I've never heard that before. 
10
Season Average Rating
- Appearances
- 41
- Goals
- 15
- Assists
- 6
- Yellow cards
- 5
- Status
Other than the fact that was 6 years ago, and he's not getting any younger (or sharper)... and we (and by we I mean Fergie) tried to get rid of him twice in that time frame.
Try reading what I'm actually saying. I didn't say he's going to perform like he did that season, but are you seriously telling me he can't finish those chances in the present day?
yeah... I've read what you are saying and I am fully disagreeing with you. I think relying on him without suitable back-up would be Van Gaal's undoing... do I think Wilson and Hernandez are that back up... NO... I fully believe we (and by we I mean Van Gaal) are looking to add strength to the striker position.
Rooney's peak (as in his best) season was 9/10 which quite frankly was only 3/4 a season, really ending with his ankle injury vs Bayern... since then he he has played 1 and 1/3 seasons of football which could be describe as "at that level" (the last 3rd of 10/11... and most of 11/ 12 - although he did go shockingly missing in several key games that season). Other than those windows he has largely played in fits and spurts looking world class at times, very ordinary more often than not.
the present version of Rooney is clearly NOT as good as the 9/10 version. Funnily enough prior to the 9/10 season finishing was seen as a weakness in Rooney's overall game... now it is being touted as his strength. While I believe he will be give an chance to prove he can still deliver, I believe LVG will drop him especially if he does sign another name striker who will want his chance... and with our newly fortified midfield Rooney may find himself completely out in the cold if he does not produce.
Remember when Valencia and Nani were really, really fecking good? Berbatov with some lovely football in there, too.
Rooney is fine up top. Create chances for him and he'll bag 20-30, comfortably.
Clearly you haven't read what I said. I was responding to a post that said something along the lines of how a striker need to beat defenders to get opportunities to score 25+. I displayed a video showing Rooney scoring 34 goals without the need to beat defenders 1 v 1. I'm not saying he will play all round as well as that season, but there's no doubt he can finish chances like that if he gets similar service to that year. Answer this question, is he capable of finishing chances like in that video? That's where my discussion is, not with whatever else you have posted.
Btw what key games did Rooney go missing in 11/12? 3 goals against Arsenal, 3 goals against Chelsea, 2 goals against Man City, 2 goals against Liverpool, 2 goals against Spurs, 2 goals against Everton. He was pretty fecking good in big games that year, ridiculous criticism.
The delusion about him is real, he's done very little recently to suggest that he'll be one of the highest goalscorers in Europe.
Played upfront every week he will score over 20 goals guaranteed.
I'll give you three games where Rooney "went missing" in 11/12 and they were all extremely costly...
0-1 vs Basel as United crashed out of the champions league.
0-1 vs Wigan as United started to let City back in the title race
0-1 vs City where we basically handed the title to City.
and it wasn't that he didn't score in those games, it was that fact that he was utterly dire in what were must win games.
To answer your other question , come on... not nearly as simple as you make it out to be. You show a video of Rooney's best season in a United shirt, and you make it seem like all he did was put away tap ins. No chance. His movement, finding space, his instinct to get in scoring positions and his passion to deliver was world class that season. You have to be able to be the a position to deal with the service he got that season. Do I think the present day Rooney operates at the same level to be able to do the things he did in 09/10... NO, I don't. Do I think he will fair as well with the potential of decent service this season, NO again I don't believe he will match what he achieved during that season. Will his finishing mask the other elements of his game which have gone into decline... NO. Is his movement and pace what it was 6 seasons ago, come on. Will he score 30 goals if all he has to do is tap the ball into an open net... sure, yes he will.
You forget that Rooney was our main penalty taker that season as well... now he's probably 3rd -4th choice. I'd say somewhere between 15-18 league goals, would be a decent expectation for Rooney this season (and quite frankly that's not a bad haul for a premier league striker)... I believe LVG will give him the opportunity to show us he can deliver the goods, but I don't think he will hesitate to go another route if Rooney is not up for it.
Sorry but Wigan does not count as a key game, there were far more important games that season. So basically two games you've picked out, out of how many key games? I think you'll find he performed in the vast majority of the key games that season and was one of the best big game players in Europe that season. Absolutely ridiculous criticism. Thanks for goals and winning us games against Chelsea, Man City, Liverpool, Arsenal, Tottenham and Everton but because you had a couple of bad games, you went missing in key games that season. Right.
We haven't seen Rooney consistently in a striker role for a long time for United but I think it's premature to say his movement and ability to find space have gone. As someone mentioned earlier in the thread, he's managed a good record under Hodgson for England primarily playing as a number 10 or striker.
2012 - 4 goals in 5 games
2013 - 6 goals in 10 games
2014 - 8 goals in 13 games
2015 - 2 goals in 4 games
I'm not saying he's the same player as 6 years ago, but he can still score goals when playing up front. It will be interesting to see how many he does score this season if he does indeed play up front every game.
This hero worship is getting boring
Please don't ever confuse playing for United and England... they are not the same thing.
Sorry, but every game does count in April when you are locked in a heated title race with your cross town rivals. So Wigan absolutely counts as a key game, a draw in that game and we win the league.
And as for "going missing" how about Blackburn H 2-3 in 11/12 when Rooney was suspended by Fergie for getting drunk the night before the previous match... hardly the trait of a leader (or someone to pin your hopes on)... again, this is the year we lost the title on goal difference.
Listen to be honest... I really hope that we play beautiful attacking football and that Rooney has a great year banging in lots of goals... because it means that Manchester United will win things, which quite frankly is what we should all want. I'm just not so certain it will work that way. Lets not forget that in the two seasons Rooney operated as the lone primary striker we didn't win the league.
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Am I alone in the idea that, Rooney will be sold next year, and Basti is made captain?
Not based on anything...Just a feeling
Not based on anything...Just a feeling
You're missing the point. Rooney hasn't played striker consistently for us for a long time, so from what sample size are you judging Rooney's ability to score for us as a striker? The only team we've seen Rooney consistently play up front for is England and he's managed to score at International level just fine. That doesn't mean United = England obviously but it is a bigger sample size than an assumption based on his performances in various positions. He will also in theory have better team mates and service this year.
A game against Wigan is not more important than games against Chelsea, Liverpool, Arsenal etc. If we hadn't won those big games, we may not even be talking about the 'Wigan' game right now. Like I said, Rooney performed in the vast majority of key games that year. I've listed the amount of goals he scored against the big teams, that far out weights whatever poor games you've listed. Unless you'd rather he performed in the few games you listed and didn't score all those goals against the top six. Yeah, I don't think so.
As for the last part, Rooney only operated as 9 for one season post-Ronaldo and that was 09/10. He played behind Welbeck or Hernandez in the 11/12 season. Yes we didn't win the league in 09/10 season, we lost by a point and he got injured before the Chelsea clash and other players couldn't step up. Let's hold that against him, just because.
Its all about context... must win games speak for themselves... even if the opposition isn't all that fashionable. And yes... I expect ALL of our players (especially our so called talisman) to show up for them... all of them. We all should. Games don't get bigger than that City away game in 11/12... everything was on the line.
I notice you didn't want to touch this grenade... I guess it doesn't really work with your narrative.
Fergie changed Rooney's role in the City game to lone striker and we brought Park in. We set up defensively, created nothing and everyone played shit. He had a bad game but so did everyone else. Like I said, he performed in the vast majority of key games so there's no need to nit pick a few games and then claim he didn't turn up in key games.
Second part, that's obviously poor behaviour on his part but it doesn't change the point that he turned up in the vast majority of key games. You stated that he went 'shockingly missing in several key games' which is not true. He turned up in more key games for us than any other player that year and rivalled most in Europe with goals scored in big games. You're just nit picking and criticising unnecessarily. I'll repeat, 3 goals against Arsenal, 3 goals against Chelsea, 2 goals against Man City, 2 goals against Liverpool, 2 goals against Spurs, 2 goals against Everton. Not bad for going shockingly missing in key games.
Man, what a player. I expect Golden Balls this season.
Becks coming out of retirement is he?
Pffft, nah. Valencia going back to his natural place, right winger. Assists galore!
Who will buy him? I never heard any rumours about any team interested in him recently.
And not a good sign if anyone is made captain just after a year in the team, doesn't reflect good on other players.
Well, I've always been of the belief that Carrick, if he wasn't injured, would have been made captain.
As for Rooney...He's already making noises about the MLS.
This is just me thinking out loud btw....No substance to it
There are no rumours as he recently signed a new contract. Before that, Jose, of Porto fame, wanted to sign him. For some crumbs. Edward literally told him to feck off.
More like Moyes....Only one who had his back
Is there any place which has Rooney's assists broken down into open play and set pieces?
@Varun, RedCafe will have it in around 10 days.
Entire career?
Yeah, but not just him, all the players from around 1987 season.
That's a great addition. Nice!
The delusion about him 'being shit' or 'mediocre' is just as big.
The problem about 'recently' is that he hasn't really had the opportunity to feature in a balanced team as the out and out striker - unlike players you'd be comparing him to. The last time he was the #9 of the team was a while ago, so you necessarily have to look at those numbers, which look like those of an elite European striker. Many of you (including yourself, clearly), believe these numbers are too old and he's now past it. Others think he still has it in him to do very well as a center forward in a team which will create chances.
Neither of those are actually deluded. They're just opinions expressed by people on the basis of the trust they have in Rooney.
He isnt mediocre nor shit, but just watch him play. He has declined physically and its very significant. He's lost strength, pace and dynamism. Other than that, his first touch holds himself back a lot. These are attributes a striker at the highest level in modern days has to have, especially in the PL. He scored 4 goals in 14 matches as a striker for is, and has just scored one away goal domestically since March 2014. Its just clear that Rooney isnt the same as he was even under Moyes.
If you watch him, his link up and hold up play have both just not been the same, he gets shrugged off the ball easily, rarely combinates properly. If we were to build a team where Rooney could score 20 league goals, I think in that team Berahino could score similar too. It's not worth it for me.
How on earth are people still debating whether he's good enough? Don't you ever get bored arguing about the same thing every few months?
I wonder if Rooney is going to be like Giggs -- I was saying that Giggs was in decline around 2003, played for 11 more years.
Rooney's case does feel a lot different though.
Rooney's case does feel a lot different though.
I wouldn't agree with that. I believe Rooney is a massive blind spot for Van Gaal, and as I've said for about two years, the need to have him, somewhere, in any United XI will hold the team back. He is simply not in the group of players (on the field anyway) that warrants such status at a super club.
People speak about Van Gaal's ruthlessness - Evans was terrible last season and is up for sale, Di Maria, our record signing and probably our best player underperformed and was dropped and made to fight for his place. Rafael disappointed and up for sale. Many examples of players getting what they deserved. Can anyone really say Rooney's season warranted no scrutiny at all? Instead, Van Gaal has removed all realistic competition from the squad so as to have nobody in his way. A lot will depend on the level of striker we go for, because if it is a Diafra Sakho level player, then it will confirm the creation of conditions that will allow Rooney to walk into the side unchallenged.
I read an interview with Persie this morning saying how he wasn't given a fair chance to compete for his place. That is my worry here. I don't think most strikers we could sign will actually be allowed to 'compete' with Rooney. All this talk about how we need a 'back up ' for Rooney? Why on earth would we be searching simply for a backup to a player who got us 12 league goals last season?
From LVGs time here, I don't see how he could have concluded that the strikers position in his team is settled. Even if he thinks Rooney is good enough for it, it cannot be said that last season has proven this. So given his treatment of others in the squad, I don't think Rooney did enough last season to earn the status he seems to have in the team. Not even close.
I think this is a defining season for him. He is now the main man once again after 3 seasons of sharing that with RVP. If he finds form he could score a shedload and everyone's happy. If he doesn't I think we sign a top striker next summer and he has a choice of accepting a lesser role, and hoping to be involved in one last hurrah somewhere down the line a la Giggs, or moving club.
Think he will score 20 goals this season but that doesn't stop us acquiring Kane next summer who will be at that time comfortably better imo so we will see then if Van Gaal has balls or not to bench him.. if so it will lead to Rooney's departure which would be a good move for both sides. I think he's off to MLS after next two seasons maximum
The fact he is, and has been a permanent fixture under 3 managers, the most recent one known for his 'ruthless streak', might suggest you're slightly mistaken. When you listen to people who really know football, and I'm not talking about shit pundits here but the ones who have a bit of knowledge of the game, they'll always say that Rooney brings a lot more to a team than meets the eye. I also think seeing him live, as opposed to on TV, shows how much he does on a field. As @Captain Hindsight said, it's a tired debate that's been done hundreds of times on here and I can't really be bothered, but I think it's crazy for people to suggest he's not good enough for a club like ours as if he's getting a free ride just because of his marketing status or something.
If he plays up front all season, I'm confident he'll get more than 20.
The guy somehow manages to score 14 goals whilst playing in midfield, strike and feckin defence. He's never failed to score less than 10 goals for us, and has only ever had two seasons where he has played upfront, consistently.
For the first time in forever, we have a real midfield with actual mid-fielders, along with bags of creative players. I'd be very surprised if he doesn't get 20 goals this season.
He needs to deliver or else we're in trouble.
Hope striker we're after is going to give him some real competition for place up top, rate him but it would be silly going into season with Rooney as only real option for the striker postion.
Hope striker we're after is going to give him some real competition for place up top, rate him but it would be silly going into season with Rooney as only real option for the striker postion.
The exact same debate everywhere at the start of every season : what to do with Rooney. 13-14 it was sell him and play welbeck and chich with rvp and we would be fine. At the end of the season : top scorer- Wayne Rooney
14-15 - after signing falcao, cries of drop Rooney, play rvp falcao and mata. End of season top scorer - Wayne Rooney.
Every year same thing
14-15 - after signing falcao, cries of drop Rooney, play rvp falcao and mata. End of season top scorer - Wayne Rooney.
Every year same thing
Danny Ings would score 20 for us playing upfront. Rooney is nothing special at all these days.
- Status