I genuinely think the football is worse than under LvG.
Erik ten Hag - Manchester United manager
- Thread starter sewey89
- Start date
This. It is just the most positive possible Eth interpretation of the dribble of made up info the media give us. Instead of assessing what we can actually see (football matches) we dream up a nonsense narrative from nonsense info.
We look so toothless, slow, no ideas going one way and open as feck going the other way. What is going on!?
De Zerbi over Potter everyday of the week
Stumbling on like a drunk in the night
Hojilund need to return, that's what needs to happen.
Another 200 plus words looking to absolve the manager of all blame for the quality of the players he evidently thought he could mould into a system and a succesful team.
Every sane fan recognises that pre-takeover the club was run shambolically. Should they have brought in an untested foreign manager and backed him like they did and given him control of transfers? Should they have gone all in on the players he wanted? Of course not. They should have had a DoF or similar, like all well ran clubs. That's not in dispute.
But how does that absolve him of total blame if those players are as far off the quality required as they appear to be? Does it not suggest he's vastly over-estimated those players, or underestimated the quality of the league he's coming to (and by this summer had been in for a year), or overestimate his own ability to get the collection of players, playing the way he wants? None of that reflects well on his ability as a coach - and that's what this is about.
Antony, whether at £80 million or £8 million isn't good enough. We've lacked legs in midfield and Amrabat isn't anywhere near good enough either, whilst Mount - who was always going to cost decent money from Chelsea, looks very much like a luxury alternative to Fernandes yet was the first through the door. But for Mainoo we'd be much worse off - so fair play for throwing him in. If Amrabat was the best he could do, why not can the Mount deal and get a quality holding midfield player in first, if he does have a transfer veto?
Putting all that aside, the question should be whether this manager, on the body of evidence we've seen so far has the ability to take this club forward. Over and above transfers - i.e. his decision making in game, the way he sets us up, the chances we concede (in my view, damning stats in the thread above which even I was surprised at) - what suggests that he's good enough to manage one of the biggest clubs in the world?
I've posed that question to various people on here and never had a straight answer. I am far from any sort of expert in football - so what am I missing?
We're in big trouble on Sunday if that's the best we can produce.
Unacceptable that it's Nuno hounding the ref at the end and not Ten Hag.
So it’ll be City, Everton, Liverpool in the cup then the international break.
ominous
ominous
If he has any sense he should complain like crazy that Felipe should have gotten a red
Hope I wake up tomorrow to the news of an interim replacement.
If he does, youll get the Athletic criticising him for it. There's already an article saying he's cracking for going out swinging against the press for criticism.
City yeah. I'll take a 3-0 forfeit now. But it's not beyond us to beat the other two.
No way INEOS can sit through that and be happy with how utd play football.
Listen i'm happy with win and in to next round but its painful to watch.
Listen i'm happy with win and in to next round but its painful to watch.
7 wins out of the last 9 games. The Zidane fans better keep waiting a bit longer. I dont see INEOS kicking Ten Hag out as long as he produces wins, ugly but without a host of players. City a write off. Then the break. Well done Erik for now.
I think he'll be gone next week.
He won’t be gone next week, next month and not until deep into next season at very least.
he will be here until the end of the season
no point in changing now.
I still want to see him get a chance under a proper structure next season but I know I’m in minority on here
He’s getting lucky all the time. Scraping wins together
I don't know. I think they need to make a decision by mid-March at the absolute latest to plan next season.
It's really in the balance.
We had three times more xG than Forest, should have won by several goals, what luck?
He will get his extension soon. Probably two extra years with some assurances from the board that he’s safe and trusted.
That or the boot yeah.
What are you missing? Basic reading comprehension by the looks of it. I'm not "looking to absolve the manager of all blame for quality of the players" he's brought in, and it's mad that you've somehow got that idea. I'm simply looking to provide the much needed context to whatever criticisms people want to make about those players.
Your stuff about whether he's the man to take us forward is completely irrelevant to this specific discussion, but again, you're clearly lacking comprehension if you can't see that there aren't many people (myself included) that are more than happy for him to get the boot, whether that's soon or at the end of the season. However, the reason they're happy for that to happen has nothing to do with his shit transfer record (which was the topic of discussion here, and that shouldn't have been his responsibility anyway), and a lot more to do with the other points you've raised. Points that are often ignored in favour of wailing incessantly about him signing Antony and Weghorst.
I'm actually more than happy to criticise Ten Hag for how little he's managed to get out of Antony, especially given that they'd worked together before. Similarly, I'm happy to criticise him for how often he expects Casemiro to cover half the pitch on his own, and even for how Mount appears completely unsuited for the role we apparently bought him to fill, even if we've not seen that much of him. Importantly, these critcisms can't be made without the caveat of how these players came to the club though, and that's a massive fecking caveat.
I'm not sure if you did and I can't be arsed going back to check, but people keep banging on about transfer fees, as if this is Football Manager and Ten Hag's the one sitting down negotiating these deals himself. The money spent has nothing to do with him whatsoever, even if some of the players were his recommendations. Simply put, the club shouldn't be giving him first choice of his own targets anyway, and even if they are, they certainly shouldn't be paying well over the odds for them, just because he wants them. Again, I don't care if he's sacked tonight (even though we won), but it's very hard to trust that the people who desperately want him gone now won't be equally as toxic with whoever replaces him, when they're constantly using stuff that's got feck all to do with him as a stick to beat him with.
Oh so now you care about xG
I am with you. Will be very interesting to see him under a proper structure.
I do not, but all the moaners do, who conveniently forget about that bloody stat every time it doesn't fit their moan session.
That would be utter madness from INEOS. Even if they want to change next week, who is going to take over? And why would they if he keeps producing wins?
Wich of the current technical board - the outgoing, is going to advice a new manager? Then sack that guy when new CEO, technical director is in and outlined a new approach?
It does not make sense at all to sack Ten Hag now.
Sounds like he's pre-empting the moans. We had more possession and more XG got a clean sheet and won the game, but it didn't stop the whingers from coming out
Berrarda and Ashworth will decide if it happened.
It was a better performance than Luton or Fulham. Not saying much as those two were horrid, but we had more control today. I expected us to get beaten and we edged it so happy overall.
Liverpool will be a good test. Win that and he will alter the outlook of this season significantly. Lose and it will be even more depressing.
Liverpool will be a good test. Win that and he will alter the outlook of this season significantly. Lose and it will be even more depressing.
They would, but they will not be doing anything at this point.
Beat Liverpool 7-0 for a lifetime contract
Were you happy with how we played or feel entertained or did it just feel like a drag?Sounds like he's pre-empting the moans. We had more possession and more XG got a clean sheet and won the game, but it didn't stop the whingers from coming out
I thought he made some decent tweaks to the shape today, fullbacks a touch lower and midfield had more bodies. I’d have liked to see him trust a couple of the kids he had on the bench, just to gamble on them having a good impact.
They already are
Another tough watch against a poor side. But a wins a win.
I was fine with it honestly. 60+% possession, 3x more XG, clean sheet. I thought we were well structured and worked hard - but yes, there was no cutting edge from Rashford/Garnacho (I think Antony did better than the pair of them). That being said, with no actual left back, Licha out, Mainoo benched and Hojlund injured I wasn't expecting squashbuckling football away from home to a defensive Nuno side.
I feel like this is a good example of just whinging for the sake of it. If Ten Hag dares to be open and progressive there's bitching about how we invite too many chances and we aren't solid enough. If we're solid and structured, there's bitching about how its boring to watch.
Bitching? Or just unhappiness. The game bored the life out of me to be honest. Both teams as bad as each other. Forest had chances when they just run through us but had no quality up top, we made some chances in the first ten minutes and then nothing all game. It was just a match of nothingness between two awful teams. That’s not bitching but just expecting a little more, just some spark or directness or I don’t know what, but it’s just flat and crap. And not just tonight but weekly.