Erik ten Hag - Manchester United manager

[DSG]

No. Not yet.

He has the highest win percentage of any manager post SAF at 65%.

we have started the season poorly, but we have significant injuries and the finishing has been atrocious. We desperately need Shaw and Varane back. Licha seems not to have completely recovered from the ankle injury.

 

[NZT-One]

The new system clearly isn't fit for purpose if it isn't tailored for the players Ten Hag has in front of him. I'm not asking for his head yet but we have to hold some kind of standards.

We're not talking about playing against great teams here either. Wolves at home, Spurs away, Forest and Brighton at home. These aren't teams we should be intimidated by and we haven't had one game yet where there isn't some level of concern about the performance or the result.

The opponents we played don't matter. Again, for right or wrong - ETH decided for a formation change seemingly going away from a more or less 4-2-3-1 last year to a 4-3-3 this year with the biggest difference being the structure in midfield. This is a way many successful teams are setting up these days so it isn't a bad plan per se. I'll give you that it didn't really worked until today. But a) was unlikely to start with as such a change is pretty difficult to implement (given where we came from) and b) key personnel for this formation were never available to train it.

I see your point - yes, we shouldn't make Brighton look like the home team when they come to the OT but it also doesn't make sense to deny reality because "we are Manchester United" as if this would still mean anything. Other teams went through phases of adaptation as well. We will too. But this will only work if we will stick with it and not revert back as soon as some aversion pops up. I am not defending the manager here, I wouldn't have gone for Mount and I wouldn't even have considered a formation where Bruno is required to do something that isn't chance creation but it is what it is. ETH is the manager, he has a plan, he recruited for that plan and just throwing it in the bin after a bad start would/could only hinder our progress. Don't know what peoples expectation were - as if we were challenger this year and subsequently as if bringing another manager in could potentially unleash the mighty forces.

Again, it is absolutely fine to criticize him but if our fans are too fickle, then the mood will change even quicker and the only ones to suffer will be us because the the circle of shit will just reset. Trust Murtough to find a better manager than ETH? I don't and I have no idea how anybody could think differently.

Except he did we, we played the best football I have seen us play post Fergie last season before the Eriksen injury

Means absolutely nothing when our football has been shite for all this time. Arguments like this do absolutely nothing because they have no substance. "Best football" is also highly subjective so it doesn't really make sense to discuss it anyway. Also I think you have taken a camp in the Rashford thread saying he was just fine today. Legitimate standpoint, don't get me wrong but if that was just fine for you, it gives perspective to your idea of "best football since".

 

[Cassidy]

We should also bring over all the Dutch clubs to replace the English clubs in the PL.

 

[Cassidy]

The opponents we played don't matter. Again, for right or wrong - ETH decided for a formation change seemingly going away from a more or less 4-2-3-1 last year to a 4-3-3 this year with the biggest difference being the structure in midfield. This is a way many successful teams are setting up these days so it isn't a bad plan per se. I'll give you that it didn't really worked until today. But a) was unlikely to start with as such a change is pretty difficult to implement (given where we came from) and b) key personnel for this formation were never available to train it.

I see your point - yes, we shouldn't make Brighton look like the home team when they come to the OT but it also doesn't make sense to deny reality because "we are Manchester United" as if this would still mean anything. Other teams went through phases of adaptation as well. We will too. But this will only work if we will stick with it and not revert back as soon as some aversion pops up. I am not defending the manager here, I wouldn't have gone for Mount and I wouldn't even have considered a formation where Bruno is required to do something that isn't chance creation but it is what it is. ETH is the manager, he has a plan, he recruited for that plan and just throwing it in the bin after a bad start would/could only hinder our progress. Don't know what peoples expectation were - as if we were challenger this year and subsequently as if bringing another manager in could potentially unleash the mighty forces.

Again, it is absolutely fine to criticize him but if our fans are too fickle, then the mood will change even quicker and the only ones to suffer will be us because the the circle of shit will just reset. Trust Murtough to find a better manager than ETH? I don't and I have no idea how anybody could think differently.


Means absolutely nothing when our football has been shite for all this time. Arguments like this do absolutely nothing because they have no substance. "Best football" is also highly subjective so it doesn't really make sense to discuss it anyway. Also I think you have taken a camp in the Rashford thread saying he was just fine today. Legitimate standpoint, don't get me wrong but if that was just fine for you, it gives perspective to your idea of "best football since".

Our football has been rubbish since we lost our key midfielder and was playing without a CF. Wonder why that happened

 

[James35]

I don't disagree with your point. We don't need to chop and change every speed bump in the road. Last year he brought us back to the Champions League while performing well in the league. Based on that he deserves a chance to make things right.

If he looked out of his depth or the team looked lost then I agree its time to go. I put some of this on the players too.

Anyone thinking he should go now is a bit mad but if we lose our next few games his job should rightfully start being questioned. Other managers have injuries etc, he just needs to get the available players playing better and his tactics should vary to accommodate this. We look like we rely solely on something happening rather than having a solid game plan... actually I forgot we are pressing monster or something…never mind being able to pass, control and create spaces to score like other teams find so easy to do against us. The whole club is a shit show so I do feel for him but he is in a results based job and currently we are failing. It could all change for the better soon enough or we can lose the next three or four games and he really will be under pressure. Time will tell.

 

[OverratedOpinion]

Our structure is a problem, but there seems to be a crowd willing to absolve the manager of failing here now.

You can also say the common denominator is managers who aren't good often. Every manager we've sacked has gone down a level since then and hasn't had a top club employ them(and some are still unemployed). Speaks volumes.

Your second point is a little disingenuous (maybe not intentionally).

Let's just imagine that there is such a flawed structure within the club that even Pep Guardiola would fail.

Well once he fails due to not being a magician he will be seen as a failure in a cut throat business where it takes a long time to lose that stench.

I would argue that the common denominator is the club and the structure set by the owners for at least 3 highly lauded coaches in Van Gaal, Mourinho and Ten Hag.

 

[Garethw]

Check your posts, dude. You said in both 'He has lost the dressing room'.

Well apologies I should have put “in my opinion” because I wasn’t talking from any position of knowing for certain.

 

[justboy68]

I just want him to go back to sending out teams and lineups that make sense and if he feels he needs to gamble on something then try a youngster like Mejbri or Pellistri, not the same tired experiments like McTominay. I really do believe that the coach is just a single cog in the overall success of a club. There are a multitude of bigger issues no doubt. But at the same time please just pick teams that make sense and for the love of Cantona stay away from recruitment my guy.

 

[justboy68]

Really? We must watch different games then. We press high now, our ball retention out of the back is far and away better. We have elements of positional play. We play in a 3-2-5 buildup structure.

Might just be me though.

https://markstats.club/epl-teams-23-24/

15th deepest defensive line in the league so far. Stop confusing what we expected Ten Hag's style to be with what we are actually seeing.

14th last season after a whole year so not a sample size issue.

 

[Ahmer Baig]

His biggest flaw is not bringing the change in time. He brought Garnacho and Hannibal too late. It's his stubbornness that is costing us these matches. And the taking off Hojlund for Martial who is finished and offers nothing.

 

[Cassidy]

His biggest flaw is not bringing the change in time. He brought Garnacho and Hannibal too late. It's his stubbornness that is costing us these matches. And the taking off Hojlund for Martial who is finished and offers nothing.

Agree aside from the Hojlund sub which was clearly a precaution due to his injury issues

 

[RedPed]

He needs to start to digging other players out or get Sancho (who I'm sympathising with more and more) back in the team asap or things are not going to end well for ten Hag.

Quite depressing really. Really thought he was the one.

 

[Tyrion]

I've been genuinely surprised how quickly people have turned on him. I'm starting to think we deserve to be where we are.

He needs to start to digging other players out or get Sancho (who I'm sympathising with more and more) back in the team asap or things are not going to end well for ten Hag.

Quite depressing really. Really thought he was the one.

How on earth can you be sympathising with Sancho?

 

[JakeC]

He is a terrible manager & a diva.

Laughable

 

[Cassidy]

I've been genuinely surprised how quickly people have turned on him. I'm starting to think we deserve to be where we are.



How on earth can you be sympathising with Sancho?

When players don’t play they are always so much better than they really are

 

[Cassidy]

https://markstats.club/epl-teams-23-24/

15th deepest defensive line in the league so far. Stop confusing what we expected Ten Hag's style to be with what we are actually seeing.

14th last season after a whole year so not a sample size issue.

Pressing high is not directly related to the height of the defensive line. You’ll want to look how how many times we recover the ball in the final third.

 

[Fluctuation0161]

You conveniently left out Antony. I wonder why.

I left out Antony because that was his signing, obviously.

 

[Fluctuation0161]

Bit weird to pin all the blame on previous management when this manager has skeletons of his own.

Not weird at all. But I see you are knee jerking, so not being rational. Let me break it down.

I listed 6 problems which stem from either owner mismanagement or previous managers. If you add Antony that is still 6 problems out of 7 which are caused by previous managers/club owners.

That is not pinning all of the blame on previous situations, it is 6/7 of the blame though.

That's before we even talk about the state of the club before ETH took over.

 

[Freak]

I’m not sure anymore. I’d still say keep but still not being able to see a proper style of football every week is very disappointing. Also seeing players gassed by 60 minutes makes me wonder if he even did any fitness stuff during pre season.

 

[Tyrion]

When players don’t play they are always so much better than they really are

Exactly. The idea that Sancho being left out has anything to do with this loss can only make sense if you ignore the last 2 years of his performances. The last 2 weeks of news are the biggest impact he's had on United since arriving.

 

[RedPed]

I've been genuinely surprised how quickly people have turned on him. I'm starting to think we deserve to be where we are.



How on earth can you be sympathising with Sancho?

Because he hasn't been the worst player in the team by a long stretch and digging him out like that was really unnecessary and just adding more drama to an already drama-filled season. It's fine singling a player out when the team is winning. I also don't see any difference in players not doing it in training and not doing it on the pitch. So if players constantly fail to follow instructions on the pitch, all that training means jack and he should call them out too. Sancho had nothing to do with that shit show today.

 

[KGBhoy]

My issue with ETH currently is that every team we play looks to be better coached than us. Even Forest - we got lucky they ran out of steam. That's 100% on him.

 

[croadyman]

Absolutely convinced dressing room is split on him,fully expecting this leads to more leaks from Utd sources when we suffer more defeats

 

[Eddy_JukeZ]

My issue with ETH currently is that every team we play looks to be better coached than us. Even Forest - we got lucky they ran out of steam. That's 100% on him.

Forest did not look better than us.

We absolutely dominated that game after the opening period.

The other games, sure.

 

[vva]

He's good manager who's got boost from the good structure and recruitment in Ajax. It's quite clear he's not top-tier manager and below the rank of Pep, Klopp, Ancelotti and etc. His talent identification and his implementation of the way of play is not good enough until now. By our useless DOF and boards, he's not the right manager (hardly find out the ones also) who can turn around Man united.

 

[Luffy]

ETH is not the manager to bring the title back to the club. We will keep on playing until we get thrashed by Sheffield United. Personally I don't mind keeping Ten Hag. It's just that we need some kind of shamanic manager to break the curse afflicting our team, where playing attractive football is an impossibility.

 

[croadyman]

Don’t you lot ever get fed up with calling for manager’s heads?

Get in the Brighton manager? Ok. Then what? He will still have the same issues ETH has.

We’ve got terrible owners and they are running the club into the ground.

Into the ground we are in it already,this is a decade of decay finally come to a sad demise. Needed to get Guardiola/Klopp but once it never happened we were fecked. I can't think of anyone good enough to manage us under these owners.

 

[kouroux]

He didn't when they beat us 5-1 in 1989, the rest he obviously did, but the statement was that a big club would sack the manager after such a big defeat, which is nonsense. I was simply pointing out it wasn't true, with examples.

You cannot compare football methods between 1989 and 2023 anyway. The whole world has changed, managers are paid a lot more so there is a much bigger expectancy on them to do well very fast.
We need to learn to let go of SAF, what he did was unique, ain't no one ever getting close to that so there is no need to treat any other underperforming manager like he could be a potential SAF

 

[Nicoseth]

Well apologies I should have put “in my opinion” because I wasn’t talking from any position of knowing for certain.

Apologies accepted. I'm just saying that we, as fans, should not be fueling the fire when it comes to the pressure that ETH is facing already.

 

[L1nk]

My issue with ETH currently is that every team we play looks to be better coached than us. Even Forest - we got lucky they ran out of steam. That's 100% on him.

Every manager we have had for years - every team has looked better coached than us. I've forgotten the amount of times the entire fanbase has complained about what it is we actually do in training no matter who the manager was. This was the whole crux of Solksjaers reign and why everyone wanted Carrick's and McKenna's heads. Why is it other managers/coaches come into other clubs and transform them in weeks when ours can't seem to do that in months/years. Maybe a lot of our players are just egotistical unintelligent people?

 

[Son]

He was lucky he didn’t get sacked after the Liverpool shit show last season.

If he can’t turn this around I can see him being gone by Christmas.

But the problem we’ve got is that we will be back to square one. Most of his signings are likely going to be surplus to requirements for the next manager and we’ll need to spend £500-£600 million changing the squad AGAIN.

it’s an unsustainable cycle. We need a competent DOF with a club vision that each incoming manager needs to match.

Real Madrid would instantly sack a manager who loses 7-0 to Barcelona I imagine.

Ten Hag has dug himself a hole now regarding recruitment. Some of our signings absolutely baffle me much like our setup at the moment.

It’s not looking good. Very rarely do managers get to make mistakes in modern football and undo them.

 

[croadyman]

If we sack another manager with the Glazers stil as owners then I officially give up.

Yeah but sadly it's gonna happen,so guess we will both need to find something else to do

 

[Wibble]

We didn't sell many players making it hard to buy. Numerous injuries, including almost our entire defence (and Martinez not yet match fit after a long term injury), the sale debacle and the Greenwood/Anthony issues adding further pain and distraction, and it is hardly surprising that we aren't exactly sprinting out of the blocks.

 

[Sky1981]

I have a feeling that he's being thrown under the bus. The core players knew what he was trying to do ( clean houses ) and play to get him sacked.

Explains the we're going to be the best transitional club. I think the players decided they dont want Ten Haag football and wanted counter attack because it fits certain players stenght selfishly

 

[Pscholes18]

I have a feeling that he's being thrown under the bus. The core players knew what he was trying to do ( clean houses ) and play to get him sacked.

Explains the we're going to be the best transitional club. I think the players decided they dont want Ten Haag football and wanted counter attack because it fits certain players stenght selfishly

Wouldn't be surprised, these players are a joke. It also wouldn't be the first time. Inmates running the asylum.

 

[TsuWave]

we're at conspiracy stage alreaydy?

 

[Amir]

I do think we’ve made a habit of sacking managers and allowing the players off the hook.

Almost regardless of results I’d like to see us stick with Ten Hag and if he says we have sell Bruno or Rashford or whoever then do it.

The whole team needs to be told from the top that Ten Hag is safe but no player is if this keeps up.

Thing is, I'm looking at yesterday's team and I'm wondering who should be told he's not safe.

Six of the starters are players he brought in, some of them he already knew. The others are the likes of Rashford, whose career was revived by ETH, Dalot, who got quite a lot of support from him, and Bruno who if we know one thing about him is that he's not a quitter or something.

These aren't players who wouldn't be trying or playing for the manager or something, so telling them they are not safe shouldn't really be an issue.

 

[Care_de_Bobo]

Every manager we have had for years - every team has looked better coached than us. I've forgotten the amount of times the entire fanbase has complained about what it is we actually do in training no matter who the manager was. This was the whole crux of Solksjaers reign and why everyone wanted Carrick's and McKenna's heads. Why is it other managers/coaches come into other clubs and transform them in weeks when ours can't seem to do that in months/years. Maybe a lot of our players are just egotistical unintelligent people?

I don't know if this post is supposed to be defending Ten Hag, but he signed Antony which just adds to the list of unintelligent people at the club. He also wanted GreenWood back, which might indicate he's not the best judge of character or intelligence.

I actually had no real issue with him until the Greenwood fiasco, if he had just said he wants him sold or loaned straight away I think it would have shown leadership and character. It was totally tone deaf and it should have been obvious immediately that the chances of him playing for United this season were slim to zero. He's not alone in the handling of the whole thing, but he definitely could have helped nip it in the bud.

 

[Kostov]

I think he fecked up in the recruitment part and will pay the price with his head. And he is not the first manager doing that here, ultimately showing why we need some bigger figure above the manager not some incompetent yes man who will pay 100m for Antony just because the manager said he is good enough.

 

[The United]

I have a feeling that he's being thrown under the bus. The core players knew what he was trying to do ( clean houses ) and play to get him sacked.

Explains the we're going to be the best transitional club. I think the players decided they dont want Ten Haag football and wanted counter attack because it fits certain players stenght selfishly

Well, that's laughable.