SARS CoV-2 coronavirus / Covid-19 (No tin foil hat silliness please)

T00lsh3d

T00ly O' Sh3d
Joined
Mar 20, 2014
Messages
8,780
If a person catches Covid from another, we know it can take a few days before any symptoms show.

But, how long does it take the person to become a transmitter? A few hours, a day?

I'm v concerned for Retail workers on boxing day when people will pile in for discounts/sale, customers don't give a feck they want a bargain, and staff have no choice but to do their job, no social distancing (customers constantly getting close to staff) or stores packaed.

Tomorrows a huge day for transmission, hence the question
Well going by the tiered system aren’t all retail outlets in tier 3&4 closed anyway? So if they’re in tier 1 or 2 they might be open but theoretically at least they’re in a region with much less community transmission happening.
NB I know this requires faith in the tier system being correct
 

Andy_Cole

Full Member
Joined
Apr 15, 2009
Messages
8,083
Location
Manchester
Well going by the tiered system aren’t all retail outlets in tier 3&4 closed anyway? So if they’re in tier 1 or 2 they might be open but theoretically at least they’re in a region with much less community transmission happening.
NB I know this requires faith in the tier system being correct
Just 4
 

Tibs

Full Member
Joined
Aug 16, 2007
Messages
13,813
Location
UK
Well going by the tiered system aren’t all retail outlets in tier 3&4 closed anyway? So if they’re in tier 1 or 2 they might be open but theoretically at least they’re in a region with much less community transmission happening.
NB I know this requires faith in the tier system being correct
Only T4 has retail closed.

All the others allow for all retail to be open
 

Penna

Kind Moderator (with a bit of a mean streak)
Staff
Joined
May 1, 2012
Messages
49,742
Location
Ubi caritas et amor, Deus ibi est.
A am already at home for an hour now. In Germany X-mas family celebrations are limited to a household and max. 4 other people + kids below 14. And there is a nightly curfew from 9 pm to 5 am.
It's similar, then. Here we've had a curfew from 10pm to 5am for some weeks now. We can have 2 people visit with children under 14.
 

Eire Red United

New Member
Joined
Aug 30, 2016
Messages
2,723
Location
Ireland
How do you know it doesn’t exist, is it the IFP nut job that looks like she is going through a mental breakdown, or some other Karen on YouTube, because they are all full of shit, it exists anyone who says otherwise is like flat earth idiot.
It exists of course. Just not worth shutting the world down or the hysteria that’s being caused over it.
 

Relevated

fixated with venom and phalluses
Joined
May 3, 2011
Messages
25,995
Location
18M1955/JU5
I have anxiety and I'm taking a covid test in the morning at 9.

Whens the soonest I'll have my results? Easily within 24 hours?
 

F-Red

Full Member
Joined
Nov 15, 2008
Messages
11,027
Location
Cheshire
I have anxiety and I'm taking a covid test in the morning at 9.

Whens the soonest I'll have my results? Easily within 24 hours?
Swab test at a site? If so you’re looking at it coming back on Monday/Tuesday at the earliest. More likely Tuesday considering the festive break.
 

F-Red

Full Member
Joined
Nov 15, 2008
Messages
11,027
Location
Cheshire
Yikes. What makes u say that?
Current test return/backlog is around 2.9 days based on the latest data released yesterday.

1,698 were from tests taken y'day (5%)
15,475 Tuesday (44%)
12,203 Monday (34%)
3,991 Sunday (11%)
1,553 Saturday (4%)
511 Friday (1%)
114 last Thurs
 

Relevated

fixated with venom and phalluses
Joined
May 3, 2011
Messages
25,995
Location
18M1955/JU5
Current test return/backlog is around 2.9 days based on the latest data released yesterday.

1,698 were from tests taken y'day (5%)
15,475 Tuesday (44%)
12,203 Monday (34%)
3,991 Sunday (11%)
1,553 Saturday (4%)
511 Friday (1%)
114 last Thurs
So there's a dead certain delay of 3 days in all cases? Damn
 

Pogue Mahone

Swiftie Fan Club President
Joined
Feb 22, 2006
Messages
134,695
Location
"like a man in silk pyjamas shooting pigeons
I've looked at this gif for a solid minute and it's funnier every time.
It’s so good. Does anyone know what the incident was? Presumably a tackle that might have meant a yellow card? How could Mourinho have seen it if he was looking at his phone? Why was he looking at his phone?

So many questions...
 

F-Red

Full Member
Joined
Nov 15, 2008
Messages
11,027
Location
Cheshire
So there's a dead certain delay of 3 days in all cases? Damn
On average, yes. The only thing that could improve or delay it is the Xmas period being quiet, or staff shortage due to Xmas and increase in demand due to the virus spreading. Monday/Tuesday I’d be confident in saying that’s when you’ll get something. Fingers crossed it’s negative.
 

gormless

Full Member
Joined
Jun 25, 2008
Messages
8,571
Location
comfortable and settled in my rut
It’s so good. Does anyone know what the incident was? Presumably a tackle that might have meant a yellow card? How could Mourinho have seen it if he was looking at his phone? Why was he looking at his phone?

So many questions...
I think it was something along lines of realising somebody may have received a second yellow but not been sent off. It’s pointed out to Jose who goes mental
 

F-Red

Full Member
Joined
Nov 15, 2008
Messages
11,027
Location
Cheshire
It’s so good. Does anyone know what the incident was? Presumably a tackle that might have meant a yellow card? How could Mourinho have seen it if he was looking at his phone? Why was he looking at his phone?

So many questions...
It was against Man City, Sterling was on a yellow already and collided with Loris. Ref said no penalty and gave a free kick to Spurs. Mourinho was then protesting that if it wasn’t a penalty, then it was a dive and Sterling should get a second yellow.
 

Relevated

fixated with venom and phalluses
Joined
May 3, 2011
Messages
25,995
Location
18M1955/JU5
On average, yes. The only thing that could improve or delay it is the Xmas period being quiet, or staff shortage due to Xmas and increase in demand due to the virus spreading. Monday/Tuesday I’d be confident in saying that’s when you’ll get something. Fingers crossed it’s negative.
I hope so man. I asked the dude and he said something similar. He said usually you'd get em next day but it'll be earliest Sunday.
 

Pogue Mahone

Swiftie Fan Club President
Joined
Feb 22, 2006
Messages
134,695
Location
"like a man in silk pyjamas shooting pigeons
It was against Man City, Sterling was on a yellow already and collided with Loris. Ref said no penalty and gave a free kick to Spurs. Mourinho was then protesting that if it wasn’t a penalty, then it was a dive and Sterling should get a second yellow.
Nice one. Thanks. That’s the sort of expertise and scientific rigor that keeps me coming back to this thread.
 

Sarni

nice guy, unassuming, objective United fan.
Joined
Jan 21, 2004
Messages
58,220
Location
Krakow
It exists of course. Just not worth shutting the world down or the hysteria that’s being caused over it.
What in your eyes would be worth shutting down the way we have, all across the world?

Personally living in a country that just had 100% excess deaths in November (32,000, nearly 1 in 1,000) I feel that if anything our response has been way too soft.

It is the worst pandemic of modern era, it completely warrants all the ‘hysteria’.
 

finneh

Full Member
Joined
Jun 28, 2010
Messages
7,318
What in your eyes would be worth shutting down the way we have, all across the world?

Personally living in a country that just had 100% excess deaths in November (32,000, nearly 1 in 1,000) I feel that if anything our response has been way too soft.

It is the worst pandemic of modern era, it completely warrants all the ‘hysteria’.
I think for people who believe the reaction has been disproportionate; one key reason is the opportunity cost of the trillions that as a result have either been spent on Covid or not earned due to measures introduced.

Had the world wholly ignored the virus* and focused this spend / loss of income on tackling issues such as world poverty or climate change; there's an argument that the years of life saved would be many, many times larger.

If you're sympathetic to that view then we've essentially spent trillions replacing the carpets when the roof is collapsing and the foundations are subsiding.

Truthfully if someone explained the Western reaction to this virus without giving details about the virus itself I'd have assumed the mortality to be several times greater and the average age of death to be much younger (e.g. the very young being disproportionately at risk)

*Not say this was a viable political strategy of course.
 

golden_blunder

Site admin. Manchester United fan
Staff
Joined
Jun 1, 2000
Messages
121,200
Location
Dublin, Ireland
I think for people who believe the reaction has been disproportionate; one key reason is the opportunity cost of the trillions that as a result have either been spent on Covid or not earned due to measures introduced.

Had the world wholly ignored the virus* and focused this spend / loss of income on tackling issues such as world poverty or climate change; there's an argument that the years of life saved would be many, many times larger.

If you're sympathetic to that view then we've essentially spent trillions replacing the carpets when the roof is collapsing and the foundations are subsiding.

Truthfully if someone explained the Western reaction to this virus without giving details about the virus itself I'd have assumed the mortality to be several times greater and the average age of death to be much younger (e.g. the very young being disproportionately at risk)

*Not say this was a viable political strategy of course.
The median age in ireland is 37 btw. It’s not right for people to keep believing it’s an old person thing
 

T00lsh3d

T00ly O' Sh3d
Joined
Mar 20, 2014
Messages
8,780
I think for people who believe the reaction has been disproportionate; one key reason is the opportunity cost of the trillions that as a result have either been spent on Covid or not earned due to measures introduced.

Had the world wholly ignored the virus* and focused this spend / loss of income on tackling issues such as world poverty or climate change; there's an argument that the years of life saved would be many, many times larger.

If you're sympathetic to that view then we've essentially spent trillions replacing the carpets when the roof is collapsing and the foundations are subsiding.

Truthfully if someone explained the Western reaction to this virus without giving details about the virus itself I'd have assumed the mortality to be several times greater and the average age of death to be much younger (e.g. the very young being disproportionately at risk)

*Not say this was a viable political strategy of course.
The problem with this of course is that hunger, poverty and climate change are constant issues so it’s very difficult to hedge an opportunity cost against them as you know that the money ‘wouldn’t have been available’ to be spent.
Additionally, re the fatalities, we don’t really know what they’d have looked like unless measures were put in place, so it’s a mute point isn’t it?
 

Pogue Mahone

Swiftie Fan Club President
Joined
Feb 22, 2006
Messages
134,695
Location
"like a man in silk pyjamas shooting pigeons
I think for people who believe the reaction has been disproportionate; one key reason is the opportunity cost of the trillions that as a result have either been spent on Covid or not earned due to measures introduced.

Had the world wholly ignored the virus* and focused this spend / loss of income on tackling issues such as world poverty or climate change; there's an argument that the years of life saved would be many, many times larger.

If you're sympathetic to that view then we've essentially spent trillions replacing the carpets when the roof is collapsing and the foundations are subsiding.

Truthfully if someone explained the Western reaction to this virus without giving details about the virus itself I'd have assumed the mortality to be several times greater and the average age of death to be much younger (e.g. the very young being disproportionately at risk)

*Not say this was a viable political strategy of course.
And we all know exactly what your response would have been if governments all over the world suddenly decided to invest trillions in fighting world poverty and climate change...
 

T00lsh3d

T00ly O' Sh3d
Joined
Mar 20, 2014
Messages
8,780
And we all know exactly what your response would have been if governments all over the world suddenly decided to invest trillions in fighting world poverty and climate change...
I very nearly wrote this in the post above but thought it too cynical
 

Fully Fledged

Full Member
Joined
May 23, 2013
Messages
16,332
Location
Midlands UK
I think for people who believe the reaction has been disproportionate; one key reason is the opportunity cost of the trillions that as a result have either been spent on Covid or not earned due to measures introduced.

Had the world wholly ignored the virus* and focused this spend / loss of income on tackling issues such as world poverty or climate change; there's an argument that the years of life saved would be many, many times larger.

If you're sympathetic to that view then we've essentially spent trillions replacing the carpets when the roof is collapsing and the foundations are subsiding.

Truthfully if someone explained the Western reaction to this virus without giving details about the virus itself I'd have assumed the mortality to be several times greater and the average age of death to be much younger (e.g. the very young being disproportionately at risk)

*Not say this was a viable political strategy of course.
I think that if it hadn't swamped hospital capacity as quickly as it did then this might have been a feasible option for people with a Libertarian political stance. The problem was that all across the World hospitals just could not cope with the influx of patients.

Edit: Of course I'm talking about letting the virus run it's coarse not investing in the poor when I'm talking about Libertarians.
 

finneh

Full Member
Joined
Jun 28, 2010
Messages
7,318
The problem with this of course is that hunger, poverty and climate change are constant issues so it’s very difficult to hedge an opportunity cost against them as you know that the money ‘wouldn’t have been available’ to be spent.
Additionally, re the fatalities, we don’t really know what they’d have looked like unless measures were put in place, so it’s a mute point isn’t it?
There's a lot of unknowns in this arena, including scientific models based on so many assumptions that the outputs are all over the place.

If we're currently making decisions based on a lot of unknowns and were making decisions back in March based on even more; then I'm sure pontificating on different possibilities isn't beyond the pale.

And we all know exactly what your response would have been if governments all over the world suddenly decided to invest trillions in fighting world poverty and climate change...
That's the point of an opportunity cost though isn't it? It's about the opportunity.

But to answer the point more directly if given a binary choice to save a million years of wealthy white western life or tens of millions of years of poorer non-white lives; then the latter is obviously preferable.

I think that if it hadn't swamped hospital capacity as quickly as it did then this might have been a feasible option for people with a Libertarian political stance. The problem was that all across the World hospitals just could not cope with the influx of patients.

Edit: Of course I'm talking about letting the virus run it's coarse not investing in the poor when I'm talking about Libertarians.
I'm sure after decades of research we still won't get an exact idea about what would have occurred if various different scenarios were implemented.

What we will know however is the cost and what could have been done with it.

It reminds me of a statistic (how true it is I'm unsure) that I saw stating that housing regulations to prevent deaths by fires cost (per live that the save) us over one hundred thousand times that of preventing aids related deaths in some African countries. Likewise DoT spending on road safety is over fifteen thousand times.

Effectively the opportunity cost of saving one UK life from fire is over 100,000 lives in another part of the world. Counter-intuitively then it could be argued that the inevitably onerous regulations that will result from Grenfell should have us infuriated at the opportunity cost of thousands of lives in other parts of the world.

An interesting theoretical debate no doubt. However one that I've realised has taken up too much of this day so I'll wish all a Merry Christmas!
 
Last edited: