It´s getting to the point that those slating him for his play against Villa are just being wankers. Even his crossing was quite good in that match.
25
Season Average Rating
- Appearances
- 35
- Clean sheets
- 12
- Goals
- 0
- Assists
- 5
- Yellow cards
- 4
Agreed. It's odd because I feel as if Valencia's been far better than Young, over the past few games, yet the latter has been receiving a ridiculous amount of praise, whereas the former seems only to attract criticism... At least the man in charge of the club doesn't see it that way and has Valencia starting every game, and rightly so. He's been one of our most consistent performers this season and well done to him.
Oh and 0.50 seconds into the video... my word, that was an incredible pass.
Valencia is solid. But there's always this niggling feeling that even a slight improvement on the quality of RB, will resonance twice to the quality of our overall attacking play on the right. It just seems like Valencia is not only lessen the input from RB, but also shackled Herrera and Mata quality to truly shine that right side of the field.
http://www.stretford-end.com/2015/04/valencias-renaissance-defender-key-united/
He’s won a club-high 86% of his club-high 90 tackles, a ridiculous feat given that he makes a tackle more often than any other player in the squad (every 22 minutes). He’s also made a club-high 144 ball recoveries (recovering the ball when it’s gone loose in play), that’s one every 14 minutes, unsurprisingly also more often than any other player in the squad. Going forwards he has a better cross completion rate than Di Maria and has the second highest number of assists after the Argentinian. He seldom gives the ball away either; only Rooney and Blind have played more passes but neither boast the 90% accuracy he does.
He’s won a club-high 86% of his club-high 90 tackles, a ridiculous feat given that he makes a tackle more often than any other player in the squad (every 22 minutes). He’s also made a club-high 144 ball recoveries (recovering the ball when it’s gone loose in play), that’s one every 14 minutes, unsurprisingly also more often than any other player in the squad. Going forwards he has a better cross completion rate than Di Maria and has the second highest number of assists after the Argentinian. He seldom gives the ball away either; only Rooney and Blind have played more passes but neither boast the 90% accuracy he does.
Some negatives to provide the usual balance to this argument:
Not Rafael
Still Antonio Valencia
Has made a couple of mistakes over the course of the season
It's really starting to get boring, he gets the most unfair criticism at this club. If he reinvents his attacking quality, we arguably have one of the best/most complete rb in the league.
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Hark at those stats. A whole year of scouting potential first choice right backs is futile after seeing those.
I think he will be our first choice right back next season and while it might take a while, people will come around to him and realise how solid he actually is there once the pundits start highlighting his work
Are they accurate though?
I don't know where the check them all but the second highest number of assists is surely wrong, according to soccerway he has two. Mata, Rooney, Falcao and Herrera have all got double that.
http://uk.soccerway.com/teams/england/manchester-united-fc/662/squad/
Herrera and Mata are in the best form of their United lives, yet Valencia is guilty of shackling them?
Is this how low the criticism can go?
He's consistent, defends fairly well, works hard, has good link up play and is even a good passer when he's not crossing the ball. For a RB that's a pretty good mix to have but I can't get over his a)his poor crossing from great positions and b)his reluctance to take the full back on. That's mainly down to how good and deadly he has been over the years as a winger for us. In time, I reckon I'll get over his decline as a winger and emergence as a very solid RB for United.
It's so easy to make any player look good with using the stats that fits him. Well, the stats are definitely telling (almost) nothing in this case.
First, whoscored have him as having 3.1 tackles per game, so that means he makes tackle every 29 minutes, and not 22 like said in that site, and whoscored is usually most reliable sources for this stuff. But fair enough, he still makes more tackles than any other player.
As for his other defensive contribution, he is only 12th highest by clearances in the squad, 11th highest by interceptions, 9th highest in blocked shots, but highest from all defenders in number of fouls given against him per game(which is bad btw, just from watching the games you can see that he has a bad habbit of giving away silly fouls,similar to Fellaini).
So, basically his defensive stats are actually very average, probably even poor.
Also, worth mentioning that from mentioned stats, Rafael is weaker than him only at tackling, at every other defensive contribution he has better stats.
As for that recovered ball stats, I can't find it, but I don't doubt he bulks them up by winning back possession after his blocked crosses anyway.
And the passing stats is misleading too. Yes, only Mata has better passing accuracy, but it tells you nothing when Valencia makes less passes than 7 other players per game, someone like Blind makes almost 15 more passes per game, and it's really not difficult to tell how creative Valencia is his with passing in comparision with someone like Herrera, Carrick, Rooney, etc.
The assists stat is just a lie, nothing else, he only has 2 assists, same as Carrick, Blind and van Persie, and less than 5 other players, even though he is our third most featured outfield player this season(just 40 mins short of 2nd place).
Stats are great. Can I now make a thread to show that Rafael is better defensively looking through the stats?
First, whoscored have him as having 3.1 tackles per game, so that means he makes tackle every 29 minutes, and not 22 like said in that site, and whoscored is usually most reliable sources for this stuff. But fair enough, he still makes more tackles than any other player.
As for his other defensive contribution, he is only 12th highest by clearances in the squad, 11th highest by interceptions, 9th highest in blocked shots, but highest from all defenders in number of fouls given against him per game(which is bad btw, just from watching the games you can see that he has a bad habbit of giving away silly fouls,similar to Fellaini).
So, basically his defensive stats are actually very average, probably even poor.
Also, worth mentioning that from mentioned stats, Rafael is weaker than him only at tackling, at every other defensive contribution he has better stats.
As for that recovered ball stats, I can't find it, but I don't doubt he bulks them up by winning back possession after his blocked crosses anyway.
And the passing stats is misleading too. Yes, only Mata has better passing accuracy, but it tells you nothing when Valencia makes less passes than 7 other players per game, someone like Blind makes almost 15 more passes per game, and it's really not difficult to tell how creative Valencia is his with passing in comparision with someone like Herrera, Carrick, Rooney, etc.
The assists stat is just a lie, nothing else, he only has 2 assists, same as Carrick, Blind and van Persie, and less than 5 other players, even though he is our third most featured outfield player this season(just 40 mins short of 2nd place).
Stats are great. Can I now make a thread to show that Rafael is better defensively looking through the stats?
His profile at the top of this page has 5 assists this season. Not that anything on here is credible
I don't get the Valencia hate. Van Gaal clearly rates him over Rafa at the moment so lets kick on and see where this goes.
I'm still not convinced by his defensive ability. He's improved from last season where he was a complete liability and he completely trumps the kick and run merchants. But he doesn't have the brains of a defender, and doesn't convince me positionally or against smarter wingers. It helps that we generally don't do much defending due to our possession and that there are a big number of purely pace merchants in the league, but I could see us getting found out in Europe next season for example.
One thing I've noticed though, is that there is a large number of people who refuse to criticise Valencia at all. I can see why he's fairly likeable, but at the end of the day the bloke has gone from one of the best wingers in the league, to a full back who's better at defending than he is attacking, and he's no fecking Paolo Maldini either at the back. But he's gone backwards so much and there's a huge block of people who keep lowering their standards to praise him. Which if you compare to someone like Rooney who gets shit from daring not to be as good as Ronaldo and Messi, I think there's a big undeserved love in for Valencia.
One thing I've noticed though, is that there is a large number of people who refuse to criticise Valencia at all. I can see why he's fairly likeable, but at the end of the day the bloke has gone from one of the best wingers in the league, to a full back who's better at defending than he is attacking, and he's no fecking Paolo Maldini either at the back. But he's gone backwards so much and there's a huge block of people who keep lowering their standards to praise him. Which if you compare to someone like Rooney who gets shit from daring not to be as good as Ronaldo and Messi, I think there's a big undeserved love in for Valencia.
He is part of a system, which is coming into fruition. Could you not state the same about Young ? Wasnt he a winger before ? Has he now not won the critics over by mastering his new position ? The correlation between praising somebody for interchanging (lowering the standards) in positions doesnt convince me at all. There are plenty of members who have criticized Valencia for his one dimensional performances and there are enough members as well who even advocated a transfer because of that exact reason. The reason why Valencia is well liked as a person is because of the way he is carrying himself. Very demure, not seeking the spotlights and giving every inch of his lungs whenever he plays. I would actually argue that Valencia is more self-aware in regards of how to position himself and how to distribute the ball. That is Van Gaal in every way. Motivating players to use their cognitive abilties, but thats another topic. I would like to know which members are criticizing Wazza for not being on the same level as Messi and Ronaldo, because at least 99.99% of the footballers around the globe arent, so that would be a silly case to argue in my opinion. Anyway, i think Valencia as a right back has grown into many fans. This summer will one way or the other provide some answers regarding the fullback position.
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I just laugh at the hate he gets these days. Its hilarious that some think hes playing out of position, or he is wank. Its like the less rafael plays the more god like he becomes. While the more valencia does well the more shit some posters think he is. I'm sure given the option city fans would wish Rafa played over Toby V tomorrow.
He makes the odd mistake and is slaughtered on here like rafael is some master right back that does no wrong and makes the perfect right back performance every time. fact is, he is playing over rafael because he is simply playing better that him at the moment.
He makes the odd mistake and is slaughtered on here like rafael is some master right back that does no wrong and makes the perfect right back performance every time. fact is, he is playing over rafael because he is simply playing better that him at the moment.
I don't see the 'hates' here. It just people have differences in rating him.
Maybe Valencia does a "decent' job but Rafael would do a wonderful job. That's what's frustrating about Valencia starting. And I'm sure it'll hit LvG suddenly one day just like the decisions to put Rooney up top, play Herrera and give Mata games. It's fairly obvious but takes LvG ages to figure.
Or... it'll take a while for Rafael to figure out how to play in Van Gaal's system and until then he will remain outcast. Just like Herrera was.
I'm reminded of the debate about Carrick a few years ago when his defenders were hiding behind stats when it was clear that he was not the same player from the season or two before. The posters who pointed this out were called haters and derided as not being as knowledgeable as his die hard fans.
Nobody doubts Valencia's heart and commitment. Everyone loves the fact that he's not an ego manic whose off the field antics are in the papers every week. He's a good pro. He's solid. He gives everything. All the things people say when they're defending him are true. But he's not that good at either defending or attacking and we should be looking for a replacement, in my opinion. He is not the best there is in the RB/RMF/RW/RWB position and the best is what we should always be aspiring to.
I look at the stats about recovering the ball and, on the face of it, they are impressive. What they don't tell you, however, and it's something that is apparent when you watch him play, is that he's the reason he lost the ball in the first place, with an awful first touch. He is in the Stewart Downing at Liverpool mould, in that he runs at defenders, stops, then plays the ball back to a team mate a very high percentage of the time. And when he reaches the byline, he's going to smash it low and hard, hitting the first defender the vast majority of the time.
If you watch him doing this week in, week out, and you are satisfied with that, then I don't know what to tell you. But I'm used to wingers who can beat people and full backs who can cross the ball. Dani Alves on a free would hopefully make you see what you're missing.
Nobody doubts Valencia's heart and commitment. Everyone loves the fact that he's not an ego manic whose off the field antics are in the papers every week. He's a good pro. He's solid. He gives everything. All the things people say when they're defending him are true. But he's not that good at either defending or attacking and we should be looking for a replacement, in my opinion. He is not the best there is in the RB/RMF/RW/RWB position and the best is what we should always be aspiring to.
I look at the stats about recovering the ball and, on the face of it, they are impressive. What they don't tell you, however, and it's something that is apparent when you watch him play, is that he's the reason he lost the ball in the first place, with an awful first touch. He is in the Stewart Downing at Liverpool mould, in that he runs at defenders, stops, then plays the ball back to a team mate a very high percentage of the time. And when he reaches the byline, he's going to smash it low and hard, hitting the first defender the vast majority of the time.
If you watch him doing this week in, week out, and you are satisfied with that, then I don't know what to tell you. But I'm used to wingers who can beat people and full backs who can cross the ball. Dani Alves on a free would hopefully make you see what you're missing.
Criticise him for a lot of things but his first touch and ball retention is impeccable so that is just bollocks.
Secondly, he's not a winger, he's a fullback with two creative players working the channel ahead of him.
Thirdly, here's the comparison to Dani Alves who plays in a team that has scored 87 goals this season compared to United's 55. Alves has 4 assists compared to Valencia's 2.
Man Utd 4:2 Man City
Absolutely shocking from Valencia there.
Does anyone actually want to play against the likes of Barca, Bayern and Madrid and other UCL opposition with Valencia as our right back?
But think about the statistics!
It more than likely will not be Rafael but, we are going to need a real RB starting at RB next season.
I've banged on about Valencia being defensively solid nearly all season, but he looks dizzy. He doesn't seem to know where to be, who to mark, where the danger is. Doesn't seem to do anything when City get behind him with the ball, which is unlike him. His defensive game has been top this season, but he's just everywhere he shouldn't be so far.
He's been decent enough. Massive overreaction to single him out.
Epic defending from Tony. Saved us a goal just now.
Aye, did very well just there.
It was a great recovery from him but it was terrible from Aguero and I agree with Neville that his positioning was pretty poor to begin with too.
Not sure if I slept through the first few minutes but he's been quite good.
People are actually complaining 
Give the guy a fecking break please. He's had a very good half.
Give the guy a fecking break please. He's had a very good half.
His own mistake in the first place.
Started badly like 100% of our players. been very good since like the rest of them.
Nothing to see here.
Nothing to see here.
Smalling has had to cover for him as he slowly jogs back time and again. He's extremely lazy getting back. He's been decent going forward, but that was screaming out for a first time cross to Fellaini at the end who was unmarked. He took a touch and Zabaleta got back
It was his fault to begin with, the centreback steps up you step up. Played him onside and if it weren't for the bad first touch he wouldn't have had the time to recover from his mistake.
More like Smalling's ridiculous offside trap attempt.