Now that's just too much. I don't see how Mourinho come out of it looking good in any way. Our defence went from one of the best to one of the worst in the league. He must've tried to make the board give in and let him buy more defenders. I'm sure in his last meeting with Ed Woodward, Mourinho told him it's their fault and they are a bunch of idiots and amateurs, then put up 3 fingers and asked them: "Do you know what this is? Three! Three! Respect! Respect!".
6
Season Average Rating
- Appearances
- 47
- Goals
- 16
- Assists
- 14
- Yellow cards
- 7
- Red cards
- 1
- Status
Pogbas current role is a great example of why numbering systems and positions are extremely overrated. We are still playing the same "system" as we did under Mourinho. Its a 4-3-3 with Matic holding. Pogba is still LCM or #8, whatever you prefer.
But at the same time its completely different:
i) we stand 20 yards higher with our back four defensively and actually press the ball when we lose it instead of falling back and covering space.
ii) We also leave our wingers much higher up the pitch even if we do give away the ball. There is no back-six any more with the wingers needing to defend the channels in the extreme.
iii) we commit so many more players in front of the ball when in possession. Especially the FBs.
There is not one FB venturing a ltb forward and the other one tucking in to the CBs as Mourinho insisted on. Now we have both FBs high up the pitch in possession.
It helps Pogba immensely when he is on the ball, but even Matic looks really good on the ball now when there is actually alternatives in front of him.
Under Mourinho Pogba - playing in the same position - many times had just Lukaku in front of him when we actually recovered the ball. He was given a lot of crap for diddling on the ball when he IMO was just waiting for us to move players forward from way too deep positions defensively to begin with.
Its by far the biggest difference compared to under Mourinho.
iv) We are not afraid of passing the ball forward even if we have committed players in front of the ball. The ridiculous constant fear of turnovers that was the worst thing about Mourinhos game seems to be gone.
So all good so far, it will be really interesting to see how this team playing this type of football fares against a team like City or even Spurs. i am still very afraid of how Matic will look then. We will see soon I guess. Spurs is coming up....
But at the same time its completely different:
i) we stand 20 yards higher with our back four defensively and actually press the ball when we lose it instead of falling back and covering space.
ii) We also leave our wingers much higher up the pitch even if we do give away the ball. There is no back-six any more with the wingers needing to defend the channels in the extreme.
iii) we commit so many more players in front of the ball when in possession. Especially the FBs.
There is not one FB venturing a ltb forward and the other one tucking in to the CBs as Mourinho insisted on. Now we have both FBs high up the pitch in possession.
It helps Pogba immensely when he is on the ball, but even Matic looks really good on the ball now when there is actually alternatives in front of him.
Under Mourinho Pogba - playing in the same position - many times had just Lukaku in front of him when we actually recovered the ball. He was given a lot of crap for diddling on the ball when he IMO was just waiting for us to move players forward from way too deep positions defensively to begin with.
Its by far the biggest difference compared to under Mourinho.
iv) We are not afraid of passing the ball forward even if we have committed players in front of the ball. The ridiculous constant fear of turnovers that was the worst thing about Mourinhos game seems to be gone.
So all good so far, it will be really interesting to see how this team playing this type of football fares against a team like City or even Spurs. i am still very afraid of how Matic will look then. We will see soon I guess. Spurs is coming up....
Both those games had extended periods where the opposition were on top though.
In terms of a full 90 minutes where a player was all over it for the full 90 (with very little down time) ... I'd go back to Depay.
Spot on
It's a curious top 20, filled understandably with attackers.
And then Pogba, the only midfielder in the top 20 - and the only Manchester United player. And also interestingly, there's no Pogba in the top 20 of the previous 2 seasons - there's POTY KDB at 20th in the 17/18 list, though.
Looking further back, this trend holds even more -
POTY Ronaldo shows up in both 07/08 and 08/09 (no Rooney),
POTY Rooney in 09/10,
Club POTY Nani in 10/11 (never appeared before, no Rooney),
both POTY RvP (never appeared before) and club POTY Rooney in 11/12, when they both scored 30+ goals (also Aguero)
Rooney duly disappears from the 12/13 list corresponding with his poor season, leaving RvP, Suarez, and Aguero all on the list.
To me this suggests - dispossession is a function of your position (forwards try more things and get tackled more), how "central" you are to your teams' goalscoring or creating, and your role (trying the tough pass many times will put you on the list).
Under the static system we played, Pogba (or any other player, like Sanchez, high up in last years' list) has to create an opening by individual skill or individual passing brilliance. Last season, the team was a little more cohesive, allowing goals to come from multiple sources, while it has been miserable this time, forcing individual players to have the responsibility of single-highhandedly bringing the ball out from a press, launching a counter, or opening the defence. And I think that explains Pogba's position on the list this time.
You’ve provided a rationale/justification for Pogba featuring in that list but not for him topping it.
Besides, I’m willing to bet he’s nowhere near the top of the list for the last three games. Which says it all really. When he’s playing well it’s not an issue.
I remember this one well, it was in January, Lukaku injured, before Sanchez. Martial restored to the lineup and brilliant, midfield 3 with Pogba given license to drift left, making Shaw-Pogba-Martial our very deadly left side. Something similar for a few more games, with Martial scoring twice more.
And then United buy Sanchez, shift and then immediately drop Martial, restore Lukaku, Pogba goes back to the midfield 2.
By the end of the season Martial is about to be sold with the support of fans.
And you could be right. A high usage creative player usually tops the stats like these. It's the same in the NBA, where the superstars always have the most turnovers, but they have the most assists too. Although Pogba could still cut out some of the unnecessary turnovers.
He doesn't top it (among all players, which is the list I've been referring to).
Yes, unfortunately I can't find stats for individual games. What I will say is - he has an easier job in this team than he had under Jose. There are passing options and movement.
And I think it's more than "playing well" - that was the point of including all the POTY players who appeared on the list. It's not just performance (Carlton Cole appears on the list a lot, and that's because he's shit), but also position and role (KdB only last season, Rooney's on-and-off appearances, etc).
Ok
What does pogba get the blame for?
Pogba has plenty of very good games under Jose. This season alone. He had 2 or 3 poor games shortly before JM was sacked, but I don’t agree with the narrative that he’s only started playing a week ago or something. He was our best player in many games this season m, and the best player on the pitch altogether. He missed a few games with injury too let’s not forget.
Don't you think that's a tad hypocritical when you've made jokes about wanting to be infected by Pogba's vvirus. Obviously you were joking, it's just all fun isn't it?
Found out that his gf is pregnant, truly heartbroken
It's fecking weird. This is a thread tallking about player performances and yet we're reduced to talking about Pogba pregnating people.
Just turned Talksport on for a couple of minutes and Sam Delaney and Jason Cundy are on. They are backing Pogba over his dancing. Delaney was slagging off these pundits who are coming out and saying the lad is unprofessional, when as he said, in their day it was Win, draw, lose always on the booze. That they think being professional is after scoring a goal you run to back to halfway with your hand in the air. Cundy said when he saw Pogba dancing before the game, all he thought was 'he knows he's going to score', not that it was shameful. Cundy just said Jose sucked the life out of Pogba and the team. Cundy will know exactly how Jose is after being around him at Chelsea
Have you not been watching our games recently? The guy has more options, and more importantly the passes starts from the back with everyone one higher it's a huge contrast to having just 3 players to pass to with the rest behind the halfway line.
Look at Sanchez for example a smooth passer of the ball for arsenal who uses quick one two's to open defences came here and look like someone who has never played in a team in his life, constantly giving the ball away due to players doubling up on him with no one to pass to.
People say he hasn't scored enough but I can't even remember him missing any big goal scoring chances cause he hardly saw any.mourinho's style was just horrible for all the attacking minded individuals we have.
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The part that ceases to amaze me was referring to his girlfriend as a 'bird', I've long accepted that objectifying women based on how they look will always happen on here - and I partake in doing the same to men too, but referring to girls as birds is still quite dismissive & unnecessary.
He's scoring on and off the field, I think that's worth celebrating.It's fecking weird. This is a thread tallking about player performances and yet we're reduced to talking about Pogba pregnating people.
Brilliant. Any chance we can hear that online?
Once again, Pogba reduced to pace and power.
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Robbie Keane was doing some corny roll for years and years and nothing was ever said about his trademark celebration. What is people’s problem? Haha.
LeBron too of course. Double whammy.
where did he show any pace?Not sure. Sometimes they do post stuff on their website. Just heard a bit more, not sure if it was Jamie Jackson they were talking to and race came into it. That you never heard anyone saying anything when Lee Sharpe was doing his thing, or Robbie Keane was somersaulting after his goals, yet Pogba and Sterling get relentless criticism.
Woody should have the lawyers line up contract extension talks asap. Only time till next summer before the "only one year" left talk starts.
I love the Gerrard taking over idea. Can they do it this summer please?
People said he cant play for Barca
This guy is a beast. One of the very rare players who has everything. Someone has been talking about a Toure Mk2. Dare to say, he has much higher ceiling than Toure.
This guy is a beast. One of the very rare players who has everything. Someone has been talking about a Toure Mk2. Dare to say, he has much higher ceiling than Toure.
I’ll ignore the first question in your post
I don’t disagree with the reasons you give for Pogba losing the ball less when the team plays well. This doesn’t change the fact that he’s been careless in possession plenty of times this season, for reasons that have nothing to with anyone else. And that’s why he’s on top of that list.
Oh come on. The height of his leap and hang time for the second goal was always going to earn comparisons with basketball players. How is what Redknapp said in any way problematic?
I didn't note the context of his goal. But I don't think the technical parameters of his game is mentioned enough. In the context of the goal, yeah, not much wrong with that.
I’d need to read the full article too tbf. I just assumed the LeBron stuff was all about the goal. The height he got was so fecking impressive. His head was at least a foot higher up than the keeper’s hands. It was amazing and very reminiscent of watching a basketballer dunk on someone.
His skill and creative vision has been the defining factor. He's one of the best in the world and we should try to keep him. I'm overjoyed we've started to play him higher and be more attacking.
Paul Scholes had the vision and passing range yet for some reason we have been wasting Pogba's talents.
I'm really surprised Makelele has a problem with his dancing. Different people express themselves differently, we've seen lots of dances and routines over the years. How is it suddenly disrespectful?
Paul Scholes had the vision and passing range yet for some reason we have been wasting Pogba's talents.
I'm really surprised Makelele has a problem with his dancing. Different people express themselves differently, we've seen lots of dances and routines over the years. How is it suddenly disrespectful?
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I remember the boss building him up and even defending him when the media criticized him. Let's not have selective memory.
I guess it's easier for Matic to hit a forward pass when there's some off the ball movement around him, isn't it?
See above.
In any case, enjoy. To each fan a befitting idol.
Pogba performance under Solskjaer are slapping those faces who booed him. Love those happy ending. It's like watching Rocky movie, when he KO'd that stupid s*itface, smarta*s, egocentric and arrogant Drago in his own turf.
Goodness, I hate that Drago.
Goodness, I hate that Drago.
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Or he told them that there's no way we're beating PSG
It's odd, especially as his pal and former teammate Drogba was known to bust a move now and then. I highly doubt such issues were raised then.
On par with Hazard and KDB at their best? Or better?
So glad he's ours and will be for a long time
So glad he's ours and will be for a long time
Henry was known for his shithouse celebrations as well if I remember correctly.
Makelele must be a racist then.
I dont get the hatred aimed at pogba, a friend of mine who is a massive red and went to 99 champs final with me said Pogba should never where a united short again? Wtf, Forget politics and personailities for me, if he does it on the pitch im good with that. We dont really know how much JM tried to bully Pogba but the change in his persona is so clear under Ole and long may it continue.
If anyone knows about injuries from goal celebrations it's Ole. I'm sure our manager will have a word of advice.
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