It's really not. Liverpool right now are playing like s*it. Arsenal won 4-0 in swansea without doing anything all game. You didn't draw at stoke because they played well and gave you a tough game, you gifted them the point.
Top 4 race 2016/17
- Thread starter Yorkeontop
- Start date
If you think anyone is going to take 6th spot off them then you haven't been watching football for the last few months.Think you need to add Everton to this discussion now or you going to wait till we leapfrog United?
If anything this post proves my point. Dropped points can come out of the blue
You can drop points anywhere. There doesn't have to be a rhyme or reason
There is a reason. Namely, other than chelsea (and maybe spurs) the other top sides for whatever reason are too prone to shoot themselves in the foot
....which backs up my point about how nonsensical the easier fixtures narrative is.
I'm not saying the league is full of world class sides here.
More of a title race comment initially, but I think if Chelsea win today and avoid defeat at Anfield (and sort out any Costa problems of course) then they've done enough to win it. Can't see anyone catching them if so.
As for the rest of the top six, they could finish in any order. City seem to be tanking it, Liverpool in a bit of a free-fall if they don't recover big time against Chelsea, United seem to need 4-5 big chances to score a goal, while I think Arsenal and Spurs will both have some form of collapse at some point as well (but at the moment, the London sides seem to be favourites for finshing in those top three/four places).
As for the rest of the top six, they could finish in any order. City seem to be tanking it, Liverpool in a bit of a free-fall if they don't recover big time against Chelsea, United seem to need 4-5 big chances to score a goal, while I think Arsenal and Spurs will both have some form of collapse at some point as well (but at the moment, the London sides seem to be favourites for finshing in those top three/four places).
Sigh. I mentioned two fixtures (playing Chelski away and Sunderland at home). You then cited two results with these in relation to one particular team (Liverpool) ... as if that disproves the general rule that the one fixture is much tougher than the other.
It doesn't. King Canute couldn't command the tide to turn ... and neither will your obtuse denials about fixture difficulties change reality.
City didn't get the right result yesterday but I'm very positive about the performance. We made Spurs look largely ordinary which is no mean feat. It's also promising that when we (hopefully) fix our defence/fullbacks in summer we'll be a smart outfit again. We've seen a few teams start to slip up now in the top 4 chase so next few weeks will be interesting. We've got United and Liverpool to come at home in the next handful of fixtures so it's a crucial few weeks.
I tend to agree with this. As much as I love him, Mata was collateral damage this game. O.G and missed open goal is what self-destructed us. We lack the proper teeth to kill goalscoring chances.
The reaction to the result yesterday has been ridiculous. Drawing with Stoke away wont cost us top 4. As long as we keep playing as we have done since November we will be absolutely fine
100% agree.
I'd agree with that. Stoke is a famously painful fixture for the all top sides. Yeah sometimes we breeze through it, but it shouldn't shock any of us to trip up there. "A cold, wet Wednesday in Stoke" became a saying for a reason.
United have become a force again and I'd be shocked if you weren't at battling hard for top 4 by the end of the season. Mourinho is a master at grinding the points.
King Kanoute and Prince Pirlo could tell you how ridiculous it is to proclaim these fixtures being easier than other fixtures when football has so many variables never mind there being so many games left to play.
Lets be honest, you're changing the goalposts here. You have been pushing this easier fixtures played so far bullshit for weeks now. Utd have had the easier first half of the fecking season you said.
So you're not just comparing playing Chelsea v Sunderland as you claim
Will I find those posts for you? And post the shocking results inbetween now and then"
Ill post a dozen results from top sides throwing away points v the 'easier' sides if you wish?
Just say the word buddy. Happy to help
Correct, in relation to some of the 5 teams above you.
For example, Spurs now have only 3 remaining games against top 6 clubs, 2 of them at home. In contrast United have 4 such games left, 3 of them away.
But then you're in denial that any given fixture is more difficult than any other, so I doubt this example will pull your head from out of the sand.
Our last 3 fixtures of the season are Arsenal (A), Spurs (A) & Palace (H), I can see it going down to the last day for top 4 places.
Matchday 23
31 Jan: Sunderland vs Tottenham Hotspur
31 Jan: Arsenal vs Watford
31 Jan: Liverpool vs Chelsea
01 Feb: West Ham United vs Manchester City
01 Feb: Manchester United vs Hull City
(with City game likely to be moved until late in the season)
We've been 6th since Matchweek 11.
After 22 weeks:
So basically, Chelsea have won 10 out of their last 11 and collected 30 points in the process.
Spurs have gained 25 points in this period. Arsenal 23.
City and Liverpool have lost traction and gained only 19 points.
We have gained 23 points, but essentially treaded water.
It's clear that the top 6 are remarkably consistent, and for us to make it, we need to start winning against the other top 4 contenders. Need to win at City, Spurs, Arsenal and beat Chelsea at home, because the other 5 will probably continue winning against the dross.
- Liverpool 26
- Chelsea 25
- City 24
- Arsenal 24
- Spurs 21
- Man United 18
After 22 weeks:
- Chelsea 55
- Arsenal 47
- Spurs 46
- Liverpool 45
- City 43
- Man United 41
So basically, Chelsea have won 10 out of their last 11 and collected 30 points in the process.
Spurs have gained 25 points in this period. Arsenal 23.
City and Liverpool have lost traction and gained only 19 points.
We have gained 23 points, but essentially treaded water.
It's clear that the top 6 are remarkably consistent, and for us to make it, we need to start winning against the other top 4 contenders. Need to win at City, Spurs, Arsenal and beat Chelsea at home, because the other 5 will probably continue winning against the dross.
If only we had beaten Everton and City, two games where we were leading, we would have been just two points behind Chelsea. Damn you Arsenal! 
If only we had beaten Everton and City, two games where we were leading, we would have been just two points behind Chelsea. Damn you Arsenal!
we were not leading against city or am i in a parallel universe?
I am an Arsenal fan
. Arsenal were leading against them.I am an Arsenal fan
oh i see, it me being stoopid, no change there then
No problem mate
To be fair we've dropped a crazy amount of points this seasons from losing positions (including to yourselves). We would be second if we hadn't thrown always points against Everton, Stoke, Arsenal and Burnley (yes I know we weren't leading but we did enough to win that game).If only we had beaten Everton and City, two games where we were leading, we would have been just two points behind Chelsea. Damn you Arsenal!
So far. The only team I can safely say will get top four is Chelsea. There is literally no other team I would be willing to put my money on. At all.
Yep. Fair play to Chelsea for the season they are having, but us and you have dropped some important points.
yeah and if my auntie had balls ..........If only we had beaten Everton and City, two games where we were leading, we would have been just two points behind Chelsea. Damn you Arsenal!
The 'if only' posts are a waste of time because every team can say that. e.g. if only the Chelsea manager had changed his system earlier or if only that de bruyne chance had gone in v Chelsea or if only the linesman had got the offside right before the ref awarded a pen to Arsenal v Burnley
This is a good point Iam about to make and an important one. When the other teams drop points United don't really capitalise. You've closed the point gap a little but still are sixth. I can see our bad run coming to an end soon.
i'll say Spurs too, they have a complete squad, young and hunger too.
Terrible result for us at the weekend, Swansea started the weekend bottom of the league and if you can lose to them at home then you can lose any fixture in the league.
We need desperately to beat Chelsea next Tuesday otherwise its over for us. We also need to go on an extended run of consecutive victories as well, so altogether I don't think we have much of a prayer for the league all in all.
We need desperately to beat Chelsea next Tuesday otherwise its over for us. We also need to go on an extended run of consecutive victories as well, so altogether I don't think we have much of a prayer for the league all in all.
I think even if you beat us, you guys should just focus on getting top 4 and the cup. The league is gone for you.
Exactly. Every team has a litany of 'what-ifs' so it's ridiculous to say 'if only .... '. Liverpool vs. Burnley, Bournemouth, Sunderland and Swansea for example ... in fact for most Top 6 teams it's every game they play against teams outside the Top 6 because they inevitably statistically dominate in all of them.
If the league is gone for L'pool then I can say Chelsea already won the title. L'pool has similar advantage in not having European football to worry about just like Chelsea. If they can't challenge then the other stand no chance once European football resume. I meant L'pool only 2 points behind Arsenal, 1 behind Tottenham with both North Londoners to visit Anfield at some points. Arsenal is due to annual February collapse while Tottenham likely adjust themselves to finish just below Arsenal. City 2 points behind L'pool is undergoing new year consistency syndrome just like last season. Us 2 points behind City and 4 points behind L'pool, which are catchable point gap
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We are 10 pts behind Chelsea .. there is no way in this world we are catching them even if they lose both at Anfield and to Arsenal.
Let say Chelsea lose those 2 games, while L'pool wins the other easier game, then it's 4 point gap in early February. You can say L'pool have a tough run of games but you didn't factor in that other top 6 teams would get their European football resume giving L'pool the advantage of more preparation time. Then count in the mentality factor in case those team didn't do so well in Europe (defeat breed defeat). Not to forget you play most of these tough top 6 games at Anfield.
I can't wish your team luck, just stating that your team with the right spirit has better chance compare to other 4 teams in top 6 to catch on Chelsea. In case you guys give in, as i already said, the title is already won by Chelsea as the 2 North Londoners are not in any shape to catch on Chelsea, while City and us is even further away and having our own problem.
It's unlikely but we have to keep some hope alive that its possible. If they lose back to back game and we win both of ours then it goes down to four, the lowest it would have been for some time, and everything all to play for. We have players returning from injury and what not.
Also we only have City to go to from March till the end of the season, some might say that that is the problem but if we are on our game like we at the beginning of the campaign the potential for a winning run is there.
If they continue their current season form then yeah, Chelsea have only dropped 11 points in 22 games. At that rate if you won every game from here on in you'd still turn up two points short. That said there is definitely a world in which they lose their next three games and you win them. Burnley away isn't an easy fixture.
Europa league is our best chance for CL considering Jose's eratic decision making and frankly terrible ability to consistently play our 11 best players. He is trying too hard to play everybody. Martial and Mkhi are clearly our best wide players, and subbing Zlatan for Rashford once in a while won't hurt either. We tend to play slowly with players like Pogba and Zlatan who hold on to the ball for far too long, but somehow don't get subbed no matter how badly they play. Sure Zlatan will score 1 a game, but could we be scoring 2-3 team goals if we had more fluidity and urgency in our ball movement?
One weird thing about this season, we've only drawn once. I just checked the record and the least draws for a season is 3 (by us in 97/98 apparently). Seems bizarre that we've lost 3 times more often than we've held a draw.
Agreed. We'd need to beat you. Then have you slip up X2. + get our form back.
Not gonna happen
wow mate! It is disappointing that you feel this way. Have you forgotten that Jose is picking up a team that was left behind by LVG, a man who suffered numerous injuries and had a saddened philosophy. Newspapers and Media always have questions and that's their job primarily but as a United fan, i think you know we are doing much better than last season. I know we have off games but that's because we are not taking our chances. It is too late for a title rush this season but keep faith in Jose. He loves winning and will decimate any team to get where he wants to. He has inherited a team that lacks confidence, he has introduced wonderful and confident lads in the summer and he has kept the whole team in shape. He's already making plans for the summer window and sold players to save some in the bank. He's doing very well. I mean he cannot get on the field and play, our players have to take responsibility and perform.