Me criticizing Klopp doesn mean I dont think what the players did was a joke. Everyone is to be blamed for a calamity like that
Jurgen Klopp Sack Watch
- Thread starter Samid
- Start date
Game management or the lack there of is what frustrates me.
Yesterday was another prime example of that.
This is a joke and a clear case of bias.
Are you surprised that the officiating bodies are biased? When Mourinho first came to England he could have a dump in their mouths and they would eat it up.
I shouldn't be surprised but with so much money involved you'd expect a decent level of professionalism
I'll give you that.Klopp's just bloody good entertainment and what would the Caf have to get excited / agast about without him
Happy Xmas !
Cheers.
Money is the source of all evil isn't it? Absolute power corrupts absolutely. We like to think that society rewards people with money and power for upholding good values, but its actually the opposite.
Sorry I got a little too deep for a football forum
Not really no. You have a problem with that, but yesterday was something else. Sometimes, sh*t happens.
It’s not the first time something like that has happened since Klopp’s been in charge though.
Yeah, you do have a problem with game management. Yesterday wasn't about that though. 2 individual mistakes in 2 minutes got them back in the game. That's not bad game management, that's just two individual mistakes in 2 minutes. Call it bad luck if you want
If he has these defenders and GKs at his disposal, a choice of his own making at this point, then his tactical setup will always make Liverpool susceptible at the back. I don't know if he's a tactical simpleton as many have said, but he doesn't get absolved of all blame because his defenders suck too.
There's a give and take between being a threat going forward and solid at the back. Even with imperfect options Klopp could do more to find a better balance, but he hasn't done so. Unless his tactics change or they simply add quality defenders matches like this will continue to be an occurrence.
Seriously, look at those players, then tell me he isn't getting good results from them
He is but it's his own damn fault these are his options. He doesn't get a pass for the state of things, but I'm not really sold his tactical setup is untenable if he actually does address those areas.
First part, sure! Second part, already said it, the "problem" *are* the players. They aren't really doing worse than they should, and luck has consistently gone against them. The 3-3 draw at watford came with an offside last second goal. Everton's penalty...
He is too friendly with his players imo. The likes of Mignolet, Lovren and Moreno would have been binned by any other manager a long time ago. Just hope that this faith of his doesn't continue.
jose kicked a bottle which could have landed in someones eye. Here, Jurgen merely places the bottle on the floor
Definitely. No intention, perfectly calm, slow movement.
He's such a knob. I expect Liverpool fans to just eat up the shite he talks since they worship their managers like a cult, but neutral fans love him too and will not hear a word against him. it's baffling, any other manager acts the way he does and he would get called out but Klopp gets a pass because of the "zany pashunate German!!!1!" circlejerk. "Halfway win"...fecking clown.
Serious question.
How long does Klopp have left? Spending mega money at the club and seemingly no closer to winning anything of note yet.
If he's not successful next term at what point do they part company do we think? He's had a fair bit of time now.
How long does Klopp have left? Spending mega money at the club and seemingly no closer to winning anything of note yet.
If he's not successful next term at what point do they part company do we think? He's had a fair bit of time now.
Serious question ? Don't you mean shit stirring bollocks ? Spending mega money ? Keita & VVD haven't even arrived yet you are already berating Klop for not winning anything ? Since the most he'd spent on a player prior to that was £35m on Salah (and that seems to have worked out pretty damn good so far) and net £26m spend over 2 years - hardly spending 'mega money' even if on Accrington Stanley's books.
He's got at least another 2 seasons leeway to be 'successful' (see Q below) and as for 'must win something' there is really only the PL and CL that are worth winning, the FAC & LC are simply great days out for the fans now, they really aren't relevant in elevating a clubs' standing. Those two are going to be very very difficult with City, United and Chelsea also spending huge amounts and the likes of Barca, RM and PSG likewise.
The real question is what constitutes success in this new era of moneyed clubs.
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I dont get from where you got that.
Spending mega money ?
His first season , he was a Midway appointment and we were 8th when Rodgers stepped down, that season klopp did not sign a single player.
Next season ,
Mane - 34 miln - worth every penny
Salah - 35 miln - success.
Matip - free easyly the best CB we have.
Ox - already on the up.
Robertson- 10 miln panic buy i guess but still showing signs of a good option.
Wijnaldum- 25 miln .. Starting XI player.
(There are other small buys here and there like klavan, karius ( 4miln each) thats im not going to mention.)
By what means you see them as mega multimillion sigmings? On the contrary it could be argued that every big money signing under klopp has been successful. If you are really trying to measure improvement and money spent ...you cant really add keita and vvd to it.
Secondly about klopp having a pressure to deliver, well obviously we want to win it no doubt, we didn't sign klopp to finish 4th, while all this is true we cant be unrealistic and pull the plug on klopp if he fails to win us title in next two years.
As a individual you may have your own opinion but as far as i see and understand this game, i can see klopp is making forward strides. Two finals, top 4, topped the champions league group, squad quality is much better, the football we are playing is really good, the attack we have is 3rd best in Europe. ( only 2 teams all over Europe have out scored us this calendar year. Bayern and PSG),... Barring the defense everything is falling in place... Yes may be the pace is slow compared to city but ...thats obvious.
It's not klopp being given preferential treatment. It's mourinho being hounded because no one likes him. It was a fecking bottle, ffs. Justifiable only because mourinho did it.
Could have killed Van Persie if he was nearby.
It's not a preferential treatment but they're treated differently? Sounds legit.
He's been very successful from my point of view. Liverpool are a very good side.
As for winning the league, it's Pep's as long he stays at ManCity. No need to be bothered because of not winning it.
Correct. Most other managers would get away with it too, ergo not preferential. It's just mourinho being singled out on account of being a cnut.
So you think it's fair FA treats him differently and singles him out cause 'he's a cnut'?
Also your dear Klopp acts as a cnut lots of times.
Mourinho is obviously the most disliked manager in the league. The punishment he got was ridiculous to begin with. But that's about it. Looking at Klopp and moaning how he 'gets away with it' is wide of the mark as he is not getting away with anything. Mourinho was brought up on a silly and arbitrary charge that it is hard to see anyone not named mourinho being charged for.
That's the FA in a nutshell. They rule according to whatever way the wind is blowing and how they feel about the weather.
Ffs.
OK, Klopp net spent ~115m over 3 seasons. Are you sure that's a huge sum? City spent more each year then Klopp spent in 3 years, yet some suggest we're now pressured to overtake them. We're not. If we'll throw VvD-like money each window for a few consecutive years then we will be. But for now, we're spending rather small and smart.
Are they? Who did? I think people are taking the piss out of Klopp for saying he'd never spend that much money on a player when we got a 23yo Pogba from Juve for £90m.
Obviously now that he's spunked £75m on a 27yo CB form Southampton his previous comments sound rather idiotic and hypocritical, don't you think?
B-b-b-but, net spend, 5 times.
There are a lot of ppl here and in Liverpool thread that suggested now there's pressure on Klopp to win something.
Yes, we overpaid. No, he's 26. No, 75m now, and especially in January, is not the same as 90m more than a year ago. Also, afaik it's 70m +5 in bonuses.
Funny everyone forgets the 40m fee for Oxlaide-Chamberlain..
40m Ox
35m Salah
75m VVD
67m Keita
If that's not mega money then I don't know what is? 217 million on 4 players.
The expectation has got to be trophies surely.
I did forget Ox.
However again you've included two players who haven't even arrived yet (and one won't until the Summer) so any expectations should be tempered to next season at the earliest (and let's see what happens with regard to a GK, ST and DM first).
And again I'll emphasise that the FAC and LC mean next to nothing in the big picture now, it's all about PL and CL and there heavy hitters abound. Forget fan expectation, that's like the majority RC United fans voting in the pre-season poll who thought you'd win the PL this season, I'm sure there will be plenty of LFC fans on Twitter claiming the last piece of the jigsaw will be in place next Summer, neither of which were/wil be realistic. However the reality is winning either of the PL or CL is still going to be a mighty task requiring a degree of luck, as well as skill and a deep squad, to achieve.
VVD is 26 years old.
Yes, but the point still stands.
Klopp signed Grujic and brought in Caulker on loan during his first season. He then decided to play Caulker up front and lump the ball forward to him as Liverpool chased a goal, something he'd criticised United for doing with Fellaini about a week earlier.
Klopp was also brought in very early, eight games into the domestic season and appointed on October 8th because there was a fear that top 4 would slip away from Liverpool if a change wasn't made. At the time of his appointment, Liverpool were 3 points off 4th. They finished the season in 8th, trophyless, and outside of the European places entirely, securing their lowest finish since Dalglish's second stint.
He was not a midway appointment. He did sign players. He failed to meet his first season's objectives.
The line from Liverpool fans at the point was "wait until his first full season," so we did. Liverpool finished 4th and trophyless, but 4th was at least a step in the right direction.
However, since Klopp's first full season, Liverpool have the 3rd highest net spend of any of the top 6 clubs, having been outspent by only United and City. They have also spent over £100 million more than both Chelsea and Spurs.
Liverpool are currently sat 4th, closer to Arsenal in 6th than they are to Chelsea in 3rd. They fell at the first hurdle in the League Cup, and have the most difficult 3rd round draw of any of the top 6 in the FA Cup, a competition that Klopp has yet to see past the 4th round in. With pretty much every English side not Manchester City, they are rank outsiders for the Champions League.
Liverpool look very much on course to have another trophyless season, and also look well on course to be scrapping for 4th. This would not be making "forward strides," it'd be the very definition of stagnation.
Also, Liverpool categorically do not have the 3rd best attack in Europe ffs.
There's another side to the coin that you're not really discussing with Keita and van Dijk.
With Keita, you've got a near £70 million signing confirmed, but he's not joining you until next summer. By which time, Coutinho and Can could be gone, and Liverpool could have slipped back out of the top 4, having gone through yet another trophyless season, and will find themselves once again playing catch up.
With van Dijk, you've just broken the bank mid-season for a player that you spent all summer refusing to break the bank for, a player that's played in just 16 matches in 2017.
This is garbage transfer business however you look at it, regardless of how good these players might be for you when they actually arrive.
Ever since Klopp arrived it's been a case of tempering expectations until next season. In 2015/16 it was "wait until next season when he has a summer transfer window". In 2016/17 it was "wait until he's had a full season so things can click." Now it's "wait until our signings that we didn't bring in straight away are actually available." If Coutinho goes it'll be "wait until his replacement is properly settled/the team adapts."
When he arrived he said he'd deliver Liverpool the title within 3 seasons, and you all lapped it up. Even if you discount 2015/16 as he arrived in October with the insurmountable gap of 6 points off top to claw back, he's halfway through season 2 now and don't look remotely close to winning the league next season. You'll tell me you never believed that was possible, which I'd agree with, but the broader point is that Klopp promised success. Thus far that success is losing two cup finals and finishing 4th by a point. Disregarding the League Cup and FA Cup because they "mean nothing" misses the point regarding fan expectations, and seems incredibly odd as they're the only two trophies you've won in the last 12 seasons.
Forget the fact that there are now multiple generations of Liverpool fans that have never seen them win the league, if you disregard the FA Cup and League Cup in the way you suggest, you're going to end up with a generation of Liverpool fans that have never seen them win anything.