Westminster Politics

What you have is minority groups scrambling to control one of the big parties.

Yes, as they might see it for the great good...and the 'greater good' is being in power, part of a government that can accomplish things and whatever their shade of opinion within their party, all MP's are subjected to, or subject themselves to, the party Whips.

When you have a number of differing parties, trying to participate in governance each with its own sense of being, then even more boundaries are created. Also even if some are broadly aligned on the left, on the right, or even in the centre, they are subject to their own membership rules and regulations, operation procedures; etc; hence you have the same leadership machinations/intrigues as you have in the larger parties, the same objections/ differing emphasis in policy matters, the same tendency to want to 'deal'; inertia in a government is the worst sin of all at times, and when there are more than two parties in any coalition, inertia is much more likely to occur.

It is true that some countries, their population mix, their constitutions, their geography and even their history may make a 'better fit' for PR than others, but as I said before its my view that without a written constitution, that involves more than precedent, and still retaining an 'island race' mentality, which over the centuries the majority of immigrants embrace, then simple PR is not the solution for the UK. Its possible, e.g. if the UK were to break up, then PR lite or PR+ might be an answer, but at the present I don't see that occurring.
 
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No but it generally delivers the majority of votes needed to govern

This has nothing to do with it being democratic and representing the will of the people though, which was the thrust of your argument. The big argument for FPTP isn't that it delivers outcomes which reflect the will of the people, it's that, as you've alluded to, it's meant to deliver strong, stable governments who can prosecute their agendas quickly and unhindered by the opposition.

The reason its stupid now is that it was introduced at a time in the late 19th century when the pool of people who had the ability to decide the outcome of an election was pretty homogenous - rich, property-owning men. In that situation, where basically everyone involved in politics shared an interest in preserving the status quo, a system which delivers strong governments capable of acting quickly to protect those shared interests, which favours established political parties and tends to disadvantage new ones (like those pesky trade unionists) and in which results can be very easily manipulated depending on how you draw the constituency boundaries, was exactly what the political class of the time wanted.

Nowadays, in a country where diverse groups with disparate opinions and interests expect to be equally treated by the electoral system, it's a millstone around the country's neck. It's not the only reason the country is fecked, but it's a big contributing factor to it.
 
So the plan is to use the money to hedge future gas supplies now, right at the top of the market? That sounds a surefire way to need a further taxpayer bailout in a year or two.

How aren't we in the streets with torches over this? This is the most blatant lining of pockets with public money since the last one.
 
This has nothing to do with it being democratic and representing the will of the people though, which was the thrust of your argument. The big argument for FPTP isn't that it delivers outcomes which reflect the will of the people, it's that, as you've alluded to, it's meant to deliver strong, stable governments who can prosecute their agendas quickly and unhindered by the opposition.

This is exactly what its meant to do and is everything to do with democracy and the defined will of the people.

Once a government is elected it has to be able to govern. An official opposition does just that and opposes, and except where there are massive (80+seat) majorities can do so effectively when there is genuine doubt/disagreement about a specific policy being pursued by the Government of the day.
I do agree that massive majorities such as we have seen with Boris/Tories can reduce effective opposition and invests too much power in a Government, however as we have seen such sizeable majorities tend to breed complacency and that leads to collapse.

Without (preferably written) constitutional change, political PR type changes will not bring better representation to the process of governing in the UK. Maybe a 'third way', arguably tried by Roy Jenkins & Co. with the Social Democrats might work now, it was perhaps a head of its time previously. However having a myriad of small parties who in theory coalesce around some ideal of broad political representation is a non-starter as far as effective governance is concerned..

There is also the 'sticky' point about how to effect both Constitutional and Political change, no Government having been elected is going to even try to make such changes...they have enough to do dealing with things like climate change, energy costs, food shortages and mass immigration/migration issues, to name but a few.
 




Christ on a bike

Oops.

Ms Truss initially promised to save up to £8.8bn annually by “adjusting” officials’ salaries to match living costs in the areas where they work.

But aides were forced to amend the claim after experts at the Institute for Government pointed out that the foreign secretary’s target was almost as much as the total annual civil service pay bill of around £9bn.
 
I'm all for civil servants getting more money but it's not exactly unusual for area based pay. Is that not already a feature of the civil service today? Surely London staff aren't getting the same pay as Hull?
 
I'm all for civil servants getting more money but it's not exactly unusual for area based pay. Is that not already a feature of the civil service today? Surely London staff aren't getting the same pay as Hull?

It is already a feature, jobs are always advertised as 2-4k more in London.
 
Liz Truss has described Wales' First Minister Mark Drakeford as a "low-energy version of Jeremy Corbyn" days after criticising Scottish leader Nicola Sturgeon.

She called Sturgeon "an attention seeker" who is "best ignored" during Monday's hustings in Exeter.

Truss lambasted Drakeford for his "negativity" over a 2019 decision to drop the M4 relief road.

"And that's why we need to kick out the Labour government and give the people in Wales the NHS they deserve." - Sunak
 

It's like she's giddy with her new found popularity so is acting the class clown to get more attention.

She's basically going to be Trump, instead of fox news it'll be GB News but she'll be led by seeking praise.
 
Yep, the thickos think rearranging the deck chairs on the titanic makes a difference.
yeah I mean 90%+ of the population are really disengaged with politics and as such something like changing a PM probably cuts through more than the intricacies of the leadership battle and policy ideas - UK politics would probably be a far better thing if more people were engaged - Im not sure labelling them all thickos is the right way to go about that though
 
the people who one hand say you cant trust politicians anymore and then on the other hand say they want boris back. they are thickos. theres plenty of them.
 
these are also the same people who go on about no one having the right to be offended, and then shit their pants when they are called out for being thickos.
:lol: the funny thing is the politicians they support treat them with so much more contempt and disrespect than me or you calling them thick ever could.
 
Interest rates... its nowhere near Norman Lamont's 15% (Black Wednesday- 16/09/1992) (ERM and all that) figure?

"Don't, panic.... don't panic....Jonesy!!
 
Special Program/debate on Sky News

Sunak and Truss have 45 mins to answer questions from audience and then host
 
With my fixed rate mortgage due to end next month and my meeting with the advisors next week...I want to cry.

I fecking hate Tories.