Westminster Politics

[Mr Pigeon]

Just despicable.

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[esmufc07]

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[Tibs]

Just despicable.

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Deleted tweet? What did it say?

 

[Tibs]

Any NHS staff affected by the above should go on strike now.

 

[sun_tzu]

Any NHS staff affected by the above should go on strike now.

in the middle of a pandemic... without a ballot?

 

[Tibs]

in the middle of a pandemic... without a ballot?

In the middle of the pandemic they're being told to essentially feck off.

The Government give zero fecks about them, this is the time they have most leverage.

 

[sun_tzu]

In the middle of the pandemic they're being told to essentially feck off.

The Government give zero fecks about them, this is the time they have most leverage.

so they should basically say we are going to break the law to risk peoples lives till you change the law to suit us ... thats pretty much blackmail.

 

[africanspur]

In the middle of the pandemic they're being told to essentially feck off.

The Government give zero fecks about them, this is the time they have most leverage.

Unfortunately, a lot of NHS staff care too much what the public think and the Government were far better at PR the last time someone in the NHS tried to pipe up (the junior doctors, who've ended up having a shitty contract imposed on them).

I'm not sure what it is about the system in the UK (perhaps the fact its completely state owned) but there is a bit of a taboo about pay weirdly. Both for HC workers bringing it up and seemingly a lot of members of the public find it weird too.

I've worked in Australia and in a few countries across South America. I've got friends who work in Canada/ USA/ NZ. There really are no qualms, you work and you get paid for the work you do. Its so strange here.

 

[africanspur]

As for the above, I'm not even slightly surprised. They have also kept the NHS surcharge in for HCWs from abroad too, which is paid above their normal taxes and NI contributions too.

Utter scum.

 

[Buster15]

I actually think if starmer deals with it well pointing out that the conservatives are busy yaaaaa booooing like children whilst people are dying will work well for him (provided his own side can resist the urge to join in the pantomime)

Yes.
He has already shown himself to be highly professional.
And as you say, that professionalism has to be shown by the rest of the party.

 

[Jericholyte2]

so they should basically say we are going to break the law to risk peoples lives till you change the law to suit us ... thats pretty much blackmail.

And this is why workers rights have stagnated as they have. We all go on about shitty working conditions and bullshit like this but then as soon as people suggest we do something about it, they're the ones who get villified.

Need a but of the French workers spirit, they ow how to do a strike properly. Understanding that what they're fighting for is far greater than the inconvenience they cause.

 

[africanspur]

This is genuinely infuriating. You want to see frontline NHS staff paid properly, while your party has overseen a real term drop in salary of up to 30% for NHS staff. You want to invest in the NHS...as your party has gutted it.

Doesn't answer the question, does the usual look around to his troops as he's answering...when there are no troops, which just makes it look so ridiculous.

Idiot.

 

[T00lsh3d]

Watched some of PMQs and it really is technical versus bluster. I just wonder whether Starmer has the oomph to carry it through, it's not a court of law and bullshit does travel in the house

 

[BobbyManc]

so they should basically say we are going to break the law to risk peoples lives till you change the law to suit us ... thats pretty much blackmail.

Yet on the previous page you had a problem with a trade union leader acknowledging that the law protected workers from being put at risk. Now you are clutching your pearls at the suggestion workers should break the law.

 

[Mr Pigeon]

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You're odds on for retaining your Worst Poster award, you know?

Just tell us what it said ffs Elvis.

 

[Tibs]

so they should basically say we are going to break the law to risk peoples lives till you change the law to suit us ... thats pretty much blackmail.

Yes, its best to do this kind of thing when you have most leverage....remember, these people have done nothing wrong, they're heroes.

 

[sun_tzu]

Yet on the previous page you had a problem with a trade union leader acknowledging that the law protected workers from being put at risk. Now you are clutching your pearls at the suggestion workers should break the law.

For a strike to be legal does it not have to have a compliant ballot rather than people simply walking out (leaving essential medical services unstaffed in a pandemic for an added bonus i guess)

 

[sun_tzu]

Yes, its best to do this kind of thing when you have most leverage....remember, these people have done nothing wrong, they're heroes.

isnt it best to do these things legally...
you know having a ballott in line with the regulations
giving due notice to the employer (in this case NHS) so they can ensure an adequate level of care is available to patients in the middle of a pandemic
rather than just walking out ... and potentially killing a lot of people who have done nothing wrong (which would go against the heroic description a tad)

 

[Mr Pigeon]

isnt it best to do these things legally...
you know having a ballott in line with the regulations
giving due notice to the employer (in this case NHS) so they can ensure an adequate level of care is available to patients in the middle of a pandemic
rather than just walking out ... and potentially killing a lot of people who have done nothing wrong (which would go against the heroic description a tad)

But it's ok for the employer to make these decisions themselves without consulting their employees?

 

[esmufc07]

You're odds on for retaining your Worst Poster award, you know?

Just tell us what it said ffs Elvis.

Just ban me now.

 

[sun_tzu]

But it's ok for the employer to make these decisions themselves without consulting their employees?

pretty sure its a government decision and essentially they have stuck to what they always said ... (income thresholds / who is entitled to what etc in the immigration bill)
Not up to employers in anyway what the government imposes
Some are saying because of the work the NHS has done the givernment should change the law - not on the face of it an unreasonable proposal
Some are now saying because they have not changed their proposals the NHS should walk out now in the middle of a pandemic ... on the face of it I think thats unreasonable

 

[Tibs]

isnt it best to do these things legally...
you know having a ballott in line with the regulations
giving due notice to the employer (in this case NHS) so they can ensure an adequate level of care is available to patients in the middle of a pandemic
rather than just walking out ... and potentially killing a lot of people who have done nothing wrong (which would go against the heroic description a tad)

They're doing the work, putting themselves on the line, and then going to get told to pay up or get out.

If a vote needs to be had then fair enough - but now is the time to take action. However, as somebody else has pointed out, these EU nationals are legends, they're not going to do anything to harm patients.

It'll pass through the house, and the majority of the public will stay quiet, and Brexit means brexit

 

[esmufc07]

Any of our resident Brexiteers signing up for Pick for Britain?

 

[Compton22]

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Can't help but think this will end up back firing massively. Heckling from Conservative backbenchers against a calm opposition leader focused on the facts of just how terrible the government's coronavirus response has been will only serve in making the opposition look like the grown ups in the debate. Especially since this new format has exposed Boris Johnson and his cabinet for the lying chancers that they are.

 

[Sweet Square]

Can't help but think this will end up back firing massively. Heckling from Conservative backbenchers against a calm opposition leader focused on the facts of just how terrible the government's coronavirus response has been will only serve in making the opposition look like the grown ups in the debate. Especially since this new format has exposed Boris Johnson and his cabinet for the lying chancers that they are.

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It literally doesn't matter as no one sadly cares about PMQ's.

 

[Compton22]

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It literally doesn't matter as no one sadly cares about PMQ's.

Admittedly I didn't care much for it until the virtual format was introduced. It's so much more productive and watchable without the childish booing and heckling over ministers raising important questions. I'll be sad to see it go back to normal.

On YouGov's polls, it truly baffles me that people would still vote Conservative. They may not be watching PMQ's but the media is certainly not giving them an easy ride on the way they have handled this situation.

 

[Sweet Square]

Admittedly I didn't care much for it until the virtual format was introduced. It's so much more productive and watchable without the childish booing and heckling over ministers raising important questions. I'll be sad to see it go back to normal.

Agree with you here, its far better than the norm and it's going to be pretty awful when it returns back.

On YouGov's polls, it truly baffles me that people would still vote Conservative. They may not be watching PMQ's but the media is certainly not giving them an easy ride on the way they have handled this situation.

Hopefully it's just them still riding high due to the pandemic. In times of crisis people tend to rally around the government(Almost all western governments have had a massive polling boost since the pandemic).

The worry for Starmer is his personal polling numbers are quite high, so people are clearly impressive by him but Labour still poll in the low 30's. It's very possible that the public like Starmer but that doesn't translate into future votes for Labour.

 

[esmufc07]

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[Dobba]

Sorry Nye, but Sir Keir (and his private health lobbyist Director of Comms) is in charge now and we need to establish tiers of deserving and undeserving foreigners.

 

[SteveJ]

According to Sky’s Tamara Cohen, the Independent Office for Police Conduct will announce shortly that it will not be launching a criminal investigation into Boris Johnson and his relationship with the American businesswoman Jennifer Arcuri when he was mayor.

 

[TheGame]

Oh what a surprise, Teflon Boris does it again.

 

[Drifter]

Britain First leader Paul Golding convicted under terrorism law
https://www.standard.co.uk/news/cri...ng-guilty-terrorism-act-offence-a4446516.html

Russia seems to be a bit of a hot spot for these people.

 

[FireballXL5]

Boris Johnson will not face criminal inquiry over Jennifer Arcuri
https://www.theguardian.com/politic...ot-face-criminal-inquiry-over-jennifer-arcuri

We laugh at America, but this shit has been going on over here for longer. But.....clap, clap

 

[Fluctuation0161]

isnt it best to do these things legally...
you know having a ballott in line with the regulations
giving due notice to the employer (in this case NHS) so they can ensure an adequate level of care is available to patients in the middle of a pandemic
rather than just walking out ... and potentially killing a lot of people who have done nothing wrong (which would go against the heroic description a tad)

Maybe they should just write a strongly worded email instead? All workers rights have been won that way, right?

 

[Fluctuation0161]

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Can't help but think this will end up back firing massively. Heckling from Conservative backbenchers against a calm opposition leader focused on the facts of just how terrible the government's coronavirus response has been will only serve in making the opposition look like the grown ups in the debate. Especially since this new format has exposed Boris Johnson and his cabinet for the lying chancers that they are.

Also does not follow government advice of work from home if possible.

Hypocrites only coming back to hide Boris Johnsons inadequacies.

 

[Fluctuation0161]

Boris Johnson will not face criminal inquiry over Jennifer Arcuri
https://www.theguardian.com/politic...ot-face-criminal-inquiry-over-jennifer-arcuri

We laugh at America, but this shit has been going on over here for longer. But.....clap, clap

BBC news saying no evidence to investigate further but record keeping at the mayor's office has been criticised while Johnson was in office.

Hmmmmmmmm.

 

[Mr Pigeon]

BBC news saying no evidence to investigate further but record keeping at the mayor's office has been criticised while Johnson was in office.

Hmmmmmmmm.

I'm just picturing huge stacks of paper being tossed by Boris' team into a bonfire with the independent investigators standing beside it ticking a few boxes in their notebooks and shouting "nothing to see here"

 

[Untied]

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This is literally so dumb. I don't know if anyone has done a take down of his points but anyway.

Firstly, his house isn't going to be on the hook. Fine but that's normally the case anyway with regards to limited liability companies. Weird to be crying over it. Sure in theory banks could require guarantee/collateral on a loan and the Govt is instead guaranteeing the loans, but yeah. Noting particularly abnormal about being somewhat insulated from personal loss if your business collapses.

Anyway, onto the Bounce Back loans and why it's a shitty policy.

- Government guarantees the loans, but is not itself the lender.
- So the taxpayer takes on 100% of the risk of the loan meanwhile the lenders (all private companies) take 100% of the reward
- The loans have a 2.5% interest rate, which… given the base rate just dropped by a factor of 7 to 0.1% is probably going to look pretty pricey in 6 months time.
- Why isn't the Government itself backing these loans and charging say 0.5% interest on them? Instead the real winners of this policy are the lenders who make a guaranteed 2.5% return on the loans until the businesses either collapse or the balance is paid off. And that's a policy that is being emotionally praised?

 

[Sweet Square]

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[Compton22]

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Of course the older generation would want them to pay.