[Ekeke]

I’ve noticed the theme seems to be the questioning of his attacking contribution, which is perhaps fair, but my concerns with him are just as much defensive.

Yesterday, crosses were coming in too easily. He’s easy to beat 1v1 and yesterday he was typically hanging about 10 yards away from his winger allowing him to cross unchallenged. He did this against Watford a couple years back and everyone had a pop at Mourinho for having a problem with it.

If he's easy to beat why does he make the joint 2nd most tackles of our fullbacks this season? He averages 2 exactly the same as Valencia, with Darmian out in front with 3.3

Shaw averages being beaten by a dribble 1 time every 2 games. Valencia is 0.3 times per match and the rest of our fullbacks are beaten more often than those 2

Shaw makes the most shot blocks (0.4), 3rd most cross blocks (0.4 behind Young and Dalot but ahead of Valencia and Darmian) and 2nd most passes blocked in the whole team behind Darmian (1.4 per game). He also wins the most headers of our fullbacks 3.6 per 90 mins.

So overall defensively he's one of our most solid fullbacks this season with Darmian and maybe Valencia running him close. But yes if theres one area where he is slightly behind compared to the other parts its blocking crosses where he's 3rd best instead of top 2 in everything else.

 

[Freak]

He's good enough defensively. I'd like to see him be more direct with his attacks. Take the defender on for pace and whip in crosses.

 

[IrishRedDevil]

Needs to sharpen up on his passing, too many are underhit.

 

[Rozay]

If he's easy to beat why does he make the joint 2nd most tackles of our fullbacks this season? He averages 2 exactly the same as Valencia, with Darmian out in front with 3.3

Shaw averages being beaten by a dribble 1 time every 2 games. Valencia is 0.3 times per match and the rest of our fullbacks are beaten more often than those 2

Shaw makes the most shot blocks (0.4), 3rd most cross blocks (0.4 behind Young and Dalot but ahead of Valencia and Darmian) and 2nd most passes blocked in the whole team behind Darmian (1.4 per game). He also wins the most headers of our fullbacks 3.6 per 90 mins.

So overall defensively he's one of our most solid fullbacks this season with Darmian and maybe Valencia running him close. But yes if theres one area where he is slightly behind compared to the other parts its blocking crosses where he's 3rd best instead of top 2 in everything else.

I cannot interpret football in the same way you do. I believe in saying things as I see them, not so much text books. Context is key with numbers. What constitutes as a ‘dribble’? Are there other times his man has gone past him easily in something that doesn’t fall into the ‘dribble’ box?

What I do know, or what I at least think I know, is that Shaw is better defensively than Dalot, he’s a better full-back than Darmian etc. That may not be the correct answer to an exam question though.

I genuinely don’t mean to sound condescending, but you should perhaps rely less on Opta to determine the best footballers. Context is key, and every situation is fluid. Shaw is easy to beat, in my eyes, because when I watch United, he doesn’t do enough to stop people getting past. I’d say that’s the same observation I have for Dalot, although perhaps the numbers say differently.

 

[ChaddyP]

Thought he was fine yesterday considering he didn't have martial or rashford to link up with. Don't understand the issue people have about his defending. It's his best asset. He's very strong in that area and was so yesterday. Least of our issues

 

[Ekeke]

I cannot interpret football in the same way you do. I believe in saying things as I see them, not so much text books. Context is key with numbers. What constitutes as a ‘dribble’? Are there other times his man has gone past him easily in something that doesn’t fall into the ‘dribble’ box?

What I do know, or what I at least think I know, is that Shaw is better defensively than Dalot, he’s a better full-back than Darmian etc. That may not be the correct answer to an exam question though.

I genuinely don’t mean to sound condescending, but you should perhaps rely less on Opta to determine the best footballers. Context is key, and every situation is fluid. Shaw is easy to beat, in my eyes, because when I watch United, he doesn’t do enough to stop people getting past. I’d say that’s the same observation I have for Dalot, although perhaps the numbers say differently.

Did you know that eye witness accounts are often considered bias in a court of law?

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/do-the-eyes-have-it/

If you go in with a certain belief you're more likely to see what you want to see. Its the stats that will either disprove or prove what you think you saw, in terms of numbers.

You think you saw Shaw get beaten too many times, but the numbers tell you that actually he wins more tackles than at least half of our fullbacks and gets beaten less than others. So whats really happening is you are looking for it with Shaw and you havent noticed it so much with Young or Darmian who are beaten more often and because the numbers are slight. For example Young is beaten by a dribble 0.6 times per 90 mins, whereas Shaw is beaten by a dribble 0.5 times per 90 mins.

Who is seeing that realtime? Nobody. It would take 5 matches for Young to be beaten 3 times going by his average whereas it would take 6 matches for Young to be beaten 3 times by his. Even if things went exactly like that, are you sitting there counting how many times each of our fullbacks are beaten every single match and making a note of it even mentally so that after 5 or 6 matches you know who has been beaten more than others?

Of course not.

If you think your eyes and memory are up to taking in all the information you are seeing on a football pitch immaculately with no bias whatsoever, you simply arent up to the task you think you are. I'm not sure who is. Other than people who are specifically counting all of these things so that data is available.

And just to prove it, I would agree with you that Dalot seems a bit too easy to beat. But guess what? We're both wrong. Technically he hasn't been beaten once in the league because although players have knocked the ball past him, each time he's made a recovery and blocked their pass/cross/got a foot in to knock it away. So statistically at least he's been beaten 0 times in the league this season.

 

[bosnian_red]

Thought he was fine yesterday considering he didn't have martial or rashford to link up with. Don't understand the issue people have about his defending. It's his best asset. He's very strong in that area and was so yesterday. Least of our issues

Think the issue is that in a lot of positions we have potential or some very good players who just werent performing and we are optimistic with going forward, while Shaw has been here for a while now and just seems pretty average all around. Getting a left back who can turn into a quality attacking outlet is such a huge bonus for a team and Shaw won't ever be that. Think about how big of an impact Evra had for us in his prime, Marcelo was one of Madrids 3 main players for their CL dominance, Jordi Alba always is a huge threat because of his understanding with Messi, Andy Robertson plays a massive part for Liverpool, etc...
Obviously theres multiple ways to play, but attacking fullbacks have always been important for us. Shaw is still young so the hope is there, but we have nobody else basically. So we're relying on shaw or just accepting he'll remain pretty average.

 

[Rozay]

Did you know that eye witness accounts are often considered bias in a court of law?

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/do-the-eyes-have-it/

If you go in with a certain belief you're more likely to see what you want to see. Its the stats that will either disprove or prove what you think you saw, in terms of numbers.

You think you saw Shaw get beaten too many times, but the numbers tell you that actually he wins more tackles than at least half of our fullbacks and gets beaten less than others. So whats really happening is you are looking for it with Shaw and you havent noticed it so much with Young or Darmian who are beaten more often and because the numbers are slight. For example Young is beaten by a dribble 0.6 times per 90 mins, whereas Shaw is beaten by a dribble 0.5 times per 90 mins.

Who is seeing that realtime? Nobody. It would take 5 matches for Young to be beaten 3 times going by his average whereas it would take 6 matches for Young to be beaten 3 times by his. Even if things went exactly like that, are you sitting there counting how many times each of our fullbacks are beaten every single match and making a note of it even mentally so that after 5 or 6 matches you know who has been beaten more than others?

Of course not.

If you think your eyes and memory are up to taking in all the information you are seeing on a football pitch immaculately with no bias whatsoever, you simply arent up to the task you think you are. I'm not sure who is. Other than people who are specifically counting all of these things so that data is available.

And just to prove it, I would agree with you that Dalot seems a bit too easy to beat. But guess what? We're both wrong. Technically he hasn't been beaten once in the league because although players have knocked the ball past him, each time he's made a recovery and blocked their pass/cross/got a foot in to knock it away. So statistically at least he's been beaten 0 times in the league this season.

There’s no basis for my bias though. What you seem to be proposing is a world where there is no room for two people to interpret the game differently, because after all, we can simply read all about it.

Over the years I’ve seen plenty stats that shock people. ‘Did you know that x is the player with the most y’? Everyone is scratching their heads because he’s perhaps not a good player. For me, if you watch football and decide a player you watch isn’t good, that’s a valid opinion. These are not facts.

 

[simplyared]

I'm starting getting used to the idea of having him as our 1st choice LB. Good enough imo!

 

[ChaddyP]

Think the issue is that in a lot of positions we have potential or some very good players who just werent performing and we are optimistic with going forward, while Shaw has been here for a while now and just seems pretty average all around. Getting a left back who can turn into a quality attacking outlet is such a huge bonus for a team and Shaw won't ever be that. Think about how big of an impact Evra had for us in his prime, Marcelo was one of Madrids 3 main players for their CL dominance, Jordi Alba always is a huge threat because of his understanding with Messi, Andy Robertson plays a massive part for Liverpool, etc...
Obviously theres multiple ways to play, but attacking fullbacks have always been important for us. Shaw is still young so the hope is there, but we have nobody else basically. So we're relying on shaw or just accepting he'll remain pretty average.

I think Shaw is still very young and still has time to improve. Think he just needs a manager that believes in him and gets a run of games. He's only 23 and has spent most of his career here injured. Prior to his broken leg we thought he was amazing. I guess I prefer to give young players a chance than open up the cheque book just because they aren't world class at 23

 

[BrianMcClair'sBarnet]

Shaw: "I think you can see from the outside how much he (Solskjær) has changed things in such a short space of time. He is just a really positive manager, he knows what the club needs and also what the fans want in the way we are playing." #mulive [sky]

Shaw: "He's (Solskjær) bringing that attacking, quick play back to Old Trafford. I'm sure the fans are going to appreciate that as much as we [the players] do." #mulive [sky]

 

[Litch]

Prior to injury was superb and hope he can find that level again....

 

[Rash Decision]

I've not really been that impressed with Shaw so far, but he's not really a problem for us either. Solid defensively, provides a decent outlet with his runs and short passing, but also provides very little threat in attack. Can be upgraded on but is satisfactory for now.

 

[Fosu-Mens]

I've not really been that impressed with Shaw so far, but he's not really a problem for us either. Solid defensively, provides a decent outlet with his runs and short passing, but also provides very little threat in attack. Can be upgraded on but is satisfactory for now.

Good in defense, but going forward with the passingdecisions and crossing he is not good enough(as of yet, and most likely never) to be part of a team that fights for a major trophy. In no way deserving the wage and contract extension, and if he was playing for another national team.....

Should be upgraded on in the summer.

 

[Mcking]

Good in defense, but going forward with the passingdecisions and crossing he is not good enough(as of yet, and most likely never) to be part of a team that fights for a major trophy. In no way deserving the wage and contract extension, and if he was playing for another national team.....

Should be upgraded on in the summer.

I bet it won't take long before you start making similar comments about the would-be upgrade.

 

[Alabaster Codify7]

He's been alright but like others in the squad, we've been so accustomed to seeing him either being unfit or playing poorly that our standards have fallen. Alright is now acceptable or somehow impressive for some of our players and it's a symbol of how we've had our expectations lowered by three managers over five seasons.

Alright should never be good enough for a starting player for a supposed top, top club. He'd be a very good back-up/rotation LB with a world-class starting player ahead of him. Unfortunately, we have other matters to worry about more than LB - CB, RW for a start. So I could see Shaw still being our first choice LB next season if fit.

 

[Fosu-Mens]

I bet it won't take long before you start making similar comments about the would-be upgrade.

Depends on the upgrade and how he/she/it performs. Since fullbacks are extremely important going forward for how many team(and most likely MUFC next season) attacks, having a fullback that can cross/pass/dribble(similar to how wingers are/were) on a high level would be beneficial.

 

[FootyGirl88]

Considering this is his first full season back since his bad injury I think he's done well. He can only get better next season.

 

[Mickson]

Prior to injury was superb and hope he can find that level again....

So was Darmian.

 

[Fluctuation0161]

He should be a squad player but we don't have a better LB.

 

[It's B Rubble]

I don’t see Luke Shaw being a worry to the board. A solid LB who can man that flank for years to come, if he stays fit. Pace, strength and strong defensively, just needs more confidence. RB needs strengthening and a certain Crystal palac.. nevermind.

 

[SoCross]

Why are some so quick to judge? We’ve had several seasons of sterile football, let’s see what our players can do under a more attacking manager before jumping into conclusions.

There’s a lot to like about Shaw. Pace, strength, keeps a low enough profile and has reacted very well to being frozen at points which demonstrates a certain determination to make it at United. Always willing to get forward and attack too.

 

[red4ever 79]

Considering this is his first full season back since his bad injury I think he's done well. He can only get better next season.

Feels like we say that every season about Shaw though. He will be better next season!

 

[Jeppers7]

Shaw: "I think you can see from the outside how much he (Solskjær) has changed things in such a short space of time. He is just a really positive manager, he knows what the club needs and also what the fans want in the way we are playing." #mulive [sky]

Shaw: "He's (Solskjær) bringing that attacking, quick play back to Old Trafford. I'm sure the fans are going to appreciate that as much as we [the players] do." #mulive [sky]

That's an interesting interview.....tells you he thinks Jose was very negative, didn't get what the club and fans want and that the players always felt the tactics were wrong.

 

[buckooo1978]

Shaw needs to show much more to be our starting LB I feel.

he's been solid in an average kind of way. He's not outstanding at anything, not a great passer or crossed, link up play is alright and he's not the greatest athlete.

I think it really dawned on my when we played Juve at home and Sandro and Cancelo were truly excellent- two highly technical athletes.

Dalot looks to have more potential as in the short space of time he's been here he seems to be a better athlete, a better crosser and someone who can beat a man.

Fullbacks are so important these days especially as we rely on them for width at times. You take Robertson out of Liverpool and you'd see a big difference.

 

[andersj]

Because Robertson gets played in. Shaw still gets forward, like his run to allow space for the 3rd goal we scored yesterday. He was still making those runs 80 mins in. Its just whether its Martial, Rashford, or Lingard, whoever we play on the left comes inside and uses his outside run to create space every time. They never play the pass to put him down the side. Thats what Robertson and the rest get.

Young doesnt get that pass in behind either when he plays left back, but he really doesnt want it. Because hes right footed, he wants a pass to his feet so he can come inside and cross just like whoever we have on the left. Its a bad dynamic with our left sided players not appreciating the runs by mixing it up and actually playing the pass. It makes us more predictable because every single time, our left sided player comes back into the crowd centrally.

This is spot on! At the same time, I do think Mourinho is at fault for not forcing our fullbacks higher and telling our players to involve them more.

Solskjaer appears to address it:

https://mobile.twitter.com/sistoney67/status/1077948522970910721

Regarding Tierney, I agree that he has not proven much. However, you could have said the same about van Dijk at the age of 24. What sets Tierney apart, in my opinion, is much of the same as van Dijk.

Initially I did not understand the fuzz about Tierney. He looked like a very good player, but not extraordinary, and I, like you, were unconvinced due to the level of the scottish league. The main reason I have changed opinion on him is his physical and mental attributes. His build and pace is very special and similar to players like Ronaldo and Bale at a younger age. At the age of 21 I think his development in this area reflect his mentality and dedication. And this is another area where he stands out. Reading or watching interviews with him you get the impression that he is a type of guy you would want in a team.

 

[MadDogg]

Shaw needs to show much more to be our starting LB I feel.

he's been solid in an average kind of way. He's not outstanding at anything, not a great passer or crossed, link up play is alright and he's not the greatest athlete.

I think it really dawned on my when we played Juve at home and Sandro and Cancelo were truly excellent- two highly technical athletes.

Dalot looks to have more potential as in the short space of time he's been here he seems to be a better athlete, a better crosser and someone who can beat a man.

Fullbacks are so important these days especially as we rely on them for width at times. You take Robertson out of Liverpool and you'd see a big difference.

I actually think he is a very good passer, but he doesn't have the greatest vision to truly take advantage of it. He plays some great balls at times with perfect placement and power, but they seem to always be in front of him where he can see the runners. Speaking of which, I think his passing will be more noticeable now with better movement in front of him.

 

[el3mel]

Has become very passive and useless going forward. Solid at the back, but he pulls a Darmian in forward position now.

He's good, but not good enough long term imho. We'll need to upgrade over him.

 

[Di Maria's angel]

Feel the same way. Doesnt offer anything going forward.

 

[Andersons Dietician]

Was great today, had a few one on ones vs King who is ridiculously fast and he bossed him. Winning headers, linking play, getting forward certainly needs to improve crossing. There was a moment when Martial put him through and he didn’t really try and create the space for himself so he can cross, just smashed it off the defender.

I’ve seen him cross, I know he can do it but weirdly he seems to be looking more like a midfielder to me as his involvement in our build up looks more like something you’d see a midfielder do. Still plenty of occasions he offered the run but just wasn’t played in but overall pretty solid.

 

[We need an rvn]

Has become very passive and useless going forward. Solid at the back, but he pulls a Darmian in forward position now.

He's good, but not good enough long term imho. We'll need to upgrade over him.

I can see what you're saying but we don't know what he was told by Ole what to do for a team that was good one counter attack. Perhaps for this match he didn't want the backs to fly forward and overlap and instead let Pogba on left mid do that instead. Example when he didn't do that and instead tracked back and did a brilliant tackle to pass it back to DDG...I still see a good future for him personally

 

[SATA]

Is he okay? Saw that he was down injured. Wouldn't mind getting in the young Celtic leftback chap as competition for him

 

[el3mel]

I can see what you're saying but we don't know what he was told by Ole what to do for a team that was good one counter attack. Perhaps for this match he didn't want the backs to fly forward and overlap and instead let Pogba on left mid do that instead. Example when he didn't do that and instead tracked back and did a brilliant tackle to pass it back to DDG...I still see a good future for him personally

It's not just this game. The previous 2 games too. Actually the last 2 months.

The fullbacks are already very high on the pitch so I don't think he's getting defensive instructions. It's just he has become pretty passive out of nowhere. He doesn't even make these runs anymore. He gets the ball and passes it back to Martial or midfield. Very Valencia or Darmian esque performance here and like them he's still sold on defensive side.

 

[SteveW]

Good game.

 

[Ekeke]

When he does make offensive runs hes ignored. But yes for the most part he's a defensively assured left back rather than raiding forward every time we attack. Wants to pass the ball rather than make overlapping runs

 

[AR87]

I thought he was very solid today and I don't mind him not overlapping as I think that's being influenced by Martial, Pogba and even Rashford and Lingard often drifting over into those areas.

 

[LJJT]

He’s ok but don’t think he’s good enough for us long term, he’s poor going forward and 7/10 defensively. He will cost us in the big games like Raphael da Silva used to

 

[kiristao]

Might be given instructions not to be too adventurous has he has Martial and Pogba ahead of him; both of whom are not too defensive minded. Young on the other hand has Lingard and Herrera on his side so can afford to go ahead of them both as he has enough cover on his side.
Defensively he has done decently well the last 3 games.

 

[Kostov]

I felt he was good today, definitely better than his last game. Very solid in defense but he must improve in attack.

 

[Sylar]

His defending of one on ones and one-twos was fantastic.