Giggsyking
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- Aug 24, 2013
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Greedy Jimmy. How much money do you want?
Greedy Jimmy. How much money do you want?
What? they have taken out in dividends and interests payments more than 1 billion pound, very small!!It's not a massive difference at all. They haven't taken dividends out in a while and debt repayments amount to the price of an average fullback, ie. they are very small in the grand scheme of things.
You didn't counter this point since you agreed and you also didn't counter it with Hamad Al Thani being globally more infuential since I literally wrote it in the paragraph above the one you quoted. I simply stated what is true for both Hamad Al Thani is probably more influential globally because he was a major political leader in the Middle East and Ineos are more influential regionally because it's their backyard and where they focus their lobbying.I was countering this point in particular:
"But people need to remember something that they seem to willingly ignore or brush aside, the most influential people outside of political leaders are men like Ratcliffe, leaders in the petrochemical, energy, pharmaceutical industries and banking those people are the main source of corruption, political manipulation, dubious laws and regulations making in the world and in particular in our western countries, someone like Ratcliffe has more political power than most members of any british/french government, he has more influence on the EU or similar organization than most members of parliaments or political boards."
(Apologies, I'd quote it directly but I'm posting this whilst out at the gym)
My point was that I don't think people are less ignorant of it and more just considering the situation through the "lesser of two evils" lens.
Regardless, if I misinterpreted your post I extend my apologies. I think it was largely correct.
I was specifically countering the idea that people are "seemingly willing to ignore or brush aside" what you said, not the content itself. Again, apologies if that was not clear.You didn't counter this point since you agreed and you also didn't counter it with Hamad Al Thani being globally more infuential since I literally wrote it in the paragraph above the one you quoted. I simply stated what is true for both Hamad Al Thani is probably more influential globally because he was a major political leader in the Middle East and Ineos are more influential regionally because it's their backyard and where they focus their lobbying.
How much is the Spurs owner worth? How much of his money has he invested?Might I be so bold as to ask the people who think we'll become "the next Spurs" if Ratcliffe takes over, why they think this?
The way people talk about it, you'd think the guy was a pauper. He'd be one of the league's richest owners by net worth if his bid is successful.
Joe Lewis is worth less than half what Jim Ratcliffe is worth.How much is the Spurs owner worth? How much of his money has he invested?
No, you weren't.I was specifically countering the idea that people are "seemingly willing to ignore or brush aside" what you said, not the content itself. Again, apologies if that was not clear.
INEOS, absolutely. My counter to that would be that Hamad Al Thani's political influence over Qatar is more considerable than INEOS' over any single state, probably by a considerable margin.
Assuming this is a jokeIs this how you engage in dialog with others who disagree with you, you bully them, steal their belongings, few digs ? You sound like an autocratic country leader.. The irony.
I was talking about my response to your original post:No, you weren't.
The post you quoted was in response to a different question that you asked so, respectfully, yes I was.I'd argue most of the people who want Ratcliffe rather than Jassim want him because of what he isn't rather than what he is. That's certainly the case for me, anyway.
Ratcliffe might well be a ruthless piece of shit businessman, but he isn't almost certainly a front for a sportswashing venture for an abhorrent regime. The same cannot be said for Jassim, and I'm afraid those who claim otherwise are simply hypocrites because they would not be this willing to give the benefit of the doubt if it were another club involved.
Twice 0 is still 0 which is what this equation comes up to.Joe Lewis is worth less than half what Jim Ratcliffe is worth.
I'd call them hypocrites but they know what they're doing. It's massive double standards and these so-called democratic fighters fail to see how their thinking is closer to that of an authoritarian state when it suits and their values come out only to fight the battles which are convenient.Is this how you engage in dialog with others who disagree with you, you bully them, steal their belongings, few digs ? You sound like an autocratic country leader.. The irony.
Are you really going to try to argue that Britain's wealthiest man by net worth is actually worth nothing? What the serious feck?Twice 0 is still 0 which is what this equation comes up to.
Not to mention most of Ratcliffe's 'wealth' is coming from his Ineos ownership and he's not about to sell that, is he? Such basic misconceptions about net worth just demonstrate how much some of you underestimate the power of hard cash in a time of insane interest rates which even for Ineos may be higher than our debt from 2020.
It can't be a counter when I already made that point. Your counter is stating something that I already stated. To summarize you agree with my view on Hamad Al Thani in the ME and you agree with my view of Ineos in the UK but you are countering both with the other.I was talking about my response to your original post:
The post you quoted was in response to a different question that you asked so, respectfully, yes I was.
Not sure he is arguing that. But having a guesstimate net worth of £13bn doesn't mean having £13bn.Are you really going to try to argue that Britain's wealthiest man by net worth is actually worth nothing? What the serious feck?
I meant the annual debt repayments going forward. Most experts would agree that it's a small fry in the grand scheme of things.What? they have taken out in dividends and interests payments more than 1 billion pound, very small!!
OK. So then I have 2 questions for you if this isn’t that much.
1. why are the vast majority of fans opposed to the Glazer ownership?
2.Why have we fallen so far behind other clubs and Man City in particular ?
Yeah, I understand that Ratcliffe doesn't have £13 billion just lying around. The point still stands, though, that he is really wealthy even by Premier League owner standards. It's only really the nation states that Ratcliffe looks poor in comparison to.Not sure he is arguing that. But having a guesstimate net worth of £13bn doesn't mean having £13bn.
Is he? Why is he offering to buy just the majority of Glazer shares not even buying them out outright. Just enough to have control.Yeah, I understand that Ratcliffe doesn't have £13 billion just lying around. The point still stands, though, that he is really wealthy even by Premier League owner standards. It's only really the nation states that Ratcliffe looks poor in comparison to.
He is dirt poor next to the Kroenke power couple especially Ms Walton.Yeah, I understand that Ratcliffe doesn't have £13 billion just lying around. The point still stands, though, that he is really wealthy even by Premier League owner standards. It's only really the nation states that Ratcliffe looks poor in comparison to.
You do realise the vast majority of the wealth in Qatar comes from oil and gas.How about 20, 30 or even 50? Shall we become mid-table to make sure no one can say anything? What happens when Green peace start on Ratcliffe?
Why spend more than he has to?Is he? Why is he offering to buy just the majority of Glazer shares not even buying them out outright. Just enough to have control.
He isn't selling Ineos. How much money he has outside of what the assumed value of that company is, doesn't seem proven.
Oh yeah, I forgot that Kroenke was married to Ann Walton.He is dirt poor next the Kroenke power couple especially Ms Walton.
you cannot in all sincerity believe that ?I meant the annual debt repayments going forward. Most experts would agree that it's a small fry in the grand scheme of things.
1. Different fans have different reasons. Some fans have valid reasons and others oppose them without really understanding the detail as to why they oppose.
2. Poor decision making; allowing Woodward run the football operation for nearly a decade. A journalist recently said that United probably would have won the league by now if Arnold had replaced Woodward 5 years ago. I tend to agree with that perspective.
You shouldn't spend more than you need to but Ineos runs with a substantial debt burden itself. The misconception that he's going to get rid of the Glazers and clear the debt which is where the first thousand pages of this thread were at, isn't going to happenWhy spend more than he has to?
How do you prove the value of a company?
Thank you, I don't have the patience to explain basic stuff like this.Not sure he is arguing that. But having a guesstimate net worth of £13bn doesn't mean having £13bn.
Your gran might own her own £200,000 house, her "net worth" will then be set at at least £200k. Doesn't mean anything that costs £20k is affordable to her.
Billionaires of major companies have almost all of their worth tied up in those companies and linked to their assumed value.
To be fair she is discreet even though from what I understand she is an actor in his investments, at least that's what I understood in the context of the St Louis/LA Rams.Oh yeah, I forgot that Kroenke was married to Ann Walton.
This is most probably a bullshit story but it's the most logical thing to happen.Tweet
— Twitter API (@user) date
Who blinks first…Glazers or Qatar
There is no way Ogden has this explosive news in his pocket and he’s wasted it on the United Stand never mind how ridiculous it is that Ogden would even know.Tweet
— Twitter API (@user) date
Who blinks first…Glazers or Qatar
I'm not a Ratcliffe guy, but you could say that about Elon or Bezos or anyone on the Forbes Richest list. Most of their wealth is based upon assumed value of their companies.Is he? Why is he offering to buy just the majority of Glazer shares not even buying them out outright. Just enough to have control.
He isn't selling Ineos. How much money he has outside of what the assumed value of that company is, doesn't seem proven.
Well, crap, that would not be ideal for us or the rest of the league.Tweet
— Twitter API (@user) date
Who blinks first…Glazers or Qatar
He's always said there would be no fresh debt, meaning it would go to Ineos so unless his company goes bust, it shouldn't affect us as their annual turnover is like 100 times our clubs.You shouldn't spend more than you need to but Ineos runs with a substantial debt burden itself. The misconception that he's going to get rid of the Glazers and clear the debt which is where the first thousand pages of this thread were at, isn't going to happen
He does not have access to billions of pounds to do that. A takeover will be heavily financed and borrowed
All quiet. Expect at some point soon we shall either hear that the Ratcliffe bid has been accepted or that Qatar have made an increased offer.Are we any closer to this coming to a conclusion? Who has the upper hand now, last week it was Ratcliffe, now it seems to be Sheikh Jassim. I can't keep track of what's going on.
Spurs would still find a way to be crap.Now that Jassy's bought Hotspurs, will he bring Mbappe and Verrati with him? This is such a panicy situation, how the feck are we going to manage top 4 next year?
True. Them and Arsenal never let you down.Spurs would still find a way to be crap.
I’ve just watched that Ben Jacobs fella chatting on the United people’s, it’s probably been mentioned in this bastard thread somewhere but he said that by making it look like a private bid from jassim if it all goes tits up and they lose out to Ineos or whoever they can walk away without losing face because essentially they’re claiming nothing to do with the bid.This is most probably a bullshit story but it's the most logical thing to happen.
But hey, at least Jimmy Brexit might attend a game of the team he supports from time to time.
Which makes no sense. They're hardly strapped for cash.I’ve just watched that Ben Jacobs fella chatting on the United people’s, it’s probably been mentioned in this bastard thread somewhere but he said that by making it look like a private bid from jassim if it all goes tits up and they lose out to Ineos or whoever they can walk away without losing face because essentially they’re claiming nothing to do with the bid.
Just something I hadn’t really considered, so I guess they could just turn their attention to somebody else.