[Grande]

Well, we really have to agree to disagree on his anticipation as I feel it is just fine.

I see you have replied @Andersons Dietician on the weaknesses you see in his game and overall I feel we are on the same page

Every player has areas of the game that's needs improvement and my saying his defensive game can't be criticized is pointing out that it's very solid and it's more his attacking game that needs tweaking

Honestly, if his defensive game is bad then he's a dud as he doesn't offer much in attack and I just don't see that.

Ok, then we’re not so far of. I think you confuse me and perhaps the poster you earlier answered to with your use of ‘criticizing’ as viewing something as on the whole bad or negative. It’s normally a more neutral word, originally close to ‘analyzing’ - in a neutral way evaluating all the good and the bad on down to the details. It’s normal use I’d say is more about pointing out ‘the bad’ or weaknesses or ‘areas for improvement’ as it’s often referred to today. Shaw, ie, can very well be world class defensively on the whole and still have features or traits worthy of critique.

Likewise, I find some people overlook quite a few strengths he has attacking wise, just because he on the whole isn’t one of the best attacking FBs at the moment.

 

[Grande]

Just shows how statistics can fool you. He offers nothing going forward. NOTHING.

If three concrete through passes against Spurs to you is ‘statistics’ and you sum it up as ‘nothing’, I can see why you wouldn’t like statistics.

If you look, you should be able to see some things Shaw offer going forward. He is better than most full backs (including all our own) at passing out from the back with short passing. Which is an important quality for us going forward.

He is fast in moving upfield (when he is allowed to), important when we transition from defense to attack.

He is better at retaining possesion in tight spaces with good first touch, close control and short passing. Very importan, particularly when he has Martial and Pogba on his side who can penetrate, but need someone to play off.

He plays good through passes, which depending on the teams style of play, can be more important than crossing.

All these are things he offer forward.

 

[yfoFC]

If three concrete through passes against Spurs to you is ‘statistics’ and you sum it up as ‘nothing’, I can see why you wouldn’t like statistics.

If you look, you should be able to see some things Shaw offer going forward. He is better than most full backs (including all our own) at passing out from the back with short passing. Which is an important quality for us going forward.

He is fast in moving upfield (when he is allowed to), important when we transition from defense to attack.

He is better at retaining possesion in tight spaces with good first touch, close control and short passing. Very importan, particularly when he has Martial and Pogba on his side who can penetrate, but need someone to play off.

He plays good through passes, which depending on the teams style of play, can be more important than crossing.

All these are things he offer forward.

Seems his attacking play has been undervalued here (including by me)

Top post, hard to argue against the points made.

 

[haram]

If three concrete through passes against Spurs to you is ‘statistics’ and you sum it up as ‘nothing’, I can see why you wouldn’t like statistics.

If you look, you should be able to see some things Shaw offer going forward. He is better than most full backs (including all our own) at passing out from the back with short passing. Which is an important quality for us going forward.

He is fast in moving upfield (when he is allowed to), important when we transition from defense to attack.

He is better at retaining possesion in tight spaces with good first touch, close control and short passing. Very importan, particularly when he has Martial and Pogba on his side who can penetrate, but need someone to play off.

He plays good through passes, which depending on the teams style of play, can be more important than crossing.

All these are things he offer forward.

While I agree with most of this, his level of play when approaching the final third is not that good.

 

[AR87]

While I agree with most of this, his level of play when approaching the final third is not that good.

He hesitates to run into space. It's why I think at times this could be due to tactical instructions laid out to him, but it's hard to always believe that to be the case. It's especially annoying because his link up in the final third with Martial and Pogba is often excellent even if his crossing is subpar.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

He hesitates to run into space. It's why I think at times this could be due to tactical instructions laid out to him, but it's hard to always believe that to be the case. It's especially annoying because his link up in the final third with Martial and Pogba is often excellent even if his crossing is subpar.

I’m hoping that’s a hangover from two years of constantly being told - often via the press - that all his instincts as a fullback are wrong. Just needs a few more games to get the Mourinho monkey off his back.

 

[Ekeke]

People clearly dont understand how a fullback can contribute going forward, without being Evra and bombing on an overlap on every attack.

Its like any other position on the pitch. You don't necessarily have to do the running, the ball can do the running. Shaw is more of a passer than a bombing overlapping fullback and when he does overlap he gets ignored anyway. Martial always comes inside and never passes the ball into a position for Shaw to run onto so it never needs to be defended.

We saw how effective passes in behind the defense can be from Shaw against Spurs. He played 3 good passes behind the defense for Rashford and Martial which was our gameplan, all 3 were good passes that our players got on the end of.

Its weird how people go nuts for a CB that does this, with a worse success rate than 100% like Toby. But Shaw doing it from leftback doesnt contribute to the attack apparently.

 

[Foxbatt]

Martial does not need Shaw. Sometimes the best help a player can give is not by getting close to his team mate. Martial uses Shaw to get the defenders to be aware of Shaw so that he gets more space. That is a good tactic too. His defending was good too. He is going to be a very good defender if he keeps playing the way he is playing now.

 

[Stacks]

Robertson was no where near as effective at Hull. He was decent but let’s not re-write history. He wasn’t even first choice at Pool that long ago until he went to Klopp and asked him what he needed to do. The 3 mentioned do make a difference because it’s 3 mobile hard working guys that can cover. Herrera plays on the right hand side Matic can’t cover because he doesn’t have the energy or legs for it and Pogba is not particularly defensively astute hence why he Shaw can’t bomb on all the time. He has to be less adventurous because if he isn’t and a move breaks down we are toast. People need to look at the much wider picture and think how the team functions and why certain players do certain jobs.

What do you mean by “he’s a joke technically compared to other players”? He’s got a good first touch a good pass a good shot on him his crossing isn’t/ hasn’t been great because it’s practically non existent. He never seems to ever put one in and when he is in position he is normally looking to pick someone out with a pass.

I mean of course everyone is going to see things very differently but for me there is a player there and we’d struggle to buy better for less than 60mil and even then there probably aren’t many better around the same age, I can’t actually think of one of the top of my head.

Good pass? compared to who? Sideways and backwards passes isn't a good passer. a good passer has variety in their passing. Good shot? so when Shaw who has f all goals in his career, winds up for a shot, do you think keepers are like "holy feck Luke's winding up, better block that shit". A good 1st touch is contentious.. Most of the passes he receives are short, simple sideways passes out the left, which is fairly easy to trap. Not like he overlaps like Alvez and has to bring balls out the air from a lofted Xavi pass. I'd say his touch his just standard. Luke Shaw averages 30 backwards passes per 90 minute.

He's a joke technically? What? He could be better going forward, but it's not a lack of technical ability that's holding him back.

I was exaggerating but that is in comparison to highly technical players. E.g. Gareth Bale did in the 1st team, what Shaw supposedly did at youth level so compared to these attacking players (who I am comparing him to based off his exploits at youth level) yes he is a joke technically. Same with Ashley Cole. He was picked up as a striker but if you think of the skill level of strikers who play professionally he is miles behind. For a FB, he's not bad technically.

Shaw is very adept technically.

And at Fabio who had what 10 decent games for us?

At what? dribbling, crossing, creative passing? I see him an extremely limited FB and those are not the most technically proficient. think about Gary Neville's crossing, Rafael dribbling and even his crossing in his pomp and his odd wondergoal. Think about Baines. that's technique. Shaw's is very ordinary.

Stacks saying Shaw his trash technically is all I need to know to disregard that opinion on Shaw. Same like the people who hated Smalling for being slow or crap in the air.

Trash is me being hyperbolic and its dependent on who you compare him too. My initial point was in how Shaw supposedly was when playing at Youth level with a "wand of a foot" which is basically describing Bale or Robben and of course compared to them Shaw technical aspects of his game are pretty trash. Obviously he is a pro so can do some basic aspects of football like receiving a pass, passing it backwards, passing it sideways and to the feet of others near by. I don't hate him. I just think he's not very good. If he becomes England's FB then our standards are low.

 

[ravelston]

Good pass? compared to who? Sideways and backwards passes isn't a good passer. a good passer has variety in their passing. Good shot? so when Shaw who has f all goals in his career, winds up for a shot, do you think keepers are like "holy feck Luke's winding up, better block that shit". A good 1st touch is contentious.. Most of the passes he receives are short, simple sideways passes out the left, which is fairly easy to trap. Not like he overlaps like Alvez and has to bring balls out the air from a lofted Xavi pass. I'd say his touch his just standard. Luke Shaw averages 30 backwards passes per 90 minute.

I was exaggerating but that is in comparison to highly technical players. E.g. Gareth Bale did in the 1st team, what Shaw supposedly did at youth level so compared to these attacking players (who I am comparing him to based off his exploits at youth level) yes he is a joke technically. Same with Ashley Cole. He was picked up as a striker but if you think of the skill level of strikers who play professionally he is miles behind. For a FB, he's not bad technically.

At what? dribbling, crossing, creative passing? I see him an extremely limited FB and those are not the most technically proficient. think about Gary Neville's crossing, Rafael dribbling and even his crossing in his pomp and his odd wondergoal. Think about Baines. that's technique. Shaw's is very ordinary.

Trash is me being hyperbolic and its dependent on who you compare him too. My initial point was in how Shaw supposedly was when playing at Youth level with a "wand of a foot" which is basically describing Bale or Robben and of course compared to them Shaw technical aspects of his game are pretty trash. Obviously he is a pro so can do some basic aspects of football like receiving a pass, passing it backwards, passing it sideways and to the feet of others near by. I don't hate him. I just think he's not very good. If he becomes England's FB then our standards are low.

I'm assuming that this is a WUM, why else would anyone write such drivel.

 

[FerociousCorgis]

The one thing i really almost would say about shaw is i swear he has one of the hardest shots on the team. Every time i see him shoot he just absolutely crushes the ball. If he could get it more in the corner would really up his goals.

 

[AltiUn]

I don't get why spouting crap like this is becoming a trend on here. He's not hit his pre-legbreak heights yet but he's our best left-back nonetheless and he's improving. We all know Shaw can be very dangerous going forward. Back then he often put in dangerous crosses and went on marauding runs, which in the end resulted in the legbreak because Hector Moreno was so desperate to stop him INSIDE THEIR 16. It's not that he can't do it, it's just that Mourinho didn't allow it and he adapted. Give him and the rest of the squad a bit of time to get used to the United way of playing again.

To be fair, he's literally our only left back.

 

[tomaldinho1]

I'm assuming that this is a WUM, why else would anyone write such drivel.

Sadly I think it's serious.

I do appreciate the poster however highlighting that Luke Shaw is lucky not to have played with such a bad passer of the ball as Xavi, unlike poor Dani Alves who was constantly having to bring balls out of the air for him

 

[Stacks]

Sadly I think it's serious.

I do appreciate the poster however highlighting that Luke Shaw is lucky not to have played with such a bad passer of the ball as Xavi, unlike poor Dani Alves who was constantly having to bring balls out of the air for him

In many ways he is like the reincarnation of Stuart Pearce.......

 

[Glow]

I find Luke Shaw on the very edge between being an acceptable substitution player and a player we should try to get some transfer money on before it's too late. He may have a much brighter future on a lower level, e.g. the championship.

 

[AR87]

The one thing i really almost would say about shaw is i swear he has one of the hardest shots on the team. Every time i see him shoot he just absolutely crushes the ball. If he could get it more in the corner would really up his goals.

Yeah, very true.

 

[Stacks]

Yeah, very true.

A bit like Stuart Pearce

 

[Skills]

He's doing fine. Just think he needs to work on his crossing. If he was a quality crosser he'd be a menace.

Crossing is hugely overrated in my opinion. There aren't many full backs who can cross and most struggle to beat the first man, when they're actually marked (which is natural).

I think he needs to up his fitness though. He needs to be able to bomb up and down the pitch constantly like Kimmich, Robertson, Walker & Mendy do because that's what he's really lacking. He just doesn't do it enough. His movement also needs better coaching - I'd argue that's the case for the entire left side, they're all a bit static and if they gained a bit of synergy and better link up they've got everything to work really well.

 

[Andersonson]

The one thing i really almost would say about shaw is i swear he has one of the hardest shots on the team. Every time i see him shoot he just absolutely crushes the ball. If he could get it more in the corner would really up his goals.

Up his goals from 1 to 2. I like Shaw, he's a good LB. Not very good or world class, but stable and good. Not my first worry when it comes to upgrading

 

[meamth]

Shaw lacks flair, not all that nonsense about him being slow and technically poor.

I get it, those who hates him are so jealous of Liverpool's left back that they want the same kind of player.

World class in every position, sign everyone.

 

[Web of Bissaka]

Is he injured?

Absent last game.

Defensively he's more reliable than Dalot at LB, need him vs Arsenal.

 

[yfoFC]

Fell ill I believe, should be back for arsenal.

 

[Zoo]

Thought he was excellent defensively and got forward when he could, starting the move for the second goal. Probably his best game of the season.

 

[Doracle]

Absolute quality tonight. Great to see.

 

[Damien]

That was great for the second goal. Surprised someone was in the match thread saying that was nothing.

 

[roonster09]

Very good game. Defensively very good and made so many good attacking runs. Second ball was all down to his work, what a pass.

 

[Kostov]

Very good game tonight.

 

[Hoboman]

Fantastic second half from Luke

 

[roonster09]

That was great for the second goal. Surprised someone was in the match thread saying that was nothing

Wow, not surprising though.

 

[Nick7]

He was great tonight.

 

[Aint gota Kalou]

Thought he looked ruined stamina wise towards the end of the first half but coped really well all game. With the attackers staying high our fullbacks are doing a lot so he deserves credit.

 

[VeevaVee]

That run for the second goal was great.

Excellent awareness and decision making at speed. Just what the doctor ordered for us.

 

[thepolice123]

He is quite incredible at defending. Kept Aubameyang in his pocket in the first half.

 

[acnumber9]

I thought he went from doing really shit things to really good things throughout the game. Hard to judge. Though I dislike Shaw so I’m maybe overly harsh.

 

[KM]

One of his best performances ever for us, I reckon.

 

[Ekeke]

Brave near the end making the challenge where Lacazette pushed him right into the post. He really helps our defense pinching the ball, 4 interceptions today and 4 clearances once again helping the CBs deal with something they're weakest on. The most of both in the team today. Also blocked 1 shot, made 2 tackles and 2 headers

 

[MyOnlySolskjaer]

His best game for us, still he needs to really work hard offensively but he slipped in some excellent balls today.

 

[UNITED ACADEMY]

My motm. He was solid defensively. And the run was good as well for the 2nd goal.

 

[Hugh Jass]

Brilliant today.

 

[Andersons Dietician]

Honestly that was a sexy through ball. Guessing it was off of the outside of his boot but hilarious to see elmel in the MD saying it was nothing other than that assist thought he was solid made a huge contribution in the defence with all those little blocks or just winning stuff. Had that weird moment when he was jogging back side by side with Pogba but from his reaction I guess he was expecting Lindelof to go out to Auba. Still managed to get the block in.

People question his stamina but he was bombing forward in the dying minutes.