It's not really, the lack of other options is why he is persisting.
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik @Rood and Imran @Annihilate Now! start with the good news by celebrating Manchester United Women's emphatic FA Cup win over Spurs at Wembley and the future of manager Marc Skinner.
Then it's the bad news and the ever worsening form of our Men with losses to Arsenal and Palace.
Finally the main debate - ETH Out now or keep him until the end of the season - if not longer. Are you Team Nik or Team Imran?
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I really hope this League One standard player is not harbouring any intentions of staying beyond this season. He's literally almost costing us games.
He has to be the biggest fraud in a United shirt that I've seen in a long time.
He has to be the biggest fraud in a United shirt that I've seen in a long time.
Jup. Good hold up play and passed it neatly. Shame he isn't getting on the end of our balls into the box a bit more though
I think ETH loving him is a mistake as well. And just because a player is a stop gap doesn’t mean he should be cheered on for serving up shit on a weekly basis, but by all means just go be a top red fist pumping to that pressing masterclass from Weghorst.
Also for the record, “good hold up play” involves taking the ball under pressure and retaining possession and progressing it forward, not just being a fecking human backboard immediately passing it back when someone fires a nice pass between the lines to you.
How's he a fraud? Did he dress up as Haaland when he first met with delegates from United?
He was okay. But he doesn’t have any striking ability. His shots are terrible when he occasionally does shoot. He falls over a lot and generally looks desperate. He’s contributing but I feel sure ETH is (or was) expecting slightly more potency.
I think the results we have achieved over the last 3 months are fairly fecking impressive considering we haven’t been playing with a decent striker all along .
I mean he isn't good enough and agree is probably getting progressively worse but he's playing an important role when we have nobody else.
I remember him winning a header (like actually winning it and passing to a United player!). Fulham defender didn't challenge so it helped but it was a nice achievement either way. Oh and also that lobbed pass (or was it a terrible attempt to control the ball, probably the latter) that almost put Sabitzer 1v1 against the keeper. Anyway, I just cannot understand how he has over 170 career goals. He has absolutely no ability to strike the ball whatsoever and is never dangerous in the box. Like really, how?
Has anyone ever seen Weghorst score a goal in real life or is it some sort of conspiracy? I'm an anti-Wegger.
He was either getting significantly more chances over there and finishing a fraction, or he was finishing much better from similar chances to what he gets now. At the moment when you see his weak shots, constantly shooting off balance and generally making a meal of any opportunity near the goal it's really hard to understand what's going on.
I think he must have been getting cleaner chances at a higher frequency. Like between the posts more often, getting through on goal clearly because the defenders aren't so good. I'm guessing it's the higher standard of football and the rate of clear chances he's receiving as a result of his own lack of quality relative to this league that is the difference. Because I don't really believe in finishing just going to complete shit, generally stats have people close to xG which says it will even out but in English football his rate is exceptionally poor altogether.
They are decent results but they're not sustainable. We've had a lot of shocking performances with Weghorst there and gotten lucky in several games.
We're not going to win most of the games in April if Weghorst is playing 90 minutes in all of them. He's just too detrimental when we have the ball, have the momentum in certain moments and are trying to score goals.
We're already carrying crappy midfielders and dodgy wingers, we can't also carry a striker who can't for love or money meet a cross or hit a decent shot.
Just watch a compilation of him at wolfsburg. He was a great poacher, strong shots in the corners. The difference is really strange
What? 170 goals? No way. Has he had a really bad injury, perhaps? The player we have just couldn’t score that many.
I disagree with this, football is a team game but it's still dependant on the competency of players in individual positions. Weghorst doesn't offer enough attacking dynamic, it's still comical that he's even at the club.
That shot in the first half
youth league perhapsHa! Yeah. Awful. It was more of a back-pass.That shot in the first half
So maybe, just maybe, it’s difficult to form an accurate opinion on exactly how good a footballer is based on his first couple of months at a new club?
He's a golden retriever. Big, goofy, loveable, loyal and not the least the bit threatening.
Strange yet easily explained. Confidence is a massive factor in every striker’s game. And when one of them bursts into tears after scoring a goal it’s reasonable to assume he’s not exactly bursting with confidence in front of goal.
He's on loan. We have nobody else. If you all want to be pissed off with someone then direct your ire at the board, who would not buy a striker knowing that Ronaldo's position was untenable.
I know you have a bit of a man crush for him given your activity in this thread, but surely you do realize how badly this reads right?
So he kept out 2 players who aren’t striker by trade, both currently not good enough for Utd by virtue of their age and experience, and somehow that’s a defense of him?
The only reason he’s here and starting is because we are skint and our first choice striker’s body gave up on him. The way a portion of this fanbase have hypnotized themselves into believing he’s a decent footballer or somehow we can’t upgrade on him in the summer is nothing short of spectacular. Fortunately, the madness seems to have receded a bit.
He honestly should be nowhere near the team.
For people lamenting the lack of alternative options, Rashford is a miles better option up top.
For people lamenting the lack of alternative options, Rashford is a miles better option up top.
Man crush. Very good. How old are you? 12?
The point is we have alternatives. There are XI’s ETH could select that don’t involve Weghorst. Yet he chooses to play him. So he provides some value to the team in the eyes of a manager who obviously knows what he’s doing. My money’s on that value being based more on what he could provide for the team than what he has provided so far. Time will tell. It’s still early days.
Whatever, he’s a stop gap loan signing, is clearly a limited player and literally nobody is saying we couldn’t upgrade him in the summer so I’ve no idea why you need to make shit up to try and make whatever point you’re trying to make.
Agreed. I'm really struggling to understand why we're not seeing a front three of rashford central, with Antony & Sancho interchanging left/right. No brainer for me
We've been watching so many games with Wout on those. There's a pattern. Wout started as main striker, with Rashford on the wing. Then as game went on, it's either Wout came off or he dropped deep into 10, where Rashford became the striker. This happens so many times, any United fans should've seen it.
My take on this. EtH mentioned before that he likes opponents to get use to defending on certain type of play, then he changes the attackers to make opponents need to change their mindset. He has Wout as battering ram who just press like maniac, then on 3/4th of the game, has a speedy Rashford who eats through ball (playing on the defender shoulder).
So the talk that Elanga or Bruno could do what Wout can is a disservice to the big man. We battered Barcelona on their own turf playing this tactic.
But it's all probably just BS, and Wout is just EtH's lovechild, like some mentioned.
I haven’t made up anything, in this very thread plenty of people expressed their support for keeping him as a squad player and contended that what he provides is good enough as a squad player and we can’t aspire for more since better strikers than Weghorst wouldn’t be content with a bench role at this club, imagine that. You don’t even have to look that far back, it was pages upon pages of twerking for it after the cup final.
And in case you haven’t realized, we are more than half way through March and by the time club football is back, it’s April, so if that’s ‘early days’, when can we actually judge him? For a loan signing? And it’s not like he’s been used sparingly so we can default to argument about lack of game time/chemistry, man played near enough every matches.
I have nothing against you Pogue, I have been on here enough to know that you are generally a sound poster, but you have a pretty big blindspot here regarding him. It’s not the guy’s fault that he’s not good enough for United, but just as with Dan James or Lingard, some people are willing to overlook glaring faults in a player because they’ve taken a liking to him based on attitude.
Re: EtH. I simply disagree that he’s playing Weghorst on unseen value for supporters, because he’s been public about what he brought to the team e.g pressing and link up. The problem is, for him, the likes of Elanga and Pellistri simply aren’t alternatives, just as as bad as McTominay has been, he considers him the only back up to Casemiro because we’ve seen how bad Fred was there when he tried early on in the season. So Weghorst is starting due to the constraints put on EtH by the board, rather than some mysterious quality that’s gone unnoticed by the football plebs.
The Dutch Haaland they say, only better.
It’s not really that difficult is it?
18 starts and he’s currently averaging a goal every 672.5 minutes. Over the course of a 38 game season if he played 90 minutes every game, then you’re looking at 5 goals from your CF. It’s diabolical.
In addition to this he isn’t very good at football.
I wonder if he looked different, more flashy, played a bit more like Antony, rather than a plumber who’s also semi-pro, if he’d be getting support from the same people.
For those saying we could play Rashford up top, we could. But it's a last resort for the manager, that's clear. I think he could and maybe should do it some games from a tactical perspective but I also understand why he's not keen.
Probably because the vast majority of his best performances and goals are coming from the left. So you're moving your best player which seems a bit strange.
And probably also because we don't have two other wide players that are performing consistently so then you have to find them elsewhere so does that become worth moving Rashford for?
I don't think Sancho has performed any better than Wout and probably also hasn't worked as hard as compensation for that fact. Antony has been extremely hit and miss. There's an element of shuffling deckchairs around. Bottom line is we're short a quality striker and there isn't much you can do about that. Every striking decision is very far from the ideal. It's not going to be resolved without using the market so anything the manager does will have drawbacks.
Probably because the vast majority of his best performances and goals are coming from the left. So you're moving your best player which seems a bit strange.
And probably also because we don't have two other wide players that are performing consistently so then you have to find them elsewhere so does that become worth moving Rashford for?
I don't think Sancho has performed any better than Wout and probably also hasn't worked as hard as compensation for that fact. Antony has been extremely hit and miss. There's an element of shuffling deckchairs around. Bottom line is we're short a quality striker and there isn't much you can do about that. Every striking decision is very far from the ideal. It's not going to be resolved without using the market so anything the manager does will have drawbacks.
Ha, yes! Definitely true. And he’s been shipped about from one club to the next for a year or two.
He has qualities but, to me, he looks like a 5-10 goals a season player so far. Time will tell (and give the boy a chance, for sure) but my hunch is he would not have 170 goals if he’d played the last ten years in the Prem, based, that is, on his first couple of months at a new club.
This is a lazy take. Of course, against 9 man Fulham everyone from our team would improve toward the end. Sancho was terrible up until the penalty and mass sent off incident. Then he looked liked he toying with Fulham had great impact for second goal. However, against 11 men, Sancho had a meh performance.
This is nothing new. Similar things have been said all along about Sancho doing well when the game is easy, but struggling when the going is tough. Similarly Weghorst do well in situation when we had more control of the game. When the game is fast paced, end to end or when opposition is too skill at keeping possession, Weghorst almost has no impact.
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The Barcelona away game is a big myth to using the pattern changing argument. Rashford was up top all game as was Weghorst in no 10 role. Xavi messed up by playing Alba and Alonso, which with Rashford pace, he exploited that side of Barcelona defense. Xavi wisen up in the return leg, and ETH had to throw in the towel with Weghorst after a half playing him up front. Moving Weghorst to no 10, changing pattern wouldn't help because Barcelona was much better equipped to deal with Rashford up front now than the first leg. A more balanced right wing with Antony was the answer instead of shoehorning Bruno around. Weghorst is meh in the first leg himself despite as a team and some players like Fred, Rashford were unplayable for Barcelona.
ETH does have some hipster decision in him and it sometimes cost him and his team. Reason is not always reasonable. Latest weird hipster tactic is Bruno on the left vs Liverpool. Barcelona second leg first half Bruno on the right was not the only weird ineffective tactic. Sancho was deployed as no 10 in the first half too.
Did Cavani need half a season? And Cavani had little professional football for about half a year before joining. He's already on sharp decline, with underwhelming goal record the previous season for PSG, and injury prone to boost. Stop gap signing is not required to carry the team like being top scorer, but being able to hit the ground running quickly and being competent in his role. There is a reason top gap signing option associated with seasoned players because the expectation is that their experience would help them adapt quicker. Weghorst even had some PL exposure with Burnley.
Outside of those with elite attribute, quite a few Bundesliga attackers haven't proven themselves, even when they had time to adapt in the new teams. We have another former Bundesliga attacker who still adapt after moving here over one and half season! Weghorst had decent scoring record but he's not at the same high profile in comparison. Doesn't look promising.
Why conveniently ignoring Weghorst good scoring rate in Turkey now? He didn't need much time to adapt to Turkish league to score 1 goal in game rate, right? Perhaps it's just PL defenders being much faster, more physical and being more physical when his two struggling spell is for Premier League team despite big gap of quality/ambition.
Also if you believe people are only judging Weghorst only on goal scoring metric, only then this logic can be applied for a stop gap short term signing. In reality his positioning is not very effective either. He visually runs a lot because he reacts to opposition's action. His workrate may make up if opposition lack quality. However when opposition play well, no amount chasing would help him getting back into game when opposition dictate the play (pace of the game faster than his ability to play). His anticipation overall is poor. Mitrovic is slow as feck too, but you can see how experience and good sense of anticipation help him to position himself to get the better of his marker. Even without the goal, he really impact the game with CF play.
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Clearly not good enough. Last 2 games he was terrible, even to his own standard.
That being said, if we get a top striker in the summer and have to pick between him and Martial for the backup role, then I'd prefer him for sure.
That being said, if we get a top striker in the summer and have to pick between him and Martial for the backup role, then I'd prefer him for sure.
Really hope United signs him long term. C'mon ETH, do the right thing.
It's miraculous
Mate have you sussed out the Nunez and Gapko related threads. Even the Antony thread too. No one has any patience anymore.
As of now we are getting more out of him than out of Martial. That‘s it really.
He seems hopelessly out of form, yet still does the things required of him. Except scoring.
He seems hopelessly out of form, yet still does the things required of him. Except scoring.
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