, Pogba did quite well in the left side of a 3 man midfield.But that lasted only for a few games before Jose started messing up with the formations and personnel every single game! Now i get your point, and that is what i said in my earlier post too, that a player in any team let alone united, need to be flexible and adapt to situations and I feel Pogba needs to mature in that respect and i am sure he will. Whether it's united or elsewhere that is to be seen.

My gripe with this offensive on Pogba is two folded
1- We all knew what his strengths were when he was here and also at Juve, and we signed him to do exactly that be the creative force and to his defense he did that well in a team that is devoid of any attacking stability! You might not agree but that is the fact. When you expect him to be defensive and also be creative then that reduces his capabilities by 50% ( a tad exaggerated maybe)

2- Jose has his favorites and they cannot do anything wrong! but small mistakes by our record signing are highlighted and scrutinized to the nth degree. It's easy to scapegoat Pogba because of his off field antics, his lifestyle etc.
Matic being a defensive midfielder can make any number of defensive mistakes but he gets a start no matter what. But a creative midfielder not tracking back is the bigger issue!

Now regarding tweaking formations to accommodate players - the reason why you do that is because you know that player is special! no one would every build a team around Young would they? so there is no harm in doing that but it has to be with conviction.

Like i said the fault lies in both parties but Pogba's % of faultiness (sorry couldn't thing of any other word) is slightly lesser thats all.
Oh come off it. Pogba's played on the left of a three for most of this calendar year. If that isn't a large enough sample size to work out that it isn't a magic bullet that instantly makes him a better player then I don't know what is. The simple fact is he's almost exactly as likely to veer game to game from very, very good to bad playing there than anywhere else; it is down to him, not the formation.

And yes, Pogba being the world's most expensive midfielder does mean that he has to cope with higher expectations. But that's natural and correct and comes with the territory of being a supposedly world class midfielder. I'm not sure dropping our standards is the right response.
 

Litch

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He managed that at Juve for four years in a team no one could describe as soft centred. It just needs the players and/or system around him to maximise his talent. Now if Jose doesn’t want to build his team in such a way, well that’s his choice, but it certainly can be done.
I agree and which star players doesn't need a system and players around them. Jose seems to always fall out with the highest profile players in the clubs where other managers get them on side cause more times than not, they are the difference between winning and losing.....
 

Di Maria's angel

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Then we miss what he can bring deeper in terms of his driving runs and long range passing ability. He has everything needed to succeed, hopefully he plays like a man with something to prove vs Valencia.
This is so true. He's obviously good enough to play in midfield and be the driving force to take us forward. As with Martial, they both lack... the intelligence to play their respective positions.
 

roonster09

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This is so true. He's obviously good enough to play in midfield and be the driving force to take us forward. As with Martial, they both lack... the intelligence to play their respective positions.
Pogba and Martial lack intelligence to play their positions? That's why both are involved in more goals than any players since they joined the club?
 

In Rainbows

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I can’t remember seeing a post with so many points that I vehemently disagree with !

“ In the emptihad when he dragged us back to victory “ After a 1 st half when he was absolutely useless probably the worst player on the pitch and I for one was staggered that he even came out for the second half and we should be grateful that he decided to put some effort in for the second half if ever a display sums up Pogba it was that ..he doesn’t play for the shirt ,the club , the fans ..just when he feels like it .

“Our team has been crying out for a midfielder of his ilk for years “ yes we have been crying out for a world class midfielder but one that performs consistently at the highest level not one who decides to turn up occasionally and has the worst pass completion rate in the premiership ( up to last weekend he had given the ball away over 250 times this season)

“Mad dog Fred “...are you serious ?

“How Jose handled Zlatan “ Zlatan was the complete team leader on the pitch , leading by example motivating the others and 100% effort every game , The complete opposite of Pogba

“It’s Mourinho job to make sure they plays to Pogba’s strengths “ unbelievable comment ! It is
Pogbas job to do as he is told , play to whatever the team tactics and set up is and put in maximum effort into every minute this in Manchester United for gods sake we shouldn’t pander to one prima donnas demands .

The last 2 games have clearly illustrated that we are better without him ,the team now looks together and committed .

I hope so much we sell him on he will be far better in easier lge like Italy again or Spain when he can play for the dominant team in a crap lge , play at walking pace have the time to make sure his passes go to someone wearing the same shirt and look world class again .The prem is far to tough , fast and aggressive for him
1. He was not the worst player on the pitch in that 1st half. Matic was. I noted this at the time and it was at this point in time that Matic was still escaping criticism for whatever reason.

https://www.redcafe.net/matches/man...r-united.222/discussion?page=50#post-22377333

My post
Amazing how Matic continues to escape criticism because Pogba is the easy target. Matic was worse. At least Pogba was trying to keep possession even with City's pressing. Too bad his teammates were frozen.
2. Again, why not place the blame on Mourinho. Because there are levels to what you're saying. Pogba has still been our best midfielder. That is a fact. You can't expect world class consistency when the manager has the entire team playing below their level. If everyone played at the level we want them too, as long as Pogba maintains being our best midfielder, that consistency should come.

3.Yes it is Mourinho's job to make sure they play to Pogba's strengths. Since when is it a bad thing to wanting to get the best out of your better players? Why cater to the lesser players? What does Pogba lack? He lacks defensive workrate, and he'll be the B to someone's A when it comes to controlling the play through passing. He's the spear of the midfield. What did Juve do? They had a midfield 3 that all complimented one another. What did France do? They had a midfield 2 that complimented one another. For some weird reason, this basic strategy is something United fans feel United should be above. I have no idea why.

These last 2 games demonstrated nothing. Funny how you don't bring up how we lost to Derby when United did not have Pogba. Or are you only using evidence that fits your narrative?
 

Greck

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This is so true. He's obviously good enough to play in midfield and be the driving force to take us forward. As with Martial, they both lack... the intelligence to play their respective positions.
:rolleyes:
It's like only their bad decisions are counted against them while their many intelligent decisions are swept under the rug
 

Di Maria's angel

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Pogba and Martial lack intelligence to play their positions? That's why both are involved in more goals than any players since they joined the club?
Yeah, that's the impression I get when I watch both play. I believe, as do many others, that they're our best players however, they make the same mistakes in almost every game they play and that tells me they lack the intelligence to both understand and correct their issues. Maybe it's down to the manager, I don't know but it's an issue for both them and someone needs to change this.
 

Di Maria's angel

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:rolleyes:
It's like only their bad decisions are counted against them while their many intelligent decisions are swept under the rug
Yeah, because that's exactly what I meant and said.

I want both to be the best and I get no joy from criticising our own players but that's just what I see right now. If these two are to fulfill their potential they need to cut out their mistakes.
 

roonster09

Hercule Poirot of the scouting world
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Yeah, that's the impression I get when I watch both play. I believe, as do many others, that they're our best players however, they make the same mistakes in almost every game they play and that tells me they lack the intelligence to both understand and correct their issues. Maybe it's down to the manager, I don't know but it's an issue for both them and someone needs to change this.
What mistakes they do? Players who tries to create gives away possession, higher risk and higher gain. Pogba loses possession in midfield sometimes, when he pulls it off, he takes away 2-4 players from the game. That's the risk he should take to create in our static team.
 

In Rainbows

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Oh come off it. Pogba's played on the left of a three for most of this calendar year. If that isn't a large enough sample size to work out that it isn't a magic bullet that instantly makes him a better player then I don't know what is. The simple fact is he's almost exactly as likely to veer game to game from very, very good to bad playing there than anywhere else; it is down to him, not the formation.

And yes, Pogba being the world's most expensive midfielder does mean that he has to cope with higher expectations. But that's natural and correct and comes with the territory of being a supposedly world class midfielder. I'm not sure dropping our standards is the right response.
Again, criticism against Pogba is welcomed. What does my head in is that people want Pogba out of the club. You guys jump from "not performing to expectations" to "he needs to get out of the club." I want to keep our better players. If a better player is underperforming, but is still better than his teammates who are overperforming, everyone should want to keep the better player regardless of consistency and expectations.

No on the team is performing consistently well.
 
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