Gary_Walsh_Nou_Camp_Hell
Full Member
Perhaps he's not that good as many thought when we signed him?
To you Van de Beek is either good or bad, you don't understand nuance or that external factors will influence how a footballer performs.
Perhaps he's not that good as many thought when we signed him?
Never understood this but I'll try again. Based on what exactly.. is he a technically "very very" good player?
1. Does he have a good shot on him? No
2. Is he two footed? No
3. Can he ping balls and play long balls to our wingers or centrally? No
4. Can he dictate the tempo of the game? No
5. Can he create killer through balls? No
6. Does he have a great touch? No
7. Can he dribble with the ball, does he have close control? No
8. Can he beat a man with skills or pace in order to create space? No
9. Can he attack the space like Anderson? No
I'm sorry, he's not technically very very good at all. He's technically poor.
based on his technique you clown. watch some videos on him
Some of those points you raised are factually incorrect but hey never mind, watch some of his game time at Ajax or better yet, get some coaching under your belt to understand what technical ability is.
Other point 9, can't agree to any of that.
Good signing. You geniuses are confusing hindsight with making a decision with info you have at the time. Basic mistake
I have played football at a good enough level to understand what technique is - Thank you. The points I mentioned, he's not shown any of those based on his time at Utd and I've watched him very closely. His short passing is also poor which he's supposed to be a master at - you know the good old "pass and move" and one touch football. He's not shown any technical ability at his time here - and I'm sure many will agree with me.
You have a rather simplistic views on transfers. Club don't simply come knocking at the club's door with a bag of money and "say here, 40m and give me ABC." Negotiations take time and with United things tend to drag down months. You only have to see how we dealt regarding the likes of Maguire and Lindelof. So in my opinion, United tried to negotiate with Aston Villa but were priced out. Then they used our connections with Ajax and told Ole that its either VDB or nothing.
I am not here to defend or criticise Ole/club. Both have their valid arguments and their faults in my opinion. My point is that we see a significant shift from last year and the year before something that is consistent with other administrations as well. Also I find it very hard to understand why United fans are portraying our transfer strategy as having any sense when we all know that we've been a mess on that for at least 7 years
But you said a very good squad player. Which to me means he can come into the team when we need him and be relied upon. Hasn’t done that for us, whether that’s due to lack of opportunities or whatever.Because he is a good player, just because he hasn't been brilliant for us doesn't mean he isn't good!
He showed his quality at the highest level at Ajax.
According to the Athletic and Donny, Ole convinced Donny to come, he's an Ole signing.
"In an ‘inside story’ of how the Red Devils won the race for Van de Beek’s signature, The Athletic’s Adam Crafton revealed this morning that the key figure in the deal was manager Ole Gunnar Solskjaer.
‘Before committing to the transfer, [Van de Beek] insisted upon holding talks with Ole Gunnar Solskjaer,’ Crafton explains.
‘Those familiar with the deal say that Van de Beek came off the phone immediately convinced by the Norwegian’s pitch.
‘Van de Beek was excited to hear how Solskjaer would fit him into United’s midfield alongside Paul Pogba and Bruno Fernandes.
‘Solskjaer’s response was said to be authoritative.’
The reporter confirms that although other clubs were also in the race to sign the midfielder, Solskjaer’s intervention had convinced him that his future lay with United.
‘Reports over the weekend indicated serious interest from Tottenham and Barcelona in Van de Beek. Members of Barcelona manager Ronald Koeman’s backroom staff are believed to have a strong relationship with the player.
‘It is true the two clubs were kept abreast but it is also the case that after speaking to Solskjaer, Van de Beek’s representatives made clear that the player’s future would lie at Old Trafford.
‘Throughout the whole process, including Real Madrid, Solskjaer is the only manager outside of Ajax who has spoken to Van de Beek about a transfer.’
£35 million spent and it seems a waste for both parties.
I've said it before a few times but Donny did play well initially, slotted in very well, his best game was probably against 5-0 win over Leipzig at home in which he started, he was fantastic but since then Ole stopped using him and didn't bother in the away leg where we went 2-0 down in the opening minutes while playing a back 3 with Fred banned, they rinsed AWB, something they tried to do at OT but failed. Donny was so good across the middle in protecting and beating the press and leading by example with quick one touch passing, he played like he did for Ajax in the CL. That sharp on it Donny is long gone now so I can't propose he should play but i think ole is to blame for not seeing how good he was and sticking to his trusted lineup. Anyone who comes in are woeful now and our top players are feeling the burn like Rashford again. After the CL exit we did go on a excellent run so Ole has stuck with that.
Ole after signing Van de Beek”I really felt that we needed this type of player in our squad....Extremely versatile will definitely add goals from midfield....I actually followed his career right from when he made his debut against Molde....
Its quite clear that this was Oles signing...Maybe Ole thought he was good enough to play in a deeper role,but after watching him train every day he has come to the cinclusion that he’s not suited to play in midfield...
What are you on about!!But you said a very good squad player. Which to me means he can come into the team when we need him and be relied upon. Hasn’t done that for us, whether that’s due to lack of opportunities or whatever.
how old are you 14? Real Madrid wanted him, you think they go for players with no 'technique'Great stuff - so apparently first touch, shooting, heading, dribbling are not part of "technique". Got it!
Small and hair color. Except for them, VDB is nothing like Scholes.If anything his technique is his biggest asset. I would say his issues have been adjusting to the pace and physicality of the PL and adjusting to playing for man utd. It takes time sometimes, and as the season has progressed he has seen less gametime and been thrust in often with some of the second string after not playing for a good while.
He was also unfortunate that when we lost pogba and mctom he himself also got injured when it was his best chance to get a run of games.
He kind of reminds me of Scholes a little bit, small, not quick or strong but good first touch and eye for a pass he just hasn't worked out how to impose himself in games for us yet.
What are you on about!!
He's a good player. We know that.
Just because he's only had a few good appearances for us so far doesn't mean he needs to be sold!
He needs to find himself in this team. He hasn't performed poorly, just not particularly great.
Scholes reacted about a fortnight quicker with and without the ball than VDB has done so far for us.If anything his technique is his biggest asset. I would say his issues have been adjusting to the pace and physicality of the PL and adjusting to playing for man utd. It takes time sometimes, and as the season has progressed he has seen less gametime and been thrust in often with some of the second string after not playing for a good while.
He was also unfortunate that when we lost pogba and mctom he himself also got injured when it was his best chance to get a run of games.
He kind of reminds me of Scholes a little bit, small, not quick or strong but good first touch and eye for a pass he just hasn't worked out how to impose himself in games for us yet.
Small and hair color. Except for them, VDB is nothing like Scholes.
Oh, so you are serious? Ok.Both are best at no8 despite people obsessing with playing them in a no10/support striker role.
Both don't have great physical attributes but have the technique to play there way out of trouble in the middle of the park.
Scholes at a similar age to V.D.B would also go missing in games quite regularly its why keane/butt would often be preferred.
Scholes was more of a goal threat and more aggressive in the tackle and had a better range of passing, but Scholes at a similar age to V.D.B Deffo shares some similar attributes/traits.
Also Scholes was ginger and V.D.B is blond.
He hasn't had much of an opportunity to be fair.He hasn’t proven himself as a good squad player for us. It’s a pretty simple point, dude.
Same here, coached at a good level for ten years if we want to make it into a pissing contest.I have played football at a good enough level to understand what technique is - Thank you. The points I mentioned, he's not shown any of those based on his time at Utd and I've watched him very closely. His short passing is also poor which he's supposed to be a master at - you know the good old "pass and move" and one touch football. He's not shown any technical ability at his time here - and I'm sure many will agree with me.
They aren't ignoring them but rather they're wilfully ignorant.How are people just ignoring these quotes, you have it from VDB's mouth and Ole's, yet people still want to argue against it, and invent some conspiracy to add even more fuel to the fire against Ed and the owners. (They're terrible enough without blaming them for VDB's poor season)
Hindsight is 20/20, almost everybody here thought it was a great signing at the time, due to him doing very well at Ajax in multiple positions.
Sometimes things just don't work out, like Veron, but that doesn't mean Ole didn't want him.
He's obviously failed to impress in training.
It's a shame.
how old are you 14? Real Madrid wanted him, you think they go for players with no 'technique'
how old are you 14? Real Madrid wanted him, you think they go for players with no 'technique'
If anything his technique is his biggest asset. I would say his issues have been adjusting to the pace and physicality of the PL and adjusting to playing for man utd. It takes time sometimes, and as the season has progressed he has seen less gametime and been thrust in often with some of the second string after not playing for a good while.
He was also unfortunate that when we lost pogba and mctom he himself also got injured when it was his best chance to get a run of games.
He kind of reminds me of Scholes a little bit, small, not quick or strong but good first touch and eye for a pass he just hasn't worked out how to impose himself in games for us yet.
Same here, coached at a good level for ten years if we want to make it into a pissing contest.
As they say form is temporary. If you have technique, you really don't lose it by moving clubs but you know that right? If you are suggesting he has had a massive drop in form from his previous club, I would agree. Has he lost his technical ability? I seriously doubt it
DVB was clearly a very good player in a very good and highly technical team like Ajax and also coveted by Real Madrid. He may take more time to adjust to United than other players. Ajax have enjoyed a golden generation with DVB (United) Frenkie De Jong (Barca) Matthijs De Ligt (Juve), Hakim Ziyech (Chelsea), Quincy Promes (Spartak Moscow) All have had very ordinary careers away from Ajax since their move. It could be argues that De Jong has started to hit some form. Bottom line is, the lad has serious time on his side. If he makes it here then great, it will be a great addition, he is quality. If he doesn't step up, we wont lose too much money on him.
I haven’t seen him at Ajax but I understand the system Ajax play - he is an intelligent player and can fit in that system where everyone is on the move and the players look for short passes to create space.
That surely doesn’t mean Donny has great technique. He is a good intelligent player who uses the ball well but technical attributes like shooting, control, dribbling, long passing, heading, crossing etc.
Have you seen any of these attributes from his time here?
Because of course, Ajax just play one touch for shits n giggles and sit stroking their own dicks in mid table. You really don't survive and thrive, even at a club like Ajax without good technique you get found out early doors. Technique is your foundation as a player at a club like Ajax.
Ole, but i'm sure he had a gun to his head. Feels a bit like when Mourinho was given Fred after moaning about lack of transfer activity.
Paul Tomkins and Graeme Riley did a huge research project into transfers as part of their book, Pay As You Play. They found that 50% of transfers are a success, and that figure applies as much to high priced signings of elite players, as it does to lower priced transfers. If you go on Transfermarkt and look at a few clubs' signings over say the last 8 to 10 years, you'll see that this 50% figure seems realistic.
Van de Beek was signed using the same process as Maguire, Wan-Bissaka, James, Fernandes, Telles, Cavani, Pellistri and Amad. The recruitment team have a veto, as does Solskjaer. Both parties must have been sufficiently happy to agree to the signing, otherwise they would have used their veto.
Donny was signed as a back-up player. Since the first choice in his position, Bruno Fernandes, was fit through-out the season, Donny hasn't featured that often. Liverpool signed a left-back last summer, Tsimikas, who has barely played for them. Ake cost City £40m, he hasn't played much either. Real Madrid have bought numerous back-up players over recent years, that haven't featured that often.
Teams have a 25 player squad. We buy players to be part of the squad. No-one knows which players will get injured during the season. No-one knows which players will have a Martial season. Suppose we bought Sancho for the price that Dortmund asked for, but missed out on Cavani, Amad, Pellistri and van de Beek, in order to part fund the deal. Sancho creates tons of chances that Martial, our main striker, without serious competition, then misses because he is having a terrible season.
Yup.
Back then most people in football thought it was a good deal for a very handy player, those people will have included Ole, Phelan and the transfer board, none of which vetoed the move.
Just because it hasn’t worked out in hindsight, a la Poborski or Klebersen, doesn’t suddenly mean it was any different to any other signing.
We all know Frank didn't want the Germans
Can’t remember a “competition” between Grealish and VDB and many of us preferring VDB on equal terms.This is a funny thread because when VDB was linked with our club it was in competition with Grealish and there were so many clowns on this site that thought With the European experience and versatility that they thought VDB had that he was a better option for the club than Grealish and at that time they were in a fairly similar price range.
These clowns have gone quiet now and do not be surprised if there is a similar reaction if Sancho does come to our club and does not perform as expected.
I hope if Sancho comes he does pull up trees at our club but I find it so annoying when certain posters talk it up big style before the event and are nowhere to be seen if things do not work out.
He personally called them multiple times to convince them to join and then kept picking them despite despite their shit performances.
He definitely wanted them.
I do like Grealish and believe it or not I was hoping VDB would hit the ground running and be good for us but it is obvious it is not going to happen for him at our club.Can’t remember a “competition” between Grealish and VDB and many of us preferring VDB on equal terms.
VDB wasn’t our first or second choice. Grealish probably was. Everyone thought VDB was better than nothing and wanted to give him a chance after the deal was sealed.
Think your tone is too much “I told you so”, and I don’t understand why you start early warning about Sancho in this context.
Sound like you have an agenda (Grealish) and do the same “talk up big time before the event”. Grealish isn’t more a guarantee for success than, example Sancho. United is a different world than Aston Villa, and we don’t know how Grealish will cope with new surroundings, teammates and a different way to play football.