legball
Full Member
- Joined
- Jun 10, 2013
- Messages
- 2,889
I won't really disagree with you.My understanding is both Shaw and Herrera were targeted by the club's scouting team for a long time. So I wouldn't class them as Moyes' signings at all.
I won't really disagree with you.My understanding is both Shaw and Herrera were targeted by the club's scouting team for a long time. So I wouldn't class them as Moyes' signings at all.
What the feck do you want us to do, man?Here is more........Quite damning! Especially the video and Vidic part
Who is still defending Moyes?Can we all just forget moyes and what he did to the team. Can't believe there are still a few defending moyes, a man who managed to piss off so many senior members of the squad. Even our ex captain decided that if that was our future, he needed to feck off.
Chips?What is the story with the chips?!?!
Yes he did, he nearly did...I'm glad Rio isn't at the club anymore. Thanks for the years of success, but he didn't deserve to be on the pitch most games last season. Didn't he make a comment about only needing to put 80% effort on the pitch or something?
Glad most of the troublemakers have been phased out or otherwise relegated to the bench.
It's really impossible to discuss Moyes on here, he almost ruined Colin's life you know.
What a surprise that a classic line-hugging winger comes out in support of classic throwback British manager favouring prehistoric wing tactics.Kilbane is an idiot. I recall him defending Moyes on Radio Five Live, and his justifications were asinine.
OK leaving Moyes aside and looking merely from a player's perspective:
You are one of the senior players who has been at the club for over a decade and has won everything. You were part of that group who saw Chelsea's money dominating everything but your group still won the PL back. Then you also were part of the group which reached 3 CL finals in 4 years. You were also part of the group which lost the title to your mega rich local rivals in the worst possible way but you still came back to win the title the following year.
Then all of a sudden you have a new manager and as soon as things don't work all those hard work, come-backs, acchievements are forgotten and ppl can't stop questionning you as a player. Whatever the tactic, performance or result, it was always you as player who was questioned by the media and not the manager. The same manager btw who hadn't won anything but had the balls to call you and your group who has had all kind of high and lows "mentally soft". And what are you supposed to do? Not even defend yourself? Just keep your mouth shut? Not tell what really happened?
I am actually shocked that the players kept silent while Moyes was destroying the club for 10 months. It is actually a huge credit to SAF that out of respect of him and his values (which also include not to question the manager) the players (serial winners, not some pub players) didn't speak up for that long.
If I am questioned in my daily life / work I immediately try to clear the issue or defend myself if necessary.
Hell even on an internet forum if I feel misunderstood or attacked I justify myself.
But Rio the player, who was openly questionned by the whole media in order to protect their Scot darling, should not be allowed to tell his story?
Not really, if you read it properly, you'd know that it was just a ritual. May be silly to you, but I'm still astonished at the caf's naivety when it comes to professional footballers, in some aspects they are all children really, I don't find that surprising at all, seeing the antics at other clubs as well. And honestly I don't blame them, they earn loads of money for playing a game, why should United's players be any different to Chelsea's for example? Whenever I read interviews from professional atheles, they all have rituals and all kind of superstition going on. Ferdinand said it himself, it wasn't about eating something unhealthy, they were a professional bunch, it was just a ritual, which they cared about for whatever reason. Of course it's still silly.Jeez, stuff like that only puts lads and Ferdinand in bad light, not Moyes.
Maybe they were playing exactly the way Moyes wanted them to and that was the result.Are there any excerpts of Rio blaming himself or his teammates for the shambolic season?
Innocent until proven guilty. There has never been conclusive information to tie Rio in with Disco Mirror's lineup leaks. Just because he acts the prat at times doesn't imply he would deliberately try to sabotage the club. This is a professional of the highest order, someone who has given the bulk of his career to United and is one of our all time greats. It's offensive to assume that he was the one to feed inside club information to the media when one can't provide the evidence to back up those claims.Yes, everybody has a right to say what they want in their biographies. My problem is not with what has come out, my problem is with who has said it. If Rio hadn't done stuff like leaking line-ups before the game, I wouldn't have a problem with this. That's not the case, is it?
Why not ? Is honesty a sin ? Rio's being transparent with his readers who are primarily United fans and 90 % of us wish to know what really went on behind closed doors last season.The stuff about practicing set-pieces at the park, about Rio wanting to strangle him or what not, was that really necessary? As much as Moyes is to blame for the shambles of last year, the players aren't lily-white either. Especially senior players like Rio, van Persie, Vidic , etc.
I don't want to indulge in this debate but to address it a bit, from the players you mentioned -The only players who showed the right attitude despite the results were Rooney, Januzaj and De Gea. If they had come out and said this stuff, fair enough.
Wut ? It is a part of football folklore. By your analogy is archiving history or forensic data a waste ? There's always something to be learnt from past mistakes. And Rio going public has made people aware of the United standard and how incompatibility with it can be ruinous - evinced by the past season.David Moyes and Manchester United is done. It's in the past. Neither party gains much by going on and on about it.
Revisiting the glory days and recounting the events of 2013/ 2014 are two separate issues. People will associate what they want to but those who saw him at his pomp will always remember those times. What do people most remember Georgie Best for ? Butchering Benfica and being in Sir Matt's arms after it or the to and fro with Frank O'Farrell. People emote with positive reminiscing and Rio's United legacy has been set in stone.Players like Rio Ferdinand, who gave so much to this club, need to understand that. In a couple of years, Rio is going to be all over the pundit circle. Would he prefer that people ask him about the 10 successful seasons he had with us or the one season where everything went wrong?
Away teams can't always get closed door training facilities at European matches. I assume Rio means we had to use a (pre-booked!) public pitch but that instead of a few routine drills and a practice match, they did proper setpiece training.I still don't get taking training at a local park.
Yeah there's no doubt the players have to take the blame which is why Rio got shipped out minutes after the final whistle was blown. That doesn't mean the players like Moyes when he comes round to it should not have the chance to state their story.The witch hunt escalates I see.
Can't wait when Moyes will release his book with notes about some Manchester United players and their 'world class' ambitions and reasons why Louie was forced to sell 14 players in his first months here.
To be fair David is hardly a victim here after receiving astronomical money from his departure. He could easily sign Fellaini again from his own pocket.
If you mean Moyes, then yeah it is incredibly damaging. He shouldn't be so picky where he ends up and given the amount of money we gave him, he should go abroad for a bit.He'll end up down in the Championship at this rate, very damaging to his career.
We have real published authors on the Caf', we're a little above Rio's ghost writer.Those statements sounds like someone here ghostwrote it.
I seem to remember that the players were constantly blaming themselves throughout the season and never once directly blamed Moyes or his tactics, they defended the club and took the blame for the poor performances. Something Moyes never, ever, did, during or since.Are there any excerpts of Rio blaming himself or his teammates for the shambolic season?
Absolutely. Gotta be 100% objective and also look from player's perspective.Yeah there's no doubt the players have to take the blame which is why Rio got shipped out minutes after the final whistle was blown. That doesn't mean the players like Moyes when he comes round to it should not have the chance to state their story.
Yep that makes Ferdinand come across like G.Neville when he was banging on about the history of United and wingers. Moyes was terrible but there shouldn't of been a problem if he wanted to move away from 'tradition'.The comment about the narrow 4222 is interesting. Sounds like he would have sabotaged Van Gaal too. Getting rid of senior players who aren't open to new ideas is obviously more important than I thought. We're probably well rid of Rio, Evra and Vidic.
There isn't much detail provided but I imagine as he refers to 'low fat chips' that this was a 'treat' given to professional athletes who normally have to avoid (except Ando) many types of food that they see friends and family enjoy.So random
I was thinking that myself actually. I'm still glad Moyes was sacked and I'm actually quite fond of Rio these days but he comes across as very stubborn and old fashioned there. You have to evolve with the times.The comment about the narrow 4222 is interesting. Sounds like he would have sabotaged Van Gaal too. Getting rid of senior players who aren't open to new ideas is obviously more important than I thought. We're probably well rid of Rio, Evra and Vidic.
If there was someone who should know what the job was all about was SAF. He covered the role for more then two decades. I love SAF but there's too much thing pointing to that directionThat's going a bit too far. Let's just say the top board underestimated the amount of work that needed to be done, and had faith in Moyes' ability to get the job done.
It's alright....LVG, I think, has brainwashed Giggs with this "philosophy" crap.I was thinking that myself actually. I'm still glad Moyes was sacked and I'm actually quite fond of Rio these days but he comes across as very stubborn and old fashioned there. You have to evolve with the times.
It's the same thing that worries me about Giggs eventually becoming manager one day but that's another discussion I suppose.
His performance, his snipes towards the manager (especially when he got fired) etc were ridiculous. As a veteran he should behaved better then that.What did he do that's so 'unforgiveable'? I see people saying this, yet there's no evidence of anything.
IMO what becomes obvious more than everything with this is Moyes' inability to convince the players that he was setting the club and players on the right path. Van Gaal is changing a lot and he can do it, because he's been ruthless, decisive and demands respect, something Moyes clearly lacked.Yep that makes Ferdinand come across like G.Neville when he was banging on about the history of United and wingers. Moyes was terrible but there shouldn't of been a problem if he wanted to move away from 'tradition'.
Yes, everybody has a right to say what they want in their biographies. My problem is not with what has come out, my problem is with who has said it. If Rio hadn't done stuff like leaking line-ups before the game, I wouldn't have a problem with this. That's not the case, is it? The stuff about practicing set-pieces at the park, about Rio wanting to strangle him or what not, was that really necessary? As much as Moyes is to blame for the shambles of last year, the players aren't lily-white either. Especially senior players like Rio, van Persie, Vidic , etc. One would have expected higher standards from them given what they've done for this club, but that's not the case. The only players who showed the right attitude despite the results were Rooney, Januzaj and De Gea. If they had come out and said this stuff, fair enough.
David Moyes and Manchester United is done. It's in the past. Neither party gains much by going on and on about it. Players like Rio Ferdinand, who gave so much to this club, need to understand that. In a couple of years, Rio is going to be all over the pundit circle. Would he prefer that people ask him about the 10 successful seasons he had with us or the one season where everything went wrong?
I doubt that LVG needed to brainwash Giggs. LVG is a world class manager. Giggs is an inexperienced assistant manager who is still working on his coaching badges and is lucky that LVG accepted him as an AM. Under such circumstances Its his way or the highway.It's alright....LVG, I think, has brainwashed Giggs with this "philosophy" crap.
I believe in LVG, I love the guy and he can have all the time in the world as far as i'm concerned....However, I hate that word!
"They tell me it's a big club"Don't feel bad for Moyes. He will be managing Newcastle in a few weeks. Will sign a 6 year deal.
But taking jabs at your manager and leaking it to the press is captain material?Ferdinand played for Alex Ferguson for over a decade and was made club captain someone with the type of character to achieve those feats would not be so unprofessional to leak his own teams line ups.
I think the senior players would have been open to new ideas if it came from someone with authority like Van Gaal.The comment about the narrow 4222 is interesting. Sounds like he would have sabotaged Van Gaal too. Getting rid of senior players who aren't open to new ideas is obviously more important than I thought. We're probably well rid of Rio, Evra and Vidic.
The biggest problem was he moved away from the tradition of winning. I'm sure the players could accept change if it isn't negative.Yep that makes Ferdinand come across like G.Neville when he was banging on about the history of United and wingers. Moyes was terrible but there shouldn't of been a problem if he wanted to move away from 'tradition'.