Every time I think about Valencia I'm impressed he had a good season in a position that isn't his and he improved all season long, at 29 years old. I though that Juanfran was special but Valencia is also an impressive character.
Every time I think about him, I wonder how much he can bench and how many push ups he can make.Every time I think about Valencia I'm impressed he had a good season in a position that isn't his and he improved all season long, at 29 years old. I though that Juanfran was special but Valencia is also an impressive character.
I guess its just what we expect of him now. The days of him beating his defender and putting a good cross in are gone. But if you want someone who is solid and can defend at fall back there are few better in our squad. (Even with his mistake against Asnl)I wasnt impressed and disagree that he had a good season. He was decent at best with ups and downs but was a big reason why we looked so shaky. You couldnt have counted how often he was out of position. He shouldnt be more than a back up player next season
true, but if you asked me which one of our current first team regulars should be a backup next season, I'd say Valencia every single time.The amount of players who should only be back-ups next season means that we're not even going to have a first team at this rate.
Except he wasn't solid, he looked OK when we were dominating teams possession wise because we had very little defending to do. He was guilty of some very poor defending through the season and big lapses in concentration.I guess its just what we expect of him now. The days of him beating his defender and putting a good cross in are gone. But if you want someone who is solid and can defend at fall back there are few better in our squad. (Even with his mistake against Asnl)
I think for the most part he was. Its easy to have a distorted view by a few mistakes through the season but on the whole there was a reason why he kept Rafael out of the sideExcept he wasn't solid, he looked OK when we were dominating teams possession wise because we had very little defending to do. He was guilty of some very poor defending through the season and big lapses in concentration.
Perhaps, although its equally likely to have a distorted view based on teams overall performance and not on individual ones. He kept Rafael out because Rafael couldn't keep himself fit and LVG thought consistency was the key at the end of the season. Still, this has been discussed to death with two clear camps.I think for the most part he was. Its easy to have a distorted view by a few mistakes through the season but on the whole there was a reason why he kept Rafael out of the side
Yes I noticed that as well.Will be a decent back up RB next season. Also didn't LVG refer to him as 'the best player in the Arsenal game making a mistake' in his end of the season awards speech?
He did. Highly rated by SAF, LvG and Pep Guardiola. What is it people are missing in their assessment of his value to the squad?Will be a decent back up RB next season. Also didn't LVG refer to him as 'the best player in the Arsenal game making a mistake' in his end of the season awards speech?
The rating by Ferguson was from when he played without fear and at the same time had the tag of Mr. Reliable and will do the job asked. Pep's backing was also when Valencia was having one of this best season. The times when he was tearing Ashley Cole a new one. As far as LVG goes, LVG likes players that do what he asks and are reliable.He did. Highly rated by SAF, LvG and Pep Guardiola. What is it people are missing in their assessment of his value to the squad?
Who do you think are Barca's and Real Madrid's version of Valencia/John O'Shea?The rating by Ferguson was from when he played without fear and at the same time had the tag of Mr. Reliable and will do the job asked. Pep's backing was also when Valencia was having one of this best season. The times when he was tearing Ashley Cole a new one. As far as LVG goes, LVG likes players that do what he asks and are reliable.
As supporters though I'd say most of us are looking for the Tony V. and not turn back Tony. And obviously there are quite a few that still are upset he was bought to fill the right wing spot after Ronaldo and demand an almost like for like replacement even though he has given us very good service.
I also do think people just don't value the players like the Valencia's Parks, O'Sheas etc - who are not glamorous but, are integral to a teams success during the year. I think he gives us a great squad option but, would nice if at this point he wasn't the shoe in first XI option.
Some valid points. I tend to condemn his worst critics as butthurt Ronaldo fanbois. It'll be interesting to see if he'll improve after having the screws removed from his leg.The rating by Ferguson was from when he played without fear and at the same time had the tag of Mr. Reliable and will do the job asked. Pep's backing was also when Valencia was having one of this best season. The times when he was tearing Ashley Cole a new one. As far as LVG goes, LVG likes players that do what he asks and are reliable.
As supporters though I'd say most of us are looking for the Tony V. and not turn back Tony. And obviously there are quite a few that still are upset he was bought to fill the right wing spot after Ronaldo and demand an almost like for like replacement even though he has given us very good service.
I also do think people just don't value the players like the Valencia's Parks, O'Sheas etc - who are not glamorous but, are integral to a teams success during the year. I think he gives us a great squad option but, would nice if at this point he wasn't the shoe in first XI option.
Who did Madrid have coming off the bench against Juve to save them? Chicharito - a player deemed surplus to us this season. The grass is not always greener. Barca in their recent history have had one of the greatest players and two of the best central midfielders of the generation playing behind him. However, even they looked wanting in games when some of their role players could not step up.Who do you think are Barca's and Real Madrid's version of Valencia/John O'Shea?
I think you're taking the piss if you really think Busquets is just a role player.Who did Madrid have coming off the bench against Juve to save them? Chicharito - a player deemed surplus to us this season. The grass is not always greener. Barca in their recent history have had one of the greatest players and two of the best central midfielders of the generation playing behind him. However, even they looked wanting in games when some of their role players could not step up.
You come across as one of those that simply expect a world XI for every team and if they are not then they are just not good enough. When in truth great teams are made by a combination of great players and by role players such as the Busquets, Pedros and the likes. United's problem right now has not been the likes of Valencia does not belong but, more that the players we expect great things from have not delivered - the likes Rooney, RVP, Falcao, ADM. Valencia has done the job more or less that has been expected out of him. Which is why managers keep playing him.
So just to clarify, you don't know.Who did Madrid have coming off the bench against Juve to save them? Chicharito - a player deemed surplus to us this season. The grass is not always greener. Barca in their recent history have had one of the greatest players and two of the best central midfielders of the generation playing behind him. However, even they looked wanting in games when some of their role players could not step up.
You come across as one of those that simply expect a world XI for every team and if they are not then they are just not good enough. When in truth great teams are made by a combination of great players and by role players such as the Busquets, Pedros and the likes. United's problem right now has not been the likes of Valencia does not belong but, more that the players we expect great things from have not delivered - the likes Rooney, RVP, Falcao, ADM. Valencia has done the job more or less that has been expected out of him. Which is why managers keep playing him.
Under Guardiola and Villanova it was Adriano, Bayern it's Rode, for Chelsea Ramires, City has Milner.Who do you think are Barca's and Real Madrid's version of Valencia/John O'Shea?
Really? You think they are acceptable comparisons? Adriano and Rode or Valencia and O'Shea...Under Guardiola and Villanova it was Adriano, Bayern it's Rode, for Chelsea Ramires, City has Milner.
I'm not sure if I'm supposed to answer but Valencia and O'Shea played at a higher level.Adriano and Rode orrr Valencia and O'Shea. Hmmmm.
Yet Fergie dominated domestically and was second only to one of the best teams ever in Europe with John O'Shea an almost guaranteed starter when fit. Go figure.So just to clarify, you don't know.
I should come across as someone who thinks Manchester United should be competing with Barca and Madrid, not accepting mediocrity within our squad. Quite simply the reason why you couldn't give me the Barca version of O'Shea or Valencia is because they haven't got one. Busquets is the best defensive midfielder of his generation, Pedro just a few weeks ago scored a spectacular overhead kick, these are players of real quality who are technically brilliant.
This 'do a job' mentality has to stop, its small time.
And Obertan played at a higher level than Matt Le Tissier.I'm not sure if I'm supposed to answer but Valencia and O'Shea played at a higher level.
Cleverley was also a pivotal player under Fergie toward the end of his career, should we bring him back as well? Think we should avoid continued comparisons to O'Shea anyway as its derailing the thread and he was at least very versatile (which AV isnt).Yet Fergie dominated domestically and was second only to one of the best teams ever in Europe with John O'Shea an almost guaranteed starter when fit. Go figure.
Valencia and O'Shea have individually played at a high level, I'm not talking about the environment but about their performances.And Obertan played at a higher level than Matt Le Tissier.
Rode is 24 and is considered by many to be Schweinsteigers heir.
The Valencia of a bygone era was brilliant, he isn't even close to that now. I think we should leave O'Shea out of this as its derailing the thread a little and he at least has the skill of being extremely versatile. Valencia isn't that. He's an average full back and a mediocre winger. He shouldnt be anywhere near the starting XI if we have serious aspirations of challenging in Europe.Valencia and O'Shea have individually played at a high level, I'm not talking about the environment but about their performances.
What needs to stop is the thought that the only way to compete is having world XI players through the team when that is not the case and not something that can be maintained unless bank rolled - by a bank. Madrid tried their galacticos that has failed. City, PSG have been met with the same fate.So just to clarify, you don't know.
I should come across as someone who thinks Manchester United should be competing with Barca and Madrid, not accepting mediocrity within our squad. Quite simply the reason why you couldn't give me the Barca version of O'Shea or Valencia is because they haven't got one. Busquets is the best defensive midfielder of his generation, Pedro just a few weeks ago scored a spectacular overhead kick, these are players of real quality who are technically brilliant.
This 'do a job' mentality has to stop, its small time.
Who said that he should be in our starting eleven? He had a good season in a position alien to him, that's worthy of praises, there is no subliminal message.The Valencia of a bygone era was brilliant, he isn't even close to that now. I think we should leave O'Shea out of this as its derailing the thread a little and he at least has the skill of being extremely versatile. Valencia isn't that. He's an average full back and a mediocre winger. He shouldnt be anywhere near the starting XI if we have serious aspirations of challenging in Europe.
Arbeloa for Real. Far worse than Valencia and O'Shea.Who do you think are Barca's and Real Madrid's version of Valencia/John O'Shea?
It's nice to have mind readers around the place.Perhaps, although its equally likely to have a distorted view based on teams overall performance and not on individual ones. He kept Rafael out because Rafael couldn't keep himself fit and LVG thought consistency was the key at the end of the season. Still, this has been discussed to death with two clear camps.
I've heard LVG say he was our best player (as in MOTM) on a couple of occasions so I doubt it was just about him keeping fit.Perhaps, although its equally likely to have a distorted view based on teams overall performance and not on individual ones. He kept Rafael out because Rafael couldn't keep himself fit and LVG thought consistency was the key at the end of the season. Still, this has been discussed to death with two clear camps.
Who's the answer to the RB quandry?I used to be a massive Valencia fan but I'm past the point of trying to defend him. To go from a Man Utd number 7 and player of the year to a stop gap fullback is one of the biggest declines I can remember. Rooney gets stick for not being up there with Messi whilst you still have people who continually set the bar lower and lower for Valencia.
I'll give him the benefit of the doubt as a RB but he's dodgy positional and is very guilty of ball watching. And I think his lack of willingness to overlap at pace is stopping us breaking down teams. Arsenal had their full backs bombing beyond the ball at pace creating space on the weekend. Valencia is too content to backup the play, slow it down & not aggressively attack the space Mata leaves for him. Means we have no penetration on the right. Compare that to Blind at LB and Shaw vs Chelsea and the link up play with Young.
A fit RafaelWho's the answer to the RB quandry?